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Waterford GAA thread - mod warning post #1 and #51
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Based in cork these days close to Pat Ryan’s club. Pat Ryan was county boards choice and had accepted the position. Ryan was diagnosed with an illness shortly after which prevented him from taking up the role. Presume this led to the debacle of all media reporting him as the new manager and then fanning eventually getting it a few weeks later.
I’m certainly not supportive of the current co. Board but infairness to them they did look outside of the county to a coach who is (I’m told) highly regarded in Cork GAA circles.
Matty Kenny had the job too but obv fell through and Is now Dublin manager and doesn't have too worry about fundraising up there
Cant see Fanning walking away and he will be in charge in 2020.
2021- new stadium with a new manager0 -
Matty Kenny had the job too but obv fell through and Is now Dublin manager and doesn't have too worry about fundraising up there
Cant see Fanning walking away and he will be in charge in 2020.
2021- new stadium with a new manager
New stadium?
Rumour doing the round today is that the stadium revamp is being canned.
It will literally be lipstick on a pig a €1m spend just touching up Walsh park0 -
thesaturdayman wrote: »Would have to agree with all of that, bar the last bit.
Call me out all ya want but don’t tell blatant lies, if your not prepared to take a call from me on it or ring me then you are a siht house & spineless.
Iv done as much as anyone for my club, played a long time and still playing, entitled to an opinion, entitled to be challenged on it totally but I think it’s unfair to have blatant lies told about me too & it’s my right to call that out. The other spineless pirck won’t even ring me.
Instead will hide behind the keyboard typing away - irony Im aware I am too, but I’ll be out tomorrow night Thursday night Friday night & Sunday with my club & at the county board meeting Monday.
No one is doubting your dedication to the cause Saturday man. To be fair your the only man putting forward a way to resolve this horrible situation that Waterford have found themselves in.
As for people suggesting Donal O'Grady? Come in out of the fog. That ship has sailed long ago. If Sean Power was the man for the job he should have got it over Padraig. It's time to go outside the county, someone with a point to prove - why not go to Tipp an look at Eamon O'Shea or Tommy Dunne? Head to KK and chat to Mick Dempsey or James Mcgarry?
These players need an outside voice with no allegiance to past pupils or club mates to sort them out. If you think the answer lies within the county you are gravely mistaken.0 -
Mastermcgrath wrote: »He’s rated as being a top class manager by thissr and and proved by sauntering to an AI in his first season. But DOG out of the game with 10 years is the right man for it because you couldn’t think of anyone else
I reckon something akin to the running game OGrady had Cork playing would suit the players we have. Also seems like the kind of lad who would take no **** from any of the players but yeah, it's wishful thinking really.
You might be right about Shefflin being a top coach, but he won that AI with his own club where he is a local hero and lads most likely idolise him. Would our current crop of prima donnas listen to him or run through walls for him? Hard to tell if he would have the authority to get any more from them than Fanning has done like.0 -
If Fanning is the problem then remove him, if the players are the problem then it dosent matter who the manager is0
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Let's call a spade a spade, the next manager is probably going to be Derek again the way things are going. He's the easy option for the county board and his old favourites clearly want him there as they wouldn't play for Skully and they're not playing for Fanning. Judging by the stuff he's written in the papers he wants to go back as well. We could be in for decades of puke hurling and lads playing well into their 40s. Cant wait!0
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Why are we the only county that has problems with players like this. KK, Tipp, Cork etc players will always die with their boots on in games and if they are seen to be not trying they are never seen in a county jersey again. Even the Cork strikes in the 00's their players never gave less than 100% on the field.
But sure ya bring back Derek, let him doing his mollycoddling, iron their socks, give them a bit pocket money for a few pints0 -
If this happens then I can only imagine how demoralised players trying to break into the team will be. It could set the county back decades if the core group of Derek's players get their way after showing such distain for the shirt in recent weeks.Let's call a spade a spade, the next manager is probably going to be Derek again the way things are going. He's the easy option for the county board and his old favourites clearly want him there as they wouldn't play for Skully and they're not playing for Fanning. Judging by the stuff he's written in the papers he wants to go back as well. We could be in for decades of puke hurling and lads playing well into their 40s. Cant wait!0 -
Stacksofwacks wrote: »Why are we the only county that has problems with players like this. KK, Tipp, Cork etc players will always die with their boots on in games and if they are seen to be not trying they are never seen in a county jersey again. Even the Cork strikes in the 00's their players never gave less than 100% on the field.
