Dee Forbes banging the RTE TV licence drum again 60m uncollected fee poll not working - pl ignore

RabbleRouser2k · 08-07-2019 7:09pm

vriesmays wrote: »

Did they include the RTÉ clip where she's in black face.

To be Fair, Mike Murphy wore black face too. As did that 'Damo and Ivor' douche... but that was in the 2000s.

Actually, a lot of folks wore blackface WELL into the time where it was not kosher to do so-Ant and Dec, the entire Dead Ringers cast in the early to mid 2000s.
Freaking Angelina Jolie wore blackface in A Mighty Heart.
One of those 'give me an Oscar roles'... in a movie that tanked.

(Always loved how Robert Downey Jr won an Oscar nomination for playing a character who is essentially shredding actors, like the likes of Jolie and Laurence Olivier.)

The Late Late Show · 08-07-2019 8:39pm

Boggles wrote: »

It's not that hard understand TBF, it gets ratings.

Very simple really.

Sadly, this is true. I think some shows get very lucky with their timing and this is what helped Mrs Brown's Boys. When it came onto our screens in January 2011, it was regarded as escape TV, an antidote to the depressing news and equally depressing chatshows like The Frontline that were constantly talking about doom and gloom bank style. It also came after a spell of very poor weather in the latter 2 months of 2010. Everyone was glad to see the back of 2010 and embraced 2011 as a new beginning and Mrs Brown's Boys was part of that.

I don't think anyone was ever calling it superb TV even then and the good TV shows of the time like Breaking Bad and Love/Hate were spoken of in an entirely different manner. Mrs Brown's Boys was rubbish everyone knew but was outrageous and different to anything else. That it was poorly made and everyone knew that and O'Carroll embraced that (camera men falling into Mrs Brown's kitchen and the like) but it got lucky.

O'Carroll milked it for what it is worth and I feel it is now more popular in England and Scotland than here.

retalivity · 08-07-2019 9:28pm

Elmo wrote: »

So where are they getting the 15% evasion rate?

I dont have a license as i dont have a tv, yet i am probably included in that.

RabbleRouser2k · 08-07-2019 10:17pm

The Late Late Show wrote: »

Sadly, this is true. I think some shows get very lucky with their timing and this is what helped Mrs Brown's Boys. When it came onto our screens in January 2011, it was regarded as escape TV, an antidote to the depressing news and equally depressing chatshows like The Frontline that were constantly talking about doom and gloom bank style. It also came after a spell of very poor weather in the latter 2 months of 2010. Everyone was glad to see the back of 2010 and embraced 2011 as a new beginning and Mrs Brown's Boys was part of that.

I don't think anyone was ever calling it superb TV even then and the good TV shows of the time like Breaking Bad and Love/Hate were spoken of in an entirely different manner. Mrs Brown's Boys was rubbish everyone knew but was outrageous and different to anything else. That it was poorly made and everyone knew that and O'Carroll embraced that (camera men falling into Mrs Brown's kitchen and the like) but it got lucky.

O'Carroll milked it for what it is worth and I feel it is now more popular in England and Scotland than here.

Well, that and he built up an audience with his live shows. His shows often made more money than the supposed 'artsy fartsy' plays that would run at the same time. His shows often sold out too.
That and he would meet with the audience. He was quite clever with 'how' he marketed the show. Built up a large following at home and in the UK, and then when he went to the UK to look into getting it made into a show, he was able to demonstrate there was a very large audience on the sidelines waiting to watch it.

The quality of the show is terrible, in my opinion, but I know a lot of folks, young and old, who LOVE it. My mum's cousin lives in the UK, has lived there for a couple of decades, and she loves the show. Finds it hilarious.
As do her children.
It's not offensive enough, or badly made enough, for me to truly hate it.
I mean, it's not RTE's revival of Podge and Rodge, for one thing.

[Deleted User] · 08-07-2019 10:45pm

You know a major problem with the license fee? It's essentially a tax on my already taxed income. Which is why I resent paying it and why so many people avoid paying it.

By my reckoning it costs at least a million to collect per year. Why does it not come out of everyones normal taxes? Instead of all this evasion talk? As bad as it is, it is a public service, like the Gardai or the Fire Service - both of which are arguably seriously under-funded also.

