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Lunchtime Live with Ciara Kelly [Mod warning post #1]

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    #62
    meeeeh
    Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    I'm starting to think that woman with an opinion equals deranged feminist for some.


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    #63
    ButtersSuki
    Registered Users Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    meeeeh wrote: »
    How was it incorrect? Why would you need feeding rooms? To hide nasty breasts? It's nothing to do with feminism, it's hiding breastfeeding women away in a country with criminally low breastfeeding rates. It's perfectly easy to breastfeed in airport without a special room and frankly people should cop on, including breastfeeding women who think they have to hide away.

    That was pretty much her reaction alright.

    The DAA came on to say that mothers were free to breastfeed in any area of the airport and that the service was there for those who wanted to feed their babies in a quieter and/or more private area. It was also pointed out that the room was also available to fathers who wished to feed their babies (it was not called a 'breastfeeding" room), but that was missed by Kelly in her effort to be as outraged as quickly as possible without of course taking the time to establish the facts.


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    #64
    ButtersSuki
    Registered Users Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    meeeeh wrote: »
    I'm starting to think that woman with an opinion equals deranged feminist for some.

    Not at all, but that's exactly the type of defence I've come to expect in recent debates. A woman with a stupid opinion deserves to be called out for it every bit as much as a man with one, but in recent times and in certain quarters it seems like a woman can say anything they want with impunity and any criticism is met with calls of misogyny.

    For the record, IMO, Paul Williams (and yes, to paraphrase someone, he is a man :rolleyes:) is IMO by far the worst presenter on Newstalk; but that fact alone doesn't make Ciara Kelly great.


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    #65
    hullaballoo
    Administrators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,710 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭hullaballoo


    ButtersSuki wrote: »
    A woman with a stupid opinion deserves to be called out for it every bit as much as a man with one, but in recent times and in certain quarters it seems like a woman can say anything they want with impunity and any criticism is met with calls of misogyny.

    Call out the stupid opinion then instead of the gender of the opinion-giver.

    That's the issue we're having here. Some cannot separate the two and are for their own reasons presuming the gender has something to do with the stupidity. Do you see?


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    #66
    meeeeh
    Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    ButtersSuki wrote: »
    That was pretty much her reaction alright.

    The DAA came on to say that mothers were free to breastfeed in any area of the airport and that the service was there for those who wanted to feed their babies in a quieter and/or more private area. It was also pointed out that the room was also available to fathers who wished to feed their babies (it was not called a 'breastfeeding" room), but that was missed by Kelly in her effort to be as outraged as quickly as possible without of course taking the time to establish the facts.

    Do you think it will help low breastfeeding rates if special rooms are provided because you should feel uncomfortable doing it in public? She put forward perfectly reasonable argument. If more women saw others breastfeeding in public, they would less likely start using bottles first time they needed to leave the house for more than an hour. It's not healthy attitude and sometimes it's better to provide less and make someone uncomfortable for 30 seconds (that's max how long breast is on show) than create this whole idea that breastfeeding mothers want to be hidden away .

    I apologise for derailing the thread. The reaction to her comments annoyed me then but I
    didn't have the time to reply. I'm not some bf activist but if you evaluate the problem rationally feeding rooms will do more damage than good.


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    #67
    ButtersSuki
    Registered Users Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    hullaballoo wrote: »
    Call out the stupid opinion then instead of the gender of the opinion-giver.

    That's the issue we're having here. Some cannot separate the two and are for their own reasons presuming the gender has something to do with the stupidity. Do you see?

    Did you read all of my post?


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    #68
    bloodless_coup
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭bloodless_coup


    ButtersSuki wrote: »
    Did you read all of my post?

    Of course they didn't. Too busy getting outraged and formulating their response.


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    #69
    ButtersSuki
    Registered Users Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Do you think it will help low breastfeeding rates if special rooms are provided because you should feel uncomfortable doing it in public? She put forward perfectly reasonable argument. If more women saw others breastfeeding in public, they would less likely start using bottles first time they needed to leave the house for more than an hour. It's not healthy attitude and sometimes it's better to provide less and make someone uncomfortable for 30 seconds (that's max how long breast is on show) than create this whole idea that breastfeeding mothers want to be hidden away .

