Learning German

warlikedave · 25-07-2017 3:38pm #1

Hi All

Just wanted to post up a thread to get some advice and information - I am looking to learn German from scratch and am daunted by the challenge.

I was wondering what is the best way to approach learning a language especially for someone who does not have a good ability concerning languages and language learning.

I also have restrictive money to invest in this but I really want to learn this language since it opens up a lot of working opportunities across the continent (Switzerland, Germany, Austria etc). I am open to getting one to one grinds but am limited by location (south county wicklow). Long term goal is to reach a good working understanding and speaking level of German in a 9 to 15 month period max.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Kind Regards

David

Captain Havoc · 27-07-2017 1:18pm

I'm learning with the open university but it's not cheap.

justback83 · 27-07-2017 1:30pm

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I'm learning with the open university but it's not cheap.

How is that going? I'm learning at the moment also but am like Goldilocks with teachers and methods........!

Manach · 27-07-2017 1:52pm

Duolingo - Free (advert supported) and good enough to get a grounding of the language.

warlikedave · 27-07-2017 1:57pm

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I'm learning with the open university but it's not cheap.

What is it like to learn with them? And what is the cost like? I was looking at the Goethe-Institut Irland currently but its a nightmare to get to especially with my working hours.

Solomon Pleasant · 27-07-2017 2:25pm

Hi,

I can hopefully give you some help, I'm studying business and german in Trinity college.

First of all, vocab is essential. You have to learn new words every day. Try spending 30-45 minutes everyday learning new words. I'd suggest going onto one of the german papers websites, finding a topic that interests you and translating it. Learn the new words. Keep doing this and you'll build vocab gradually. Examples would be Das Bild, Die Zeit or Handelsblatt.

For grammar, I would suggest "Hammer's German Grammar and Usage' by Martin Durrell. It has served me very well. Another one which is excellent is Essential German Grammar by Martin Durrell.

For spoken German, this
is an excellent site where you can write, skype and meet face to face with people all with the goal of improving your German.

For listening to German, I would suggest Deutsche Welle, a news website which has short clips in German. However some of it will be too complex for a beginner. There are also films on YouTube in German which have English subtitles. One example is Sophie Scholl - Die letzten Tage. If there are any films or TV shows which you really like, you could buy them in German and watch them. Leaving and Junior Certificate listening tapes are also a good test to try and improve your listening German. They're all available on examinations.ie.

The most difficult aspect will probably be maintaining motivation. Learning a foreign language is challenging and it may feel like you're not making progress at times. Persevere and you will get there. If you have any more questions let me know!

warlikedave · 28-07-2017 10:17am

Solomon Pleasant wrote: »

Hi,

I can hopefully give you some help, I'm studying business and german in Trinity college.

First of all, vocab is essential. You have to learn new words every day. Try spending 30-45 minutes everyday learning new words. I'd suggest going onto one of the german papers websites, finding a topic that interests you and translating it. Learn the new words. Keep doing this and you'll build vocab gradually. Examples would be Das Bild, Die Zeit or Handelsblatt.

For grammar, I would suggest "Hammer's German Grammar and Usage' by Martin Durrell. It has served me very well. Another one which is excellent is Essential German Grammar by Martin Durrell.

For spoken German, this
is an excellent site where you can write, skype and meet face to face with people all with the goal of improving your German.

For listening to German, I would suggest Deutsche Welle, a news website which has short clips in German. However some of it will be too complex for a beginner. There are also films on YouTube in German which have English subtitles. One example is Sophie Scholl - Die letzten Tage. If there are any films or TV shows which you really like, you could buy them in German and watch them. Leaving and Junior Certificate listening tapes are also a good test to try and improve your listening German. They're all available on examinations.ie.

The most difficult aspect will probably be maintaining motivation. Learning a foreign language is challenging and it may feel like you're not making progress at times. Persevere and you will get there. If you have any more questions let me know!

