A young women's suicide

AlekSmart · 10-11-2019 2:20pm

silver2020 wrote: »

I'm purely going on what is written by the Irish time - my original post only gives an excerpt.
This was a relatively minor offence. Bail was set at €100 which she did not have. She became agitated and was brought to hospital. She was released into garda custody. gardai brought her to dochas and according to the article, they did not inform dochas that she had required hospital care that day.

That is a phenomenal failure on the part of gardai.

and its not the only case where some gardai have such little understanding of mental health issues, that their actions cause serious harm.

I will say that the vast vast majority of gardai are decent, but there are still far too many that have an inability to display empathy when there is an obvious mental health issue involved

The IT article does not make any mention of what transpired between the Gardai and Dóchas.

While in Garda custody after court she became extremely agitated. An ambulance was called and she was brought to Mullingar hospital emergency department. She was treated, given medication and discharged back into Garda custody to be delivered to the Dóchas centre.

Are you aware of what protocols exist for prisoner transfers in general ?

Do you have specific knowledge (other than the IT article) of what exactly transpired in this instance ?

What would your approach be,if,for example,the Gardai had NOT acted on the Bench Warrant ?

This sad case is (Very) far from the open & shut variety,which you appear to desire.

I would wait until the results of the investigations are published before attempting to act as Judge,Jury and Executioner without any actual evidence.

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:20pm

fullstop wrote: »

Someone being in prison isn’t in Garda custody. Can you understand that? Do you ever go into a random office down the road from your own just to check on the staff? You know, to be a decent human being who isn’t a piece of scum :rolleyes:

Then the prison officers are VERY responsible.

And yes ..i have ...many people have...its not a big deal

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:22pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

Unless they are double jobbing as prison officers....

Then no they are most certainly not.

A lot of em are actually.

fullstop · 10-11-2019 2:23pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Then the prison officers are VERY responsible.

And yes ..i have ...many people have...its not a big deal

Hahahahahahaha. Your shtick just gets better and better

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:24pm

JupiterKid wrote: »

Well I can speak from a bit of first hand experience/perspective on this one.

My OH is bipolar - he has been through awful episodes of both depression and euphoric/dysphoric elation in the past. But when he is well- which is 95% of the time - he is a fantastic person.

When he was having a bad episode of dysphoric elation a couple of years back, he confronted the builders working on his neighbour’s house early in the morning after he had been awake all night. He was very unwell. He didn’t make death threats or anything, but his behaviour caused the workmen to call his neighbour who proceeded to call the Gardai and he was arrested and forcefully taken away in handcuffs to the Gardai station, where he was put in a cell for a few hours.

Eventually he was taken by ambulance to A&E and then transferred to a psychiatric facility where he finally was given medication and helped greatly by the staff. He stayed there for two weeks until he was well enough to be discharged.

Whilst he was in Garda custody he was very upset, disoriented and felt suicidal at times. Thank God he was in the private healthcare system and that his psychiatric team were contacted by the doctor in A&E and he ended up getting proper help.

The Gardai are clearly not properly trained to deal with cases of people with mental health difficulties and this can lead to tragedy. It is something that badly needs to be addressed.

These cases are never black or white but they do show how the justice system can badly fail people who need appropriate help and intervention.

I don't know if people who become guards are the right type of people to deal with mental health tbh. They don't have the right personality type. Not gentle or empathetic enough.

I don't think prison officers do either tbh. I think they would be rubbish at it.

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:25pm

fullstop wrote: »

Hahahahahahaha. Your shtick just gets better and better

You have no argument.

fullstop · 10-11-2019 2:27pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

You have no argument.

Why would I ‘argue’ with barefaced lies?

HeidiHeidi · 10-11-2019 2:27pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I don't know if people who become guards are the right type of people to deal with mental health tbh. They don't have the right personality type. Not gentle or empathetic enough.

It's not the job of gardai to deal with mental health though. Their job is the enforce the law. They're not social workers, they're not doctors, they're not psychiatrists. And most of all they're not prison officers, in whose custody this unfortunate girl was when she took her life.

You're conflating an awful lot of roles in your rush to condemn.

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:29pm

fullstop wrote: »

Why would I ‘argue’ with barefaced lies?

Its perfectly normal to call over to a friend or a colleague you know is in trouble. Many people have done it the fact that its so far out of your world shows you might not be the person people turn to in those times.

Anyway prison officers are insensitive pricks.

HeidiHeidi · 10-11-2019 2:31pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Its perfectly normal to call over to a friend or a colleague you know is in trouble. Many people have done it the fact that its so far out of your world shows you might not be the person people turn to in those times.

Anyway prison officers are insensitive pricks.

The mask is starting to slip.....

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:31pm

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

It's not the job of gardai to deal with mental health though. Their job is the enforce the law. They're not social workers, they're not doctors, they're not psychiatrists. And most of all they're not prison officers, in whose custody this unfortunate girl was when she took her life.

You're conflating an awful lot of roles in your rush to condemn.

They don't need to be. They just need to make sure no one self harms or commits suicide in custody. Same with prison officers.

They don't need to cure her or even talk to her.

