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The Impossible Burger 2.0

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Comments

  • #362
    stefanovich
    Registered Users Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭stefanovich


    my3cents wrote: »
    But we aren't arguing that the yeast is in the burger. The soybean is in the burger and the soybean has roundup in it.

    Yes a lot of bread has roundup in it. Hard to avoid it. The papers quote 60% of bread has roundup in it https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/oct/24/eu-brink-historic-decision-pervasive-glyphosate-weedkiller .

    Bread sold in Irish supermarkets is utter ****. Toxic.


  • #363
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    my3cents wrote: »
    But we aren't arguing that the yeast is in the burger. The soybean is in the burger and the soybean has roundup in it.

    Yes a lot of bread has roundup in it. Hard to avoid it. The papers quote 60% of bread has roundup in it https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/oct/24/eu-brink-historic-decision-pervasive-glyphosate-weedkiller .

    I'm not trying to knock beef with this question but can you assume most meat fed with anything grown also contains roundup seen as we seem to have some in us.
    That's pretty shocking numbers from the guardian article, is the same true in Ireland, all our bread is contaminated?


  • #364
    stefanovich
    Registered Users Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭stefanovich


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    I'm not trying to knock beef with this question but can you assume most meat fed with anything grown also contains roundup seen as we seem to have some in us.
    That's pretty shocking numbers from the guardian article, is the same true in Ireland, all our bread is contaminated?

    Organic meat.


  • #365
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    stefanovich wrote: »
    Organic meat.

    It can still be fed on products where roundup was used in production from my reading of what your allowed to use as feed.


  • #366
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,957 ✭✭✭emaherx


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    It can still be fed on products where roundup was used in production from my reading of what your allowed to use as feed.

    If the above is true, those feeds are a tiny part of most Irish beef cattles diets. (Organic or or not)



    If I had to pick between eating something with high levels of round up and eating something which ate something else that had high levels of round up, I know which one I'd choose.

    I'd bet detectable levels in beef will be miniscule compared with this fake meat.

    Also the levels detected in the impossible burger are 11 times higher than it's nearest competitor in the fake meat business.


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  • #367
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    emaherx wrote: »
    If the above is true, those feeds are a tiny part of most Irish beef cattles diets. (Organic or or not)



    If I had to pick between eating something with high levels of round up and eating something which ate something else that had high levels of round up, I know which one I'd choose.

    I'd bet detectable levels in beef will be miniscule compared with this fake meat.

    Also the levels detected in the impossible burger are 11 times higher than it's nearest competitor in the fake meat business.

    All assumptions again and you referenced the article that doesn't refer to a product still on the market.


  • #368
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,957 ✭✭✭emaherx


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    All assumptions again and you referenced the article that doesn't refer to a product still on the market.

    You make plenty of your own assumptions.

    But what exactly do you disagree with what I said in that quote.


    The high levels of round up are in the product currently on the market and they are moving to a new source of soybeans which will have even higher levels. Their move to GM soybeans is not an attempt to reduce such levels.


  • #369
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    There's nothing to agree or disagree it's just an assumption you've made and can't back up with any facts.
    Your stating there now going to move to an ingredient with even more roundup in it. I think that's nonsense and scaremongering, I haven't the facts nor can I find them anywhere so your entitled to your assumption as much as I am that your assumptions are horse manure.


  • #370
    Base price
    Registered Users Posts: 11,130 ✭✭✭✭Base price


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    There's nothing to agree or disagree it's just an assumption you've made and can't back up with any facts.
    Your stating there now going to move to an ingredient with even more roundup in it. I think that's nonsense and scaremongering, I haven't the facts nor can I find them anywhere so your entitled to your assumption as much as I am that your assumptions are horse manure.
    They changed the protein source from Wheat protein to Soy protein in the new composition. See the first link for 2019 ingredients and the second for the previous.
    https://faq.impossiblefoods.com/hc/en-us/articles/360018937494-What-are-the-ingredients-
    https://faq.impossiblefoods.com/hc/en-us/articles/360021729274-What-was-the-original-Impossible-Burger-


  • #371
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Without anything to back up the roundup claims. You can't claim the new process is worse. I'm sure the facts will come out in time. I'd be just as concerned about the vegetables and bun as the burger itself from what I've read this morning.