Awesome - thank you for all the advice. Think I will spend the first couple of weeks just immersing myself in the vocabulary and some of the basics. Some really good advice there and will structure my study of it in this way.

Captain Havoc · 28-07-2017 12:37pm

justback83 wrote: »

How is that going? I'm learning at the moment also but am like Goldilocks with teachers and methods........!

warlikedave wrote: »

What is it like to learn with them? And what is the cost like? I was looking at the Goethe-Institut Irland currently but its a nightmare to get to especially with my working hours.

I'll address the easiest question first cost: I am studying part-time and it is costing me around €3,000 a year, Brexit saved me about €500 last year, I think. To go full time is double that. I am studying for a degree in language studies, which in total will take me six years, I have completed two. The languages I am studying are French and German.

The first year I did beginners German and Languages and culture. Languages and culture is a bit wishy washy but I enjoyed it. I found distance learning really good, it is like going to a real college, I would know as I'm a graduate of Shannon College of Hotel Management. There were also physical lectures which I never attended.

Year two, I studied intermediate French and intermediate German. Just like the first year but harder. 75% of my work was in German because I already have a decent level of French. They brought in a new system last year where you could attend any other lectures in your course, which was great, so for instance if I couldn't make my group's lecture (Ireland and SE England), I could attend the same lecture from another group which was at a more suitable time e.g. I might be working Tuesday evening and couldn't attend but I could show up on Wednesday. I have a really good German lecturer, she's brilliant. You are provided with all the materials you need and I can ask my lecturer for advice at any time. There's online interactive material and book work. I was studying for about 15 hours a week, ten or more in German and the rest in French.

I would love to sign up fulltime for the remainder but I have no idea what I will be working at in November so I can't commit. I will definitely be signing up though. Any more questions, just ask.

warlikedave · 28-07-2017 1:53pm

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I'll address the easiest question first cost: I am studying part-time and it is costing me around €3,000 a year, Brexit saved me about €500 last year, I think. To go full time is double that. I am studying for a degree in language studies, which in total will take me six years, I have completed two. The languages I am studying are French and German.

The first year I did beginners German and Languages and culture. Languages and culture is a bit wishy washy but I enjoyed it. I found distance learning really good, it is like going to a real college, I would know as I'm a graduate of Shannon College of Hotel Management. There were also physical lectures which I never attended.

Year two, I studied intermediate French and intermediate German. Just like the first year but harder. 75% of my work was in German because I already have a decent level of French. They brought in a new system last year where you could attend any other lectures in your course, which was great, so for instance if I couldn't make my group's lecture (Ireland and SE England), I could attend the same lecture from another group which was at a more suitable time e.g. I might be working Tuesday evening and couldn't attend but I could show up on Wednesday. I have a really good German lecturer, she's brilliant. You are provided with all the materials you need and I can ask my lecturer for advice at any time. There's online interactive material and book work. I was studying for about 15 hours a week, ten or more in German and the rest in French.

I would love to sign up fulltime for the remainder but I have no idea what I will be working at in November so I can't commit. I will definitely be signing up though. Any more questions, just ask.

Cheers for that detailed insight - it certainly seems like an interesting route to take, only issue for me would be that at part time it would take 6 years but still it sounds like that there is an amazingly fast progression even at part time - to be at intermediate german at the start of year two part time is certainly a tempting prospect. Do you get a lot of verbal / oral work with another person to do as part of year one and two?

riffmongous · 28-07-2017 2:00pm

Just as an fyi there is also a huge difference in dialects between Austria, Germany and Switzerland. A year or two of learning high german will not prepare you at all for Austria to the point you could work in a job outside Vienna

warlikedave · 28-07-2017 2:17pm

riffmongous wrote: »

Just as an fyi there is also a huge difference in dialects between Austria, Germany and Switzerland. A year or two of learning high german will not prepare you at all for Austria to the point you could work in a job outside Vienna

Cheers - yeah ive been reading about that myself. Still if I can get the base language in place then it will be a little easier to pick up on the dialects. The biggest challenge is going to actually learn the language in question - if I can overcome that then its a major step in the right direction.

