Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all,
Vanilla are planning an update to the site on April 24th (next Wednesday). It is a major PHP8 update which is expected to boost performance across the site. The site will be down from 7pm and it is expected to take about an hour to complete. We appreciate your patience during the update.
Thanks all.

Anti-vaxxers

1…167168170172173…199

Comments

  • #5072
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,684 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    ProfessorPlum wrote: »
    Even at 4C, it will be a mammoth operation, particularly for air freight. Refrigeration in aircraft is not so straight forward, and globally many thousands of aircraft are grounded, vastly reducing the lift capacity available.

    https://www.biopharma-reporter.com/Article/2020/09/11/Delivering-COVID-19-vaccines-the-mission-of-the-century-for-air-cargo-industry
    A third of the world's population live in India and China where vaccines are made. So a few days by road or rail gets you to a third of the worlds population. Other vaccine production areas are near major population centres too.


    How big is a single dose if you remove all the retail packaging ?

    1g each works out at 1Kg per 1,000 and a tonne per million doses.
    One cargo 747 could manage 100 tonnes.

    Refrigeration is easier if you use refrigerated containers.

    And there's still time to figure it out.


  • #5073
    ProfessorPlum
    Registered Users Posts: 1,795 ✭✭✭ProfessorPlum


    Capt'n Midnight wrote: »
    A third of the world's population live in India and China where vaccines are made. So a few days by road or rail gets you to a third of the worlds population. Other vaccine production areas are near major population centres too.


    How big is a single dose if you remove all the retail packaging ?

    1g each works out at 1Kg per 1,000 and a tonne per million doses.
    One cargo 747 could manage 100 tonnes.

    Refrigeration is easier if you use refrigerated containers.

    And there's still time to figure it out.


    The article I linked references IATA, and they probably know what they’re talking about!
    It’s a massive operation, and as IATA point out, we need to start planing for it now.

    You can’t just remove all the packaging - most of the weight of a vaccine is the vial, and you can’t just leave that out. You might get typically 5-10 doses per vial, depending on what the formulation ends up at. That doesn’t include any of the outer packing, which is mandatory for air transport.
    Not every aircraft can carry refrigerated ULDs. They also need regulatory approval for carriage.
    Other than refrigerated ULDs, you are relying on dry ice for refrigeration, and that is quantity (and time) limited on aircraft.
    I’ve no experience in road transport, but for example aircraft refrigerated UKDs are self contained battery operated, if similar are used for road/rail transport, will the refrigeration last for days? I don’t know, but it might not be as straight forward as loading it up and putting it on a train for a 10 day trip across for example continental Russia, or 5 days across China. In any case, the IATA estimation was based on 50% of the supply needing air carraige.

    You will not get anything even remotely approaching 100 tonnes of vaccine on a 747 - it will bulk out long before getting anywhere near that.

    There are huge supply chain issues involved here - there is also apparently a global shortage in the glass vials used for vaccines - those in the industry reckon it could take years to even make enough vials!

    https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-vaccine-glass-vial-shortage-could-delay-global-rollout-2020-5%3famp


  • #5074
    paul71
    Registered Users Posts: 3,105 ✭✭✭paul71


    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/oct/01/hpv-vaccine-helps-prevent-invasive-cervical-cancer-landmark-study-shows

    The proof and benefits keep piling up.


  • #5075
    hcf500
    Registered Users Posts: 173 ✭✭hcf500


    Looks like the h1n1 narcolepsy cases will finally be settled. They will receive a long list of benefits as well as the compensation payout. The Irish taxpayer will have a big bill coming their way. I imagine it will cost at least 200 million, probably a lot more.


  • #5076
    eagle eye
    Registered Users Posts: 37,491 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    These people should have to wear something that identifies them to the public.
    In this day and age they are such a health risk.


  • Advertisement
  • #5077
    hcf500
    Registered Users Posts: 173 ✭✭hcf500


    eagle eye wrote: »
    These people should have to wear something that identifies them to the public.
    In this day and age they are such a health risk.

