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Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VIII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

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  • Options
    #4472
    moon2
    Registered Users Posts: 677 ✭✭✭moon2


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I'm not sure if that greatly changes anything. He still didn't condemn white supremacy which is bizarre..

    Why did he tell a group to stand by if he doesn't even know who they are?

    I'm not sure which lie makes it worse for him...


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    #4473
    StringerBell
    Registered Users Posts: 14,019 ✭✭✭✭StringerBell


    hetuzozaho wrote: »
    Think he's done that before.

    I didn't think he'd tell the proud boys to stand down. So I have to hold my hands up.

    He told them to stand down at the debate though. Stand down and stand by.

    Imagine the heat he took from his team after the debate to get him to issue that semi correction (filled with other lies)

    "People say ‘go with the flow’ but do you know what goes with the flow? Dead fish."



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    #4474
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    duploelabs wrote: »
    I acknowledged your correction and apologised.
    Still doesn't stop them being a hateful shower of pricks

    No worries.


  • Options
    #4475
    hetuzozaho
    Registered Users Posts: 2,840 ✭✭✭hetuzozaho


    StringerBell wrote: »
    He told them to stand down at the debate though. Stand down and stand by.

    No he didn't.


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    #4476
    volchitsa
    Registered Users Posts: 7,000 ✭✭✭volchitsa


    StringerBell wrote: »
    He told them to stand down at the debate though. Stand down and stand by.

    Imagine the heat he took from his team after the debate to get him to issue that semi correction (filled with other lies)

    Stand back, rather than stand down, I thought?


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    #4477
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,651 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I'm not dying on any hill. I don't see how correcting people on false accusations is defending their target.

    They may not explicitly state they are white supremacists but a venn diagram that shows their membership and those who are also white supremacists is going to just show one circle.

    If it walks and quacks like a duck.....


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    #4478
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,941 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    The reality is with these fringe groups, is they tend to cross-pollinate, or swim in similar, anti establishment waters. Same seen here in Ireland where for whatever reason the anti lockdown crowd seem to mix and match with the various nationalist or we're-not-racist-but... groups. Maybe it's the similar thread of sovereignty as a unifying totem in our cases, maybe it's just outlying groups tend to orbit each other.

    But while Proud Boys may not themselves be white supremacists, white supremacy tends toward a toxic brand of masculinity or men as the dominant gender. Sounds familiar. So invariably crossover occurs within these two groups. No more than any ideological grouping, no matter how honest the purpose it's hard to root out extremists. When Proud Boys are already extremist in their views that slide takes less time.


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    #4479
    timsey tiger
    Registered Users Posts: 1,768 ✭✭✭timsey tiger


    volchitsa wrote: »
    Stand back, rather than stand down, I thought?

    Just listened to the debate segment, he definitely said stand back and stand by. Shame on anybody coming on here saying otherwise.


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    #4480
    timsey tiger
    Registered Users Posts: 1,768 ✭✭✭timsey tiger


    VinLieger wrote: »
    They may not explicitly state they are white supremacists but a venn diagram that shows their membership and those who are also white supremacists is going to just show one circle.

    If it walks and quacks like a duck.....

    ... but doesn't fly, then it could well be a duck billed platypus.

    I think your Venn diagram would be one small circle within a much larger one.


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    #4481
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,400 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    timsey tiger wrote: »
    Just listened to the debate segment, he definitely said stand back and stand down. Shame on anybody coming on here saying otherwise.

    Heres the video

    He clearly says stand back and stand by!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZk6VzSLe4Y


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    #4482
    timsey tiger
    Registered Users Posts: 1,768 ✭✭✭timsey tiger


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    Heres the video

    He clearly says stand back and stand by!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZk6VzSLe4Y

    Woops :( thanks


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    #4483
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    timsey tiger wrote: »
    Woops :( thanks

    OK, I have to ask; why were you so certain before that video was posted? Why were you so comfortable to shame on people about something that would take 5 seconds to check? What had you so convinced? This honestly isn't an attack, I just can't understand it coming from a genuine place.


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    #4484
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 9,957 ✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    pixelburp wrote: »
    The reality is with these fringe groups, is they tend to cross-pollinate, or swim in similar, anti establishment waters. Same seen here in Ireland where for whatever reason the anti lockdown crowd seem to mix and match with the various nationalist or we're-not-racist-but... groups. Maybe it's the similar thread of sovereignty as a unifying totem in our cases, maybe it's just outlying groups tend to orbit each other.

