Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all,
Vanilla are planning an update to the site on April 24th (next Wednesday). It is a major PHP8 update which is expected to boost performance across the site. The site will be down from 7pm and it is expected to take about an hour to complete. We appreciate your patience during the update.
Thanks all.

VHI allowing genetic testing already?

Options
2»

Comments

  • Options
    #32
    Cleopatra_
    Closed Accounts Posts: 812 ✭✭✭Cleopatra_


    Meh. I have Cystic Fibrosis. The only reason I managed to get VHI was because my parents got it for me before I was diagnosed. When I was in the UK I couldn't get health insurance with a pre-existing medical condition. Also happens to be genetic. It's sh1tty but what can you do.


  • Options
    #33
    _Whimsical_
    Registered Users Posts: 7,955 ✭✭✭_Whimsical_


    Cleopatra_ wrote: »
    Meh. I have Cystic Fibrosis. The only reason I managed to get VHI was because my parents got it for me before I was diagnosed. When I was in the UK I couldn't get health insurance with a pre-existing medical condition. Also happens to be genetic. It's sh1tty but what can you do.

    You can get health insurance if you have a preexisting condition and you don't have to pay an extra premium.
    You will have to serve a 5 year waiting period however for any expenses directly related to your condition though.
    So if your condition was severe arthritis before getting insurance no hospitalisations etc would be covered for you for 5 years if they were arthritis related, but if you broke your arm/got cancer/ need your appendix out all that would be covered.
    That sucks of course if you do have an illness though.

    I don't think what VHI are offering here is genetic testing to determine susceptibility to illness. I think it's genetic testing to determine what treatment will give the best chance of success based on certain aspects of your genetic makeup. That can be done in certain cancers, definitely breast cancer, and it's a very positive development. This is nothing like, or even approaching, eugenics.


  • Options
    #34
    Purple Mountain
    Registered Users Posts: 13,003 ✭✭✭✭Purple Mountain


    _Whimsical_ wrote: »

    I don't think what VHI are offering here is genetic testing to determine susceptibility to illness. I think it's genetic testing to determine what treatment will give the best chance of success based on certain aspects of your genetic makeup. That can be done in certain cancers, definitely breast cancer, and it's a very positive development. This is nothing like, or even approaching, eugenics.
    That's my take on it anyway.

    To thine own self be true



  • Options
    #35
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    _Whimsical_ wrote: »
    I don't think what VHI are offering here is genetic testing to determine susceptibility to illness. I think it's genetic testing to determine what treatment will give the best chance of success based on certain aspects of your genetic makeup. That can be done in certain cancers, definitely breast cancer, and it's a very positive development. This is nothing like, or even approaching, eugenics.
    Aye. Some people prefer to believe it's a sinister development though, and something something big pharma.


  • Options
    #36
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    I received genetic testing for a hereditary cancer. Before testing I was told that's not legal for insurance companies to request results of genetic tests (not sure if that was under Irish or EU law). Not sure how that works if you're accessing genetic testing through your insurance company, but I suspect it is probably illegal for them to increase premiums on the basis of genetic results.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #37
    paleoperson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,522 ✭✭✭paleoperson


    Gimme A Pound what is your deal? Are you actually an adult for a reasonable period?

    I'm here talking about a sensitive and important issue and here you are pulling out the "tinfoil hat" namecalling and sarcastically saying "big pharma". I suggest you have a bit of cop on to yourself please, you're impressing noone. It's great to make fun of the "big pharma" people - until it turns out they were right all along and it's now been well-established by people like Ben Goldacre how bad pharmaceutical companies have been behaving and what they've gotten away with over the years. It would be a bit like saying "Catholic conspiracy"... yeah sure, a big conspiracy that the catholic church has behaved badly right? I'm aware that After Hours is considered a non-serious forum, but where else are you going to get this amount of views and replies within a short period about an Irish issue?


  • Options
    #38
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    You’re the one who invoked eugenics and wiping out genes (whatever that is) about medical tests, it’s up to you to substantiate your claims.


