Zamano

cormie · 23-03-2009 4:49pm #1

So on I think it was, March 7th, I got a text out of nowhere about some Podge and Rodge subscription and it told me text STOP to unsubscribe (unsubscribe to what I thought?). Apparantly I signed up to some service and it was done from my phone, the only way possible I think it could have been that my browser was activated while in my pocket and it did it from the homepage somehow, an unfortunate coincidence of random key presses in my pocket perhaps?

Anyway, it turned out I was charged 2.50 the next day after I got another text because I didn't text stop. I was afraid to text stop incase that itself would sign me up to something, these services are generally very sneaky. I rang o2 and they unsubscribed me but I wanted to find out where this company got my details from anyway and to get my money back. They said it'd be investigated and all that and I'd be sent a call log. I never got the log which was sent out on March 9th and that was the last I heard. I rang back today and they said it was investigated and they said the refund was declined as it happened from my phone and I didn't text stop! This was seen as them getting my permission:eek:

The lady the first day said it was done through a company called eirborne, I forgot the name of them today when I rang back but I asked who it was done through and the lady on the phone said she didn't have access to that info, I said the last lady in the same department was able to tell me, so why couldn't she. Then I remembered it was eirborne. I googled and saw eirborne was bought by Zamano!

It's only 2.50 yeah, but it's a matter of principal, I feel I've been robbed of 2.50 and I don't like the idea of it.

Any suggestions as to how I can go about getting what I believe is my money back?

jordainius · 23-03-2009 5:10pm

To be honest, I think you should be glad that it was just 2.50euro and leave it be! I've heard horror stories of people being sprung for much worse than that!

I know its no use to you now but you should always reply STOP. Then they have to stop, if they continue after that then I think they're breakin some laws and you would be entitled to reclaim anything they charge you.

But if you don't reply stop, technically speaking they have done nothing wrong.

Rsaeire · 23-03-2009 5:20pm

cormie wrote: »

So on I think it was, March 7th, I got a text out of nowhere about some Podge and Rodge subscription and it told me text STOP to unsubscribe (unsubscribe to what I thought?). Apparantly I signed up to some service and it was done from my phone, the only way possible I think it could have been that my browser was activated while in my pocket and it did it from the homepage somehow, an unfortunate coincidence of random key presses in my pocket perhaps?

Anyway, it turned out I was charged 2.50 the next day after I got another text because I didn't text stop. I was afraid to text stop incase that itself would sign me up to something, these services are generally very sneaky. I rang o2 and they unsubscribed me but I wanted to find out where this company got my details from anyway and to get my money back. They said it'd be investigated and all that and I'd be sent a call log. I never got the log which was sent out on March 9th and that was the last I heard. I rang back today and they said it was investigated and they said the refund was declined as it happened from my phone and I didn't text stop! This was seen as them getting my permission:eek:

The lady the first day said it was done through a company called eirborne, I forgot the name of them today when I rang back but I asked who it was done through and the lady on the phone said she didn't have access to that info, I said the last lady in the same department was able to tell me, so why couldn't she. Then I remembered it was eirborne. I googled and saw eirborne was bought by Zamano!

It's only 2.50 yeah, but it's a matter of principal, I feel I've been robbed of 2.50 and I don't like the idea of it.

Any suggestions as to how I can go about getting what I believe is my money back?

Some people, like yourself, are signed up to these services due to a family member/friend/ colleague using their phone to download a ringtone/game/wallpaper etc and don’t realise that a subscription starts from the moment they access the provider’s website, send an sms or call the provider’s number.

O2 should be able to advise you of the exact time, date and method of subscription, e.g. 16:15 23-03-09 via SMS, took place. This information can be sought from the content provider on your behalf by O2. I wouldn't drop this issue, as you mentioned, it is the principle.

cormie · 23-03-2009 5:35pm

I'd be pretty certain the only way it could have happened is that my browser went off in my pocket, which does happen quite frequently if it's not locked properly, as there's a button that loads it up straight away and brings me to an o2 homepage, which I'm guessing is where there was a link about podge and rodge and it must have just been pressed by mistake while in my pocket. Whether this is seen as permission or not is unknown, but it's surely deceitful if it is!

Random · 23-03-2009 7:36pm

This one might be better off in Consumer Issues so I've moved it for you.

-Freebird- · 23-03-2009 10:18pm

Call the regulator - RegTel: 1850741741 www.regtel.ie

But if you didn't text stop then you won't get a refund, it's crappy but that's their legislation.

cormie · 23-03-2009 10:55pm

Who's legislation is that? Can I drive up to their offices and load my van with some office chairs, plants and anything else I fancy and tell them that by sending a text to my number they gave me permission to do this and if they want the items back, they'll have to text STOP to my number?

foggy_lad · 24-03-2009 1:20am

-Freebird- wrote: »

Call the regulator - RegTel: 1850741741 www.regtel.ie

But if you didn't text stop then you won't get a refund, it's crappy but that's their legislation.

if the message they sent was unsolicited they are breaking the law by subscribing people to their services without their knowledge or permission and the stop text is generally for when you have knowingly signed up to one of these services and want to stop recieving messages and being charged but also works when you get charged without subscribing.

robo · 06-04-2009 10:06pm

There were a good few people on Liveline today discussing this. One guy was offered money to repay the money taken from his credit, but he continued to say no as the amount being offered was not near the amount they had taken from him. He used the assistance of Regtel to get his money back. Regtell know all bout this company and loads of people have got caught with these texts cos they didn't text back STOP, but like yourself, they didn't sign up to anything to say No to!
You should be able to hear todays podcast of Liveline

pleba · 07-04-2009 7:55am

continue to push this with O2. Ask them for a log of the date and time you subscribed to this service.