    But while Proud Boys may not themselves be white supremacists, white supremacy tends toward a toxic brand of masculinity or men as the dominant gender. Sounds familiar. So invariably crossover occurs within these two groups. No more than any ideological grouping, no matter how honest the purpose it's hard to root out extremists. When Proud Boys are already extremist in their views that slide takes less time.

    Certainly some truth to that, but one could equally look at the various groups on the opposite spectrum. A tendency towards supremacy to be found there also, with no shortage of toxic femininity either.


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    #4485
    Justin Credible Darts
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Justin Credible Darts


    If Trump wins the election there will be some crying and back peddling on here.


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    #4486
    gizmo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭ gizmo


    Justin Credible Darts wrote: »
    If Trump wins the election there will be some crying and back peddling on here.
    That's the third time you've mentioned back peddling on this topic. Whatever about it potentially coming from some quarters of the DNC due to their choice of candidate, you've now explicitly said here. As a matter of interest, what do you mean by this?


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    #4487
    Justin Credible Darts
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Justin Credible Darts


    gizmo wrote: »
    That's the third time you've mentioned back peddling on this topic. Whatever about it potentially coming from some quarters of the DNC due to their choice of candidate, you've now explicitly said here. As a matter of interest, what do you mean by this?




    you are a liar.


    It was my first post in this topic, I suggest you get your facts right before firing off lies


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    #4488
    gizmo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭ gizmo


    Justin Credible Darts wrote: »
    you are a liar.


    It was my first post in this topic, I suggest you get your facts right before firing off lies

    Post #1

    Post #2

    Post #3

    Kindly apoligise.


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    #4489
    Justin Credible Darts
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Justin Credible Darts


    you said this topic. you are now bringing up other threads.....wow, speak about scraping the barrel.

    If you are going to obsess about my posts on the entire forum, then keep counting, because I can mention all I want.
    I am curious though as to what in my post would upset you that much.

    Are you genuinely worried he might win again, is it that important to you the results of an election you have no say in ?


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    #4490
    gizmo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭ gizmo


    Justin Credible Darts wrote: »
    you said this topic. you are now bringing up other threads.....wow, speak about scraping the barrel.

    If you are going to obsess about my posts on the entire forum, then keep counting, because I can mention all I want.
    I am curious though as to what in my post would upset you that much.

    Are you genuinely worried he might win again, is it that important to you the results of an election you have no say in ?
    The topic, as is quite evident from the referenced posts, is if Trump wins you feel there'll be some back peddling done.

    The reason it stood out on each occasion is because I find it to be a rather strange assertion. It's not a trick question, you're free to mention it as many times as you want and it didn't upset me in the slightest, I'm genuinely curious to know what you feel will be said and by whom.

    And again, I'd appreciate an apology for the previous accusation, it was entirely unwarranted.


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    #4491
    Justin Credible Darts
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Justin Credible Darts


    I have read how "idiots" voted for Trump.
    How Trump never paid his taxes and people will turn on him for that.,
    Trump is a racist, he has small hands, he is dogmatic etc etc.

    I have read it all, the point is if he gets back in, will the so called people who supposedly have turned on him and vote for him again, will the people still be idiots ?

    If biden wins, and wins well, will the people who previously voted trump and were idiots, will they cease be idiots now because they voted for Biden.

    for the record I think biden will win, should win, and prefer him to Trump, as Biden is the lesser of 2 evils. But should the american people show again that they like Trump and gets back in, there will be some very upset people


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    #4492
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,479 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Justin Credible Darts wrote: »
    I have read how "idiots" voted for Trump.
    How Trump never paid his taxes and people will turn on him for that.,
    Trump is a racist, he has small hands, he is dogmatic etc etc.

    I have read it all, the point is if he gets back in, will the so called people who supposedly have turned on him and vote for him again, will the people still be idiots ?

    If biden wins, and wins well, will the people who previously voted trump and were idiots, will they cease be idiots now because they voted for Biden.

    for the record I think biden will win, should win, and prefer him to Trump, as Biden is the lesser of 2 evils. But should the american people show again that they like Trump and gets back in, there will be some very upset people

    If Trump gets back in, then every American should not only be upset but deeply worried about the future of their country.

    Trump is tearing it down. Justice is now a political plaything, division is a key target, corruption is indemic, appointments are made based on personal loyalty rather than ability, truth and accountability is gone, responsibility is for someone else.

    I could go on.

    To vote for Trump in 2016 could at least be understood on the basis of him beining a largely unknown quantity politically, the distaste for HC and a call for change.