    How are people with narcolepsy a health risk to others?


  • #5078
    COVID
    Registered Users Posts: 624 ✭✭✭COVID


    hcf500 wrote: »
    How are people with narcolepsy a health risk to others?

    I'm sure your local, garrulous taxi driver will tell you...before he suddenly falls asleep! :D


  • #5079
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,400 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    eagle eye wrote: »
    These people should have to wear something that identifies them to the public.
    In this day and age they are such a health risk.

    Maybe a big star sewn onto their clothes? :rolleyes:


  • #5080
    COVID
    Registered Users Posts: 624 ✭✭✭COVID


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    Maybe a big star sewn onto their clothes? :rolleyes:

    ....or an alarm clock! :)


  • #5081
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,129 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    hcf500 wrote: »
    So you think these children with narcolepsy should be branded? Will the next logical step see them end up naked in a trench with bullets in their heads?

    He said that he wants the pro-plaguers branded and I think he's being facetious.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Advertisement
  • #5082
    hcf500
    Registered Users Posts: 173 ✭✭hcf500


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    He said that he wants the pro-plaguers branded and I think he's being facetious.

    What makes you think they are pro plaguers? Only about one in five people in Ireland were vaccinated against H1N1. They certainly weren't pro plaguers then and I don't think there is any indication that they are pro plaguers now.


  • #5083
    paw patrol
    Registered Users Posts: 2,314 ✭✭✭paw patrol


    hcf500 wrote: »
    Looks like the h1n1 narcolepsy cases will finally be settled. They will receive a long list of benefits as well as the compensation payout. The Irish taxpayer will have a big bill coming their way. I imagine it will cost at least 200 million, probably a lot more.


    yup only had to fight for 10years for it
    10 years of pain and hassle.


    I'd rather my health and the lack of a 10year fight against the state myself


  • #5084
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,129 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    hcf500 wrote: »
    What makes you think they are pro plaguers? Only about one in five people in Ireland were vaccinated against H1N1. They certainly weren't pro plaguers then and I don't think there is any indication that they are pro plaguers now.

    I didn't say they were pro-plaguers.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • #5085
    Necro
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 51,008 Mod ✭✭✭✭Necro


    Mod:

    Folks I understand this is a polarising issue but there is no need to make such tasteless comparisons like the one I deleted.

    I understand this is an emotive topic for some so no need to antagonise the opposing side.


  • #5086
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,823 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    8a3uf93rz9p51.jpg


    via The Poke


  • #5087
    Hector Savage
    Registered Users Posts: 8,810 ✭✭✭Hector Savage


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    He said that he wants the pro-plaguers branded and I think he's being facetious.

    Pro Plaguers!!! :D

    You never disappoint with your utter drivel ...


  • #5088
    Howard Beale
    Registered Users Posts: 318 ✭✭Howard Beale


    I have met many people from all walks of life from doctors/counselors to unemployed all of whom are against a Covid19 vaccine but not one of them would I call anti vaccine as they are not.

    In fact they would be happy for people to take 10 if they want but what they are is pro choice.
    Bodily autonomy so they want choice over what is injected into their bodies permanently. Anyone of sound mind would want a choice surely? Being forced to be injected to take something is 1984 on steroids.

    People need to ask 3 questions on the covid19 vaccine.

    1. What EXACTLY is in it and what are these substances?
    2. What is the testing that has been done and what are the protocols for measuring these people?
    3. I should have a choice over these items being injected into me and if not why not?


    Whatever happened to my body my choice?

    Either way anti vaxxer is such a lazy intellectually ignorant and moronic term for those who simply want a say of what's put into their bodies. I'm sure if given a choice again people who took things like thalidomide would refuse it.


    Once this covid19 vaccine crap is in you there is no going back and me thinks the people making it aren't rushing to indemnify themselves against prosecution if nothing couldn't go wrong!.