If it was via an SMS they will have that information (but not the content of the SMS), and if it was done online they will also have this information. So make sure you push it with them.

Also, if nothing is forthcoming from them (give them a couple of days) then make sure you push this with Regtel and Zamano / Eirbourne. I find that writing to the CEO / MD of the companies involved always ensures a swift response.

Might seem like a lot of effort for €2.50 but this is happening far too often to too many people.

Slunk · 07-04-2009 8:10am

That exact same thing happened to me. I must have subscribed to some jokes while the phone was in my pocket. Poxy SE K800 has a button that brings you straight onto the web. A few times i have taken out my phone and seen the o2 site open. Must have been really unlucky to have clicked enough times in the wrong place to subscibe. Took about 12.50 off me before i realised. Checked my account on the o2 site and said Humour -€2.50 or something. I didnt find it that funny, and i never even got my jokes :mad:

I have since changed my homepage in the settings to a non exsistant site so it cannot connect to the site therefore not charging me money.

Guy:Incognito · 07-04-2009 10:51am

cormie wrote: »

Who's legislation is that? Can I drive up to their offices and load my van with some office chairs, plants and anything else I fancy and tell them that by sending a text to my number they gave me permission to do this and if they want the items back, they'll have to text STOP to my number?

Maybe if you could take the items by text you could try that. otherwise its stealing.

The texting of STOP is common practice and has been adveretised for quite a while now.

cormie · 07-04-2009 11:05am

I don't see how them coming to my phone and taking my money is any different to me pulling up in a van and loading in a few nice plants?

:pac:

Bob Z · 07-04-2009 11:26am

Stekelly wrote: »

Maybe if you could take the items by text you could try that. otherwise its stealing.

The texting of STOP is common practice and has been adveretised for quite a while now.

Hes has a point you text get signed up to these things out of the blue then its your fault for not cancelling

cormie · 07-04-2009 12:21pm

Slunk wrote: »

That exact same thing happened to me. I must have subscribed to some jokes while the phone was in my pocket. Poxy SE K800 has a button that brings you straight onto the web. A few times i have taken out my phone and seen the o2 site open. Must have been really unlucky to have clicked enough times in the wrong place to subscibe. Took about 12.50 off me before i realised. Checked my account on the o2 site and said Humour -€2.50 or something. I didnt find it that funny, and i never even got my jokes :mad:

I have since changed my homepage in the settings to a non exsistant site so it cannot connect to the site therefore not charging me money.

Yup, same phone here, SE K800, that button is a pain in the ass and I think that's what caused me to go online, and then just an unfortunate and coincidental combination of key presses while in my pocket, somehow got me subscribed to it :mad: I googled and I now have that button pointing to a picture that doesn't exist in my phone, so when I click it, nothing happens, it doesn't even attempt to go online I don't think

I Googled it and found it, forget what I googled for though or how to do it :P

jor el · 07-04-2009 12:31pm

cormie wrote: »

I don't see how them coming to my phone and taking my money is any different to me pulling up in a van and loading in a few nice plants? :pac:

If the sign up came from your phone, then they haven't stolen anything, and it's your responsibility to stop it by following the instructions they gave you.

If you can prove that you didn't sign up (either deliberately or accidentally, or through ignorance when you signed up to some other service and this may have been bundled in) then you have a case.

If the sign up did happen from your phone though, then it's your responsibility to either not let that happen in future, or to stop it when it does.

Lab_Mouse · 07-04-2009 12:32pm

RTFM..key lock on the phone anyone?just might work I think.

The majority of joke/ringtone/video services are not one off services,you do have to text stop once you subscribe to them..feel sorry for parents kids who sign up for the craaazy frog ringtones or such and wonder where there kids credit goes...

Hobbes · 07-04-2009 1:01pm

I know people are talking about keylocks and what not but Zamano are famous for pulling crap like this (opt-out billing subscription). It is illegal but at least in the UK Zamano the fines they pay (100-150K) are a tiny fraction of the profits they make from the action (millions).

Just google Zamano or "Zamano fined".

When you do reply to the msg only type in STOP ALL. You should also report them but as mentioned it will have little to no effect on that companies profits.

[edit] Actually their profits are way down. Appears the recession is hurting them as well.

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/breaking-news/ireland/business/pretax-profits-halved-at-zamano-13984915.html

cormie · 07-04-2009 1:08pm

I've automatic keyguard on, it still happens.