Captain Havoc · 28-07-2017 2:34pm

warlikedave wrote: »

Cheers for that detailed insight - it certainly seems like an interesting route to take, only issue for me would be that at part time it would take 6 years but still it sounds like that there is an amazingly fast progression even at part time - to be at intermediate german at the start of year two part time is certainly a tempting prospect. Do you get a lot of verbal / oral work with another person to do as part of year one and two?

You can do it in three years at full-time. Intermediate isn't that advanced, I'll be starting upper intermediate this year. There is some oral work, yes. I had four projects to hand in during the year and two of these were oral, I think. The final exam is also oral. Within the interactive material, there is also oral work, for example, you hear a word and then you repeat it, I found it important to listen to myself, which I really hated until I realised, it just has to be done. Within our lectures, they can pair us with another student to practice, so we will be sent to a separate virtual room, where we would discuss something, for instance, our towns and then we would be brought back to the main room and we would have to talk about our partner's town.

In my own free time, I listen to audio books when I'm working, my goal is not to understand everything but to understand as much as I can. The last book I listened to was about famous German's, in some cases, I didn't know what they did, remember I'm working and don't have time to look up things, but I would know things like where and when they lived, a bit about their family or other things. This is something that my lecturer said to me and it's stuck, it really takes a lot of the frustration out of it.

Part of my job now is giving tours in French and German, my German is still very dicky but having to get up in front of 50 German tourists builds confidence and I find them great, I explain that I am studying German and that I need help, when I'm finished they come up and talk to me, they think it's great that I'm trying to learn their language.

riffmongous wrote: »

Just as an fyi there is also a huge difference in dialects between Austria, Germany and Switzerland. A year or two of learning high german will not prepare you at all for Austria to the point you could work in a job outside Vienna

Oh God yes, I lived for a year in Zurich and my German was terrible when I left, it didn't help when I was mixing the two up. Swiss German is not a dialect, it's a language. It works speaking a mix of Swiss and High German in Zurich as they speak both. I previously lived for a year in French speaking Switzerland and other than a few words, it's the same as normal French. I left speaking a good level of French after a year but not from Zurich.

Gaz · 28-07-2017 2:54pm

Currently learning myself, I think your 15 month max goal maybe a little ambitious but thats just me, personally I set myself a goal of 3 years to get from complete 0 to reasonable fluency.

I am currently 18 months in and making steady progress but still have a looong way to go.
I spent the first year using duolingo and busuu. These are great apps/sites for getting a basic foundation and building up your vocabulary.
After one year, I started attending evening classes with the Goete Institute, this really improved my grammar understanding, which for me, is still the hardest part.
I have just finished A2 with them, next up is a 3 weeks course with a language school in Berlin (staying with a host family), so 24*7 German .. when I return I will be starting B1.2 with Goete, then hopefully spending next year doing B2, with B2 certification being my goal.

I find the following useful
- Tinycards from duolingo, this is a flashcard type app which I add new words to every day and it forces you to practice them and eventually get them into your long term memory
- dw.com - loads of free learning resources
- youtube, German with Jenny, easygerman etc
- German kids books
- learn out loud , audio books.

Above all, its practice, even 10 mins a day, just make sure you do something. I am now at the point were I can have a conversation once its not too technical or complex. But I am still completely lost when it comes to German TV or movies. I am hoping my 3 weeks away being immersed in the language will tune my ear in a bit better.