    These guys were producing more beef substitute by the end of 2018 than our entire beef industry. That's just impossible foods.
    Ridiculing it as agriculture is involved in the process isn't going to end well for more than beef farmers. You could be unintentionally cause a kick back to farming in general shouting about roundup without facts.


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  • #372
    Buford T. Justice XIX
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    Without anything to back up the roundup claims. You can't claim the new process is worse. I'm sure the facts will come out in time. I'd be just as concerned about the vegetables and bun as the burger itself from what I've read this morning.

    These guys were producing more beef substitute by the end of 2018 than our entire beef industry. That's just impossible foods.
    Ridiculing it as agriculture is involved in the process isn't going to end well for more than beef farmers. You could be unintentionally cause a kick back to farming in general shouting about roundup without facts.

    In the first incarnation of this product, textured wheat protein was the primary ingredient with less than 2% leghemoglobin.

    In the second incarnation of this product, that textured wheat has been replaced by soy protein concentrate, again with less than 2% leghemoglobin.

    Therefore, there is now much, much higher levels of soy present in the product.

    As the vast majority of soya in the USA is Roundup ready soya (90%) and there is absolutely no roundup ready wheat, the risk of glyphosate being present in the product has increased exponentially.


  • #373
    RHJ
    Closed Accounts Posts: 925 ✭✭✭RHJ


    https://medium.com/impossible-foods/setting-the-record-straight-how-moms-across-america-lies-to-promote-a-dangerous-fundamentalist-bea50822605a

    Impossible Foods have responded to the latest bull**** from the anti-science fruit cakes.


  • #374
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    You know the antivaxer brigade here won't believe a word of that. It's a burger made from roundup that's all they can see.


  • #375
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,957 ✭✭✭emaherx


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    You know the antivaxer brigade here won't believe a word of that. It's a burger made from roundup that's all they can see.

    Antivaxer brigade? That's one hell of a weird assumption. Horse manure even.


  • #376
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    emaherx wrote: »
    Antivaxer brigade? That's one hell of a weird assumption. Horse manure even.

    You kept quoting the looney tune article, now it's been called out as manure. Even the tiniest bit of research you would have known that. A look through there online shop was enough for me to know there crack pots. Pure clickbait and they got you hook line and sinker.


  • #377
    Base price
    Registered Users Posts: 11,130 ✭✭✭✭Base price


    Buford T. Justice V wrote: »
    In the first incarnation of this product, textured wheat protein was the primary ingredient with less than 2% leghemoglobin.

    In the second incarnation of this product, that textured wheat has been replaced by soy protein concentrate, again with less than 2% leghemoglobin.

    Therefore, there is now much, much higher levels of soy present in the product.

    As the vast majority of soya in the USA is Roundup ready soya (90%) and there is absolutely no roundup ready wheat, the risk of glyphosate being present in the product has increased exponentially.
    "There are non so blind as those who will not see" springs to mind.


  • #378
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,957 ✭✭✭emaherx


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    You kept quoting the looney tune article, now it's been called out as manure. Even the tiniest bit of research you would have known that. A look through there online shop was enough for me to know there crack pots. Pure clickbait and they got you hook line and sinker.

    Kept quoting? No I didn't. I posted that link alright but I only quoted impossible foods statement which was they were switching to GM soybeans which is true. And I claimed that would lead to an increase in round up found in the burger which is an assumption alright but a fairly well grounded one. That was backed up by other posters here with relevant links.

    The only BS here was when you tried to say they didn't grow soya, but produced it in fermentation vats.


  • #379
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Your assumption is knocking farming in general and not just the impossible burger I'd give it a rest until you've some facts to back up your well grounded assumptions before you do any more damage to the food cycle.
    Unless I've missed something there's roundup all over the food we eat and even in so called organic food.