It’s very difficult to know what the problem is but having spoken to a couple of my old club mates this evening the line is it’s the players revolting. I’m not sure what to believe to be honest but as suggested above, the players wouldn’t play for Michael Ryan and shafted him and it’s looking like there’s a similar situation brewing again.
Is it a case of apparently difficult lads being babied and bigged up and then throwing their toys out of the pram if they don’t get their own way? I can remember a bit of it happening towards the end of Justin McCarthy’s time and some of it with Davy too. The only thing was Davy wasn’t a man to be messed with so players kept quiet. It’s quite possible that certain players had their egos massaged by Derek and Dan for 5 years and lads simply don’t know any other way to behave now. That’s not a dig at the two lads, they obviously did what they felt was required to get the best out of certain players and I respect that. But there has to be a line drawn somewhere.
My mind is constantly changing with Fanning. He isn’t a bad chap at all, I remember him from years ago and he was always a decent man. Is the job too much for him? Yes. Like I said last week on here, I think he was goosed before a ball was pucked in January. The previous management team had such loyalty and trust from the panel that the situation is kind of like your parents have split up and your mother has moved her new boyfriend in a fortnight later. Derek often gives off the vibe that this is still his team in interviews or on The Sunday Game and I think whoever took up the job was going to have an impossible task.
Has Fanning helped himself? No he hasn’t but the players haven’t helped him either. Fanning can’t be blamed for a lack of effort or the inability to play a 15 yard pass to a teammate. Something that intercounty players could do with their eyes closed. There really is no excuse for that and it’s disrespectful. Limerick players actually looked embarrassed yesterday to be quite honest.
Whatever is going on is shameful and if it’s a case of the players downing tools then and not trying for whatever reasons then I feel sorry for them. In 5, 10 or 20 years time if they’ve no medals in their pockets I wonder will they look back on this year and think “we did the right thing in 2019. We wasted a year of our careers but we proved a point”.0 -
I reckon something akin to the running game OGrady had Cork playing would suit the players we have. Also seems like the kind of lad who would take no **** from any of the players but yeah, it's wishful thinking really.
You might be right about Shefflin being a top coach, but he won that AI with his own club where he is a local hero and lads most likely idolise him. Would our current crop of prima donnas listen to him or run through walls for him? Hard to tell if he would have the authority to get any more from them than Fanning has done like.
DOGs days are over, like being a player, coaching and managing is also a young mans game. Unless Shefflin has his heart bent set in the KK job I don’t see why someone like him wouldn’t want a shot at Waterford. Expectations will be at an all time low, the only way is up.0 -
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Stacksofwacks wrote: »Why are we the only county that has problems with players like this. KK, Tipp, Cork etc players will always die with their boots on in games and if they are seen to be not trying they are never seen in a county jersey again. Even the Cork strikes in the 00's their players never gave less than 100% on the field.
s
Really the Tipp boys didn't plan for their manager last year, now sheedy comes back in and they are flying it.
I agree when our lads go down they go down bad but all counties have this with players now.0 -
I wasn’t saying to have a dig at Limerick fans, they were laughing at what they were seeing and I can’t blame them. From one of the big counties to put in a performance like that it was shameful. Limerick are the All Ireland champions, they were coming off the back of a poor performance against Cork. These used to be the type of games that Waterford relished - fans and players alike. Yesterday it looked like the players and management would rather have been anywhere else but Walsh Park.
God be with the days of the flags, bunting, air horns and excitement that surrounded Waterford in the summer. We didn’t realise how good we had it from 1998 to 2007. Those were the glory days for Waterford and their supporters. Since 2007 we’ve had about 3 good days out with the county and it’s actually depressing to see how we’ve ended up. Looking back we were probably lucky to reach the final in 2017 and Jesus with a bit of luck we could have nicked it from Galway. Since 5 o clock that day in 2017 it’s gone from bad to worse for us.
I know you weren't having a dig I was saying what I said cos I know what it feels like to get a beating like that for us it was 2009 v tipp in croker plus cork kk and tipp themselves have got heavy beatings in last few yrs so it is recoverable if the proper structures are put in place. I'm not going to belittle what happened yesterday as it was bad but there's always hope I genuinely thought I'd never see limerick winning the all ireland but we did so can Waterford in the future not easy but can be done0 -
Really the Tipp boys didn't plan for their manager last year, now sheedy comes back in and they are flying it.
I agree when our lads go down they go down bad but all counties have this with players now.
