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Iran Did Do It..............says Trump

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Comments

  • #632
    Kimsang
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,170 ✭✭✭Kimsang


    That's the problem with the victim-perpetrator mentality. Its far too simplistic and overlooks many, many things.


  • #633
    Gringo180
    Registered Users Posts: 9,205 ✭✭✭Gringo180


    Havent seen much mentioned in the media about Israels bombing of Damascus and Homs yesterday killing at least 16 people including a babyand wounding 21. These strikes coming from Lebanese airspace. It seems the Israeli's can do what they like without facing any consequences from the west.

    Zero mention on the BBC or Sky News.


  • #634
    Franz Von Peppercorn II
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn II


    notobtuse wrote: »
    I read the reporting. Are you saying The New York Times, and most of the other well-respected media outlets, provides us with fake news?

    Yes. They lied.

    But so what. Let isrel defend itself if Iran invades which it won’t.


  • #635
    Franz Von Peppercorn II
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn II


    notobtuse wrote: »
    By all means say what you want... we've become accustomed to negative opinions from people who rely so heavily on us. It's just human nature, I figure. And everyone's allowed their opinions.

    You’ve managed to destabilise Europe twice over the last 5 years. Nor do we depend on you. Trump is right about that if nothing else.


  • #636
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    Havent seen much mentioned in the media about Israels bombing of Damascus and Homs yesterday

    Zero mention on the BBC or Sky News.


    They actually did on both ,

    It's such a regular occurrence it's not making breaking news headlines but it still gets mentioned

    They even showed the Syrian missile that accidentally hit the island of Cyprus ,
    Russian planes , foreign islands there not exactly great at shooting at **** they're not supposed to
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  • #637
    Gringo180
    Registered Users Posts: 9,205 ✭✭✭Gringo180


    Gatling wrote: »
    They actually did on both ,

    It's such a regular occurrence it's not making breaking news headlines but it still gets mentioned

    They even showed the Syrian missile that accidentally hit the island of Cyprus ,
    Russian planes , foreign islands there not exactly great at shooting at **** they're not supposed to

    Any chance of a link to the report?


  • #638
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    Any chance of a link to the report?

    bbc and sky news

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/russian-missile-hits-northern-cyprus-near-village-says-official-11752330

    "Syrian state media said Israeli warplanes fired missiles from Lebanese airspace at military positions in the central province of Homs and suburbs of the capital, killing four civilians and wounding 21."

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-middle-east-48824500

    said the missiles had hit a research centre and a military ahttps://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-middle-east-48824500irport in the Homs area used by Iranian personnel and fighters from Lebanon's Hezbollah movement.


    Video caption Syrian state media has released footage of what appears to be missiles being intercepted
    Near Damascus, a base hosting Iran's Islamic Revolution Guards Corp (IRGC) and a research facility in Jamraya were struck, it added.




    "Syria's state-run Sana news agency said four civilians had been killed, while the SOHR said six civilians and nine militia fighters, eight of them foreign nationals, died".




    Oh but wait sky news or BBC didn't report it seems someone's peddling false news


    It was also on live TV too for sky and bbc
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  • #639
    Gringo180
    Registered Users Posts: 9,205 ✭✭✭Gringo180


    Gatling wrote: »
    bbc and sky news

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/russian-missile-hits-northern-cyprus-near-village-says-official-11752330

    "Syrian state media said Israeli warplanes fired missiles from Lebanese airspace at military positions in the central province of Homs and suburbs of the capital, killing four civilians and wounding 21."

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-middle-east-48824500

    said the missiles had hit a research centre and a military ahttps://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-middle-east-48824500irport in the Homs area used by Iranian personnel and fighters from Lebanon's Hezbollah movement.


    Video caption Syrian state media has released footage of what appears to be missiles being intercepted
    Near Damascus, a base hosting Iran's Islamic Revolution Guards Corp (IRGC) and a research facility in Jamraya were struck, it added.




    "Syria's state-run Sana news agency said four civilians had been killed, while the SOHR said six civilians and nine militia fighters, eight of them foreign nationals, died".




    Oh but wait sky news or BBC didn't report it seems someone's peddling false news


    It was also on live TV too for sky and bbc

    Wow. How biased are those headlines. Nothing of the Isráelis first strike in Syria killing and wounding scores of civilians in the headlines.


  • #640
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    Havent seen much mentioned in the media about Israels bombing of Damascus and Homs yesterday killing at least 16 people including a babyand wounding 21. These strikes coming from Lebanese airspace. It seems the Israeli's can do what they like without facing any consequences from the west.

    Zero mention on the BBC or Sky News.

    Iran has made the choice to not fire back right now. They know any attack on Israel would drag in the US military.

    Israel bombs stuff in Syria, but not sure if they are degrading Iran and Hezbollah expansion plans. If they are doing so often it probably not too successful.


