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26-05-2013, 20:38   #61
 
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A few more enquiries for anyone willing to explain.

Ceist 37

An (blank) tu ansin go minic?

Bhfuil
Ta
Mbionn
Bhionn

Is e mbionn an freagra ceart. Cen fath? Cen fath nach bhfuil se "bhfuil"?

Ceist 38

Thosaigh me ag obair ansin cupla (blank) o shin.

Sheachtaine
Miosa
Mi
Mhi

Duirt me "sheachtaine" ach is e "mi" an freagra ceart. Ach nil thuigim, mar ta se an aimsir caite. Shouldn't it have a "h"?

Ceist 39

(Blank) as mo phost me an tseachtain seo caite.

Briseadh (freagra ceart)
Bhris (mo freagra)
Bristear
Bhriseann

Aris, ta se san aimsir caite. Why briseadh? What tense is that anyway?

Forgive the lack of fadas, my phone won't do 'em.
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26-05-2013, 20:56   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaryKirwan View Post
Ceist 37
Is e mbionn an freagra ceart. Cen fath? Cen fath nach bhfuil se "bhfuil"?

Ceist 38
Duirt me "sheachtaine" ach is e "mi" an freagra ceart. Ach nil thuigim, mar ta se an aimsir caite. Shouldn't it have a "h"?

Ceist 39
Aris, ta se san aimsir caite. Why briseadh? What tense is that anyway?

Forgive the lack of fadas, my phone won't do 'em.
Bí/bíonn is used for something that happens.
Tá/"bhfuil" is used for something that is happening right now.

"Cúpla" doesn't put a séimhiú on the noun that follows it.
The Aimsir Chaite puts a séimhiú on verbs, not on nouns, so that has nothing to do with it anyway.

"Briseadh" is the saorbhriathar, Aimsir Chaite. It's used for describing an action that has been done, but without saying who did it.
The sentence translates as "I was let go from my job last week". It's in the past tense, but it doesn't say exactly who let you go.
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27-05-2013, 20:42   #63
 
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Originally Posted by "Insect Overlord;84794697"

"Cúpla" doesn't put a séimhiú on the noun that follows it.
The Aimsir Chaite puts a séimhiú on [i
verbs[/i], not on nouns, so that has nothing to do with it anyway.
Okay, so it's not sheachtaine or mhi because they have a h and the sentence doesn't need one of them. And it's not miosa because that's a single month. So it has to be mi. Is that it?
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27-05-2013, 21:50   #64
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Okay, so it's not sheachtaine or mhi because they have a h and the sentence doesn't need one of them. And it's not miosa because that's a single month. So it has to be mi. Is that it?
Cúpla seachtain, cúpla mí ---- correct
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07-06-2013, 22:26   #65
 
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No specific reason, it's just that the verb féach is usually followed by ar. To be learnt and remembered!

Same reason as you'd say "the edge of the city" rather than "the edge the city"in English: it's a genitive case.

ceann amháin, dhá cheann, trí cinn, ceithre cinn etc.

one of them, two of them, three of them, four of them etc.
(although ceann, cinn mean head, heads in actual fact. Always used in counting things when you don't actually name the thing)
Also, when you are counting things, remember to use dhá and ceithre instead of and ceathair. The rest of the numbers don't have special forms, except for counting people.

Actually, I don't really understand 31. It came up in another context just now.

"...agus e ag magadh faoi chinealtas an mhaistir".

And joking about the kindness of the master (ta se ar sceal taim ag leamh)

I would have thought that it should be "chinealtas den mhaistear"

Just, you said 31 was "na cathrach" because I wouldn't say "the edge the city", so I thought you meant na implies of the, but an doesn't. In this case, it couldn't be na because it's one man. So where's the "of the" there?
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07-06-2013, 23:33   #66
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Originally Posted by MaryKirwan View Post
Actually, I don't really understand 31. It came up in another context just now.

"...agus e ag magadh faoi chinealtas an mhaistir".

And joking about the kindness of the master (ta se ar sceal taim ag leamh)

I would have thought that it should be "chinealtas den mhaistear"

Just, you said 31 was "na cathrach" because I wouldn't say "the edge the city", so I thought you meant na implies of the, but an doesn't. In this case, it couldn't be na because it's one man. So where's the "of the" there?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaryKirwan View Post
Actually, I don't really understand 31. It came up in another context just now.

"...agus e ag magadh faoi chinealtas an mhaistir".

And joking about the kindness of the master (ta se ar sceal taim ag leamh)

I would have thought that it should be "chinealtas den mhaistear"

Just, you said 31 was "na cathrach" because I wouldn't say "the edge the city", so I thought you meant na implies of the, but an doesn't. In this case, it couldn't be na because it's one man. So where's the "of the" there?
It's to do with the genitive form of the words. Bear with me, I may not be correct with my explanation, but the end result will definitely be correct

So. We have the noun, "fear". Fear = man/a man. Plural is "fir". "men".

The genitive singular form of "fear" is "fir", and the genitive plural form of it is fear. Yes, you heard me right. Like opposites.

(The) hat of the man. Possessions utulises the genitive case. So we must use it. Man is in the singular in English, so we do the same in Irish. The answer is "hata an fhir". Irish doesn't distinguish whether there's a the before hata, rather this meaning is included within the an/na in the middle if the context demands it. That's why I have the first "the" in brackets.

