Marmotte 2014........

Little Superquinn · 20-09-2013 4:01pm #1

Marmotte 2014
I know there are numerous previous treads etc on Marmotte but I wanted to stay a specific one for 2014. The aim being that anyone with the same goal can update, monitor, log progress, get advise on where they are and more important where they should be with their training and preparation.

My situation is I have signed up and the package is booked and while costs my be reduced with self organisation I wanted hassle free and any spare time on the bike!!!

It would be useful for anyone else planning the trip to join in, give updates on training, any plans previously used, nutrition etc.

So to get the ball rolling I'm male, 32, 13stone 1lbs (looking to shed approx 1stone for the event) im currently training 6hrs a week mostly sat and sun. Now I increase till Xmas to approx 10hrs give or take depending on work, family etc. At the minute I'm more interested with hours on the bike and want base fitness and won't look at any hills etc till we're into the new year. A good fitness on the flat is needed before hitting any hills. I may be naive but I want the gold medal time for the event!!!

So anyone else in a similar boat having signed or planning on signing up???

Little Superquinn · 20-09-2013 8:51pm

http://marmotte2009.blogspot.ie/

One of the previous blogs worth a read for anyone thinking about the idea.

Leroy42 · 20-09-2013 10:06pm

This is another really good guide.

http://api.ning.com/files/6DLnZfDv*8KVV8uKn3KfyDZhByDEGV7oJDS0mC1-zSxHF*JAJEhW6R7qeo5EftFOWYNXnil*8pMVRLt9-uEs25pFyXwCU5TE/marmotte_guide.pdf

From my own experience, my first thing to say is that your plans for the rest of this year are spot on. Don't stress out about particular type of training, setting targets etc. Main thing is to get out there regularly. Joining a club is a great idea as on those days when its raining/cold etc having others to go out with is a great advantage.

I was with a club in 2012 and it really helped. Not in 2013 and I really felt it as not matter how motivated you are going out on your own all the time is hard.

At 32 you're looking at 8.13 for gold. This does not include the descent of the Glandon. Timer stops as you reach the top and starts again as you pass through the town at the end of the descent. It certainly possible but don't underestimate it. So actual time is around 8.40. While you don't need to have done a spin as long as that before it, you need to be comfortable doing spins of 6 or so hours at a time. I find that doing a few sportives is good training but also goals to aim for during the year.

It's a great event, certainly something well worth doing. We have no climbs that come anywhere near the type of climbing your going to encounter. It's all about staying within your limits. Go into the red and it is very difficult to get it back. The mistake most people (including me) make is going too hard too early. Save something for the Alpe. I lost 15 minutes on it this year over last year, tbh looking back I'm surprised I only lost that.

Haven't decided yet whether I'm up for another go in 2014. Like you I'd be aiming for gold but not sure I want to put in that level of effort in training. Will decide during November.

07Lapierre · 23-09-2013 3:52pm

OP, do you mind if I ask what travel company you signed up with?

