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04-01-2020, 21:09   #106
tudderone
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Ok so the conclusion to our wonderful adventure.

The conversations over the phone were most likely because of how rough I looked in the passport picture compared to reality His tone was very very different once we met in person.

So he was very reluctant to sign off on the forms for two reasons, he "doesn't like guns, doesn't like giving out guns and doesn't like people having guns" and because "of the difficulty had in getting a hold of me". But once I explained why I needed them and how I'm not a complete danger to society all was well. The usual 'if he ever has to seize one of my firearms I'll never own one again', proper storage etc. was communicated.

Now after 'PULSE-ing' my referees he caught me looking at his award commemoration thingies PSNI, LP and AGS i.e the large framed rank insignia with different patches or items like the silver whistle and the division number or whatever etc etc, and he told me his stories from working in the PSNI and the London Police before the Gardaí, they were very, very interesting.

So with a confirmation that the applications would be signed off that day and a fine handshake, the interrogation ended

But yes lads thats the conclusion and so I'm really not sure what to make of the communication shambles at the start of this process but sure look we got there in the end.
Tough tits, its part of his job
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04-01-2020, 21:38   #107
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Ok so the conclusion to our wonderful adventure.

The conversations over the phone were most likely because of how rough I looked in the passport picture compared to reality His tone was very very different once we met in person.

So he was very reluctant to sign off on the forms for two reasons, he "doesn't like guns, doesn't like giving out guns and doesn't like people having guns" and because "of the difficulty had in getting a hold of me". But once I explained why I needed them and how I'm not a complete danger to society all was well. The usual 'if he ever has to seize one of my firearms I'll never own one again', proper storage etc. was communicated.

Now after 'PULSE-ing' my referees he caught me looking at his award commemoration thingies PSNI, LP and AGS i.e the large framed rank insignia with different patches or items like the silver whistle and the division number or whatever etc etc, and he told me his stories from working in the PSNI and the London Police before the Gardaí, they were very, very interesting.

So with a confirmation that the applications would be signed off that day and a fine handshake, the interrogation ended

But yes lads thats the conclusion and so I'm really not sure what to make of the communication shambles at the start of this process but sure look we got there in the end.
Sounds like a know-it-all w*nker. Who cares if he likes it or not.

Anyway well done on getting sorted and fighting your corner
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05-01-2020, 08:00   #108
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Whether he likes or dislikes guns on a personal level should have no bearing whatever on his administering the laws of our country. He sound a proper control freak. Another muppet who would have us hunting with sticks, Hopefully he never makes it to our Dáil.
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05-01-2020, 15:45   #109
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I’m grateful to everyone that pushes their case for a licence or for another gun or for a moderator.

Makes it easier for the rest of us.

And by easier I mean they follow the laws as they’re set out and not their own personal belief or opinion system.
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05-01-2020, 15:55   #110
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Whats the actual criteria for refusing an application? Surely it isn't like "that firearm looks like something the military would use therefore you are not allowed to have it" or else maybe "that cartridge is too powerful for what you will be doing"?

And also thank you everyone for your input over the last two weeks!
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05-01-2020, 16:59   #111
Grizzly 45
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Whats the actual criteria for refusing an application? Surely it isn't like "that firearm looks like something the military would use therefore you are not allowed to have it" or else maybe "that cartridge is too powerful for what you will be doing"?

And also thank you everyone for your input over the last two weeks!
What we christined the "I dont like de look o dat now!" clause here many years ago on boards. It has fortunately fallen into disuse after many court cases in the DC level and where "Form does NOT follow Function" was proven deciseviely in favour of the Irish shooter,as well as the slight matter of "What does an assault rifle or military "weapon" actually look like under Irish legislation?.
Referencing back to "The Waterford tractor case" in the 1980s in the High court of the Revenue Vs a local Waterford farmer who modified a Toyota HI lux PU to a low ground pressure sprayer and was attempted to be done by customs for using marked fuel in it.As there was no definition in law as to what a tractor is, despite us all maybe knowing what one looks like, it was ruled in the farmers favour.
Ergo the same in the case of firearms that might look "military like".It destroyed the cheif AGS ballistics inspector/"expert" reputation,and with the addition of costs may being awarded against the AGS by the DC for loss,AGS has pulled in their horns abit on this clause.

The simple fact is,if you can prove an especial good reason to own a restricted firearm ,it wil be granted.If say you are going to go Wild boar hiunting on the continent,and can prove such and want a 45/70 lever action or AR in 458 SOCOM for your trip,or want a 10 stot shotgun for Embassy cup.That is good reason there.
Saying you are being refused,because of DOJ policy to reduce semi autos and because the 2017 legislation that Frannie Fitz left in a mess is not good enough,when there ARE lics been granted for such,WITH THE PROVISO,that they may be revoked at some stage in the future,under some reason is possibly an acceptable risk to some?[Despite it being IPSO FACTO legislation,again violating a bunch of Irish and EU and international laws is another days work]

So in the end a Super or Cheif saying they are refusing on the grounds of looks is talking out of his gold braided cap. Ask him for those reasons in writing which he is obliged to do and take it to your solicitor if you want to go down that road.
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05-01-2020, 17:09   #112
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What we christined the "I dont like de look o dat now!" clause here many years ago on boards. It has fortunately fallen into disuse after many court cases in the DC level and where "Form does NOT follow Function" was proven deciseviely in favour of the Irish shooter,as well as the slight matter of "What does an assault rifle or military "weapon" actually look like under Irish legislation?.
Referencing back to "The Waterford tractor case" in the 1980s in the High court of the Revenue Vs a local Waterford farmer who modified a Toyota HI lux PU to a low ground pressure sprayer and was attempted to be done by customs for using marked fuel in it.As there was no definition in law as to what a tractor is, despite us all maybe knowing what one looks like, it was ruled in the farmers favour.
Ergo the same in the case of firearms that might look "military like".It destroyed the cheif AGS ballistics inspector/"expert" reputation,and with the addition of costs may being awarded against the AGS by the DC for loss,AGS has pulled in their horns abit on this clause.