Elmo · 08-07-2019 11:50pm

denartha wrote: »

By my reckoning it costs at least a million to collect per year. Why does it not come out of everyones normal taxes? Instead of all this evasion talk? As bad as it is, it is a public service, like the Gardai or the Fire Service - both of which are arguably seriously under-funded also.

No An Post rake in the collection fee, if the lost it it too would be making a loss.

fritzelly · 08-07-2019 11:58pm

denartha wrote: »

You know a major problem with the license fee? It's essentially a tax on my already taxed income. Which is why I resent paying it and why so many people avoid paying it.

By my reckoning it costs at least a million to collect per year. Why does it not come out of everyones normal taxes? Instead of all this evasion talk? As bad as it is, it is a public service, like the Gardai or the Fire Service - both of which are arguably seriously under-funded also.

Some stretch calling it a public service akin to the Garda or fire service, its a self indulgent honey pot for average presenters and below average programming

kneemos · 09-07-2019 2:58am

Elmo wrote: »

No An Post rake in the collection fee, if the lost it it too would be making a loss.

Don't know what they make from the collection service. Presumably they get a euro or two from every license bought over the counter,plus the admin service.

They made a healthy forty million profit last year however,one of the few semi states that appears we'll run.

Elmo · 09-07-2019 9:47am

kneemos wrote: »

Don't know what they make from the collection service. Presumably they get a euro or two from every license bought over the counter,plus the admin service.

They made a healthy forty million profit last year however,one of the few semi states that appears we'll run.

Hahahaha Mr. McRedmond is a master of spin. They spent €14million on "Transformation costs". That 41m reported is "Profit before transformation costs, pension interest and taxation, excluding one of items"

So their "Profit before pension interest and taxation as per Income Statement" was €27.2m

Profit ends up at €25m, with €12.5 coming from the licence fee.

They may not be making a loss without the licence fee but it is a major factor. And will they make a profit in 2019? Yes they will because they sold the gift card shop in Jan 2019.

But then An Post can do as they please in terms of commercial companies, RTÉ couldn't set up a Mobile MVNO without the minister having a conniption.

Boggles · 09-07-2019 10:04am

Elmo wrote: »

Profit ends up at €25m, with €12.5 coming from the licence fee.

I imagine there is a cost associated with the collection TBF?

Another thing that certainly needs to be looked at though, I will say farming it out to Fine Gaels private buddies may not be the correct course of action either.

Has the actual evasion rates and costs been verified? Dee seemed to be banging out some rather high figures when she was summoned to the PAC last year.

Elmo · 09-07-2019 10:05am

Boggles wrote: »

I imagine there is a cost associated with the collection TBF?

You mean the ads on the TV and Radio right?

Boggles · 09-07-2019 10:11am

Elmo wrote: »

You mean the ads on the TV and Radio right?

Not just them. Collecting large amounts of money incurs a cost.

I imagine the paying online method has decreased this, but people do still pay in branch monthly or by stamps, etc.

Giving out money incurs a cost.

It cost 6m just in admin fees to give out the "water conservation grant".

Remember that clusterfúck? :pac:

Elmo · 09-07-2019 10:22am

Boggles wrote: »

Not just them. Collecting large amounts of money incurs a cost.

Only An Post don't pay for those ads and even though "This is a message from the Government of Ireland" neither does the Government. RTÉ produce and pay for those ads. I spoke to a department official who could not understand why a contractor for a service would spend the money advertising the service!

patmahe · 09-07-2019 10:23am

I think the biggest problem RTE will have in the coming years is competition from on demand streaming services like Netflix/Amazon Prime, I know if I'm at home during the day flick through the normal channels once and if there is nothing of interest, I go straight to the streaming service and put something on, no watersheds or anything to worry about I can watch what I want when I want. How can RTE compete with that?

Even if they fully embrace the technology side of things and come up with their own streaming service or make themselves available through Netflix or similar I cannot see them having the content available to compete.

I believe RTE will dwindle and eventually become a news channel that very few people watch with lots of filler content and no original programming.