  • #5089
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,129 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Howard Beale wrote: »
    Either way anti vaxxer is such a lazy intellectually ignorant and moronic term for those who simply want a say of what's put into their bodies.

    That's like saying that using the word "rain" to describe the phenomenon of water droplets falling from clouds is lazy and intellectually ignorant. It's an easy term to use because it's concise and accurate.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • #5090
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,823 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Howard Beale wrote: »
    I have met many people from all walks of life from doctors/counselors to unemployed all of whom are against a Covid19 vaccine but not one of them would I call anti vaccine as they are not.
    I'd be curious to know why a doctor would hold such a view and what their view is on the flu vaccine.
    I guess, I don't really believe you though.
    Howard Beale wrote: »
    People need to ask 3 questions on the covid19 vaccine.

    1. What EXACTLY is in it and what are these substances?
    2. What is the testing that has been done and what are the protocols for measuring these people?
    3. I should have a choice over these items being injected into me and if not why not?
    1. would the average person know or understand the response to this question?
    2. Again, what difference would this make to the average person and their understanding of how vaccines are developed and tested?
    3. You do - you are not being forced to take it. However, should you choose to refuse a vaccine against a virus that has caused a pandemic then expect the repurcussions including not being allowed mix with others in confined spaces e.g. airlines not allowing unvaccinated passengers, etc.


  • #5091
    Howard Beale
    Registered Users Posts: 318 ✭✭Howard Beale


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    That's like saying that using the word "rain" to describe the phenomenon of water droplets falling from clouds is lazy and intellectually ignorant. It's an easy term to use because it's concise and accurate.

    Accept it isn't.

    'Anti vaxxers' aren't really 100% against ALL vaccines. Never met one like that actually.

    They overwhelmingly want a say in such matters and don't want to be forced or pushed into vaccines for them or their kids.

    Perfectly reasonable if you ask me not to want to be forced against your will to take something is it not?


  • Advertisement
  • #5092
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,400 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Howard Beale wrote: »
    I have met many people from all walks of life from doctors/counselors to unemployed all of whom are against a Covid19 vaccine but not one of them would I call anti vaccine as they are not.

    In fact they would be happy for people to take 10 if they want but what they are is pro choice.
    Bodily autonomy so they want choice over what is injected into their bodies permanently. Anyone of sound mind would want a choice surely? Being forced to be injected to take something is 1984 on steroids.

    People need to ask 3 questions on the covid19 vaccine.

    1. What EXACTLY is in it and what are these substances?
    2. What is the testing that has been done and what are the protocols for measuring these people?
    3. I should have a choice over these items being injected into me and if not why not?


    Whatever happened to my body my choice?

    Either way anti vaxxer is such a lazy intellectually ignorant and moronic term for those who simply want a say of what's put into their bodies. I'm sure if given a choice again people who took things like thalidomide would refuse it.


    Once this covid19 vaccine crap is in you there is no going back and me thinks the people making it aren't rushing to indemnify themselves against prosecution if nothing couldn't go wrong!.

    1: I'm sure the answer to that will be readily available, would you know what they mean if they listed the ingredients?

    2: They have already put this out there including numbers of people in the test and how many were in the placebo groups. Do you want their names and addresses?

    3: Has anyone forced you to have a vaccine? Of course you have a choice.


  • #5093
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,129 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Howard Beale wrote: »
    Accept it isn't.

    'Anti vaxxers' aren't really 100% against ALL vaccines. Never met one like that actually.

    They overwhelmingly want a say in such matters and don't want to be forced or pushed into vaccines for them or their kids.

    Perfectly reasonable if you ask me not to want to be forced against your will to take something is it not?

    There are over 5,000 pages of this thread now and I've got a pretty good idea of what anti-vaxxers are for and against. Dressing it up dinsingenuously and unconvincingly as a freedom of choice issue while pushing disinformation shows what their intentions are IMO.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • #5094
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,765 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Howard Beale wrote: »
    I have met many people from all walks of life from doctors/counselors to unemployed all of whom are against a Covid19 vaccine but not one of them would I call anti vaccine as they are not.

