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ex wont let me move my daughter out of dublin but i cant afford to stay

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24

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    #32
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,467 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    OP is struggling to support herself and her child, OP is doing all the childcare. The ex partner won't help despite them not having enough to eat and does little to no parenting of the child, and goes out all weekend.
    He doesn't pay maintenance or contribute towards the costs of their child.
    He has told OP he wishes she was dead.

    This would give me the impression he actually isn't all that interested in the welfare of his child, and is using said child as a means to exert control over OP.
    He knows remaining in the house is making her miserable, therefore he is manipulating her into staying.

    The atmosphere is toxic, there is no benefit in staying in the house together. Why would he want OP to stay, unless it was to make her miserable? Especially if she has no claim to the house as he says, why would he leave her live there?

    If he had the best interests of his child at heart he would be doing everything he could to ensure a good joint custody arrangement could be come to that would benefit them both.

    He isn't willing to play ball or communicate, so OP has no choice but to leave and go down the legal route.

    Someone certainly wants to have their cake and eat it, but its not the OP.

    Maybe I am blind.

    Where is the bit about him being out all weekend? and about OP not having enough to eat?

    I just cant see it.

    As I pointed out - food is one of MANY bills in a house. OP is paying for food. What about the rest of them.


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    #33
    Captain Chaos
    Registered Users Posts: 11,174 ✭✭✭✭Captain Chaos


    Tombo2001 wrote: »
    Maybe I am blind.

    Where is the bit about him being out all weekend? and about OP not having enough to eat?

    I just cant see it.

    As I pointed out - food is one of MANY bills in a house. OP is paying for food. What about the rest of them.

    In post number 4


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    #34
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,467 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    sarahg89 wrote: »
    he loves his daughter
    but would rather I was dead. his words. he would love me to just go away and leave her with him yet he never lifts a finger to help. he lives the bachelor life doing what he wants and when. out every sat and sun. no interest in doing anything with her
    super controlling.
    is happy to continue as we are as she is in the house with him but its a toxic enviroment

    Apologies all.

    I missed this post.

    Yes, this is abusive.


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    #35
    salmocab
    Registered Users Posts: 11,283 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    AulWan wrote: »
    The op works part time, and presumably also receives the monthly child benefit payment (and ECCE?) for the child, so I doubt she is starving.

    In cases like these, there are always two sides to the story and the truth usually lies somewhere in between both.

    The OP actually said in her first post that he is a good father.

    Nobody receives ECCE it goes to a crèche, a child receives a place in a crèche or other childcare facility, there is no cash.


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    #36
    AulWan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,653 ✭✭✭AulWan


    The OP said he was out every Sat and Sun. She did not mention it was to go drinking.

    If the atmosphere in the home is as toxic as she describes, then he probably goes out to escape the atmosphere.

    Instead of automatically jumping to the conclusion that he is the villain of the piece, maybe consider that he is most likely just as miserable and caught in this situation is the woman is.

    Only with the added threat that his former partner is threatening to remove his child, (that the OP states he loves and is a good father too) and move her hours away from him.


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    #37
    red petal
    Registered Users Posts: 132 ✭✭red petal


    Although it would be extremely hard, I would up and leave. If you are not working, you will not need to use childcare until you get another job. He cannot stop you moving out especially if he is not there when you do it. Sounds like he has no intentions on taking you seriously while you are there. He seems very controlling and that's really not a good environment for your child.


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    #38
    .......
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    sarahg89 wrote: »
    He is covering the mortgage now and because of that he doesn't do anything else despite being on at least 6 times my salary. I am not asking for money for hair and nails. i would like money for food! to mind my daughter!

    This is where the OP said she would like money for food.


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    #39
    AulWan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,653 ✭✭✭AulWan


    salmocab wrote: »
    Nobody receives ECCE it goes to a crèche, a child receives a place in a crèche or other childcare facility, there is no cash.

    Fine, the ECCE payment goes to the creche, reducing the overall childcare cost.

    Swings and roundabouts.

    So the OP pays for part time child care, and with a three year old, presumably with ECCE deduction.


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    #40
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    AulWan wrote: »
    The OP said he was out every Sat and Sun. She did not mention it was to go drinking.