    I apologise for derailing the thread. The reaction to her comments annoyed me then but I
    didn't have the time to reply. I'm not some bf activist but if you evaluate the problem rationally feeding rooms will do more damage than good.

    Regardless of the subject matter, she jumped to a reaction without possession of the facts - and that's something she does regularly. You're right that it has nothing to do with her gender, but equally, I'd call out any male presenter for this.

    As for my opinion on the feeding rooms in Dublin Airport, I'm fine with them. They were created due to requests from travelers for a private area - so what exactly are the DAA supposed to do? Say no to this request? Then there would be women and possibly men complaining they requested this facility and were turned down.

    You may well think it's fine for women to breastfeed publicly. I'm personally fine with it. But I do understand that not all women feel this way and simply telling them to get over themselves doesn't help that. Not all breastfeeding mothers want to be "hidden away" as you put it, but surely you'll accept that some want some level of privacy?


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    #70
    hullaballoo
    Administrators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,710 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭hullaballoo


    ButtersSuki wrote: »
    Did you read all of my post?

    Yes and I don't see how it's relevant to my point at all. You couldn't possibly be a misogynist if you think a man is the worst presenter is it?

    Or are you saying that the fact that you don't like Ciara Kelly but that has nothing to do with her gender? If that's the case, absolutely fine. No one is here to tell you or anyone else who you like or not.

    Just leave gender out of it. That's the point.


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    #71
    quintana76
    Registered Users Posts: 751 ✭✭✭quintana76


    They are trying to eliminate all traces of Hook in this slot. He is replaced by an equally opionated copy of Women's Hour.
    The only difference is that the opinions expressed are approved according to the current inflexible moral guidelines. As a result it is preachy and extremely dull.

    Chris Donohue's type of radio.


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    #72
    ButtersSuki
    Registered Users Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    hullaballoo wrote: »
    Yes and I don't see how it's relevant to my point at all. You couldn't possibly be a misogynist if you think a man is the worst presenter is it?

    Or are you saying that the fact that you don't like Ciara Kelly but that has nothing to do with her gender? If that's the case, absolutely fine. No one is here to tell you or anyone else who you like or not.

    Just leave gender out of it. That's the point.

    Not what I said at all, too busy to continue with this, sorry.


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    #73
    Five Green Bottles
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭Five Green Bottles


    A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »
    Five Green Bottles wrote: »
    Feminists hour might be a little more accurate.
    Oh give it a rest please, lads.

    Pat Kenny and George Hook (but especially Hook) have often voiced a mixture of support and incredulity at what they perceive as the unfair treatment of men and fathers in certain situations, without being slated.

    NT currently have one (temporary) solo female presenter on weekdays, and there is a disproportionate and frankly, bizarre, fixation with her gender and gender issues, which has never been applied to her predecessor.

    Get over it, please.

    For most hook supporters “ and yes, I am a woman “ was her final twist of the knife for most it was disgusting disgraceful and an appalling thing to say. The behavior of Dr. Kelly on RTÉ was worse. Her continual uninteresting one sided preaching since hooks departure is utterly intolerable.
    However if NT intends promoting a show specifically of interest to women fine, great but please label it as such and there won’t be complaints from those expecting a daily general interest/ political chat. Don’t think anyone would have a problem or a legitimate argument as to what ever Dr. Kelly’s impositions of forced feminist opinion in her daily preaching would contain were the show labeled as such.


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    #74
    PeterTheNinth
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,869 ✭✭✭PeterTheNinth


    Five Green Bottles wrote: »
    For most hook supporters “ and yes, I am a woman “ was her final twist of the knife for most it was disgusting disgraceful and an appalling thing to say.

    I wonder how Chris Donoghue or Jonathan Healy feel about her saying something like that? She has jumped them... two life long, experienced, qualified broadcasters... to land herself a prime radio slot with pretty much little or no experience / qualifications / talent herself. Both males, who Ciara Kelly perceives (from her statement) to be given preferential treatment in Newstalk. Is she really that justified in feeling oppressed or discriminated against because of her sex?

    She should just be grateful that she has been got this opportunity ahead of many much more qualified male AND female candidates.