  • #380
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,957 ✭✭✭emaherx


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    Your assumption is knocking farming in general and not just the impossible burger I'd give it a rest until you've some facts to back up your well grounded assumptions before you do any more damage to the food cycle.
    Unless I've missed something there's roundup all over the food we eat and even in so called organic food.

    Much less in beef compared with this crap. Plenty of facts linked above don't need to repost what others already have.


  • #381
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    emaherx wrote: »
    Much less in beef compared with this crap. Plenty of facts linked above don't need to repost what others already have.

    Again your referencing the bs article to make that claim as there is no other source you could be using.
    There has been facts about the burger but you either didn't read it or just blatantly ignoring it and continuing with the roundup burger mantra.


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  • #382
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,957 ✭✭✭emaherx


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    Again your referencing the bs article to make that claim as there is no other source you could be using.
    There has been facts about the burger but you either didn't read it or just blatantly ignoring it and continuing with the roundup burger mantra.

    Don't need to reference the Article. Impossible foods have made a statement saying they are using GM soybeans. Soybeans are genetically modified for 2 reasons, first is to make Roundup ready and second is to improve quality of the oil. They are not using the oil. You seem fairly fixated on that one link and blatantly ignore those posted by the others here.


  • #383
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,957 ✭✭✭emaherx


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    I'm not trying to knock beef with this question but can you assume most meat fed with anything grown also contains roundup seen as we seem to have some in us.
    That's pretty shocking numbers from the guardian article, is the same true in Ireland, all our bread is contaminated?

    And as for this nonsense. Beef cattle mostly eat grass. Roundup in grass is counter productive. Some supplemental food may contain some Roundup but that is far from assuming anything grown contains round up. And you want others to fact check? Do you think the levels in beef will compare to a crop designed specifically to be managed using round up?


  • #384
    Markcheese
    Registered Users Posts: 8,428 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    Your assumption is knocking farming in general and not just the impossible burger I'd give it a rest until you've some facts to back up your well grounded assumptions before you do any more damage to the food cycle.
    Unless I've missed something there's roundup all over the food we eat and even in so called organic food.

    There shouldn't be roundup in organic food... Its not allowed,
    But its everywhere at this stage, there's quite a lot in wheat, as its often sprayed on shortly before harvest as a desiccant, in Ireland anyway..
    Its in most watersupplies to some degree, and if you test your urine it'll more than likely be present...

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • #385
    Upstream
    Registered Users Posts: 285 ✭✭Upstream


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    It can still be fed on products where roundup was used in production from my reading of what your allowed to use as feed.

    From the Irish IOFGA Organic Food and Farming Standards
    Livestock productivity
    Do I have to use 100 % organic feed?
    Yes.


    And in America from USDA's organic standards
    Cattle can only be fed 100% organically-produced feed

    So they're pretty clear - no roundup applications are allowed in the production of feed for organic beef.
    How did you read differently?


  • #386
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,086 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Have we a supply problem with Organic beef here, you'd often see organic mince in the supermarkets but have to head to the farmers market or in-laws farm for something like a steak. Don't ever recall seeing an organic steak in a supermarket or any pre cooked meats like ham, turkey, beef etc.
    I'm going to assume that most farmers here would nearly be organic by default just without the labelling and red tape that goes with it. I can imagine it puts a big dent in profits as well. There seems to little marketing behind the products, off the top of my head I can't think what the certified organic meat label looks like even though I buy the organic mince regularly.
    It's something that should be concentrated on with the health buzz around fake meats.


  • #387
    longgonesilver
    Registered Users Posts: 734 ✭✭✭longgonesilver


    Postpone the argument lads until someone finds more reliable sources.

    That guardian article says that 60% of bread was contaminated so round-up isn't everywhere.

    When you get down to a parts/million analysis non of us would be happy with any food we are probably better off not knowing what is there. Something from Chernobyl?, Something from an Icelandic volcano? Some micro plastics?

