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Waterford Politics MEGATHREAD

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24567…63

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    #32
    sparkling sea
    Registered Users Posts: 1,410 ✭✭✭sparkling sea


    robp wrote: »
    In other words healthy women are usually not at risk but women with problems are at increased risk. Unless I am misreading this?

    Women with problems are at increased risk no matter what they decided to do - pregnancy, giving birth to a child you don't want, keeping and rearing a child can all be mental health triggers


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    #33
    28064212
    Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭28064212


    robp wrote: »
    The most up to date papers verify this link in certain conditions is one example.
    Firstly, 2004 is not "the most up to date papers". Secondly, that paper isn't available online as far I can see. And thirdly, can you please identify what relevance it has to the discussion? It certainly doesn't "verify this link" as you claim. What it says is that pregnancy was not recorded as a contributory cause of death in many cases. It is a paper on the methods of identifying deaths that may be associated with any kind of pregnancy
    robp wrote: »
    Simple causality is not going on but the data is hinting something.
    Back to woolly statements about nothing. Make a clear argument
    robp wrote: »
    The APA report even agreed with my concluding remark, thats its too simplistic to expect all the answers at this stage. As we sift through this one unpopular paper we are forgetting that the NCCMH Steering group concluded

    In other words healthy women are usually not at risk but women with problems are at increased risk. Unless I am misreading this?
    As posted above, you are wrong. "When a woman has an unwanted pregnancy, rates of mental health problems will be largely unaffected whether she has an abortion or goes on to give birth". Women with problems are at increased risk regardless of whether they have an abortion or carry it to full term

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    #34
    jayboi
    Registered Users Posts: 752 ✭✭✭jayboi


    Anyway the time has come to close this thread as the protesters are long gone the discussion off on a different direction altogether.


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    #35
    wellboytoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,081 ✭✭✭wellboytoo


    Reading any discussion on this subject always makes me lose the will to live after one page, there are always such huge gaps between the parties.never healthy always a sad ending, train crash.


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    #36
    fasttalkerchat
    Registered Users Posts: 5,652 ✭✭✭fasttalkerchat


    Meatwad wrote: »
    Throw eggs at em......

    Unfertilised eggs of course!


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    #37
    Panzer Paddy
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭Panzer Paddy


    These anti abortion posters are a disgrace and so are the people behind them. What would happen if you wanted to put up a big pro abortion poster or have a pro abortion protest. I bet you wouldn't be allowed.. Disgrace.


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    #38
    Ellis Dee
    Registered Users Posts: 2,512 ✭✭✭Ellis Dee


    deisemum wrote: »
    ---

    They're not even thinking of the welfare of the existing children if they think it's acceptable to shock them with these graphic images.


    That crowd of religious fundamentalist zealots have never thought of the welfare of existing children, never will.:rolleyes:

    The bee in their bonnet is all about what they quaintly call "the unborn". For them, even a few cells in the womb deserves total protection, and I suppose they are confident the sky fairy will take care of everything after you croak ...:D

    Although the time in between birth and death still needs more than a bit of fine-tuning, they couldn't care less about it.:rolleyes:

    Although I support freedom of expression, it has to be within reason, and it has to be weighed against another fundamental right: the right of children not be be exposed to foetus pornography.:(

    I wonder would the authorities be quicker to invoke "behaviour likely to cause public disorder" and step in if someone was displaying pictures of naked nubile (and alive) young women?:confused:


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    #39
    Am Chile
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,025 ✭✭✭Am Chile


    My sister who was in town yesterday afternoon had a bit to say about the anti abortion protesters in town yesterday -I heard there was a few anti abortion protesters outside the post office on arundel square-there was two of them sitting down with a petition and about 3 to 4 of them standing out around the footpath in a line with graphic anti abortion posters that came across as right in peoples face-did anyone else see these anti abortion protesters in town yesterday?


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    #40
    fiesty lady
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭fiesty lady


    yes I saw them two old guys harassing everyone passing by ! I asked him had he ever been pregnant and desperate, he didn't bother replying!