    If the atmosphere in the home is as toxic as she describes, then he probably goes out to escape the atmosphere.

    Instead of automatically jumping to the conclusion that he is the villain of the piece, maybe consider that he is most likely just as miserable and caught in this situation is the woman is.

    Only with the added threat that his former partner is threatening to remove his child, (that the OP states he loves and is a good father too) and move her hours away from him.

    She can't stay there forever, the current arrangement isn't working for anyone.
    Everyone is unhappy.
    She only works part time and she can't afford Dublin rent on that income.
    Bar going to live with her parents, what other possible solutions are there?

    OP would appear to be the main caregiver of the child so leaving the child with dad while she goes home to her parents isn't even an option, because presumably he works while OP does the creche drop offs/pick ups.

    If he was willing to negotiate and compromise I'm sure they could have come up with an amicable solution to suit all (OP even said she doesn't object to guardianship) but he won't communicate.

    I really don't see what other options there are bar leaving with the child.


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    #41
    DellyBelly
    Registered Users Posts: 2,858 ✭✭✭DellyBelly


    If he is beating you then I think you need to just move. You really shouldn't put up wit hthis and neither should your child. Look after yourself.


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    #42
    dusty bin
    Registered Users Posts: 149 ✭✭dusty bin


    sarahg89 wrote: »
    he loves his daughter
    but would rather I was dead. his words    . he would love me to just go away and leave her with him yet he never lifts a finger to help. he lives the bachelor life doing what he wants and when. out every sat and sun. no interest in doing anything with her
    super controlling.
    is happy to continue as we are as she is in the house with him but its a toxic enviroment

    the bolded part above is pretty serious. Whether it was said as a passing comment or a actual threat, its still very serious. I'm sorry, but i'd be onto the guards.


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    #43
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,467 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    ....... wrote: »
    This is where the OP said she would like money for food.

    Indeed.

    What I read into this, is that OP would like her partner to contribute to food costs, which is different being in a position where she is hungry and doesnt have access to food.

    Her partner might turn around and say - well I pay for a hundred other things......why should I pay for that too.


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    #44
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,467 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    dusty bin wrote: »
    the bolded part above is pretty serious. Whether it was said as a passing comment or a actual threat, its still very serious. I'm sorry, but i'd be onto the guards.

    Its a tricky one.....the guards come and visit; have a word with yer man.

    OP is still living there the next day. A toxic situation gets more toxic.

    I dont have experience in these matters; but I would be thinking Womens Aid as a first port of call.


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    #45
    salmocab
    Registered Users Posts: 11,283 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    AulWan wrote: »
    Fine, the ECCE payment goes to the creche, reducing the overall childcare cost.

    Swings and roundabouts.

    So the OP pays for part time child care, and with a three year old, presumably with ECCE deduction.

    She might be dropping to a child minder with no ECCE, not sure if she said. Anyway as with all these threads all people can do is take them at face value. If the OP is lying about things then any advice she gets is bad and she’s wasting her own time, however if she is telling the truth she is more likely to get good useable advice. Not much good will come of saying there are two sides, everyone knows there is but in the absence of the other side everyone will offer advice on what they’ve read.


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    #46
    AulWan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,653 ✭✭✭AulWan


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    She can't stay there forever, the current arrangement isn't working for anyone.
    Everyone is unhappy.
    She only works part time and she can't afford Dublin rent on that income.
    Bar going to live with her parents, what other possible solutions are there?

    OP would appear to be the main caregiver of the child so leaving the child with dad isn't even an option, because presumably he works while OP does the creche drop offs/pick ups.

    If he was willing to negotiate and compromise I'm sure they could have come up with an amicable solution to suit all (OP even said she doesn't object to guardianship) but he won't communicate.

    I really don't see what other options there are.

    Why isn't Dad having day-to-day custody and mother having access rights an option? Many single mothers work full time and have day-to-day custody of their children and nobody questions that. So why not a father? The default position should be 50:50, but that is not possible if the child lives hours away.

    The OPs partner is not stopping her from moving away, he is stopping her from taking their child with her. Emphasis on their.

    In the father's shoes, I would definitely take it to court to prevent my child being taken away.

    OP even said she doesn't object to guardianship?!?

    Well how very gracious of her!