    None of that holds up in 2020, so a vote for Trump is a vote for all the above and more. It is an acceptance of the continued decline in US standing, it is an acceptance that the US us weak and losing and needs to shrink into itself to survive.

    And its an acceptance that the next 4 years will be much worse.


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    #4493
    StringerBell
    Registered Users Posts: 14,019 ✭✭✭✭StringerBell


    hetuzozaho wrote: »
    No he didn't.

    Ah, he said stand back didn't he :D my bad, apologies!

    "People say ‘go with the flow’ but do you know what goes with the flow? Dead fish."



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    #4494
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,805 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    Justin Credible Darts wrote:
    I have read how "idiots" voted for Trump. How Trump never paid his taxes and people will turn on him for that., Trump is a racist, he has small hands, he is dogmatic etc etc.

    The 'deplorables' aren't idiots at all, they're just folks who have been completely screwed over, continually by both parties, and himself has just accelerated this screwing over, only they don't realise it


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    #4495
    timsey tiger
    Registered Users Posts: 1,768 ✭✭✭timsey tiger


    Deleted User wrote: »
    OK, I have to ask; why were you so certain before that video was posted? Why were you so comfortable to shame on people about something that would take 5 seconds to check? What had you so convinced? This honestly isn't an attack, I just can't understand it coming from a genuine place.

    It was a typo


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    #4496
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,941 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    AbusesToilets wrote: »
    Certainly some truth to that, but one could equally look at the various groups on the opposite spectrum. A tendency towards supremacy to be found there also, with no shortage of toxic femininity either.

    One could, but given my post was explicitly rebuking the contention that "Proud Boys aren't White Supremacists", I'm not sure what you're reaching for except some "both sides" reminder that yes, extremists exist in any walk of life. However, pertinent here is the notion that Fringe Groups - like Proud Boys and the myriad supremacist groups found in biker gangs etc - attract more of that cast of person; perhaps due to their inherently anti-establishment credentials. This goes double in America where the engrained culture of individualism has often mutated into militias, lone-wolf bombers, and the kind of anti-lockdown resistance seen across the country (and in its President).

    Equally relevant to your contention, is that White Supremacists currently possess far more of am immediate security threat to the US than any number of ranting "feminists" who might believe themselves the superior gender. Which would be a pretty vague, insubstantial number given there's no sign of any organised groups to the level of PB. If the next, 4th Wave of feminism begin to form militias or attacking minority groups, then there might be parity to your comparison. Until then, fringe ranting on Twitter from randomers is hardly comparable.


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    #4497
    Drumpot
    Registered Users Posts: 19,306 ✭✭✭✭Drumpot


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    If Trump gets back in, then every American should not only be upset but deeply worried about the future of their country.

    Trump is tearing it down. Justice is now a political plaything, division is a key target, corruption is indemic, appointments are made based on personal loyalty rather than ability, truth and accountability is gone, responsibility is for someone else.

    I could go on.

    To vote for Trump in 2016 could at least be understood on the basis of him beining a largely unknown quantity politically, the distaste for HC and a call for change.

    None of that holds up in 2020, so a vote for Trump is a vote for all the above and more. It is an acceptance of the continued decline in US standing, it is an acceptance that the US us weak and losing and needs to shrink into itself to survive.

    And its an acceptance that the next 4 years will be much worse.

    I think the election is for the soul of America. In the middle of chaos it can be hard to actually realise how bad something is and quantify the damage being done.

    If you wrote down all the things Trump has done to discredit the presidential position with childish rants and chronic lies, his tenure has shown foreign enemies how easy it is to manipulate an American election, using the position in an almost dictator fashion, is stoking civil unrest by dividing the nation, is undermining his countries standing on the world stage, could not of underestimated and responded to the COVID situation much worse, undermining democracy, isolating USA and to embolden/strengthen pretty much every rival of USA, he could hardly of done much more damage in 4 years. I actually think I’ve probably missed a few things aswell!

    If the president was doing these things somehow in the national interest there might be an argument for him but he’s not. There’s nothing to even hint that he cares about anything other then what he can get out of the position personally.

    More then idiotic, it shows how selfish and ignorant people can be when voting and to a degree it’s the same on both sides. It’s part of the reason I find it odd that people think religion is so bad (people blindly following it) when there are so many other things like politics and money that people will revere to the point of fanaticism, it really is no different. 40% of the population would vote for a democratic or republican candidate regardless of who was running. As Southpark said, it’s always between a giant douche or a turd sandwich.