Leroy42 · 24-09-2013 10:38am

Another thing to consider is weight. Not just yourself but also your bike. The Glandon is over 100 minutes of climbing, Telegrapgh about 55, Galibier about 80 and Alpe is over 60. That is a lot of climbing. Any weight you can save will be useful.
Obviously any weight off yourself will be great, but you already have that earmarked. Have a look at your bike. Upgrade your wheelset, don't go with carbon rims or deep dish rims. This is primarily a climbing event so the aerodynamics don't make that much difference and every year you read stories of people having blow-outs because of the carbon rims etc. There is no need for them.
Don’t cycle the Alpe on Friday, depending on your level don’t even ride on the Thursday. If you do cycle it then take it easy, then slow down even more. This is hard to do especially if you haven’t been there before, but the Alpe is a difficult climb and even taking it easy will take something out of you. Again this will all depend on yourself and how you normally recover.
Apart from maybe an early morning cycle on Friday (I cycled out to the base of the Glandon and up the dam then back) do nothing on Friday. The cycle is really just to check the bike and get a short burst into the legs but other than that just sit around and rest. Drink plenty of water. Don’t spend hours walking around the shops and tents at the finish.
Practice eating/drinking strategies. Try out gels. bars etc during your training so see which ones you like, how they affect your stomach etc. There are feedstops on the event; top of Glandon, bottom of Galibier and bottom of Alpe, and they are well stocked with a variety of food. Water (obviously) fruit juices, bananas, oranges, dates, bread, cheese, jellies.
You will be given a starting number which indicates which wave you start in. 1-2000 (I think the top 400 go to the very front but start of roughly the same time) start off at 7am, 2000 to 4000 go off at 7.30 and everyone else at 7.50. If you get a low number then the food stops are much less chaotic.
I have always struggled with the nutrition and drinking. I was totally dehydrated and the end this year. The heat can play a major role. It was 37oC on the Alpe when I was climbing it, not sure what we can do to train for that!
My stomach can only handle so many gels. Since you are going with a tour company they will probably have a van at some stage near the top of Galiber. Get some real food here (if you are particular put them in your bag yourself although at the top of Galibier I don’t think you’ll be too fussed!).
Don’t skimp on the water. Even if you don’t think you’ll need it fill your bottles whenever you can as if nothing else you can use it to cool down.
At the end of it all, if you have done the training, if you can do the Mick Byrne/W200 or other climbing type sportives, then the Marmotte is doable. Gold time is hard, but acheiveable and much easier than on other events. Stay relaxed, listen to your body and adjust accordingly. You will pass, and be passed, people constantly so block them out of your mind and focus on yourself. Jump on a wheel if you can but ease off if they are going beyond what you want, there will be somebody else to grab in the next minute or two.

07Lapierre · 24-09-2013 10:53am

Leroy42 wrote: »

Another thing to consider is weight. Not just yourself but also your bike. The Glandon is over 100 minutes of climbing, Telegrapgh about 55, Galibier about 80 and Alpe is over 60. That is a lot of climbing. Any weight you can save will be useful.
Obviously any weight off yourself will be great, but you already have that earmarked. Have a look at your bike. Upgrade your wheelset, don't go with carbon rims or deep dish rims. This is primarily a climbing event so the aerodynamics don't make that much difference and every year you read stories of people having blow-outs because of the carbon rims etc. There is no need for them.
Don’t cycle the Alpe on Friday, depending on your level don’t even ride on the Thursday. If you do cycle it then take it easy, then slow down even more. This is hard to do especially if you haven’t been there before, but the Alpe is a difficult climb and even taking it easy will take something out of you. Again this will all depend on yourself and how you normally recover.
Apart from maybe an early morning cycle on Friday (I cycled out to the base of the Glandon and up the dam then back) do nothing on Friday. The cycle is really just to check the bike and get a short burst into the legs but other than that just sit around and rest. Drink plenty of water. Don’t spend hours walking around the shops and tents at the finish.
Practice eating/drinking strategies. Try out gels. bars etc during your training so see which ones you like, how they affect your stomach etc. There are feedstops on the event; top of Glandon, bottom of Galibier and bottom of Alpe, and they are well stocked with a variety of food. Water (obviously) fruit juices, bananas, oranges, dates, bread, cheese, jellies.
You will be given a starting number which indicates which wave you start in. 1-2000 (I think the top 400 go to the very front but start of roughly the same time) start off at 7am, 2000 to 4000 go off at 7.30 and everyone else at 7.50. If you get a low number then the food stops are much less chaotic.
I have always struggled with the nutrition and drinking. I was totally dehydrated and the end this year. The heat can play a major role. It was 37oC on the Alpe when I was climbing it, not sure what we can do to train for that!
My stomach can only handle so many gels. Since you are going with a tour company they will probably have a van at some stage near the top of Galiber. Get some real food here (if you are particular put them in your bag yourself although at the top of Galibier I don’t think you’ll be too fussed!).
Don’t skimp on the water. Even if you don’t think you’ll need it fill your bottles whenever you can as if nothing else you can use it to cool down.
At the end of it all, if you have done the training, if you can do the Mick Byrne/W200 or other climbing type sportives, then the Marmotte is doable. Gold time is hard, but acheiveable and much easier than on other events. Stay relaxed, listen to your body and adjust accordingly. You will pass, and be passed, people constantly so block them out of your mind and focus on yourself. Jump on a wheel if you can but ease off if they are going beyond what you want, there will be somebody else to grab in the next minute or two.