    If you ate a standard 800G sliced pan every day of your life and lived to be 100 you would eat slightly over 29 ton of bread. If there was a contaminant at 1 ppm in that bread you would have consumed 29 grams of contaminant in your lifetime.


  • #388
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    Where are you getting the GM soybean from, there is none, it's GM yeast which produces the extract the need. No need for soybean.
    Are you seriously trying to say the FDA have approved roundup burgers.


    Soybean is the main ingredient. Soybeans grown in dirt (as our American friends would call it). It's what most of the burger is made up of.

    Bizarrly you seem to believe that the entire soy product of the Imp. Burger is somehow made in a vat from the GM yeast! It's not.

    Again these are the ingredients

    Water, Soy Protein Concentrate, Coconut Oil, Sunflower Oil, Natural Flavors, 2% or less of: Potato Protein, Methylcellulose, Yeast Extract, Cultured Dextrose, Food Starch Modified, Soy Leghemoglobin, Salt, Soy Protein Isolate, Mixed Tocopherols (Vitamin E), Zinc Gluconate, Thiamine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B1), Sodium Ascorbate (Vitamin C), Niacin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Riboflavin (Vitamin B2), Vitamin B12.

    The stuff added which makes this concoction 'taste' of meat / makes it 'bleed' (wtf?) is the soy leghemoglobin (produced from the GM yeast) and which makes up only 2% of the entire burger.

    The filler or the 'meat' substitute is primarily "soy protein concentrate" (No. 1 ingredient on the list) and this makes up the bulk of the burger. This protein concentrate is derived from soy bean meal - a waste product of the soy oil production process.


  • #389
    Xcellor
    Registered Users Posts: 2,794 ✭✭✭Xcellor


    gozunda wrote: »
    The soybean is 'needed'. It's what most of the burger is made up of.

    Bizarrly you seem to believe that the entire soy product of the Imp. Burger is somehow made from the GM yeast! Its not.

    Again these are the ingredients

    Water, Soy Protein Concentrate, Coconut Oil, Sunflower Oil, Natural Flavors, 2% or less of: Potato Protein, Methylcellulose, Yeast Extract, Cultured Dextrose, Food Starch Modified, Soy Leghemoglobin, Salt, Soy Protein Isolate, Mixed Tocopherols (Vitamin E), Zinc Gluconate, Thiamine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B1), Sodium Ascorbate (Vitamin C), Niacin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Riboflavin (Vitamin B2), Vitamin B12.

    The stuff that makes this connection 'taste' of meat / makes it 'bleed' (wtf?) is the soy leghemoglobin (produced from the GM yeast) and which makes up only 2% of the entire burger.

    The filler or the 'meat' substitute is primarily "soy protein concentrate" (No. 1 ingredient on the list) and this makes up the bulk of the burger. This protein concentrate is derived from soy bean meal - a waste product of the soy oil production process.

    Doesn't seem to be any GMO in the burgers. The yeast that is GMO creates a protein which is naturally occuring and it available in other plants just in less quantity. The yeast itself is not an ingredient in the burgers.

    https://sciblogs.co.nz/code-for-life/2018/07/06/the-impossible-burger-is-not-genetically-engineered/

    Also genetic engineering has many routine applications


  • #390
    emaherx
    Registered Users Posts: 5,957 ✭✭✭emaherx


    Xcellor wrote: »
    Doesn't seem to be any GMO in the burgers. The yeast that is GMO creates a protein which is naturally occuring and it available in other plants just in less quantity. The yeast itself is not an ingredient in the burgers.

    https://sciblogs.co.nz/code-for-life/2018/07/06/the-impossible-burger-is-not-genetically-engineered/

    Also genetic engineering has many routine applications

    That was true in 2018, company announced this month a move to GM soybeans.


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  • #391
    roosterman71
    Registered Users Posts: 5,349 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    Anyone got any idea of what the investment to date has been into this? I mean, all the money spent on research and whatnot?


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