Charging people €160 a year for that is no longer viable in today's world (where all of Netflix is 9.99 per month and optional!), if RTE is not commercially viable then it should be wound down and only the bits that can pay their own way kept.

downtheroad · 09-07-2019 10:26am

patmahe wrote: »

I think the biggest problem RTE will have in the coming years is competition from on demand streaming services like Netflix/Amazon Prime, I know if I'm at home during the day flick through the normal channels once and if there is nothing of interest, I go straight to the streaming service and put something on, no watersheds or anything to worry about I can watch what I want when I want. How can RTE compete with that?

Even if they fully embrace the technology side of things and come up with their own streaming service or make themselves available through Netflix or similar I cannot see them having the content available to compete.

I believe RTE will dwindle and eventually become a news channel that very few people watch with lots of filler content and no original programming.

Charging people €160 a year for that is no longer viable in today's world (where all of Netflix is 9.99 per month and optional!), if RTE is not commercially viable then it should be wound down and only the bits that can pay their own way kept.

Next Monday they're showing a movie that is on Netflix, The Hitman's Bodyguard. Why would anybody watch it with ads if they could just switch on Netflix ad free at any time of their choosing.

Boggles · 09-07-2019 10:26am

Elmo wrote: »

Only An Post don't pay for those ads and even though "This is a message from the Government of Ireland" neither does the Government. RTÉ produce and pay for those ads. I spoke to a department official who could understand why a contractor for a service would spend the money advertising the service!

Fair enough, I suppose ultimately it's in RTEs interest. Not that I think it is right.

But are you trying to tell me with a straight face that their is no cost incurred in collected or "enforcing" the license fee and that 12.5m is net profit?

Boggles · 09-07-2019 10:44am

patmahe wrote: »

I think the biggest problem RTE will have in the coming years is competition from on demand streaming services like Netflix/Amazon Prime, I know if I'm at home during the day flick through the normal channels once and if there is nothing of interest, I go straight to the streaming service and put something on, no watersheds or anything to worry about I can watch what I want when I want. How can RTE compete with that?

RTE can't compete and never will, Netflix are not mandated by a Public Broadcast agreement.

Also Netflix had a 10-15% increase lately didn't it? Market share and bump up the price seems to be the MO. Also the vast majority of people in Ireland don'ts have a subscription.

Also let's be honest Netflix isn't as good as people make out, the vast majority of their catalog is very poor with a lot of old content from the likes of The Beeb, Sky and even RTE. 400 different series about life behind bars.

I think the demise of RTE is being greatly exaggerated TBH, they have faced (uniquely) very powerful competition to the tune of 10-15 billion per annum for years now and are still holding their own.

Like I said they get a lot right and the same amount again wrong, it needs to be overhauled but it is very doable.

Elmo · 09-07-2019 11:11am

Boggles wrote: »

But are you trying to tell me with a straight face that their is no cost incurred in collected or "enforcing" the license fee and that 12.5m is net profit?

I agree, An Post do have associated costs, but I think that no minister is going to remove the collection from them, I think this is much more the political issue, than the idea that people resisted Property tax and the water charges.

A major part of An Post service is Government services.

Scotty # · 09-07-2019 4:02pm

Elmo wrote: »

There also supposed to support the rest of RTÉ. It's not just about the amount raised on their shows alone but how much that investment can be redistributed.

Well, where do you think the surplus from the profitable shows currently goes?

McGaggs wrote: »

Give it 5 years. The advertisers will realise that they're getting f all out of radio 1. Nothing but a load of old people who spend nothing and dentist waiting rooms tuned in. There's no value for them there.

Simply not true. They have the attention of up to 400k listeners. It'll be along time before that's worthless to any advertiser!

tayto lover wrote: »

The so called top presenters on RTÉ wouldn’t get work with the BBC and wouldn’t get the big wages they’re on anywhere else imo.

Tubridy has filled in for Graham Norton and Chris Evans for BBC several times. They're not 'so called' top presenters. They're top presenters because they top the ratings. The top presenter with the BBC earns five times what RTE's gets and he doesn't bring in a shilling for the station! At least ours generate their own wages.

Elmo · 09-07-2019 4:14pm

Scotty # wrote: »

Well, where do you think the surplus from the profitable shows currently goes?

Looking at the accounts I don't see that profitability going anywhere if it exists.