Viel Glück!

warlikedave · 28-07-2017 3:39pm

Captain Havoc wrote: »

You can do it in three years at full-time. Intermediate isn't that advanced, I'll be starting upper intermediate this year. There is some oral work, yes. I had four projects to hand in during the year and two of these were oral, I think. The final exam is also oral. Within the interactive material, there is also oral work, for example, you hear a word and then you repeat it, I found it important to listen to myself, which I really hated until I realised, it just has to be done. Within our lectures, they can pair us with another student to practice, so we will be sent to a separate virtual room, where we would discuss something, for instance, our towns and then we would be brought back to the main room and we would have to talk about our partner's town.

In my own free time, I listen to audio books when I'm working, my goal is not to understand everything but to understand as much as I can. The last book I listened to was about famous German's, in some cases, I didn't know what they did, remember I'm working and don't have time to look up things, but I would know things like where and when they lived, a bit about their family or other things. This is something that my lecturer said to me and it's stuck, it really takes a lot of the frustration out of it.

Part of my job now is giving tours in French and German, my German is still very dicky but having to get up in front of 50 German tourists builds confidence and I find them great, I explain that I am studying German and that I need help, when I'm finished they come up and talk to me, they think it's great that I'm trying to learn their language.

Oh God yes, I lived for a year in Zurich and my German was terrible when I left, it didn't help when I was mixing the two up. Swiss German is not a dialect, it's a language. It works speaking a mix of Swiss and High German in Zurich as they speak both. I previously lived for a year in French speaking Switzerland and other than a few words, it's the same as normal French. I left speaking a good level of French after a year but not from Zurich.

Cheers for that info Captain

, there is a lot to consider in this. Think ill check out the open university website and have a look at the course in question. Will also look at immersion into some of the basics at least for now. Need to see what the various courses offer as well.

Gaz wrote: »

Currently learning myself, I think your 15 month max goal maybe a little ambitious but thats just me, personally I set myself a goal of 3 years to get from complete 0 to reasonable fluency.

I am currently 18 months in and making steady progress but still have a looong way to go.
I spent the first year using duolingo and busuu. These are great apps/sites for getting a basic foundation and building up your vocabulary.
After one year, I started attending evening classes with the Goete Institute, this really improved my grammar understanding, which for me, is still the hardest part.
I have just finished A2 with them, next up is a 3 weeks course with a language school in Berlin (staying with a host family), so 24*7 German .. when I return I will be starting B1.2 with Goete, then hopefully spending next year doing B2, with B2 certification being my goal.

I find the following useful
- Tinycards from duolingo, this is a flashcard type app which I add new words to every day and it forces you to practice them and eventually get them into your long term memory
- dw.com - loads of free learning resources
- youtube, German with Jenny, easygerman etc
- German kids books
- learn out loud , audio books.

Above all, its practice, even 10 mins a day, just make sure you do something. I am now at the point were I can have a conversation once its not too technical or complex. But I am still completely lost when it comes to German TV or movies. I am hoping my 3 weeks away being immersed in the language will tune my ear in a bit better.

Viel Glück!

Thanks Gaz - just wanted to ask, how did you find the Goete Institute in terms of course structure and approach for learning may I ask? I know its kinda like the same question I asked Captain there but would like to know what style of teaching they do.

Gaz · 28-07-2017 3:58pm

I found them great to be honest.
Each week is a different topic, eg: holidays or "at the office", and the lesson is used to cover different grammar rules and introduce new words.
The teachers do not speak English if possible, trying to explain things in more simplified German or hand gestures etc to get the point across. Over the 3 hour lesson we also had lots of interactive discussions which is great for speaking practice.
Its tough but very rewarding.

MarkY91 · 07-09-2019 4:36pm

Reviving an old thread here.

I did German for my junior cert over 10 years ago and recently started back with Duolingo and other similar apps. I am listening to an amazing audiobook on audible app and my Austrian friend sent me a workbook with CDs.

I am absolutely loving it so far, cycling my bike while listening to the audiobook and saying a fairly long sentence then the woman says it and it's exactly correct... people must think I am very strange smiling to myself while cycling past lol.