+1..this is particularly good advise when you get to the bottom of the Glandon. From there to the start of the Telegraph is about 25k along a main road. if you find the group you've joined are going too fast, ease up and wait for the next group.

Little Superquinn · 25-09-2013 8:36pm

Thanks leroy42 this is exactly what I'm looking for, past experience of the little things that you won't find out training over here. I'm lucky enough to have completed the alpe d'huez Tri previous so I'm been up this climb but that was after a 1500m swim and a flat 20km into its base, tackling it after 3climbs and 160km in the legs will be a different story. The bike and accessories will be as light as possible but my big saving will be the 15kg I'm currently lugging around unnecessarily at present. While I'm not too concerned till the new year on this side either I am wary of losing weight too quick and losing power while balancing this against losing it too soon and not keeping it off.
The link for the route guide is a great read and a great point of reference and reality check for the task.

Little Superquinn · 25-09-2013 8:40pm

07lapierre I'll post the name shortly just need to dig out email, uk based tour company, do I get the feeling there is one I should have avoided!!!

07Lapierre · 26-09-2013 8:51am

Little Superquinn wrote: »

07lapierre I'll post the name shortly just need to dig out email, uk based tour company, do I get the feeling there is one I should have avoided!!!

No not at all, I just wanted to know if it was an Irish company. The only irish company I know of is Onyourbike.ie and its not clear from their website if they do the Marmotte. I've used frenchcyclingholidays.co.uk for the last two years and i found them pretty good.

Using a UK based company usually means you can't avail of their bike transport facility,which just adds to the overall cost of the trip.

Leroy42 · 26-09-2013 10:42am

Just on the weight issue, I wouldn't be too concerned about getting rid of too much weight until into the new year. At that stage your training will ramp up and you'll find the weight will come off fairly easily. Not saying don't start losing weight now but just don't get too worked up about it.

Some great links on t'net which give a good approximation of the amount of calories you need. While of course very general they do give a rough guide.

What you want to be doing now is looking at your eating habits, see those areas where you can easily save some calories. Sticking to a rigid diet is very hard so I normally let it go a little over the winter (not Ulrich style mind!). I know from experience that losing weight too fast and then trying to hold it off for a long time is very difficult and can lead to injuries and lack of performance etc. Small things like low fat milk, no deserts, change your snacks to fruit etc. No point being a monk about it, no need to totally skip everything!

As with all plans, start from the end and work back to when you want to start. So 15k in 9 months a this stage. Aim to hit the weight as close to the time as possible. This will lead to much more gradual and planned loss and easier to adapt.

borntobike · 30-09-2013 7:37pm

Just signed up as well for next years Marmotte. Aim to build stamina up over the next three months and then start serious climbing at the end of January. Will include a couple of spinning classes each week plus some heavy resistance indoor work. Took a few weeks off and now starting to train for the next nine months.
Booked with Sportactive!

07Lapierre · 30-09-2013 7:48pm

borntobike wrote: »

Just signed up as well for next years Marmotte. Aim to build stamina up over the next three months and then start serious climbing at the end of January. Will include a couple of spinning classes each week plus some heavy resistance indoor work. Took a few weeks off and now starting to train for the next nine months.
Booked with Sportactive!

Depending on the winter we get, I'd suggest you wait until February/March before you hit the hills. I didn't go near Wicklow until March 18th as the roads were still very icy.