They may have stopped playing for their manager but they still drew 2 games and lost the others only by a few points. They came from 11 points down to draw with us0 -
Whatever is going on is shameful and if it’s a case of the players downing tools then and not trying for whatever reasons then I feel sorry for them. In 5, 10 or 20 years time if they’ve no medals in their pockets I wonder will they look back on this year and think “we did the right thing in 2019. We wasted a year of our careers but we proved a point”.
You know if they wanted to waste a year of their career then so be it. The really shameful thing is they decided to take the lads who played with pride with them.0 -
Really the Tipp boys didn't plan for their manager last year, now sheedy comes back in and they are flying it.
I agree when our lads go down they go down bad but all counties have this with players now.
What other county gives up after 20 mins and only 2pts in it??
Its a joke excusing this behaviour.....no matter how bad the all ireland of 08 defeat was....noone carried on like what went on yesterday in walsh park
Nicky quaid came out and even said he felt embarassed for us0 -
What other county gives up after 20 mins and only 2pts in it??
Its a joke excusing this behaviour.....no matter how bad the all ireland of 08 defeat was....noone carried on like what went on yesterday in walsh park
Nicky quaid came out and even said he felt embarassed for us
We were caught cold in '08. The players were spooked either by the occasion or Kilkenny's aggression or both. But some of them did give up, more or less0 -
Stacksofwacks wrote: »Why are we the only county that has problems with players like this. KK, Tipp, Cork etc players will always die with their boots on in games and if they are seen to be not trying they are never seen in a county jersey again. Even the Cork strikes in the 00's their players never gave less than 100% on the field.
But sure ya bring back Derek, let him doing his mollycoddling, iron their socks, give them a bit pocket money for a few pints
Apparently when Michael Collins came to Waterford looking for support for the uprising he was thought to have left the message to visitors to the city: “tread carefully, you might wake Waterford”. That lack of internal drive seems to exist even today. It’s a forlorn city right now. I mean the “recession” is five years ago but you wouldn’t know it in Waterford. It’s something in the general psyche.0 -
You know if they wanted to waste a year of their career then so be it. The really shameful thing is they decided to take the lads who played with pride with them.
And us the fans who have wasted the last few weekends following a group of mercenaries who couldnt give a sh1t.
For Derek's sake I hope he doesn't come back, yes we had some of our best days under him and he gave it 110% but he took them as far as he can, this group couldn't give any more for him.0 -
Mastermcgrath wrote: »He’s rated as being a top class manager by thissr and and proved by sauntering to an AI in his first season. But DOG out of the game with 10 years is the right man for it because you couldn’t think of anyone else
DOG got Limerick back on the right road after the Justin debacle in 2010. The improvement we made in the first 4 years of the decade would not have happened without him.He was treated disgracefully by Limerick in 2014.
He might not win the All Ireland for ye but no way would ye have suffered a campaign like ye have this season. He'd need to be "convinced" but ye could do a lot worse.0 -
Stacksofwacks wrote: »We were caught cold in '08. The players were spooked either by the occasion or Kilkenny's aggression or both. But some of them did give up, more or less
To be fair to all concerned, what happened in 2008 was car crash stuff. Ken McGrath said it in his book that he felt they should have gotten councelling after that. I remember the banquet that evening I met a couple of the players over the course of the night and they were genuinely devastated and some of them still say they aren’t over it.
The 2008 final and the current situation is incomparable. Sadly, June 2008 and the current situation are comparable.
What I don’t get is why players train from October to now to give up. Why bother? If they don’t like the set up or the man in charge then walk away. There’s plenty of lads on the bench and the extended panel who have trained for days like yesterday.
How the **** could any self respecting player not want to turn around in a couple of years time and say that they stood toe to toe with the All Ireland winners in Walsh Park. I genuinely don’t get it. I had teachers in school that I didn’t like or didn’t get on with but I didn’t walk into the class every day and not bother my arse trying. I got on with it because at the end of the day the teachers job and my aim were the same thing. I wanted to get an education and they wanted to give me one. There’s a common goal regardless of personal relationships and the same theory applies to intercounty players and managers. Have the several hundred players that have come and gone under Brian Cody all loved him? Not at all, I’d say the vast majority of lads hated him but they all respected him and got on with the job because they all wanted the same thing. They all wanted to win.