The simple fact is,if you can prove an especial good reason to own a restricted firearm ,it wil be granted.If say you are going to go Wild boar hiunting on the continent,and can prove such and want a 45/70 lever action or AR in 458 SOCOM for your trip,or want a 10 stot shotgun for Embassy cup.That is good reason there.
Saying you are being refused,because of DOJ policy to reduce semi autos and because the 2017 legislation that Frannie Fitz left in a mess is not good enough,when there ARE lics been granted for such,WITH THE PROVISO,that they may be revoked at some stage in the future,under some reason is possibly an acceptable risk to some?[Despite it being IPSO FACTO legislation,again violating a bunch of Irish and EU and international laws is another days work]

So in the end a Super or Cheif saying they are refusing on the grounds of looks is talking out of his gold braided cap. Ask him for those reasons in writing which he is obliged to do and take it to your solicitor if you want to go down that road.



So if he can't actually come up with a reason he HAS to sign off on it or else we both take a trip down to legal city?

Technically if i had a very good reason I could get one of those SIG 516s or a bog standard AR-15? Would I even be allowed to keep it at my house?
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06-01-2020, 02:07   #113
Grizzly 45
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So if he can't actually come up with a reason he HAS to sign off on it or else we both take a trip down to legal city?

Technically if i had a very good reason I could get one of those SIG 516s or a bog standard AR-15? Would I even be allowed to keep it at my house?
Correct...And yes you can keep it in your house.As I and about 180 other semi auto sporting rifle owners can attest to .But no doubt he might take it to the court doors,and not show up and act the bollix as much as possible,until he is told by the judge to start doing his job.
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06-01-2020, 08:19   #114
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Glad you got sorted in the end. A long road but you are on the home straight now.
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06-01-2020, 16:31   #115
tudderone
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Originally Posted by Grizzly 45 View Post
What we christined the "I dont like de look o dat now!" clause here many years ago on boards. It has fortunately fallen into disuse after many court cases in the DC level and where "Form does NOT follow Function" was proven deciseviely in favour of the Irish shooter,as well as the slight matter of "What does an assault rifle or military "weapon" actually look like under Irish legislation?.
Referencing back to "The Waterford tractor case" in the 1980s in the High court
Ergo the same in the case of firearms that might look "military like".It destroyed the cheif AGS ballistics inspector/"expert" reputation,and with the addition of costs may being awarded against the AGS by the DC for loss,AGS has pulled in their horns abit on this clause.

I had this out with a fudd superintendent some years ago, not that it made much odds, thick as a brick he was. Everything we own, cars, motorcycles, home tech look very little like they did 10, 20, 30, or 40 years ago. Design moves on at a furious pace, leap-frogging the competition. I remember the first mobile phone i seen, a huge metal battery case, with a cord to a handset coming from it. It cost the earth to buy and run. Now you can get something that costs next to nothing and is basically a computer/camera that you can make calls on and slip in your pocket.

Why should guns be any different ? Technology has moved on from the stuff we had to use in the 80's, baikal double barrels and brno bolt actions. But the PTB would have us like something from the 1890's, preserved in aspic.
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11-01-2020, 11:43   #116
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was this ever resolved
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11-01-2020, 16:06   #117
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was this ever resolved

Yes everything was sorted, hopefully all my future applications will run smoothly
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11-01-2020, 17:53   #118
Grizzly 45
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I had this out with a fudd superintendent some years ago, not that it made much odds, thick as a brick he was. Everything we own, cars, motorcycles, home tech look very little like they did 10, 20, 30, or 40 years ago. Design moves on at a furious pace, leap-frogging the competition. I remember the first mobile phone i seen, a huge metal battery case, with a cord to a handset coming from it. It cost the earth to buy and run. Now you can get something that costs next to nothing and is basically a computer/camera that you can make calls on and slip in your pocket.

Why should guns be any different ? Technology has moved on from the stuff we had to use in the 80's, baikal double barrels and brno bolt actions. But the PTB would have us like something from the 1890's, preserved in aspic.

Well seniority of rank in any army or police force is no grauntee of intelligence or BCS as history has proven many times too.
My 1st boss had one of those Motorola phones...I knew only to well what one of those WW2 GI field radio men felt like.As I was always humping that pig of a device about the place with batteries and charger for him. Thing was as heavy as one of the old PRC[Guess what the GIs called it with those initials!] 10 handhelds. And yes technology moves on so fast,actually now that even the dreaded AR15 is now, in its Vietnam issue configuration,into the classic and vintage category of rifles already.
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