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    #41
    roxyworldgirl
    Registered Users Posts: 291 ✭✭roxyworldgirl


    I saw these people and walked straight past the men but wasn't harassed what so ever.. was barely acknowledged once I said no thanks?


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    #42
    Max Powers
    Registered Users Posts: 3,510 ✭✭✭Max Powers


    fiesty lady wrote: »
    yes I saw them two old guys harassing everyone passing by ! I asked him had he ever been pregnant and desperate, he didn't bother replying!

    Nice one Fiesty, you have to realise that some of these people are brainwashed by the catholic church, if they think its morally wrong to have an abortion, I wonder do they think the churches behaviour with abusing kids was morally wrong. I didnt see them on the streets about that. Generally they are old people stuck in the past or young people to immature to form a decent/balanced/educated opinion.


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    #43
    Dan133269
    Registered Users Posts: 1,229 ✭✭✭Dan133269


    I dare someone to go up to them, explain that you're a former foetus and you've fallen on hard times. Ask them if they could give you a couple of euro.


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    #44
    Max Powers
    Registered Users Posts: 3,510 ✭✭✭Max Powers


    I see councillor John Hearne (fair play to him) saying that the conferences that they attend are a complete waste of time/money.

    I hope something comes out of it, it reminds me of Mary Roches junket to East coast of USA, i was castigated on here for saying it was a waste of time/money, would not achieve anything that couldnt be achieved by a simple phone call. I dont think it has had any success. Mary O Hallorans trip with her husband is an even bigger disgrace. Im sure there are other cases.


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    #45
    wellboytoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,081 ✭✭✭wellboytoo


    It is an industry in itself,
    sure didn't SIPTU blow €4 million of the states money with no receipts in junkets all over the shop, or was that the CTU?


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    #46
    Baby4
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,407 ✭✭✭Baby4


    This post has been deleted.


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    #47
    Smiley Burnett
    Registered Users Posts: 511 ✭✭✭Smiley Burnett


    Max Powers wrote: »
    I see councillor John Hearne (fair play to him) saying that the conferences that they attend are a complete waste of time/money.

    I hope something comes out of it, it reminds me of Mary Roches junket to East coast of USA, i was castigated on here for saying it was a waste of time/money, would not achieve anything that couldnt be achieved by a simple phone call. I dont think it has had any success. Mary O Hallorans trip with her husband is an even bigger disgrace. Im sure there are other cases.

    sure weren't SF left with egg on their faces when they complained about a delegation from Waterford city council travelling to an event in order to get the tall ships event to return back to Waterford!!!

    best thing to happen Waterford in decades and they tried to get cheap headlines out of it!!


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    #48
    The Hill Billy
    Registered Users Posts: 22,746 ✭✭✭✭The Hill Billy


    I have set up a local feedback thread HERE. Please use that.

    tHB


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    #49
    Bards
    Registered Users Posts: 2,692 ✭✭✭Bards


    The Hill Billy wrote: »
    I have set up a local feedback thread HERE. Please use that.

    tHB

    P.S why is this "New" Feedback THread a hidden thread in the Waterford City Forum and not in Feedback where it belongs?


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    #50
    The Hill Billy
    Registered Users Posts: 22,746 ✭✭✭✭The Hill Billy


    Bards (in Feedback) wrote:
    ...Hey we're not even allowed to discuss the Pros and Cons of this decision in the actual Thread itself...
    No - this thread is for discussion of politics - not discussion of the thread itself.

    However, I have given you the option of discussing the thread & providing feedback in the Waterford City forum itself.

    tHB


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    #51
    Am Chile
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,025 ✭✭✭Am Chile


    I reading in waterford today online this week anti abortion protests tried to intimidate john halligan.
    Independent TD for Waterford, Deputy John Halligan in a hard-hitting and fortright statement has said attempts by local Pro Life acitivists to intimidate and coerce him last weekend have only strengthened his resolve to push for abortion legislation in cases of rape or severe foetal abnormalities.

    Deputy Halligan was referring to an altercation on the Prom in Tramore on Sunday in which a group of Pro-life activists approached him and in his own words "subjected me to abuse over my recent call for a constitutional referendum to legislate for abortion in rape cases and situations where a foetus is unviable."