It’s easy for me to say it but if I had ever been good enough to play for Waterford I can honestly say I wouldn’t have cared less if Hitler was the manager. As long as he wanted to win games I’d have shut up and got on with it no questions asked. I’m getting more and more annoyed going back over the last few weeks in my head but the bottom line is this, if these players are so precious with regards to the management set up or who gets to choose the music on the bus or whatever it is that’s causing this, we can forget about any sort of silverware for an awful long time. If my son was of an age and had a level of ability where he was close to breaking through on to this current Waterford team I wouldn’t let him play. Would I want my son being involved in a situation where fellas who are the best at what they do are happy to give up in their biggest match of the year, at home, in front of their own people? Would I fuçk. I wouldn’t want him anywhere near it and that’s what’s coming down the line here.0 -
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Apparently when Michael Collins came to Waterford looking for support for the uprising he was thought to have left the message to visitors to the city: “tread carefully, you might wake Waterford”. That lack of internal drive seems to exist even today. It’s a forlorn city right now. I mean the “recession” is five years ago but you wouldn’t know it in Waterford. It’s something in the general psyche.
Waterford was one of the few active areas in the War of Independence, personally I don't place much faith in the supposed mutterings of a man who has been misquoted many many times. The players might have given up last Sunday but I don't see that as reflective of the city or county. Lots to be optimistic about regarding the county (and city). A couple of atrocious hurling performances doesn't change that, imo.0 -
Apparently when Michael Collins came to Waterford looking for support for the uprising he was thought to have left the message to visitors to the city: “tread carefully, you might wake Waterford”. That lack of internal drive seems to exist even today. It’s a forlorn city right now. I mean the “recession” is five years ago but you wouldn’t know it in Waterford. It’s something in the general psyche.
Theres something in what you're saying. Even going back to the 90's/2000's team. You were never confident in them that they'd go right to the end. They seemed to be looking for the easy way to win games, clever flicks, audacious shots etc When it worked it was brilliant and they could blow teams off the park after 15 minutes, but when it came to wrestling teams in the mud they were often found wanting.0 -
Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 22,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭
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Folks, some of the comments posted here tonight are really deplorable.
If you continue with the petty squabbles then this thread will be closed and you will have nowhere to discuss Waterford GAA in future,
Please report problem posts rather than responding to them in future, thanks.
I shall be reviewing this evenings mod actions as I believe they were perhaps too lenient.0 -
I wouldnt fancy modding this thread for the next few months, the bile and nastiness will likely break the boards servers0
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Heres my alternate team next week.
Billy Nolan GK
Callum Lyons CB
C Gleeson FB
Noel Connors CB
C Prunty WB
A Gleeson CB
D Fives WB
Shane Bennett CM
C Roche CM
T Ryan WF
J Prendergast CF
M Shanahan WF
S Bennett CF
Brick FF
Kearney
Look at bringing in Sean Power and Paul Flynn for the last game. Take stock then over the summer and next winter.0 -
Folks, some of the comments posted here tonight are really deplorable.
If you continue with the petty squabbles then this thread will be closed and you will have nowhere to discuss Waterford GAA in future,
Please report problem posts rather than responding to them in future, thanks.
I shall be reviewing this evenings mod actions as I believe they were perhaps too lenient.
Hear hear...one fella looking for a pat on the back, the other a wind up merchant.0 -
To be fair to all concerned, what happened in 2008 was car crash stuff. Ken McGrath said it in his book that he felt they should have gotten councelling after that. I remember the banquet that evening I met a couple of the players over the course of the night and they were genuinely devastated and some of them still say they aren’t over it.
The 2008 final and the current situation is incomparable. Sadly, June 2008 and the current situation are comparable.
What I don’t get is why players train from October to now to give up. Why bother? If they don’t like the set up or the man in charge then walk away. There’s plenty of lads on the bench and the extended panel who have trained for days like yesterday.
How the **** could any self respecting player not want to turn around in a couple of years time and say that they stood toe to toe with the All Ireland winners in Walsh Park. I genuinely don’t get it. I had teachers in school that I didn’t like or didn’t get on with but I didn’t walk into the class every day and not bother my arse trying. I got on with it because at the end of the day the teachers job and my aim were the same thing. I wanted to get an education and they wanted to give me one. There’s a common goal regardless of personal relationships and the same theory applies to intercounty players and managers. Have the several hundred players that have come and gone under Brian Cody all loved him? Not at all, I’d say the vast majority of lads hated him but they all respected him and got on with the job because they all wanted the same thing. They all wanted to win.
