[corks finest]

Originally Posted by Zaph

He was an MP in name only. Even if he wasn't in prison he wouldn't have attended parliament or participated in the democratic process to represent his constituents. Thatcher was pretty cold hearted, but I fail to see why she would or should care more about Sands just because he was an MP.

And you categorically know this? Methinks not

[Zaph]

Originally Posted by corks finest

Kieran Doherty was also a TD
( Irish member of parliament)
He also died

And what difference does that make? He was in prison in a foreign jurisdiction, it's not like the government here were going to bust him out just so he could take his seat.

[Zaph]

Originally Posted by corks finest

And you categorically know this? Methinks not

And just how many SF MPs have taken their seat in Westminster? There's no way Bobby Sands would have been any different.

[corks finest]

Originally Posted by Blaaz_

It really should've saved his life though

They died for what were very modest political compromises

As an ex republican ( N and S- arrested for suspected membership etc 2003- Dundalk)
Walked away after a lifetime of it , I can heart on hand categorically state that all the hunger strikers were used for political gain for SF, which in turn brought about the GFA
Before they died SF were dead ducks so the ultimate sacrifice brought about some semblance of peace
But they were used no doubt, anyone interested Google " Brendan " the dark" Hughes"

[corks finest]

Originally Posted by Zaph

And just how many SF MPs have taken their seat in Westminster? There's no way Bobby Sands would have been any different.

That's as Maybe-MAYBE

[Edgware]

Originally Posted by corks finest

They murdered 2 of Corks elected Lord mayor's,shot one in his bed

I dont need a history lesson from you. The poster raised a question and I answered it.

[Edgware]

Originally Posted by Blaaz_

It really should've saved his life though

They died for what were very modest political compromises

Certainly very modest and if the British had honoured the agreement that ended the first hunger strike things would have been completely different. In the 80s the I.R.A. was rattled by informers and long prison sentences. It is accepted by most observers that the hunger strikers were used by Sinn Fein especially after the election of Sands, Doherty and Agnew

[corks finest]

Originally Posted by Edgware

I dont need a history lesson from you. The poster raised a question and I answered it.

Obviously need a lesson from someone

[Fuascailteoir]

Originally Posted by corks finest

As an ex republican ( N and S- arrested for suspected membership etc 2003- Dundalk)
Walked away after a lifetime of it , I can heart on hand categorically state that all the hunger strikers were used for political gain for SF, which in turn brought about the GFA
Before they died SF were dead ducks so the ultimate sacrifice brought about some semblance of peace
But they were used no doubt, anyone interested Google " Brendan " the dark" Hughes"

SF capitalised on the support for the hunger strikers. Why would they not? But the IRA had been against the second strike as if it collapsed like the first one it would have sapped morale.

[corks finest]

Originally Posted by Fuascailteoir

SF capitalised on the support for the hunger strikers. Why would they not? But the IRA had been against the second strike as if it collapsed like the first one it would have sapped morale.

Adams pushed it end of,I was visiting the H blocks at the time and for years before and after,
dogs on the street knew besides Bobby Sands and Francis Hughes all the rest including INLA prisoners were sacrificed needlessly

[corks finest]

Originally Posted by Fuascailteoir

SF capitalised on the support for the hunger strikers. Why would they not? But the IRA had been against the second strike as if it collapsed like the first one it would have sapped morale.

"Officially" they were against it, but at that stage the tail was wagging the dog, bloody horrible, they shouldn't have been left die, on a personal level it was devastating, the whole nationalist people at the time in the 6 counties were just numb and deflated

[Fuascailteoir]

Originally Posted by corks finest

Adams pushed it end of,I was visiting the H blocks at the time and for years before and after,
dogs on the street knew besides Bobby Sands and Francis Hughes all the rest including INLA prisoners were sacrificed needlessly

For Bobby sands to have been sacrificed surely he would have been ordered to go on hunger strike and not to come off it. Nothing about sands reads that way. He comes across as being totally dedicated to what lay ahead of him and was going to undertake the strike regardless of the attitude of the outside leadership. I can understand how questions might arise in relation to the last three or four to die

[corks finest]

Originally Posted by Fuascailteoir

SF capitalised on the support for the hunger strikers. Why would they not? But the IRA had been against the second strike as if it collapsed like the first one it would have sapped morale.

SF didn't just capitalise they caused it, formed it and oversaw it ,yes it brought them on politically but vvvv unfair,I'm finished,I've said my piece, maybe not to everyones approval,but it's honest,most important thing is to REMEMBER all the strikers

[Edgware]

Originally Posted by corks finest

Obviously need a lesson from someone

Usual thug answer

[Truthvader]

A lot of misguided and misunderstood history on this topic.

First; the 1916 Rising had no popular support at the time. Had a relative involved and the story is that his family were horrified that he could have got himself involved in anything so stupid. By 1916 Irish people were happy enough. The anti Catholic nonsense was over, land issues were solved and, for those interested Home Rule was on the way (though held up by the war). Most people just wanted a quiet pint and a trip to Dalkey on the tram with their girl.

In contrast Derry/ Belfast was a bearpit of poverty injustice and subjogation for working class Catholics by 1969. If you read the circumstaces of Bobby Sands childhood it is no surprise that he turned to violence and death - including his own. Working class Catholics were beaten into subjugation

Fianna Fail and Fine Gael never admit this and persist with good old freedom fighters v the terrorists which is a lie

The civil rights movement was hijacked by Adams and Mcguiness & Co ably assisted by the B Specials, parachute regiment and a segment of the RUC. The truth is that the murder and pain achieved zero save a few trips to Washington and a holiday home in Donegal for Uncle Gerry. I believe myself that Adams knew all about Stakeknife but let him run as he was clearing the runway for Adams "International Statesman" act.

The rest of it was a cruel waste of youth and beauty that led to nothing but death and tears and has left a dreadful legacy of subhuman thuggery. Even now whole working class areas have been sold out to local Provo thugs or their Loyalist counperparts controlled by people so damaged they believe that it is a greater wrong for a 15 year old boy to steal a car than for grown men to capture the same boy and maim him for life.

While I abhor the likes of Adams/ McGuinness/ Sands I understand how people were driven to a kind of insane cruelty by what was visted on them. Less time for Mary Lou who just saw an opportunity for herself - or the creepy Dessie Ellis making bombs for other people to plant from the safety of the South. Topped the poll in Finglas. So proud