    Commenting on the exchange on Sunday he said: "The exchange was quite sinister. At one point, one of the group told me I should ‘bury myself in a hole.’ I have no problem with reasonable debate on this issue but this was a busy afternoon with families with children all around. It was not the time nor the place.

    Later that night, at around midnight, Deputy Halligan said 16 pieces of literature signed by one of the activists were pushed through the letterbox of his Waterford city home.

    "I find it insensitive and offensive that anybody would think it is acceptable to come to my house after midnight to deliver this literature. I have already made my own views and position perfectly clear in the Dail. This attempt at intimidation will not work. If anything, it will strengthen my resolve on the matter."

    http://www.waterford-today.ie/waterford-today-news/19772-intimidation-attempts-won-t-change-my-views-john-halligan-td-19772.html

    I dont think this anti abortion group are doing themselves any favours abusing and trying to intimidate a public rep out in tramore on a busy afternoon with children and families around.


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    #52
    Cabaal
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    Am Chile wrote: »

    I dont think this anti abortion group are doing themselves any favours abusing and trying to intimidate a public rep out in tramore on a busy afternoon with children and families around.

    Anti-abortion crowds don't care,
    To them its fair game to protest even outside schools and show their posters to very young kids,

    They care all about the zygote but they couldn;t give a monkey's about the baby once its born, once it grows up and the life and well being of it if its a pregnant women.

    I've not seen protesters anytime I've been around Waterford or Kilkenny yet but I will be wasting their time when I do,


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    #53
    CuriousG
    Registered Users Posts: 420 ✭✭CuriousG


    Who cares???

    Everyone has their right to have an opinion and campaign for that opinion, including all of you.

    If it was something you were passionate about and someone gave out about it, you'd never hear the end of it.

    Opinions for all, except when it doesn't suit people...

    If you don't like them, ignore them. It's really that simple.


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    #54
    Cabaal
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    CuriousG wrote: »
    Who cares???

    Everyone has their right to have an opinion and campaign for that opinion, including all of you.

    If it was something you were passionate about and someone gave out about it, you'd never hear the end of it.

    Opinions for all, except when it doesn't suit people...

    If you don't like them, ignore them. It's really that simple.

    Normally I'd agree but there's a difference big between protesting and protesting by imitating people and spreading fear and lies.

    People should be under no illusions when it comes to the so called pro life crowd, they are very well funded from the USA and they take no prisoners to get what they want.


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    #55
    CuriousG
    Registered Users Posts: 420 ✭✭CuriousG


    Cabaal wrote: »
    Normally I'd agree but there's a difference big between protesting and protesting by imitating people and spreading fear and lies.

    People should be under no illusions when it comes to the so called pro life crowd, they are very well funded from the USA and they take no prisoners to get what they want.

    There are plenty of other organisations that act like that. They are funded from the US - And??? You would think it's a paramilitary we're talking about. 'Take no prisoners' They are a group of mostly older people with a passionate opinion, much like most people these days. There are people in this thread that have posted about THEIR political events etc and that was allowed, but just because it's something that isn't agreed with, it must be bad. Everyone should have their say.

    Not saying it's right, but as I said, if you don't like it, have nothing to do with it.

    If you are for abortion, fine. That's your right. It's theirs to be against it.

    They are usually two or three elderly people on the street, they hardly intimidate anyone. That's just dramatic. The definition of 'intimidating' these days is looking at someone the wrong way. Not actual intimidation.

    'Normally I'd agree, but....' Is just another way of saying you want everyone to have a fair say, unless you disagree.


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    #56
    mozattack
    Registered Users Posts: 1,908 ✭✭✭mozattack


    Anti abortion is the only way for a Catholic country where no-one has sex before marriage, no-one uses contraception and priests are lovely people who never did any harm to anyone.

    Oh wait a minute.


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    #57
    Cabaal
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    CuriousG wrote: »
    If you are for abortion, fine. That's your right. It's theirs to be against it.

    True,
    The problem with the pro-life crowd though is its applying a religious view onto none religious people.