    Guardianship is not hers to give or remove. This is equally his child too and given the change in the law in 2015, he already has guardianship.


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    #47
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,467 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    I think - with apologies to OP - we have all been a bit distracted with aspects of what she has said.

    The core point being made is:

    OP has decided to move back to here parents. He is objecting.

    Your question - to remind people - is 'what the f. do I do'?

    Maybe ask the question differently. What specifically do you want to know?


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    #48
    .......
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    Tombo2001 wrote: »
    Indeed.

    What I read into this, is that OP would like her partner to contribute to food costs, which is different being in a position where she is hungry and doesnt have access to food.

    Her partner might turn around and say - well I pay for a hundred other things......why should I pay for that too.

    Well if the OP works part time and pays all child related expenses and the ex earns 6 times as much as her, I think it is a reasonable inference that she is struggling financially.

    I mean, she is using legal aid and cannot afford to move out and clearly states that she would like help with food and childcare.

    Why would anyone who lives in a shared environment with their ex and child not make ANY financial contribution to childcare and groceries when they earn so much more than the part time working partner - if not to use it against them? Financial abuse is abuse.

    On top of telling her he would prefer if she were dead - its a very bleak picture.


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    #49
    .......
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    AulWan wrote: »
    Why isn't Dad having day-to-day custody and mother having access rights an option?

    It would be very unusual in Ireland for a mother not to be given full custody, particularly in light of the things that have been posted.


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    #50
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    AulWan wrote: »
    Why isn't Dad having day-to-day custody and mother having access rights an option? Many single mothers work full time and have day-to-day custody of their children and nobody questions that. So why not a father? The default position should be 50:50, but that is not possible if the child lives hours away.

    The OPs partner is not stopping her from moving away, he is stopping her from taking their child with her. Emphasis on their.

    In the father's shoes, I would definitely take it to court to prevent my child being taken away.

    OP even said she doesn't object to guardianship?!?

    Well how very gracious of her!

    Guardianship is not hers to give or remove. This is equally his child too and given the change in the law in 2015, he already has guardianship.

    I would presume if that were possible or indeed if Dad actually wanted that he'd have put plans in motion to have that arrangement in place by now.

    He'd have reduced his hours to involve himself in the childcare so that a judge would look favourably upon a man who was making a good case for having sole custody.
    OP has said he lives a batchelors lifestyle so I'm not sure how full time parenting would fit in with that.
    Regardless, she's doing all the donkey work. She's paying for everything and doing all the childcare and rearing, so why should she be the one with weekend access?

    Thus far, it seems he is completely inflexible and not offering any compromises, just a blanket "you're not taking my child" with no consideration for the toxic environment in the house, or what the plan going forward for the future would be.
    He doesn't seem bothered. Its all about control.

    If he actually wanted to resolve the issue I'm sure by this point (over 2 years) he'd have played ball and offered at least one solution they might be able to agree on but it seems no.
    He wishes her dead but won't let her go? OP has no choice but to leave.


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    #51
    CelticRambler
    Registered Users Posts: 6,695 ✭✭✭CelticRambler


    Sounds like both parents need time apart from each other, and it sounds like the OP needs to go for a long walk on her own in the mountains or somewhere well-removed from what has become her everyday life. So find a way to do that on the cheap, give the father a week's notice, and tell him that that's how it's going to be from now on if he looks for 50-50 custody.


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    #52
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    And just to add to the above, if sole custody with weekend access for OP was something her ex partner wanted, he'd be splitting costs, doing his fair share of childcare, helping with household items such as food, changing his schedule so he's available for drop offs, doing weekend activities with the child and not telling OP he wishes she was dead.

    His actions are not that of a desperate man concerned about his daughters welfare, devastated at the thoughts of her moving away.

    No judge is going to look favourably on a man who has carried on the way he has so he can't be all that bothered about access to his child, let alone sole custody.


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    #53
    miamee
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators Posts: 11,992 Mod ✭✭✭✭miamee


    AulWan wrote: »
    Why isn't Dad having day-to-day custody and mother having access rights an option? Many single mothers work full time and have day-to-day custody of their children and nobody questions that. So why not a father? The default position should be 50:50, but that is not possible if the child lives hours away.