Jor El, I'm saying that if they can view an un authorised combination of key presses as enough reason to take 2.50 off me because I sent them something from my phone, can I not view the the text they sent me as authorisation to go and take a few plants from their reception/waiting room? :pac:

I really don't see the difference..

jor el · 07-04-2009 2:04pm

cormie wrote: »

Jor El, I'm saying that if they can view an un authorised combination of key presses as enough reason to take 2.50 off me because I sent them something from my phone, can I not view the the text they sent me as authorisation to go and take a few plants from their reception/waiting room? :pac:

No, it's not the same thing at all. How do they know whether you signed up by accident or not? You still signed up, regardless, and are responsible for opting out. They viewed your signing up to a service as authorisation by you to pay for that service, how else would they view it?

If the phone's keypad was locked, then this should not have happened, which is why I asked if you are sure you know how you got signed up. You're accepting that it must have been accidental, where as it may have been included with something else, or it may have been completely unauthorised.

Rakeline · 10-04-2009 4:26pm

This happens to my younger brother everytime he tops up he gets 2 or 3 msgs from them each costing 2 euro hes texted stop but it did nothing hes with meteor any ideas on how to stop it? It was a thing he signed up to on setanta and had a different name i cant think of it at the moment when i searched it i ended up at the zamano page and a bit of searching looks like there in court for this all the time.

foggy_lad · 10-04-2009 10:18pm

Rakeline wrote: »

This happens to my younger brother everytime he tops up he gets 2 or 3 msgs from them each costing 2 euro hes texted stop but it did nothing hes with meteor any ideas on how to stop it? It was a thing he signed up to on setanta and had a different name i cant think of it at the moment when i searched it i ended up at the zamano page and a bit of searching looks like there in court for this all the time.

go to the RegTel website and they have a number checker, put the 5digit number you are geting the texts from in and it brings up the name and contact details of the company involved. also i would suggest an email to RegTel telling them your brother texted stop but the messages keep coming!

DrumSteve · 11-04-2009 12:24pm

od you have the 5 digit code for the premium rate sms? the operator wont refund you the charges but zamano themselves will be able to tell you themselves exactly when you signed up & what you sent to them. Head to www.regtel.ie input the 5 digit number and it will give you all their details to conatct them. i would say to do this asap.

foggy_lad · 11-04-2009 1:13pm

DrumSteve wrote: »

od you have the 5 digit code for the premium rate sms? the operator wont refund you the charges but zamano themselves will be able to tell you themselves exactly when you signed up & what you sent to them. Head to www.regtel.ie input the 5 digit number and it will give you all their details to conatct them. i would say to do this asap.

once you text stop all texts and charges are supposed to STOP. so your brother is entitled to all charges from the 1st time he texted stop to the number.

Sam Vimes · 11-04-2009 1:54pm

Unless of course he has no proof that he sent it. You should always keep these messages

bigpinkelephant · 11-04-2009 3:23pm

I had the same problem with one of these companies. Never signed up to anything, but every time I'd top up by 10 euro, 8 would be taken, and I'd text STOP but nothing would happen. O2 told me who the company was, so I rang them. At first, they told me they had unsubscribed me, but I still kept getting texts. I rang again and demanded to speak to a supervisor but he "wasn't there". I told them I'd take legal action if they continued to steal 80% of my call credit. I didn't get any more texts after that

the_syco · 11-04-2009 4:47pm

Rakeline wrote: »

This happens to my younger brother

Is he under 18? As I'm pretty sure it's illegal for a minor to enter into a contract, and thus it's illegal for them to take his money.

Rakeline · 12-04-2009 6:31pm

Cheers for all the answers will give it a try. The funny thing about these is there is no 5 digit code he got another msg today that just said win great sports trips and that was it its from

http://mobxs.tv/w?code=354618167154

Will try that regtel thing thanks all!

jor el · 14-04-2009 1:01pm

bigpinkelephant wrote: »

I didn't get any more texts after that

Did you get your money back though?

Sam Vimes · 14-04-2009 1:22pm

Rakeline wrote: »

Cheers for all the answers will give it a try. The funny thing about these is there is no 5 digit code he got another msg today that just said win great sports trips and that was it its from

http://mobxs.tv/w?code=354618167154

Will try that regtel thing thanks all!

That's definitely zamano. In the source code of that page is this:

<p style="text-align:center">

<img class="coolmenu" src="http://159.134.94.202/wapImages//NonAdultImages/174/3777.gif" alt="" />
</p>

and the IP address 159.134.94.202 is zamano.com

ferdi · 16-04-2009 12:06pm

Sam Vimes wrote: »

the IP address 159.134.94.202 is zamano.com

Yep
I just had to sort this out for somebody (who had not subscribed to this service) who was recieving "service messages" at €2 a pop with no short code only the above weblink (http://mobxs.tv/w?code=354618167154), i called zamano on +353 (0) 1 488 5820 and was put through to customer service and apparently that mobile is now unsubscribed so if any more of these "service messages" arrive i'll be back on to them double quick!!

Zamano

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