El Vino · 01-10-2013 4:52pm

I'm also planning this, I did the Etape Act 1 in 2012 which was similar in terms of total ascent with a bit less in distance so hopefully I know what I am letting myself in for. Travelled from the UK but used Onyerbike. Would recommend if they were doing the Marmotte. I did most of my climbing training on the Turbo as I don' live near many decent hills. look forward to seeing your training logs.

Little Superquinn · 06-10-2013 4:35pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

No not at all, I just wanted to know if it was an Irish company. The only irish company I know of is Onyourbike.ie and its not clear from their website if they do the Marmotte. I've used frenchcyclingholidays.co.uk for the last two years and i found them pretty good.

Using a UK based company usually means you can't avail of their bike transport facility,which just adds to the overall cost of the trip.

http://www.sportstoursinternational.co.uk/cycling/la-marmotte

This is the group I've entered with. Most seem similar enough but this is the one I've gone for. Flights and bike box separate.

For now training hours are increasing with the bulk on the weekend with no emphasis on distance or speed just hours. Turbo class on a Tuesday with a spin on Wednesdays approx 90min is my current weeks log. Gives a total of about 8.5hrs.

On the weight loss I'm planning on recording and logging my food diary for a two week period. While as it's not too important at the minute and I won't focus on this till after the new year it's good to see what consumption is actually there.

Any opinions or ideas on how best to replicate a hill on a turbo? I'm lucky to be living in Blessington so hills are everywhere and when the times comes I'll know the Wicklow gap all too we'll but to replicate those big climbs for a 60min plus duration I reckon the turbo will be an essential tool.

Leroy42 · 08-10-2013 3:07pm

Essentially the alpine climbs are all about sustainable power, keeping within your known limits. You cannot afford to go into the red as there really is little respite to get it back (save for drastically slowing or stopping).

There is a train of thought that since our climbs are in no way like the alpine climbs (being much shorter)then doing flat or Turbo sessions at slightly below your sustainable power for 60 minutes is actually better in terms of the work needed. While for a physical training point of view that is right, it doesn't take into account either the mental strategy of climbing or indeed the abilities need for descending. (and doesn't much sound like fun to me!)

Something like 2x20's over the winter twice a week (all dependent on your fitness levels of course) and then getting out at the weekends for long cycles to get time in the saddle, and get used to group riding. From the start you will surrounded by hundreds of others and while it is all very safe, everybody is very anxious and you need to feel comfortable with people all around you.

One thing that is useful on a turbo is to raise the front wheel a few inches higher than normal to better replicate the position your will be in. Also make sure you mix plenty of standing within any intervals you are doing. You will need to ability to climb standing, at the very least to simply change position and give your muscles a short rest.

There are some great videos of Marmotte and other climbs on Youtube, and many seem to be pretty long. Hook up one of them in front of the turbo and off you go.

MediaMan · 09-10-2013 12:19pm

While on the topic of turbos...

I am planning to do the Marmotte next year, and although I hate turbo-ing with a passion, I am reconciled to having to buy one and grind it out through the winter as part of my training.

With that in mind can anyone recommend a turbo (or rollers) that would be suiting to training for long and hilly events, and have some level of "road feel" about them? I don't mind spending a bit if need be for my sanity.

Little Superquinn · 11-10-2013 9:00pm

MediaMan, I'm no expert but I have done some research on turbos of late and I've ordered the Lemond Revolution. While it's not cheap I have tested it out and some others and it's the most realistic replica of the road and flow when training and for me the main bonus of not needing to change the rear wheel it great.

borntobike · 12-10-2013 10:46am

I have started doing some intense Spinning in K Leisure Naas. They have bought top of the range Keiser bikes where you can measure you wattage output, RPM and heart. They also have a range of gears for intense training. I am seeing the benefits already.