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    #75
    Grolschevik
    Registered Users Posts: 3,472 ✭✭✭Grolschevik


    I thought it had been established that she said the 'woman' thing in response to Fintan O'Toole's critique of the lack of women presenters on Newstalk?

    Only with some posters here have I seen it applied to being a commentary on Hook's statement.


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    #76
    Five Green Bottles
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭Five Green Bottles


    PeterTheNinth wrote: »
    I wonder how Chris Donoghue or Jonathan Healy feel about her saying something like that? She has jumped them... two life long, experienced, qualified broadcasters... to land herself a prime radio slot with pretty much little or no experience / qualifications / talent herself. Both males, who Ciara Kelly perceives (from her statement) to be given preferential treatment in Newstalk. Is she really that justified in feeling oppressed or discriminated against because of her sex?

    She should just be grateful that she has been got this opportunity ahead of many much more qualified male AND female candidates.

    Chris has enough to annoy him after being knifed in the back from an ex politician colleague and friend. I'm not suggesting for a moment that it shouldn't be a female that replaces GH.
    I'm merely suggesting that if its going to be a radio version of RTE's Midday that the show should be labeled as a female interest show.
    My other point is that I agree that Dr. Kelly has little experience or justification for being the replacement for GH and for the show in its current format she is an appalling presenter and the show has become insufferable, however she appears content to be the token woman given the circumstances.


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    #77
    Ol' Donie
    Registered Users Posts: 19,577 ✭✭✭✭Ol' Donie


    I haven't listened in a while, not so much because of the Hook thing, I just listen to way less Newstalk because of the ads. So many ads.

    Anyway, has Dr Ciara Kelly be confirmed as George's replacement?


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    #78
    meeeeh
    Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Grolschevik wrote: »
    I thought it had been established that she said the 'woman' thing in response to Fintan O'Toole's critique of the lack of women presenters on Newstalk?

    Only with some posters here have I seen it applied to being a commentary on Hook's statement.

    Oh that was pointed out on numerous occasions but they just ignore it because it doesn't suit their narrative.

    Btw how qualified was Hook when he started his ramblings on Newstalk.


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    #79
    hullaballoo
    Administrators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,710 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭hullaballoo


    How many times?

    Drop the gender stuff right now.

    If it isn't clear enough:

    Moderator: Drop the gender stuff right now.


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    #80
    PeterTheNinth
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,869 ✭✭✭PeterTheNinth


    hullaballoo wrote: »
    How many times? Drop the gender stuff right now.

    I don't want to sound like Basil Fawlty but...

    She Started It!!!!:pac::pac:


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    #81
    PeterTheNinth
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,869 ✭✭✭PeterTheNinth


    Grolschevik wrote: »
    I thought it had been established that she said the 'woman' thing in response to Fintan O'Toole's critique of the lack of women presenters on Newstalk?

    I thought it was in response to the "Men's Shed FM" comment by Justine McCarthy on The Marion Finucane Show.


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    #82
    ButtersSuki
    Registered Users Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Oh that was pointed out on numerous occasions but they just ignore it because it doesn't suit their narrative.

    Btw how qualified was Hook when he started his ramblings on Newstalk.

    He had many, many years as a rugby analyst on tv and therefore would have had a lot of media/studio experience.

    FWIW, I hadn't listened to Hook in years as I just didn't like his contrarian style; nothing wrong with that. However if I then say I don't like Kelly's perpetually offended style, that's sexist apparently.


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    #83
    meeeeh
    Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    You didn't mention just perpetually offended style, the f-word was also there.

    Ciara Kelly has plenty of radio and tv experience on medical issues so she is just as experienced as Hook or Yates were. Jonathan Healy already had that slot and it didn't bring in enough listeners. O'Donahue was moved because the show didn't take of as well as Newstalk were hoping. Why would Newstalk stick with the same presenters if the numbers weren't good enough before. I'm not that sure that Ciara Kelly will be in that slot long term either. Reaction to the whole thing is completely hysterical, irrational and over the top.


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    #84
    ButtersSuki
    Registered Users Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    meeeeh wrote: »
    You didn't mention just perpetually offended style, the f-word was also there.