    I don't really believe you.


  • #5095
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,823 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Howard Beale wrote: »
    Accept it isn't.

    'Anti vaxxers' aren't really 100% against ALL vaccines. Never met one like that actually.

    They overwhelmingly want a say in such matters and don't want to be forced or pushed into vaccines for them or their kids.

    Perfectly reasonable if you ask me not to want to be forced against your will to take something is it not?
    They want a say in such matters? What kind of say and on what medical or scientific grounds will they provide such input?
    The issue is that you have malicious attention seekers spreading incorrect information and then when this is read on the likes of FB by morons it becomes interpreted as some kind of fact. It is dangerous.


  • #5096
    storker
    Registered Users Posts: 5,644 ✭✭✭storker


    COVID wrote: »


    I'm sure your local, garrulous taxi driver will tell you...before he suddenly falls asleep! :D

    "I want to die peacefully in my sleep like my grandad, and not screaming in terror like his passengers..."


  • #5097
    Howard Beale
    Registered Users Posts: 318 ✭✭Howard Beale


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    They want a say in such matters? What kind of say and on what medical or scientific grounds will they provide such input?
    The issue is that you have malicious attention seekers spreading incorrect information and then when this is read on the likes of FB by morons it becomes interpreted as some kind of fact. It is dangerous.

    What drivel. Do you do logic or reason at all?

    People want a say over what goes into their bodies but somehow they need medical and scientific grounds for this???? Why??? It's their phucking body!

    Do you have no consideration for bodily autonomy or freedom at all? These just silly old fashioned words to you like codswallop or shillings?

    Attention seekers? Pretty sure anyone who goes against the grain gets very little attention but the likes of Luke O Neill who tells you to bring your own dishes to Christmas and to live as a hermit til you are vaccinated gets on RTE/Newstalk/thejournal/Independent on a weekly basis. Surely anyone seeking attention be all FOR the vaccines they never be off RTE!

    People can believe as they please.

    Calling them morons shows your unbelievable narcissism and unwillingness to accept alternative opinion.

    Also I have said nothing against vaccines, other than heaven forbid people may not want them of which they are entitled to say no to any crap in a syringe.


  • #5098
    Howard Beale
    Registered Users Posts: 318 ✭✭Howard Beale


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    I don't really believe you.

    You don't have to.

    You assume ALL doctors on planet Earth are for a covid19 vaccine?
    I don't believe you on that.

    Here's some VERY high profile doctors completely against covid vaccines.

    Dr Heiko Schöning
    Dr. Jay Bhattacharya
    Dr Anne McCloskey
    Dr Phil Hammond
    Dr Rashid Buttar etc etc


  • #5099
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,823 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Personally I couldn't care less if they choose not to take a vaccine. They're welcome to take on natural selection without any assistance from science.
    However, in doing so, they are making a potentially dangerous choice for their kids based on ignorance or paranoia.
    They are also making a choice that could impact on vulnerable who are medically unable to take a vaccine.

    Ultimately, in my view, they are selfish morons.
    I haven't accused you of being part of that group but you seem to be going out of your way to defend their actions..


  • #5100
    PopePalpatine
    Registered Users Posts: 11,841 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    I don't really believe you.

    Do doctors of theology count?


  • Advertisement
  • #5101
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,823 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Howard Beale wrote: »
    You don't have to.

    You assume ALL doctors on planet Earth are for a covid19 vaccine?
    I don't believe you on that.

    Here's some VERY high profile doctors completely against covid vaccines.

    Dr Heiko Schöning
    Dr. Jay Bhattacharya
    Dr Anne McCloskey
    Dr Phil Hammond
    Dr Rashid Buttar etc etc
    Of those I only am familiar with one: Anne McCloskey is also against the use of face masks.
    I can only assume that despite being a GP, her personal beliefs do not include the use of scientific knowledge. :rolleyes:


This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement