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Dublin ranks 3rd in terms of the amount of time spent in cars due to congestion

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    #362
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    Everybody -- back on topic now. Please and thank you!

    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    I've seen you on the RSA pages on FB almost word for word what you've written too.

    You consistently get your ass handed to you on FB so I won't further humiliate you here.

    You can't afford a car,I get it.

    I cycle myself but I drive to work because I can.

    Jealousy is a terrible affliction and making up facts and figures will not change that.

    You need to read the commuting and transport charter before posting again.

    Your posting quality need to improve -- ie cut out the sniping, cut out the one-liner replies, cut out posting links to UK articles when asked about Dublin City Centre.

    -- moderator


    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    Pedestrians are not Road users they cross the roads but they do not travel on the roads.

    I beleive you were told this numerous times when you were trolling the RSA pages on FB.

    Pedestrians are road users under Irish law.

    This is not up for debate.

    -- moderator



    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    How do get to see the screen of their phone clearly enough to know what they're watching from the seat of your four door sedan? Wouldn't their phone be above your level?
    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    No, you didn't say that before, until you were backed into a corner, surprisingly enough.

    Please deal with what posters say and not what mode of transport you think they use or don't use.

    -- moderator


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    #363
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,840 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    Would putting a toll to cross over the canals , say e1 etc, cut down traffic that might just walk or cycle instead?


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    #364
    cdaly_
    Registered Users Posts: 6,440 ✭✭✭cdaly_


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Would putting a toll to cross over the canals , say e1 etc, cut down traffic that might just walk or cycle instead?

    Not if the toll was €1. Something like €20 each way to cross the M50 and a further €20 each way to cross the canals.

    Include park and ride at €10 outside the M50 but you get a day's leap card credit thrown in.

    You could include 'necessary use' exemptions for wheelchair users or heavy tool transport etc.


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    #365
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    cdaly_ wrote: »
    Not if the toll was €1. Something like €20 each way to cross the M50 and a further €20 each way to cross the canals.

    Include park and ride at €10 outside the M50 but you get a day's leap card credit thrown in.

    You could include 'necessary use' exemptions for wheelchair users or heavy tool transport etc.

    That'll defeat the purpose of the M50, better to toll based on the number of exits traveled. Getting on at 1 and exiting at the next being more expensive than someone who goes the full length of it.


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    #366
    cdaly_
    Registered Users Posts: 6,440 ✭✭✭cdaly_


    amcalester wrote: »
    That'll defeat the purpose of the M50, better to toll based on the number of exits traveled. Getting on at 1 and exiting at the next being more expensive than someone who goes the full length of it.

    No. I'm talking about crossing the M50. You can travel along it all you like...


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    #367
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    cdaly_ wrote: »
    No. I'm talking about crossing the M50. You can travel along it all you like...

    Ah, sorry I read that as increasing the current toll.

    Still thinks it's unworkable, too big of an area. I do think there'll eventually be a congestion charge within the canals with some of the main arterial roads excluded.


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    #368
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,148 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    The Enbalmer wrote: »
    Pedestrians are not Road users they cross the roads but they do not travel on the roads.

    Ermm, they do. In fact I only done so at lunch time.


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    #369
    PhilOssophy
    Registered Users Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    I think the mods should put a stop to every thread turning into cyclists v car drivers, quoting stats, etc.
    As a pedestrian most of the time around Dublin, both are as bad as each other.


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    #370
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    PhilOssophy wrote: »
    I think the mods should put a stop to every thread turning into cyclists v car drivers, quoting stats, etc.
    As a pedestrian most of the time around Dublin, both are as bad as each other.

    The mods have already told all posters to get back on topic — please don’t discuss moderation in-thread.

    — moderator


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    #371
    PhilOssophy
    Registered Users Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    monument wrote: »
    The mods have already told all posters to get back on topic — please don’t discuss moderation in-thread.

    — moderator

    Sorry, I'd skipped a load of pages of predictable dross between them.


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    #372
    average_runner
    Registered Users Posts: 12,845 ✭✭✭✭average_runner


    cdaly_ wrote: »
    Not if the toll was €1. Something like €20 each way to cross the M50 and a further €20 each way to cross the canals.

    Include park and ride at €10 outside the M50 but you get a day's leap card credit thrown in.

    You could include 'necessary use' exemptions for wheelchair users or heavy tool transport etc.

    You need to have a quality bus service before you can do that.


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    #373
    sharper
    Registered Users Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭sharper


    average_runner wrote: »
    You need to have a quality bus service before you can do that.