Guy:Incognito · 10-11-2019 2:31pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Well firstly any decent human being who isn't a piece of scum is supposed to look out for another human being.

And yes Garda are meant to look out for suicide for people in their custody.

Not only was it duty ..its being basic.

this article points to it

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/treatment-of-people-in-garda-custody-to-be-examined-1.4000460

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/justice/arrests/treatment_in_custody.html

Do you even read what you're replying to? Maybe go back to my post you replied to and give it another go.

fullstop · 10-11-2019 2:33pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Its perfectly normal to call over to a friend or a colleague you know is in trouble. Many people have done it the fact that its so far out of your world shows you might not be the person people turn to in those times.

Anyway prison officers are insensitive pricks.

Oh so the story changes now...

Hmm...

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:33pm

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

The mask is starting to slip.....

Good.

SmartinMartin · 10-11-2019 2:34pm

Don't be feeding the well known troll.

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:35pm

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Do you even read what you're replying tio? Maybe go back to my post you replied to and give it another go.

Not worth my time.

I have shown how it is the responsibility of both prison officers and guards to ensure the safety of those in custody.

I don't have time for trolling on such a sad issue its petty.

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:36pm

SmartinMartin wrote: »

Don't be feeding the well known troll.

So you are fine with people committing suicide in prison? Their own fault ..just let them?

No compassion.

Omackeral · 10-11-2019 2:37pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Then the prison officers are VERY responsible.

And you know this how? A minute ago it was all the Gardai's fault.

Checks are done intermittently by prison staff and even more frequently on those who are deemed to be under special observation but the sad reality is that if someone wants to kill themselves, they'll find a way. Checks on special obs are done every 15 minutes. It takes a moment to hang oneself.

Omackeral · 10-11-2019 2:39pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

Unless they are double jobbing as prison officers....

Then no they are most certainly not.

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

A lot of em are actually.

What this person said.

fullstop wrote: »

Christ. Get a clue, will you?

Guy:Incognito · 10-11-2019 2:39pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Not worth my time.

I have shown how it is the responsibility of both prison officers and guards to ensure the safety of those in custody.

I don't have time for trolling on such a sad issue its petty.

"I'm wrong so I wont engage"

You were specifically asked if the gardai should be checking prisons and you said yes.

Even in this case what should the gardai do after they hand her to the dochas centre, stay there too ?

fullstop · 10-11-2019 2:39pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Not worth my time.

I have shown how it is the responsibility of both prison officers and guards to ensure the safety of those in custody.

I don't have time for trolling on such a sad issue its petty.

The only thing you’ve shown is that you haven’t a ****ing clue.

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:40pm

Omackeral wrote: »

And you know this how? A minute ago it was all the Gardai's fault.

Checks are done intermittently by prison staff and even more frequently on those who are deemed to be under special observation but the sad reality is that if someone wants to kill themselves, they'll find a way. Checks on special obs are done every 15 minutes. It takes a moment to hang oneself.

Prison staff don't give a ****.

10-11-2019 2:41pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

So you are fine with people committing suicide in prison? Their own fault ..just let them?

No compassion.

where are you fine with people committing suicide?

list a few spots out there

Killinator · 10-11-2019 2:42pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I don't know if people who become guards are the right type of people to deal with mental health tbh. They don't have the right personality type. Not gentle or empathetic enough.

I don't think prison officers do either tbh. I think they would be rubbish at it.

At least you inadvertently admitted you don't know in this post.
If what you said was true then I wouldn't have talked a young lad off a bridge and another lad off train tracks, guess I imagined that.
I'm amazed you know so much about my personality, but then I should know better then to respond to your sh*te

Omackeral · 10-11-2019 2:42pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I don't know if people who become guards are the right type of people to deal with mental health tbh. They don't have the right personality type. Not gentle or empathetic enough.

I don't think prison officers do either tbh. I think they would be rubbish at it.

How can you tar thousands of people with the one brush? It's not a hive mind. The people in these jobs come from all different backgrounds and are different ages, genders and nationalities. Mental health awareness is a massive part of training and courses are run all the time to keep staff up to date.

Educate yourself, you're ridiculously ignorant.

fullstop · 10-11-2019 2:42pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Prison staff don't give a ****.

Look, if your time in prison was tough, that’s unfortunate. But presumably you’ve paid your debt to society, so move on.

ILoveYourVibes · 10-11-2019 2:42pm

fullstop wrote: »

The only thing you’ve shown is that you haven’t a ****ing clue.

If you think prison staff give a **** you haven't a clue. Its all a joke to them.

They do be drunk half the time.

50% of the time they don't do nightchecks.
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/jail-staff-drunk-on-duty-and-not-doing-night-checks-says-director-of-prisons-38298546.html

Omackeral · 10-11-2019 2:43pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

You have no argument.

You thing Gardai are double jobbing as Prison Officers. It's you who has no argument... or clue.

HeidiHeidi · 10-11-2019 2:44pm

Ah lads, they're clearly trolling at this stage.....

Omackeral · 10-11-2019 2:44pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Anyway prison officers are insensitive pricks.

Some are. Some are the nicest people you could meet. Some are somewhere in the middle. Imagine that.

A young women's suicide

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