Case Study 1: Ray D'Arcy
You have to question why RTÉ brought Ray in, did Radio 1 really need Ray? Ray had worked on RTÉ TV before while at Today FM, one of the only non-RTÉ Radio presenters to be afforded that previlidge.
While he as brought in a high audience to the Radio 1 show, he's really only brought it back to Derek Mooney's old audience share.
And TV brings in more revenue than Radio, The Saturday Night Show was doing excellent, why was there a need to change it, on a risk, and I'd say the gains made by RTÉ Radio were wiped out by RTÉ TV's The Ray D'Arcy Show.

Case Study 2: Pat Kenny
Pat was kept on a 5 year contract by RTÉ. He moved from TLLS and saw only a small decrease in his salary. Frontline was dropped after 2 years and he was left languishing on Prime Time. I don't see how any presenter has brought in an audience to Prime Time.
Yes Newstalk has seen gains due to his arrival, but his TV career has been a shambles since, UTV Ireland's decision to put in on a pre-recorded chatshow, followed by Virgin Media's decision to give him his own current affairs show, which is now limited to just Election Debates.
Meanwhile RTÉ hasn't really seen much of dent because he has left.

kneemos · 09-07-2019 4:25pm

Elmo wrote: »

Looking at the accounts I don't see that profitability going anywhere if it exists.

Case Study 1: Ray D'Arcy
You have to question why RTÉ brought Ray in, did Radio 1 really need Ray? Ray had worked on RTÉ TV before while at Today FM, one of the only non-RTÉ Radio presenters to be afforded that previlidge.
While he as brought in a high audience to the Radio 1 show, he's really only brought it back to Derek Mooney's old audience share.
And TV brings in more revenue than Radio, The Saturday Night Show was doing excellent, why was there a need to change it, on a risk, and I'd say the gains made by RTÉ Radio were wiped out by RTÉ TV's The Ray D'Arcy Show.

Case Study 2: Pat Kenny
Pat was kept on a 5 year contract by RTÉ. He moved from TLLS and saw only a small decrease in his salary. Frontline was dropped after 2 years and he was left languishing on Prime Time. I don't see how any presenter has brought in an audience to Prime Time.
Yes Newstalk has seen gains due to his arrival, but his TV career has been a shambles since, UTV Ireland's decision to put in on a pre-recorded chatshow, followed by Virgin Media's decision to give him his own current affairs show, which is now limited to just Election Debates.
Meanwhile RTÉ hasn't really seen much of dent because he has left.

Fairly convinced people watch RTE out of sheer habit
Turbidy's misery fest is surely proof of that

Replacing the best political interviewer in the country with Claire Byrne though is a piss poor swap.
Why do they let all their talent go?

donkeykong5 · 09-07-2019 4:30pm

samjames wrote: »

I pay but RTE is rubbish, there is nothing any use on it, the quality of programmes is very poor

They redeemed themselves with me with the recent rte1 investigates programme about the greyhound cruelty.

Bass Reeves · 09-07-2019 4:30pm

Elmo wrote: »

So where are they getting the 15% evasion rate?

RTE are of the opinion that all houses should have a licence. Free licences such as for some carer's and over 70's are paid for by the state. The rules regarding a TV licence is that you are required to have one if you have a TV. Over the last 10 years we have more and more rented houses. Rented houses by there nature are harder to collect from and there will be gaps in payments when tenants change.

RTE cannot take over the collecting if the TV licence as it is collected for the Broadcasting corporation of Ireland. It is not all distributed to RTE. Over the years RTE wanted it indexed linked( now we have no inflation they are not crying half as hard as they were). It hard to know the real evasion rate but I imagine that it is hard to collect in so called working class area's, student area's as well as any high footfall rented area. Nowadays as well people are less inclined to answer doors and it is harder to catch people at home. The advent of social media especially in student area's makes it harder to catch people I say.

At the end of the day RTE has always spend its budget, it's cost cutting is never too real rather paying off lads to retire early. Finally you have over the odds wages right across the board

RunningFlyer · 09-07-2019 4:45pm

Looks like the UK HMRC have started cracking down on BBC Presenters avoiding income tax by being paid through their own companies as contractors.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/bbc-sets-aside-12m-to-settle-presenters-irregular-tax-bills-0d09hfwjk

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7215055/BBC-set-aside-12million-pay-high-paid-stars-historic-tax-bills-amid-TV-licences-row.html

I wonder would RTE set aside money for their presenters tax bills if Revenue came knocking?!