    You need a plan which will deliver a quality bus service and implement things simultaneously.

    The problem we see right now via Bus Connects is people are opposing the plan to improve the bus service because they want to use their cars because the bus service isn't good enough.


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    #374
    average_runner
    Registered Users Posts: 12,845 ✭✭✭✭average_runner


    sharper wrote: »
    You need a plan which will deliver a quality bus service and implement things simultaneously.

    The problem we see right now via Bus Connects is people are opposing the plan to improve the bus service because they want to use their cars because the bus service isn't good enough.


    Well there is that, but there also the situation where people need to get into work for 8/9 on sunday morning and there is no bus service till after 9!!


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    #375
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,499 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    I’m guessing if cars are further discouraged from driving in to the city, the buses and LUAS will move a lot better and more units can be provided.


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    #376
    average_runner
    Registered Users Posts: 12,845 ✭✭✭✭average_runner


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    I’m guessing if cars are further discouraged from driving in to the city, the buses and LUAS will move a lot better and more units can be provided.

    Aye that's the sensible thinking, now you forgot we have unions in the country who look after their own interest!!!


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    #377
    SeanW
    Registered Users Posts: 8,741 ✭✭✭SeanW


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    It was rush hour, around 8.30am.


    If you want me to do your research for you, then we'll need to agree an hourly rate in advance.
    I suspect that no amount of evidence would be sufficient for some here.

    Nevertheless I actually looked at this again this week. I happened to be around the Bank of Ireland on College Green this past Friday, and I took some photos of the mess as it existed around 6:30 PM, more like a few minutes after. Normally one would hope that the evening rush would begin to subside at that point but it was still at least part in full swing and I would estimate that it would have taken a bus trying to get beyond College St. (either D'Olier St to Grafton St, or from Pearse St. to Westmoreland St.) anywhere from 10-30 minutes to do so.

    See attachments to this post. You can see buses, taxis and Luas trams jockeying for inadequate road space. You can also see queues of buses backed up from the CG junction all the way up D'Olier St and beyond the Garda Station on Pearse St.

    There is a serious problem at that junction and the photos I've posted show at least partial evidence of that.

    Because what you see in those photos is the results of decades of under-investment in public transport in Dublin. You can wax lyrical about the evil motorists all you like it doesn't change the fact that the alternatives other cities have, like Metro or even tram networks, extensive suburban rail systems etc, just don't exist.
    Pinch Flat wrote: »
    What do you think is the main factor impacting on an inefficient bus system in Dublin? I’m guessing people travelling to the city in 20% full vehicles has a lot to do with it. And where bus lanes are provided, motorists still insist on using them.

    That’s the circular argument about bus transport in Dublin. People who insist on driving to the city centre say they won’t use buses because they’re slow. Yet they’re part of the problem contributing to this. There’s an attitude that I can do it my car, but when 100,000 other people do it it kind of screws it up for everyone.
    Private motorists are banned form many movements through College Green.
    Pinch Flat wrote:
    Sad thing is, a lot of motorists would think this is serious. Don't underestimate Joe Public who wants to drive from his 3 bed semi in Lucan to the office door in Dublin 2.
    Funny, this was EXACTLY what I had to do by bus last year. IMO anyone who tries to do that by car is insane, because if it takes 2 hours by bus, with bus lanes all the way, how long would it take in a private car? :confused::confused:

    But lets assume that there are thousands of people driving every weekday from Lucan to an office in D2, and that they are not all certifiably insane for doing so. What should they do instead? Move to Windy Arbor and get the Luas? (Spoiler: It's maxed out and they might not be able to get on). How about move to Donaghmede? That's not a good idea either, because DARTs coming into the city around 9AM at least from the Northside are sardine cans, they can't take any more people). Or maybe they should stay in Lucan and enjoy averaging 5 MPH on some variant of the 25? What are the alternatives?


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    #378
    RacoonQueen
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 20,364 Mod ✭✭✭✭RacoonQueen


    Take out the private property dumped in picture 2 and you've got another lane for traffic Sean. ;)
    Jeez this thread has reminded me why I moved close to my office.


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    #379
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,499 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    From what I can see all the traffic in those (still) photos is moving bar one. Imagine we threw private cars back in to the mix?


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    #380
    Thargor
    Registered Users Posts: 17,865 ✭✭✭✭Thargor


    Theres no half an hour wait in any of them pics! One or two traffic light cycles would clear all of the vehicles in any of your pics. You have one image of a LUAS making its way along unimpeded, but you describe this as "Luas trams jockeying for inadequate road space"?