Any update from you guys two years on?

There's a grab meet up on the meet up app. I'm considering going but I'm not confident enough to go.

Eventually, I want to take classes and possibly go to Germany or Austria for a few weeks to do classes and do German 24/7 instead of back to English life once a class ends.

Captain Havoc · 08-09-2019 3:25pm

I've completed the German half of my degree with a pass, so a lot of work to do in French to bring up my degree but French is my better language. I've set up my own business giving tours of Kilkenny in German and French, www.ormondelanguagetours.com. I still listen to audio books in German on audible, even though I'm finished, I've still a long way to go. I listen to deutsche perfekt on audible, they're one hour magazines aimed at learners and there's different levels. There is also an accompanying PDF which you can download via your PC. I watch things on my exercise bike, at them moment I'm watching inside Borussia Dortmund, which is in German.

MarkY91 · 08-09-2019 4:22pm

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I've completed the German half of my degree with a pass, so a lot of work to do in French to bring up my degree but French is my better language. I've set up my own business giving tours of Kilkenny in German and French, www.ormondelanguagetours.com. I still listen to audio books in German on audible, even though I'm finished, I've still a long way to go. I listen to deutsche perfekt on audible, they're one hour magazines aimed at learners and there's different levels. There is also an accompanying PDF which you can download via your PC. I watch things on my exercise bike, at them moment I'm watching inside Borussia Dortmund, which is in German.

Wow you did really well. That's amazing!

I'm currently using John noble's audiobook for German from audible.

I'm starting a management in tourism course tomorrow which has french (not interested in french, no inspiration, no motivation but will give it a go for the sake of passing) but I'm hoping to still find the time to practice German and improve.

I've even considered during a college break to take a couple of week out in Germany or Austria to immerse myself into the language 24/7 instead of just in a (eventual) evening class.

Captain Havoc · 09-09-2019 1:32am

I went to Germany/ Austria five times in a little over a year for weekends and stuff. I did one week in Jena as part of my course. If you keep an eye on Kayak, there's cheap flights. I was thinking I was struggling with the language as my grades weren't great, especially compared to the amount of work I was putting in but I was talking German with the natives which dramatically improved my confidence.

My website is only up over a week. I've been getting tours via Airbnb experiences. At the start of each tour I tell the people I'm learning German and I do the tours to improve it, they're immediately on board. My tours are only a tenner, which is grand. If you search Airbnb experiences and look for Kilkenny, you'll see both my tours there "Spaziergang durch Kilkenny" and "Visite guidée de Kilkenny".

I'm going to do a national tour guiding course over the winter and hope that being listed as a proper tour guide gains me access to failte Ireland promotions. I believe we fall short dealing with speakers of foreign languages. There's a guy in Dublin doing tours in German and since last month I have a competitor here in Kilkenny. Another local guide has used me for a bike tour and I will continue to help him.

There's a small market for you to tap into. Around 900,000 German speaking tourists came to Ireland last year.

MarkY91 · 19-11-2019 6:01pm

Should I look into doing an evening leaving cert German course or scrap that and do goete Institute?

LeonOSearcaigh · 27-04-2022 1:19am

Well what did you do?

Schalker · 26-12-2023 5:58am

Auch wenn es schon 5 Jahre her ist, ich kann gerne helfen.

Guess its to late for that 🤔

Nollaig shona from Germany

Jim2007 · 26-12-2023 9:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121536458#Comment_121536458

Hochdeutsch or Schriftdeutsch as we more commonly referred to it here in the Emmental, is a horribly arrogant language, best avoided when ever possible. Was in hospital just before Christmas and unfortunately the nurse was from Northern Germany and while I know he was trying to be nice, it just sounded like he was dictating to the patients! So I'll stick to my nice Bärndütsch, thank you very much.

"Einen guten Rutsch ins neue Jahr"

Why do people go sliding into the New Year?

Learning German

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