    From OP's posts, her partner doesn't even manage to share tasks relating to his child 50:50 while living in the same house. I fail to see how living a few hours away could make this any worse.


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    #54
    AulWan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,653 ✭✭✭AulWan


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    I would presume if that were possible or indeed if Dad actually wanted that he'd have put plans in motion to have that arrangement in place by now.

    He'd have reduced his hours to involve himself in the childcare so that a judge would look favourably upon a man who was making a good case for having sole custody.
    OP has said he lives a batchelors lifestyle so I'm not sure how full time parenting would fit in with that.
    Regardless, she's doing all the donkey work. She's paying for everything and doing all the childcare and rearing, so why should she be the one with weekend access?

    Thus far, it seems he is completely inflexible and not offering any compromises, just a blanket "you're not taking my child" with no consideration for the toxic environment in the house, or what the plan going forward for the future would be.
    He doesn't seem bothered. Its all about control.

    If he actually wanted to resolve the issue I'm sure by this point (over 2 years) he'd have played ball and offered at least one solution they might be able to agree on but it seems no.
    He wishes her dead but won't let her go? OP has no choice but to leave.

    I think you're making a hell of a lot of assumptions there. The mother is already on part time hours, if he also went to part time hours, how would the bills be paid?

    Because on a part time wage, there is no way the OP is paying 50% of shared costs, which means he is most likely paying more then his fair share of the mortgage, the utilities, and so on.

    There is only liability to maintain a spouse if they are married, and the OP has not clarified if they are. If they are not married, his only liability is to cover half the household and half of his child's costs.

    Saying he wishes she was dead sounds like an emotional statement to me, not a threat of harm. I didn't read anywhere that he is forcing her to stay, just that he will not consent to her removing their child, which is within his rights.

    Anyway, the first step should not have been solicitors, it should have been the family mediation service, and the OP may be surprised to find that father's do actually have rights and a say when it comes to their children, including where they live.


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    #55
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    AulWan wrote: »
    I think you're making a hell of a lot of assumptions there. The mother is already on part time hours, if he also went to part time hours, how would the bills be paid?

    Because on a part time wage, there is no way the OP is paying 50% of shared costs, which means he is most likely paying the mortgage, the utilities, and so on.

    There is only liability to maintain a spouse if they are married, and the OP has not clarified if they are. If they are not married, his only liability is to cover half the household and half of his child's costs.

    Saying he wishes she was dead and she sounds like an emotional statement to me, not a threat of harm. I didn't read anywhere that he is forcing her to stay, just that he will not consent to her removing the child, which is within his rights.

    Anyway, the first step should not have been solicitors, it should have been the family mediation service, and the OP may be surprised to find that father's do actually have rights and a say when it comes to their children.

    He currently makes little to no effort with parenting, he works full time and is gone Saturdays & Sundays.
    OP pays for everything for the child and does all the parenting and donkeywork that comes with raising a small child.
    Without doubt OP should have custody of their daughter.

    OP's ex is not carrying on like someone who has much interest in access, let alone full custody. He just doesn't want the child to leave the house, yet does nothing with the child when she's there?
    And you're arguing for his suitability for full time custody?


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    #56
    .......
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    AulWan wrote: »
    I think you're making a hell of a lot of assumptions there. The mother is already on part time hours, if he also went to part time hours, how would the bills be paid?

    So why doesnt he do things with his child when he isnt in work do you think? OP stated he was out every Sat and Sun.
    AulWan wrote: »
    Because on a part time wage, there is no way the OP is paying 50% of shared costs, which means he is most likely paying the mortgage, the utilities, and so on.

    The OP probably cant afford to work full time if she is expected to pay childcare solely.
    AulWan wrote: »
    There is only liability to maintain a spouse if they are married, and the OP has not clarified if they are. If they are not married, his only liability is to cover half the household and half of his child's costs.

    Thats not quite true. If you are talking about post break up the OP can now ask for the equivalent to spousal maintenance under the cohabitation act. Same way she can look for her share in the house. Basically the same types of things spouses can ask for.