  • #641
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    notobtuse wrote: »
    That possibility is more alarming than what Trump tweets. Is it really worth the long-term consequences of buying into what Instex does in the short-term? I don’t think Israel can take a 10% chance of 100% annihilation from a country that continues to advocate for them being wiped off the map and has been working on developing ‘the bomb.’ Iran is fortifying the defenses of their nuclear sites, and they may soon be nearly impossible to destroy. If an attack by Israel happens on their enrichment facilities (know and unknown to the IAEA) it will probably be in the next couple of months. Will running an end-around US sanctions be worth it then?

    On Sunday is the real announcement. They plan to hit 20 per cent enrichment. This is when Israel and US will be really annoyed. Going from 20 per cent to 90 per cent (weapongrade) only takes a few months, if they do a crash fast program. Of course if you believe the US and Israel they are planning on building a nuclear weapon.

    Obama made the deal to prevent a strike. It well known now Israel was planning a strike on Iran and was what lead Obama to sign the deal. Israel reckless bombing would have dragged the United States into a new war.


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  • #642
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    Wow. How biased are those headlines.

    But you claimed it wasn't reported at all .

    So claiming biased reporting offers even less credibility


    Scores of civilians killed according to who ?

    4 according to Syrian news
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • #643
    Gringo180
    Registered Users Posts: 9,205 ✭✭✭Gringo180


    Gatling wrote: »
    But you claimed it wasn't reported at all .

    So claiming biased reporting offers even less credibility


    Scores of civilians killed according to who ?

    4 according to Syrian news

    Haaretz just to name a few. I googled Isráeli attack on Syria and nothing came up in the search referencing yesterdays attack. What did you type into google to bring up those links?

    Its like reporting on missiles attacking Isráel from Gaza and the main headline being "Iron Dome rockets fired from Tel Aviv hit Lebanese mountain" :pac:

    Its there to mislead people.


  • #644
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »
    On Sunday is the real announcement. They plan to hit 20 per cent enrichment. This is when Israel and US will be really annoyed. Going from 20 per cent to 90 per cent (weapongrade) only takes a few months, if they do a crash fast program. Of course if you believe the US and Israel they are planning on building a nuclear weapon.

    Obama made the deal to prevent a strike. It well known now Israel was planning a strike on Iran and was what lead Obama to sign the deal. Israel reckless bombing would have dragged the United States into a new war.

    Obama made that terrible deal with Iran because.... Israel? Where do you come up with this stuff?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • #645
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Obama made that terrible deal with Iran because.... Israel? Where do you come up with this stuff?

    Yes Obama disliked Netanyahu and he signed the Iranian deal with other European powers, China and Russia to stop Israel from starting a war. If Obama listened to Israel there would be no deal in 2015.

    Was not a terrible deal. All enrichment was watched closely by IAEA. They hated the deal because it allowed the Iranians to keep building missiles for defence. Israel wants Iran to be defenceless and be weak miitarily. Iran was not going allow inspections of their military sites. Israel is seeking to destroy the regime, the nuclear threat just part of the game.


  • #646
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »
    Yes Obama disliked Netanyahu and he signed the Iranian deal with other European powers, China and Russia to stop Israel from starting a war. If Obama listened to Israel there would be no deal in 2015.

    Was not a terrible deal. All enrichment was watched closely by IAEA. They hated the deal because it allowed the Iranians to keep building missiles for defence. Israel wants Iran to be defenceless and be weak miitarily. Iran was not going allow inspections of their military sites. Israel is seeking to destroy the regime, the nuclear threat just part of the game.
    So it's an opinion on your part. I'm okay with opinions.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • #647
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    notobtuse wrote: »
    So it's an opinion on your part. I'm okay with opinions.

    It not just an opinion. Israel has always stated the deal did not go far enough, and they wanted military site inspections and Iran ballistic program to end. There not a shrewd of evidence Iran enchriched Uranium in secret. Be next to impossible with inspectors watching the sites full time.


  • #648
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »
    It not just an opinion. Israel has always stated the deal did not go far enough, and they wanted military site inspections and Iran ballistic program to end. There not a shrewd of evidence Iran enchriched Uranium in secret. Be next to impossible with inspectors watching the sites full time.

    Then can you show me a source to back up your claim? Also, Iran does not allow the IAEA to inspect military bases where enriched uranium might be stored or any clandestine enrichment plants. The IAEA can only report on what Iran allows them to report on.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • #649
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Then can you show me a source to back up your claim? Also, Iran does not allow the IAEA to inspect military bases where enriched uranium might be stored or any clandestine enrichment plants. The IAEA can only report on what Iran allows them to report on.

    Iran had to announce all nuclear sites under the deal. Can you point me to where this secret enrichment facility is in Iran? I fairly certain their be gases and heat signatores detected if Iran was secretly building a weapon. They never tested a bomb either. It all just speculation.

    Israel made a big deal of that raid in Iran, and what they show a nuclear program yes, but it all contained documents are from the 90s. There was not a single secret document from 2000 and beyond. I not buying Iran building a bomb till someone shows proof.

    Iran does have to open up its miltary sites for inspection, a soverign country has every right to protect itself.