    It cannot be compared to politics because unlike a political party/government religion changes with the speed of an iceage and you can't vote out the pope


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    #58
    CuriousG
    Registered Users Posts: 420 ✭✭CuriousG


    Cabaal wrote: »
    True,
    The problem with the pro-life crowd though is its applying a religious view onto none religious people.

    It cannot be compared to politics because unlike a political party/government religion changes with the speed of an iceage and you can't vote out the pope


    A good few of them are not religious in any way, can confirm that from experience.

    I am not Catholic and while I am not part of them/any organisation and have no plans to be, my opinions are from myself, I am against abortion on a personal level.

    Just because some people aren't religious doesn't mean the ones who are have to forfeit their right.

    This is meant to be a fair country, but just because people have a stigma (understandably) with the church, it is used to silence people who are entitled to their say aswell.


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    #59
    Not The Real Scarecrow
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,649 ✭✭✭Not The Real Scarecrow


    CuriousG wrote: »
    A good few of them are not religious in any way, can confirm that from experience.

    I am not Catholic and while I am not part of them/any organisation and have no plans to be, my opinions are from myself, I am against abortion on a personal level.

    Just because some people aren't religious doesn't mean the ones who are have to forfeit their right.

    This is meant to be a fair country, but just because people have a stigma (understandably) with the church, it is used to silence people who are entitled to their say aswell.

    If its fair then it should allow people to decide whats right for themselves with out the government or some one who doesn't agree with it dictating what some one should do to their own body. The main problem with the protesters is their inability to understand that just because they beliee something is right, it doesn't give them the power to force other people to adhere to their belief systems. If the abortion debate was about mandatory abortions I could see why they should get so aggressive about it,but as it is they attack people that want it legal for people to choose what they want for themselves. Their tactics in protesting are shocking at the best of times. I've seen far worse stuff at protests abroad than what I've seen in Ireland and they can be unbelievably aggressive to the point I can't believ they can even call them selves christian. I always though Christianity was about tolerence.
    I just fail to understand why people get so wound up about what other people do in their own lives. If the protesters are so concerned about other peoples bodies wouldn't they be better off spending their time fund raising for impoverished expectant mothers or tryng to make the world a better place for unborn children so that the unwanted may be wanted.
    I'm all on for tolerence but when peole like this show they have no respect for other peoples opinions and fail to even listen to ounter arguements, its time to call them out for what they really are and put them in their rightful place.


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    #60
    Am Chile
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,025 ✭✭✭Am Chile


    CuriousG wrote: »
    Who cares???

    Everyone has their right to have an opinion and campaign for that opinion, including all of you.

    If it was something you were passionate about and someone gave out about it, you'd never hear the end of it.

    Opinions for all, except when it doesn't suit people...

    If you don't like them, ignore them. It's really that simple.

    I agree people are entitled to have opinions and campaign on issues-but I think there is a fine line between campaigning and harassing people as they try to go about their business out in the street like the harassment john halligan faced from the pro life campaigners in tramore this past sunday-and the putting leaflets through his letterbox past 12 in the night- what do they hope to gain from it? they know john has his political position on the abortion issue and they still decide to put leaflets through his letterbox-from reading articles online even some fine gael tds are being targeted by pro life campaigners-anti abortion posters targetting fine gael tds being put up in the middle of the night-again what are they hoping to gain from it?


    Fine Gael party chairman Charlie Flanagan has compared extremist anti-abortion campaigners to the Ku Klux Klan.

    Mr Flanagan was responding to Fine Gael TDs being personally targeted by anti- abortion campaigners who are putting up posters outside their homes, offices and even local churches.
    The posters usually have a picture of the TD, the Fine Gael logo and a picture of a foetus in its mother's womb but no identifying marks to say who produced the poster.

    Mr Flanagan hit back at the practice saying: "Abortion posters with FG TDs appear in the night. Nobody admits to putting them up. Promoters hide their faces. Just like KKK," he said on Twitter.

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/td-claims-prolife-extremists-acting-like-ku-klux-klan-29241471.html


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    #61
    Chiparus
    Registered Users Posts: 2,254 ✭✭✭Chiparus


    Should the above post be moved to the politics super thread mods?


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