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    #381
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,363 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    From what I can see all the traffic in those (still) photos is moving bar one. Imagine we threw private cars back in to the mix?

    They raise the question of why we let taxis in bus lanes and bus gates.


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    #382
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,314 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    picture 1 - i can see what i think are 4 or 5 buses, and 8 or 9 taxis.
    picture 2 - much harder to tell, but about the same ratio.
    not madly dissimilar for most other shots. given that a car takes up pretty much half the space of a dublin bus, it is making a good argument for banning taxis from college green. you could probably double the number of buses by removing the taxis, so passenger throughput would increase.


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    #383
    SeanW
    Registered Users Posts: 8,741 ✭✭✭SeanW


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    From what I can see all the traffic in those (still) photos is moving bar one. Imagine we threw private cars back in to the mix?
    1) I did not take video on Friday. The stills were to show how far back the buses were queuing at that point. And while in some the buses were moving albeit very slowly, mostly if there's blur it's because of the camera taking poor pictures in those conditions.
    2) I am certainly not suggesting that we "throw private cars back into the mix" at that junction as it would be madness in that case. What I am suggesting is that any proposed solution must involve more than just crapping on motorists. Something no-one here seems capable of.


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    #384
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,499 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    SeanW wrote: »
    1) I did not take video on Friday. The stills were to show how far back the buses were queuing at that point. And while in some the buses were moving albeit very slowly, mostly if there's blur it's because of the camera taking poor pictures in those conditions.
    2) I am certainly not suggesting that we "throw private cars back into the mix" at that junction as it would be madness in that case. What I am suggesting is that any proposed solution must involve more than just crapping on motorists. Something no-one here seems capable of.

    Yeah, point taken and thanks for taking the time to put up images. They seem to be moving in all but one of the photos looking at the brake lights and the positioning of the buses. In one the lane that the buses could overtake each other is blocked by cars. I'm a motorist myself, but I'm experienced enough to know that motorists are the main cause of traffic delays in Dublin. Huge injections of money needs to be made in the city to get motorists out of the cars and in to a decent public transport system.

    I can't see it happening very quickly. TD's from over represented other parts of the country on the receiving end of motorways with future full capacity and road upgrades to service sparse populations do not want to see money being spent on an underground metro style service for the capital. And they seem to be having their way.


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    #385
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,314 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    https://twitter.com/cosaingalway/status/1110174376840884224


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    #386
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    PhilOssophy wrote: »
    I think the mods should put a stop to every thread turning into cyclists v car drivers, quoting stats, etc.
    As a pedestrian most of the time around Dublin, both are as bad as each other.

    In terms of outcomes they are quite evidently not.


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    #387
    downtheroad
    Registered Users Posts: 2,751 ✭✭✭downtheroad


    I found the traffic in Dublin much lighter today even with the poor weather. It's amazing the difference schools being off makes.


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    #388
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    downtheroad wrote: »
    I found the traffic in Dublin much lighter today even with the poor weather. It's amazing the difference schools being off makes.

    Just shows you how many lazy kids and parents there are out there.

    I walked or cycled to school no issues and it's amazing to see the same cars every day sit in traffic to drop the kids to turn back and sit in traffic again.

    See so many that are a 10 minutes walk from house to school but they will sit in the car for 30 minutes or more...


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    #389
    Qrt
    Registered Users Posts: 1,627 ✭✭✭Qrt


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    Just shows you how many lazy kids and parents there are out there.

    I walked or cycled to school no issues and it's amazing to see the same cars every day sit in traffic to drop the kids to turn back and sit in traffic again.

    See so many that are a 10 minutes walk from house to school but they will sit in the car for 30 minutes or more...

    The issue of schoolbags needs to be dealt with fairly urgently. My bag was routinely 10kg in weight, having to walk to the bus was absolute torture when I had to do it. Looking back (it’s not long ago), I would’ve LOVED to cycle to school, but the weight is a major obstacle.


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    #390
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Qrt wrote: »
    The issue of schoolbags needs to be dealt with fairly urgently. My bag was routinely 10kg in weight, having to walk to the bus was absolute torture when I had to do it. Looking back (it’s not long ago), I would’ve LOVED to cycle to school, but the weight is a major obstacle.

    Strap onto bike???


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    #391
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,314 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    it's not just the parents not dropping their kids to school, you'll almost certainly find that there are more parents taking the week off themselves too, so there's less worker commuter traffic also.


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