    But Trump is so f**king dangerous, he’s taken things to the next level. He doesn’t come across as anyway intelligent and is prob quite easy to manipulate with the right incentive , money, prestige and massage his ego. You need only look at how sensitive he is to criticism to see how easily he’s rattled.

    Sadly Trump is also a reflection of humanity. Following a chancer , a failed businessman who is better at projecting an image of success then being one but who people follow. As a species we are quite often destined to follow and be led by people of poor/questionable character For the very shallow reason that they possess a certain charm/charisma.


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    #4498
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,613 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    We all know Trump shoots from the hip so to speak, he doesnt really have a filter he just says whatever pops into his head. He does it daily. So when you hear something from him its most definitely what he is really thinking.

    What the whole tax fiasco has shown us is that his vehement defence of not showing his tax details for the last 4 years has been because he knew full well he pays near zero or zero tax AND on top of that he is up to his eyebrows in IOU debt. It tarnishes his image of success and being even remotely a decent business man.

    But what the above shows us is the whole Russian relationship. We know Trump shoots from the hip, we know trump cares not a jot for anyone but what he can get out of something for himself. Any Putin has consistently been his off limits subject, Just like the tax he never says anything negative about Putin. He always comes back with 'we'll look into that' . He IS hiding something, he most definitely is hiding something. The IOUs are either from Russia / Putin allies directly, there's some criminal federal problems there or Putin has got some really strong Kompromat on Trump.

    There is no other literal explanation of it. Russia is not a hoax, and just like the tax it will come out at some point properly.


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    #4499
    amandstu
    Registered Users Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭amandstu


    listermint wrote: »
    We all know Trump shoots from the hip so to speak, he doesnt really have a filter he just says whatever pops into his head. He does it daily. So when you hear something from him its most definitely what he is really thinking.

    What the whole tax fiasco has shown us is that his vehement defence of not showing his tax details for the last 4 years has been because he knew full well he pays near zero or zero tax AND on top of that he is up to his eyebrows in IOU debt. It tarnishes his image of success and being even remotely a decent business man.

    But what the above shows us is the whole Russian relationship. We know Trump shoots from the hip, we know trump cares not a jot for anyone but what he can get out of something for himself. Any Putin has consistently been his off limits subject, Just like the tax he never says anything negative about Putin. He always comes back with 'we'll look into that' . He IS hiding something, he most definitely is hiding something. The IOUs are either from Russia / Putin allies directly, there's some criminal federal problems there or Putin has got some really strong Kompromat on Trump.

    There is no other literal explanation of it. Russia is not a hoax, and just like the tax it will come out at some point properly.
    Seems like the Russian secret service would have been in dereliction of duty not to have got their claws into this excuse for a representative.

    At the least get him to borrow money from a tainted source even if innocently done .

    With this man you have to assume they could have easily gone further.


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    #4500
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,651 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    listermint wrote: »
    We all know Trump shoots from the hip so to speak, he doesnt really have a filter he just says whatever pops into his head. He does it daily. So when you hear something from him its most definitely what he is really thinking.

    What the whole tax fiasco has shown us is that his vehement defence of not showing his tax details for the last 4 years has been because he knew full well he pays near zero or zero tax AND on top of that he is up to his eyebrows in IOU debt. It tarnishes his image of success and being even remotely a decent business man.

    But what the above shows us is the whole Russian relationship. We know Trump shoots from the hip, we know trump cares not a jot for anyone but what he can get out of something for himself. Any Putin has consistently been his off limits subject, Just like the tax he never says anything negative about Putin. He always comes back with 'we'll look into that' . He IS hiding something, he most definitely is hiding something. The IOUs are either from Russia / Putin allies directly, there's some criminal federal problems there or Putin has got some really strong Kompromat on Trump.

    There is no other literal explanation of it. Russia is not a hoax, and just like the tax it will come out at some point properly.


    Heres a great summary on reddit of how involved he and his businesses are with the russian mob aka the russian intelligence service


    https://www.reddit.com/r/Keep_Track/comments/hxp0ls/an_overview_of_trumps_numerous_ties_to_russia/


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    #4501
    aloyisious
    Registered Users Posts: 11,539 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    The only thing that motivates Trump is money, hence the market and his question "what's in it for them" not being able to understand anything outside financial motivation. He refuses to get it that others can have a different outlook on reasons for doing things, that it's not always about the next deal, hence his "suckers and losers" comments. Toss him a buck and he's yours for the taking.


This discussion has been closed.
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