It’s easy for me to say it but if I had ever been good enough to play for Waterford I can honestly say I wouldn’t have cared less if Hitler was the manager. As long as he wanted to win games I’d have shut up and got on with it no questions asked. I’m getting more and more annoyed going back over the last few weeks in my head but the bottom line is this, if these players are so precious with regards to the management set up or who gets to choose the music on the bus or whatever it is that’s causing this, we can forget about any sort of silverware for an awful long time. If my son was of an age and had a level of ability where he was close to breaking through on to this current Waterford team I wouldn’t let him play. Would I want my son being involved in a situation where fellas who are the best at what they do are happy to give up in their biggest match of the year, at home, in front of their own people? Would I fuçk. I wouldn’t want him anywhere near it and that’s what’s coming down the line here.
My sentiments exactly. Well said.0 -
48 hours later and the pain of defeat is actually worse that it was Sunday? Because on reflection of the whole debacle i am struggling to see any way forward. Can anyone honestly see any manager of substance, never mind a manger trying to make a name for themselves, wanting to take charge of a group of players who act like spoiled children when they don't get what they want, and that is before the new manager would have to deal with our county board.
Lots of comments on here about underage structures, and criticism of this years minor side - this is not the root of our current problem - in actual fact this years side is one of the most competitive i have seen and last years was a very decent side also - do people think other counties are not putting the same if not more resources into their panels - of course they are. Again I will quote, look at the performances of Calum Lyons, Conor Prunty, and Jack Prednergast last Sunday, three young lads who have not had the chance to become infected by years of light touch mothering and being spoiled rotten. Those three lads have not forgotten the importance of being selected to represent your county. I will never forget the look on the face of Calum Lyons as he ran towards the tunnel at full time on Sunday even, he was visibly upset by what had happened, despite he working himself into the ground and competing manfully to the last whistle against supposedly vastly superior opposition. I did not see this emotion repeated on many others.
While there are undoubtedly deficiencies with our underage structures, they are producing decent raw material, look at last years under 21 side - but unfortunately their progression is stopping once they enter the senior grade. Can anyone honestly name even two Senior players whose game has improved or developed over the last four years - for me the majority have gone backwards!
People say we have no forwards, rubbish, we could have had a full forward line of Henry Shefflin, Patrick Horgan, and Seamus Callinan last Sunday and they would have struggled with the quality and supply of ball being delivered.
This panel needs a wrecking ball to be taken to it to root out the poison that is endemic in it at present, and unfortunately i do not see how this is going to happen. Regrettably Pauric Fanning does not seem up to the task so it will most likely be back to the return of the "messiah" telling everyone how he was right all along, his point has been proven about the need for defensive set up. At the same time he will probably continue telling anyone that will listen that the vast majority of supporters are idiots who don't know what they are talking about and don't understand what he is doing. Mind you these are the same idiots who he will be asking to fund his "playgroup" and provide new rattlers for them, especially since most of them threw theirs away last Sunday.
I am a realist, I am following Waterford Hurling longer than i care to remember, I have seen plenty of extremely poor sides beaten out the gate because of poor quality, poor preparation and poor tactics and accepted this
I have always defended my county and the players who represent it, but last Sunday, there was no defence for the majority, to me they "went on strike" and in doing so stuck two fingers up to the honest decent supporters, those same supporters who dug deep to fund their lavish holiday to Cancun, since which i don't think they have won a meaningful game of any sort.
Instead of ordering new rattlers, time to order some mirrors, because a lot of these lads need to have a long hard look at themselves and decide do they really want to represent Waterford. The sickening point is that they do have the talent and ability, they have shown that in previous displays against top quality opposition, and this for me is the hardest part to take.0 -
been discussed on WLR now0
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What I don’t get is why players train from October to now to give up. Why bother? If they don’t like the set up or the man in charge then walk away. There’s plenty of lads on the bench and the extended panel who have trained for days like yesterday.
How the **** could any self respecting player not want to turn around in a couple of years time and say that they stood toe to toe with the All Ireland winners in Walsh Park. I genuinely don’t get it. .
A lot of them don’t know any different, they’ve been involved in intercounty teams since primary game, even at that age are big fish in their local schools/area. They’ve been mentored and mollycoddled from an early age. GAA is all they know a lot of them would be lost without it it. As much as some of them have given up and don’t want to try a leg they still don’t consider packing it in and can’t envisage a life without it. I’d actually admire the lads that do have balls the balls to walk away if their not happy. kind of sad in many ways0
This discussion has been closed.
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