Boggles · 09-07-2019 5:44pm

Elmo wrote: »

Case Study 1: Ray D'Arcy

Case Study 2: Pat Kenny

I'd look at these as a different case study.

Ray was pretty well regarded and liked on Today Fm, moves to RTE and it's like he invented cancer given the anger towards him.

Pat, pretty much lampooned when he worked for RTE, now I see him referred to as the finest journalist Ireland has produced.

Conclusion, you get your salary somewhat paid by the public, the target on your back becomes far bigger.

kneemos · 09-07-2019 5:50pm

Boggles wrote: »

I'd look at these as a different case study.

Ray was pretty well regarded and liked on Today Fm, moves to RTE and it's like he invented cancer given the anger towards him.

Pat, pretty much lampooned when he worked for RTE, now I see him referred to as the finest journalist Ireland has produced.

Conclusion, you get your salary somewhat paid by the public, the target on your back becomes far bigger.

Pat got stick for the Late Show. He was always regarded for the serious stuff.

Darcy was grand when we weren't paying the guy three or four hundred grand,or whatever it is.

Edgware · 09-07-2019 6:26pm

donkeykong5 wrote: »

They redeemed themselves with me with the recent rte1 investigates programme about the greyhound cruelty.

Speaking of greyhounds they did a Twink benefit show just when we thought we had seen the end ( ooooh Vicar! ) of her

the_pen_turner · 09-07-2019 6:40pm

donkeykong5 wrote: »

They redeemed themselves with me with the recent rte1 investigates programme about the greyhound cruelty.

i doubt it. all that was public knollage and reported years ago.
anyone that sat down and thought about it would see what goes on .
the same thing happens with horse racing but nobody is documenting that

it wasnt like they reveled anything new. the prime time documentry on th ecare homes was better (or worse)

Elmo · 09-07-2019 7:47pm

Boggles wrote: »

I'd look at these as a different case study.

Ray was pretty well regarded and liked on Today Fm, moves to RTE and it's like he invented cancer given the anger towards him.

Pat, pretty much lampooned when he worked for RTE, now I see him referred to as the finest journalist Ireland has produced.

Conclusion, you get your salary somewhat paid by the public, the target on your back becomes far bigger.

That's why I number them 1 and 2

I didn't attack either presenters' work or personality.

Ray D'Arcy hasn't improved RTÉ Radio 1's audience in any massive way, and RTÉ ONE's Saturday night chat show has lost audience in comparison to The Saturday Night Show. With this in mind RTÉ rather than gaining anything actually lost, as TV advertising brings in more money that Radio Advertising.

Pat Kenny brought in some audience to Newstalk, but it didn't really cause much problems for Radio 1, his TV career since leaving TLLS has been on a downward spiral.

Perhaps I should have started with Ray D'Arcy is a good presenter but.... and Pat Kenny is our finest broadcaster but....

The Late Late Show · 09-07-2019 11:42pm

Elmo wrote: »

Case Study 2: Pat Kenny
Pat was kept on a 5 year contract by RTÉ. He moved from TLLS and saw only a small decrease in his salary. Frontline was dropped after 2 years and he was left languishing on Prime Time. I don't see how any presenter has brought in an audience to Prime Time.
Yes Newstalk has seen gains due to his arrival, but his TV career has been a shambles since, UTV Ireland's decision to put in on a pre-recorded chatshow, followed by Virgin Media's decision to give him his own current affairs show, which is now limited to just Election Debates.
Meanwhile RTÉ hasn't really seen much of dent because he has left.

I always regarded Pat Kenny as very overrated. Why has such a 'great broadcaster' left such a poor legacy of programmes? The Frontline brought a whole new meaning to misery porn so much so that the Irish people had to fall in love with Mrs Brown's Boys as the antidote!!!!

And as a guy who presented himself as a guru on all things financial, economic, legal and political, how come he lost serious amounts of money in dodgy investments (of the kind he pontifcated about so often when talking about others during his programmes). What part of 100% principal guarantee or no deal did he not understand?

Dee Forbes banging the RTE TV licence drum again 60m uncollected fee *poll not working - pl ignore*

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Dee Forbes banging the RTE TV licence drum again 60m uncollected fee poll not working - pl ignore