  • Options
    #39
    scuby
    Registered Users Posts: 907 ✭✭✭scuby


    paleoperson wrote:
    So based on an ad I just saw, VHI are now being allowed to use genetic testing just like that? There's no controversy, no mass protests, no big placards? No ethics and regulations committees, no dail debates? Where's the protesting? Not even a debate?

    paleoperson wrote:
    If it's the public system it wouldn't have affected you financially? Yes the testing has been around, but not the routine loading of premiums depending on your genes as far as I'm aware. This seems like a new age we're entering into where lucky people get even wealthier.


    What a load of crap... health insurance companies can't charge more if your sick or have a medical condition. Look up community rating.
    Also, pre-emptive knowledge about genetic conditions in your family might actually help save your life if you are predisposed to certain hereditary cancers etc
    Put the tin foil hat and mass demos away ! If your the only one so worried about it based on replies here....
    Live long & prosper !!


  • Options
    #40
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,365 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    scuby wrote: »
    What a load of crap... health insurance companies can't charge more if your sick or have a medical condition. Look up community rating.
    Also, pre-emptive knowledge about genetic conditions in your family might actually help save your life if you are predisposed to certain hereditary cancers etc
    Put the tin foil hat and mass demos away ! If your the only one so worried about it based on replies here....
    Live long & prosper !!
    What happens if a future Government decides that community rating isn't quite so important after all? Your insurance company now has information about your genetics.


  • Options
    #41
    scuby
    Registered Users Posts: 907 ✭✭✭scuby


    AndrewJRenko wrote:
    What happens if a future Government decides that community rating isn't quite so important after all? Your insurance company now has information about your genetics.


    Doubt it could be applied retrospectively, like any changes to an insurance policy..
    Also the number of people with insurance will drop due to cost, and end up on public lists overcrowding what's already a swamped public system.

    I'd be more worried about what some people put up on social media about their lifestyle, than people having a test being proactive about their health.

    Early intervention is cheaper and easier than finding out something too late.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #42
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,365 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    scuby wrote: »
    Doubt it could be applied retrospectively, like any changes to an insurance policy..
    Also the number of people with insurance will drop due to cost, and end up on public lists overcrowding what's already a swamped public system.

    I'd be more worried about what some people put up on social media about their lifestyle, than people having a test being proactive about their health.

    Early intervention is cheaper and easier than finding out something too late.


    It wouldn't be retrospective, but it would be going forward - let's say the community rating is dropped in five years time, then people who have given their genetic information could find themselves facing much higher premiums after that.


    And yes, that could push people back onto public system, just as happened during the recession years when many people were unable to keep their health insurance going.


    You have a point about social media and early intervention. For anything to do with genetic information, you'd want to know what could happen to your data in the future.


  • Options
    #43
    wakka12
    Registered Users Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    Its very cynical to think that genetic testing will be turned against us. More likely itll be used to screen for certain diseases and early prevention to save lives, this is a fair and just country, unethical misuse of large scale genetic results wouldnt be permitted


  • Options
    #44
    Sciprio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 790 ✭✭✭Sciprio


    This will be taken advandaged over time. Screen for testing? Sorry you have an 85% chance of getting this illness so your premium will cost more. They'll also have your DNA so could find out what you are suppectible to, Maybe bribe you if in future if you become a politician/well know and don't bow to popular demands, news reporter with intimate details? Christ! He/She died from a nut allergy, what a shame.:pac:


  • Options
    #45
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,351 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    paleoperson wrote: »

    Now they're taking it further and putting out genetic testing, so depending on what genes you have, you get a higher or lower premium to pay.

    Except you are ignoring the fact we live in Ireland and it is illegal to do that. You have read this and believe we live in the US where they can which is where the argument comes from.

    Gene testing under VHI is so you an get medial treatment earlier which saves on their costs. You are making up a situation that can't happen in Ireland. I think it is also an EU rule too.


  • Options
    #46
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,365 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    While not quite the same scenario, this article outlines some of the dangers involved;

    https://www.irishtimes.com/business/technology/don-t-buy-online-dna-ancestry-tests-you-are-the-real-product-1.3713619


Advertisement