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05-11-2019, 11:54   #76
average_runner
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Originally Posted by Ceepo View Post
Source??
It was in a podcast by Scullion, but also there is a study that extra cushioning causes you more injuries, which is what the vaporfly's now have, ie extra cushioning.

Most normal racing flats don't have much cushioning.
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05-11-2019, 12:18   #77
Ceepo
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Originally Posted by average_runner View Post
It was in a podcast by Scullion, but also there is a study that extra cushioning causes you more injuries, which is what the vaporfly's now have, ie extra cushioning.

Most normal racing flats don't have much cushioning.
I haven't listened to the podcast..
And while the VF has more cushion it also has the carbon plate to give it stability.
How much more cushion has the VF compared to the standard high mileage shoe of any other brand?
I'm not sure that any particular type of shoe can prevent or cause injury.
Simply stating that more cushion cause injury, you could infer that less wont cause injury, and this is not the case.
And they're studys to say that a particular type ( motion control, stability etc ) of runners doesnt prevent injury
Can you link the study stating that more cushion causes more injury. Tbh if find most of these studys very poor for the simple reason, they cant take into account the huge amount of variables that make up the gait cycle. So doing a "controlled study" is next to impossible.

Last edited by Ceepo; 05-11-2019 at 12:58.
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05-11-2019, 12:49   #78
average_runner
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Originally Posted by Ceepo View Post
I haven't listened to the podcast..
And while the VF has more cushion it also has the carbon plate to give it stability.
How much more cushion has the VF compared to the standard high mileage shoe of any other brand?
I'm not sure that any particular type of shoe can prevent or cause injury.
Simply stating that more caution cause injury, you could infer that less wont cause injury, and this is not the case.
And they're studys to say that a particular type ( motion control, stability etc ) of runners doesnt prevent injury
Can you link the study stating that more cushion causes more injury. Tbh if find most of these studys very poor for the simple reason, they cant take into account the huge amount of variables that make up the gait cycle. So doing a "controlled study" is next to impossible.
I cant find it right now, but if you google it or go through runners world you should find it. Most cushion runners are causing us injuries compare to be miminal racing flats etc.
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05-11-2019, 13:20   #79
Ceepo
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Originally Posted by average_runner View Post
I cant find it right now, but if you google it or go through runners world you should find it. Most cushion runners are causing us injuries compare to be miminal racing flats etc.
I dont have the time now to Google or go through runners world.

You made a fairly blanket statement, it would have been helpful if you cited your source of information.

"Most cushion runners are causing us injuries compare to be miminal racing flats etc"

If you believe this to be true, what is the optimum level of cushion? Is that down to stack height? What about the same stack height with a different density foam?

Most people race in racing flats don't use them for training. Some might use them for a speed session... so taking that into account they run in them 4 to 6 times per month (pure guess work).
Can we compare that to someone using a cushioned shoe say 20 times a month.. and thats before you factor in any biomechanical differences.
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05-11-2019, 14:45   #80
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its TLTR for me but here it is if anyone wants to read it

https://www.runnersworld.com/health-...-biomechanics/
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05-11-2019, 15:43   #81
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Originally Posted by IvoryTower View Post
its TLTR for me but here it is if anyone wants to read it

https://www.runnersworld.com/health-...-biomechanics/
I didnt read the study but here are a few take outs from the article.

No shoe has ever been shown to reduce or increase overall injury risk,” 
The study didn’t find enough evidence to recommend or warn against using maximalist shoes. What runners can take away from this study, however, is that no matter what shoes they wear, their biomechanics won’t change while wearing them. So if your shoes are aggravating an injury, they’ll probably continue to aggravate it as long as you run in them.

“If the goal is to reduce impact during running, it seems that there is likely a ‘sweet spot’ for cushioning in shoes,” 

The cushioning sweet spot is probably highly individual,
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07-11-2019, 19:35   #82
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https://twitter.com/sportpsychkate/s...21285250768896
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10-11-2019, 21:59   #83
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Cutting Open The Nike ZoomX Vaporfly Next% --at least he got 1 mile for $250!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SXMAg7o7rU
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11-11-2019, 17:48   #84
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Originally Posted by hawkwing View Post
Cutting Open The Nike ZoomX Vaporfly Next% --at least he got 1 mile for $250!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SXMAg7o7rU
Given his history I imagine he relished destroying anything Nike
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