  • #650
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »
    Iran had to announce all nuclear sites under the deal. Can you point me to where this secret enrichment facility is in Iran? I fairly certain their be gases and heat signatores detected if Iran was secretly building a weapon. They never tested a bomb either. It all just speculation.

    Israel made a big deal of that raid in Iran, and what they show a nuclear program yes, but it all contained documents are from the 90s. There was not a single secret document from 2000 and beyond. I not buying Iran building a bomb till someone shows proof.

    Iran does have to open up its miltary sites for inspection, a soverign country has every right to protect itself.
    Here's a report on one... You don't need much to turn low grade uranium into bomb capable material.

    http://isis-online.org/isis-reports/detail/the-fordow-enrichment-plant-aka-al-ghadir

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • #651
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Here's a report on one... You don't need much to turn low grade uranium into bomb capable material.

    http://isis-online.org/isis-reports/detail/the-fordow-enrichment-plant-aka-al-ghadir

    A site that IAEA is aware of and reported nothing. If was doing nefarious things in the past is irrelevent.


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  • #652
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »
    A site that IAEA is aware of and reported nothing. If was doing nefarious things in the past is irrelevent.
    Nefarious actions in the past is quite relevant.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • #653
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Nefarious actions in the past is quite relevant.

    Iran declared the site and inspectors have been there. It not like Iran told them to go away and all mysterious. It just intelligence speculation this underground facility in Fordo was designed to make 1 or 2 bombs a year. Israel and US have never shown this to be true, so i not sure why you keep pushing the narrative ran was building a bomb still after the 2015 agreement was signed?


  • #654
    Franz Von Peppercorn II
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn II


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Obama made that terrible deal with Iran because.... Israel? Where do you come up with this stuff?

    Israel has a fair amount of influence in US policy making, as does Saudi.

    Israel was of course opposed to the Iranian deal but the claim was that Obama didn’t want them to attack.


  • #655
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »
    Iran declared the site and inspectors have been there. It not like Iran told them to go away and all mysterious. It just intelligence speculation this underground facility in Fordo

    So we know Iran supposedly removed nuclear materials from Fordo in 2015 but in 2016 they apparently added more defence systems and new air defences too , which would suggest something is still very valuable they want protecting.

    But you cannot claim Iran don't have facilities that's are not declared you simply can't ,
    Giving opinion is one thing claiming it's fact Iran don't have undeclared facilities is wrong
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • #656
    GooglePlus
    Registered Users Posts: 2,010 ✭✭✭GooglePlus


    What are the potential risks involved in striking an enrichment facility in terms of radioactive fallout?

    Is it at a stage where it could be hazardous or no?


  • #657
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    US VP Pence was called back to Washington for an "undisclosed emergency". At the same time Putin called an urgent meeting with defense chiefs hours after 14 sailors died in a mystery submarine blast. Reports are coming out of domestic terror attacks here on the fourth of July holiday. And it seems Israel is weighing options over Iran's increased uranium stockpiles. Something seems to be going on.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • #658
    GooglePlus
    Registered Users Posts: 2,010 ✭✭✭GooglePlus


    notobtuse wrote: »
    US VP Pence was called back to Washington for an "undisclosed emergency". At the same time Putin called an urgent meeting with defense chiefs hours after 14 sailors died in a mystery submarine blast. Reports are coming out of domestic terror attacks here on the fourth of July holiday. And it seems Israel is weighing options over Iran's increased uranium stockpiles. Something seems to be going on.

    Any links?


  • #659
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    GooglePlus wrote: »
    Any links?

    A quick few...
    https://apnews.com/5bb92f50d9f64d46a0c26e78dc0eae44?
    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9421808/vladimir-putin-defence-mike-pence-air-force-washington/
    https://abcnews.go.com/US/domestic-terrorists-target-july-holiday-events-federal-authorities/story?id=64038406
    https://www.pri.org/stories/2019-06-21/israel-could-strike-first-tensions-iran-flare

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • #660
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    notobtuse wrote: »
    US VP Pence was called back to Washington for an "undisclosed emergency". At the same time Putin called an urgent meeting with defense chiefs hours after 14 sailors died in a mystery submarine blast. Reports are coming out of domestic terror attacks here on the fourth of July holiday. And it seems Israel is weighing options over Iran's increased uranium stockpiles. Something seems to be going on.

    Pence asked to return to the white house is interesting. If trump is recieving new intelligence pence would have to be there. It very unlikely its minor thing they asked him to return for, we have to wait and see. You never know with Trump white house though?

    It very unlikely about the incident in Russia, unless there was a radition leak or someway, highly unlikely in my opinion, there was incident with Nato forces lead to this incident?


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  • #661
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

    It very unlikely about the incident in Russia, unless there was a radition leak or someway, highly unlikely in my opinion, there was incident with Nato forces lead to this incident?

    If NATO was involved we wouldn't be talking about a fire on a submarine we would discussing the loss of another russian submarine,

    But that's all conspiracy theory face it the russian navy aren't exactly known for their safety record nearly sinking their own antique carrier in dry dock recently says it all,
    And the multiple fires aboard russian submarines over the last 20+ years
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




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