    Ciara Kelly has plenty of radio and tv experience on medical issues so she is just as experienced as Hook or Yates were. Jonathan Healy already had that slot and it didn't bring in enough listeners. O'Donahue was moved because the show didn't take of as well as Newstalk were hoping. Why would Newstalk stick with the same presenters if the numbers weren't good enough before. I'm not that sure that Ciara Kelly will be in that slot long term either. Reaction to the whole thing is completely hysterical, irrational and over the top.

    Where did I use any f-word? Please show me? Unless you're couning "FWIW" I'm afraid I didn't in that post.

    Surely you're not saying that presenting a pre-recorded segment on a show like "Operation Transformation" is the same as doing live TV?

    Now you've brought a load of men (Yates, Healy, Donohue) into it. If any poster mentions a woman all hell kicks off. Is that not a double standard?

    Even when I say I didn't like Hook's style, that's somehow not enough unless I praise Kelly. For the record, I wouldn't listen to and I would be as critical of Kelly if she was a man.

    I've stated Williams is the worst presenter on the station, and that I wasn't a fan of Hook's. But that criticism of males is ignored and it seems that unless I say "Ciara Kelly is amazing" I'm wrong, sexist, or both.


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    #85
    Ol' Donie
    Registered Users Posts: 19,577 ✭✭✭✭Ol' Donie


    Is she the feckin permanent host or what?

    Did they get rid of "Here come the girls" or any of the other slots?


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    #86
    monstermag
    Registered Users Posts: 192 ✭✭monstermag


    I'd say George Hook is itching to let rip, unfortunately I'd imagine he's been gagged by newstalk management. We may have to wait until he finally hangs up the microphone. The Newstalk 20, Fintan O' Toole and Dill would get it with both barrels.
    I wonder has his after dinner speech gigs been affected by this controversy?
    Is it just me or does anyone else think Pat Kenny has been a little frosty towards Chris Donohue when he does his phone in thing.


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    #87
    ligerdub
    Registered Users Posts: 2,584 ✭✭✭ligerdub


    hullaballoo wrote:
    Call out the stupid opinion then instead of the gender of the opinion-giver.

    hullaballoo wrote:
    That's the issue we're having here. Some cannot separate the two and are for their own reasons presuming the gender has something to do with the stupidity. Do you see?

    Your post would make sense were it not for the fact that Kelly herself made it her business to gender up the issue within seconds of taking up the radio show.

    With that in mind it's almost impossible to separate the two.


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    #88
    meeeeh
    Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    ButtersSuki wrote: »
    Where did I use any f-word? Please show me? Unless you're couning "FWIW" I'm afraid I didn't in that post.

    Surely you're not saying that presenting a pre-recorded segment on a show like "Operation Transformation" is the same as doing live TV?

    Now you've brought a load of men (Yates, Healy, Donohue) into it. If any poster mentions a woman all hell kicks off. Is that not a double standard?

    I mentioned presenters who had different career before they ended in media vs the seasoned presenters who maybe did not bring the numbers. It's beyond my understanding why is someone who is trying so hard to make a point that their criticism is not about gender constantly bringing up the subject of gender.

    I'm not even going to bother with the rest of the post because that horse is well dead by now.


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    #89
    meeeeh
    Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    ligerdub wrote: »
    With that in mind it's almost impossible to separate the two.

    Actually it's very easy...


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    #90
    ButtersSuki
    Registered Users Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    meeeeh wrote: »
    I mentioned presenters who had different career before they ended in media vs the seasoned presenters who maybe did not bring the numbers. It's beyond my understanding why is someone who is trying so hard to make a point that their criticism is not about gender constantly bringing up the subject of gender.

    I'm not even going to bother with the rest of the post because that horse is well dead by now.

    So responding to your comments is now me bringing up gender? Seriously?


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    #91
    Five Green Bottles
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭Five Green Bottles


    PeterTheNinth wrote: »
    I don't want to sound like Basil Fawlty but...

    She Started It!!!!:pac::pac:

    Its clearly a gender issue, It was made so by Dr. Kelly herself, and her two female NT colleagues together with the rest of NT20. Gender can not be in anyway separated from the issue no more than GH's initial comments that started this whole thing be separated from the discussion.


This discussion has been closed.
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