Little Superquinn · 12-10-2013 4:32pm

I have used the Keisers as well the last few weeks in Westpark Gym Tallaght. Great feel to a spin bike and easy to recalibrate and record progress compared to the older spin models.

MediaMan · 16-10-2013 9:44am

Little Superquinn wrote: »

MediaMan, I'm no expert but I have done some research on turbos of late and I've ordered the Lemond Revolution. While it's not cheap I have tested it out and some others and it's the most realistic replica of the road and flow when training and for me the main bonus of not needing to change the rear wheel it great.

Thanks for that. Looks like an interesting machine alright, but something of a turbulent history with ownership etc. Seems to be getting back on a stable footing now. Would be interested in more detailed comments when you get it up and running.

Meanwhile I've been looking at the Kinetic Rock and Roll. They have a new model just out and the older model is being sold at a discount. Unfortunately I haven't been able to try one out.

Anyone got any experience of the Rock and Roll?

07Lapierre · 16-10-2013 9:57am

Turbo's are fine, but remember, there's no substitute for the real thing...get out there and put the miles in over the winter. Once the weather gets better in February/March (hopefully) start heading for the hills!

El Vino · 17-10-2013 10:01am

I have a tacx satori, I honestly think that while all turbo training is fairly boring, gimmicky ones like the rock and roll add very little. Turbo can but give a huge boost to your fitness training, I'd actually say it is a very good substitute for the real thing when used with either a power meter or HRM. I tend to stick it in front of a PC screen with some noise cancelling headphones on and watch TV, boxed sets like "24" are particularly good, warm up and get in your zone then knock out a good 40 min at the sort of power output needed for a long alpine climb. No rain, no chance of being knocked off in dark wet winter evenings.

PS got a pass last night from wife for Marmott, she wants to do Dublin City Marathon next year so very supportive

Leroy42 · 04-11-2013 3:04pm

www.sportcommunication.com

El Vino · 04-11-2013 3:46pm

Leroy42 wrote: »

www.sportcommunication.com

Many thanks - I'm in!:)

El Director · 04-11-2013 9:36pm

Hey guys, just wondering what are ye doing for flights? Where are ye flying into and from where and with what airline?
Thinking about this for 2014.

Leroy42 · 04-11-2013 10:05pm

I fly direct Dublin to Lyon with Aerlingus. Hire a car in Lyon Airport and it's a pretty straightforward 100 mins drive, mostly on motorway until Grenoble (tolls are about €10 each way).

El Director · 04-11-2013 10:21pm

Leroy42 wrote: »

I fly direct Dublin to Lyon with Aerlingus. Hire a car in Lyon Airport and it's a pretty straightforward 100 mins drive, mostly on motorway until Grenoble (tolls are about €10 each way).

Cheers man, thanks.

El Vino · 04-11-2013 11:22pm

I'm flying to London with BA, you can get a bike on for free as part of standard luggage allowance.

kilns · 05-11-2013 9:47am

I am on the website but cant get in anywhere to register

Would it be sold out already??

El Vino · 05-11-2013 9:54am

http://www.sportcommunication.info/web2010/inscription.php?langue=1

Looks to be still open, do we need a main forum Thread rather than a training log one as the OP intended?

goldenboots · 07-11-2013 9:32pm

Am doing Marmotte as well and just finalised trip. Am interested in how others are approaching training. Like others, have never done anything like this and just want to finish ahead of the broomwagon. Anything else is a bonus. Want to 'enjoy' the event rather than trying to achieve a specific time. Leroy's advice has been great.

Until Christmas, I am just focussing on building up fitness. Doing at least one spin class and either an outdoor cycle or a second spin session with a lot of high resistance work at the weekend. Hopefully the weather improves some bit. So I don't get bored indoors, am also playing my regular footie and doing a 10km run during the week. Eating sensibly but not too hung up about the weight yet.

Once the New Year arrives, will start building up the mileage on the road and, if weather ok, start the hill climbing as soon as possible.

Marmotte 2014........

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