So. (The) hat of the MEN. We use "na" because it's in the plural, and because it's masculine (an for singular, na for plural - but you'll see soon, for feminine nouns it's the opposite). Remember, the genitive plural form is "fear" which means of men. So the answer is "hata na bhfear". There is an ellipsis of "fear" because anytime a noun in the genitive plural follows na this is done. So hata na gcapall means (the) hat of the horses (capall is the genitive plural form of horse - yes I know capall is also the nominative plural form in the singular).

Also note that, following "an" in the genitive the genitive singular, the genitive singular form is lenited. So we have "hata fir" which mean (a) hat of a man and "hata an fhir" (the) hat of the man. Or, since "capaill" is the genitive singular form of capall, we have either "hata capaill" or "hata an chapaill).

Hope I'm being clear so far. I'm writing this on my iphone, hopefully there are no mistakes. Now for feminine nouns.

So. "Cathair" is feminine. So using definite article is slightly different in conjunction with the genitive case relative to masculine words. It's the opposite. OK.

Cathair. (A) city. "Cathrach" is the genitive singular form of it. It is a feline noun. "Cathracha" is the genitive plural form of city, and, as you might know already means "of cities".

"Geata cathrach" (a) gate of a city. Geata na cathrach. (The) gate of the city. No mutation of the genitive singular form as you can see. Geata cathracha. Gates of cities. Geata na gcathracha. (The) gate of the cities. Note again how na mutates cathracha.

Another feminine word. Leaba. Bed. Genitive singular is "leapa". Gen. plural is "leapacha". So, we'll hata again for fun )

Hata na leapa. (The) hat of the bed. Hata na leapacha. (The) hat of the beds. Note that l resists mutation., so no change.

I hope that clears it up. an/na are definite articles in Irish, and are used accordingly when implementing the genitive case.

So, in your case we have máistir. The genitive singular is simply máistir. No change. So implementing the genitive case with a noun that's masculine is "cineáltas an mháistir". (The) kindness/generosity of the master/teacher.

Last edited by Gumbi; 07-06-2013 at 23:36.
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08-06-2013, 00:00   #67
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the master's kindness /the kindness of the master
Genitive case.

just as
the dog's colour/the colour of the dog
dath an mhadra

the cat's tail/the tail of the cat
eireaball an chait


the table legs/the legs of the table
cosa an bhoird/

the tree leaves/the leaves of the tree
duilleoga an chrainn

are other examples of the genitive case singular.

The genitive is formed differently depending on which group (declension) the noun belongs to.
All the above are formed by
  1. putting in the article an (the)
  2. séimhiú
  3. and making the noun slender. (blue)

Not all genitives are formed like this.

imeall na cathrach the edge of the city/city's edge

In this example
an chathair is the Nominative singular
and the genitive is formed by
changing an to na
and changing the spelling of cathair to cathrach
imeall na cathrach

The na does not mean that it is plural. It is used when forming the genitive singular of a feminine noun.
The examples that I gave at the top are all masculine nouns and the an does not change to na.

The bus goes to
lár na cathrach.
city centre/centre of the city

siopaí na cathrach
are
The city shops /the shops of the city.

Do you know the song
Barr na Sráide ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQaLCWhnxYg

An tsráid the street (feminine noun)
but
the top of the street (Genitive)
barr na sráide.
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08-06-2013, 00:07   #68
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Gabh mo leithscéal, a Ghumbi.
Ní fhaca mé do fhreagra go dtí go raibh mo cheannsa seolta agam.
Sílim go rabhamar ag clóscríobh ag an am céanna.
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08-06-2013, 00:11   #69
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Originally Posted by teileann View Post
Gabh mo leithscéal, a Ghumbi.
Ní fhaca mé do fhreagra go dtí go raibh mo cheannsa seolta agam.
Sílim go rabhamar ag clóscríobh ag an am céanna.
'Cuma ann go ndeirimid an rud céanna ar aon nós
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20-06-2013, 19:22   #70
 
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Cén fáth úsáideann an abairtí seo "i ngan" seachas díreach (rather than just) "gan":

"Bhí sí ag déanamh aclaíochta sa mbreis i ngan a fhios dom".

Chomh maith leis sin, cén fáth an "dom" seachas an gnáth "agam"?
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20-06-2013, 20:13   #71
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Originally Posted by MaryKirwan View Post
Cén fáth úsáideann an abairtí seo "i ngan" seachas díreach (rather than just) "gan":

"Bhí sí ag déanamh aclaíochta sa mbreis i ngan a fhios dom".

Chomh maith leis sin, cén fáth an "dom" seachas an gnáth "agam"?
That's the idiom. You have to get out of the mindset of translating word for word, it's not a good habit when it comes to learning a new language. "i ngan fhios do" is the idiom for "not knowing".
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20-06-2013, 22:55   #72
 
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That's the idiom. You have to get out of the mindset of translating word for word, it's not a good habit when it comes to learning a new language. "i ngan fhios do" is the idiom for "not knowing".
I know, but how can I know when something's an idiom?
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20-06-2013, 23:52   #73
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I know, but how can I know when something's an idiom?
You can't, you just learn it
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31-10-2013, 11:11   #74
 
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Placenames.

I just drove down Prospect Road. The Irish on the sign, and according to the usually reliable Logainm.ie, is Bóthar na Radharc. However, according to Focal.ie 'Radharc' is masculine, and the genitive is 'Radhairc'. Should, therefore, the correct Irish not be Bóthar an Radhairc?
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31-10-2013, 14:10   #75
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The official plural of radharc is 'radhairc'. The genitive of the plural is 'radharc', hence Bóthar na Radharc (more than one sight to behold!)
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