    Before the household is separated I think you will find a judge will expect costs to be shared and that the financially worse off person is not being abused by the financially better off person.
    AulWan wrote: »
    Saying he wishes she was dead and she sounds like an emotional statement to me, not a threat of harm. I didn't read anywhere that he is forcing her to stay, just that he will not consent to her removing the child, which is within his rights.

    Sounds like a threat to me.

    You do not have to tie someone down to force them to stay - emotional abuse is just as real as physical. Please dont minimise this.
    AulWan wrote: »
    Anyway, the first step should not have been solicitors, it should have been the family mediation service, and the OP may be surprised to find that father's do actually have rights and a say when it comes to their children.

    And her ex may be surprised to find that his behaviour is going to cost him in terms of access when it goes to court. Swings and roundabouts.


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    #57
    AulWan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,653 ✭✭✭AulWan


    ....... wrote: »
    It would be very unusual in Ireland for a mother not to be given full custody, particularly in light of the things that have been posted.

    Unusual, but not impossible. One in seven single parent households in Ireland are fathers raising their children.

    Source


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    #58
    .......
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    AulWan wrote: »
    Unusual, but not impossible. One in seven single parent households in Ireland are fathers raising their children.

    Source

    Oh not impossible at all but if you dig into those figures you will find that they are mostly comprised of the following 3 demographics:

    The mother is dead.
    The mother is a junkie/in prison.
    The mother did not want the child.


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    #59
    .......
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    I think its important to say to the OP that there are people minimising what is going on in this thread, its a common feature on this website. Victim blaming.

    Please disregard it.

    What is currently going on it not right. And it is damaging you AND your child.

    Children who grow up in toxic environments perceive it early, as young as 3 or 4.

    It would be very very damaging for your daughter to grow up seeing her mother abused and held financially captive.


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    #60
    CelticRambler
    Registered Users Posts: 6,695 ✭✭✭CelticRambler


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    He currently makes little to no effort with parenting
    We don't know that; we only know that the OP said he's "not a bad father" - which might be a grudging acknowledgement that he does actually make an effort
    SusieBlue wrote: »
    he works full time
    Does he have any choice? Who else is going to pay the mortgage?
    SusieBlue wrote: »
    ... and is gone Saturdays & Sundays
    Well, we don't know that it's every Saturday and Sunday, but we do know the OP is seriously stressed, and maybe her ex appreciates gets out of her way at the weekends so as not to make things worse.
    SusieBlue wrote: »
    OP pays for everything for the child ...
    The father pays for her house, her bedroom, probably the heat & light she's used to, too.
    SusieBlue wrote: »
    ...and does all the parenting and donkeywork that comes with raising a small child.
    Does the father have any choice in the matter? Do we know whether the OP has volunteered to go back to work full-time so that father can work part-time? No, we don't.
    SusieBlue wrote: »
    Without doubt OP should have custody of their daughter.
    And, starting from a point of innocent till proven guilty, so should the father.

    AulWan's assumptions were all perfectly valid, because we know precious little about the situation other than that the OP is stressed and wants to go back to live with her parents (or maybe not).


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    #61
    AulWan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,653 ✭✭✭AulWan


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    He currently makes little to no effort with parenting, he works full time and is gone Saturdays & Sundays.

    Probably staying out of her way to avoid creating more tension!
    SusieBlue wrote: »
    OP pays for everything for the child and does all the parenting and donkeywork that comes with raising a small child.

    As already posted, highly doubtful she pays for everything or even half of everything on a part time wage.
    SusieBlue wrote: »
    Without doubt OP should have custody of their daughter.

    And you've come to that conclusion on the basis of one post without hearing the other side of the story? Wow.
    SusieBlue wrote: »
    OP's ex is not carrying on like someone who has much interest in access, let alone full custody. He just doesn't want the child to leave the house, yet does nothing with the child when she's there?
    And you're arguing for his suitability for full time custody?

    He is acting exactly like someone who is in an unhappy relationship and is also confused about how to move forward. Just because you interpret that as disinterest, does not make it a fact.

    I'm not arguing his suitability for full time custody, I'm arguing that he shouldn't automatically be considered like some kind of second class parent and caregiver because he works full time. If that was the case, every parent who works full time is less of a caregiver. He deserves to be recognised as his child's parent on an equal basis to the mother instead of it just being presumed that she should have full custody because she is the mother.


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