Tralee to Fenit Greenway

kingdumb · 02-03-2012 12:15pm

Thanks for getting back to my question.

Kerry County Council wrote: »

At this moment there are no plans by Tralee Town Council to extend the walkway down by the Big River.

No plans ? This section of the line is outlined in the active town development plan to be developed as a cycleway !

Also as pointed out previously in this tread, Tralee TC have recently constructed another path on the west bank of the river, this means that there is now a path on both sides of the river which both lead to dead ends at the old railway line. From this one would have to presume that the intention was to join these path to the railway at the other side of the wall, as indicated in the town development plan.

If this was not the case why on earth would Tralee TC waste public funds constructing paths that lead no-where ?

Kerry County Council wrote: »

In relation to the Tralee-Fenit walkway, it was always envisaged that it would run from Rock Street out. At some stage later on we may look at the stretch between Rock Street and the Oakpark Road, but for the moment we're concentrating our energies from Rock Street out.

always envisaged
by whom ?

As I have stated before it is clear in the town development plan that section of line to be developed is the section of line from Edward Street to Mounthawk. Any time that the redevelopment of the line is mentioned it is the Tralee to Fenit Railway, not the section of the Tralee to Fenit railway from Rock St. to Fenit.

If it is the intention to develop this section why leave it till a later stage ? this would require 2 separate planning applications.

Althought this section of the line is short, it would be an important piece of infrastructure in the town. It would allow pedestrian/cycle access to CBS school and to the town's main transport hub, and provide a link between, Edward St., Ashe St, Rock St., Casements Ave. and Brewery Road.

The town development plan also highlights the poor pedestrian linkages between the town and the train/bus stations, the development of this section would go a good way to addressing this.

I look forward to your reply.

stevielenihan · 03-03-2012 8:03pm

clearing work stopped on friday

Quaderno · 04-03-2012 10:36am

kingdumb wrote: »

This section of the line is outlined in the active town development plan to be developed as a cycleway !

Exactly, and it has been there for good reason. I am also very interested to hear why on earth that should change. Maybe some unexpected problems with the owners of residential properties in Casement Ave.?

kingdumb · 06-03-2012 1:05am

Hopeful Kerry Co Co will respond back here soon with the reasons.

I can't imagine there being any issues, the council have licence from the landowners [CIE/IR] to use the lands.

Quaderno wrote: »

Exactly, and it has been there for good reason. I am also very interested to hear why on earth that should change. Maybe some unexpected problems with the owners of residential properties in Casement Ave.?

stevielenihan · 09-03-2012 9:06pm

what happenes now with the walkway now the the clearing work has been completed

carchaeologist · 09-03-2012 11:05pm

I was told that the guys clearing the pathway got paid with the rails.
Any truth in that I wonder.
All those rails would be worth a tidy sum of shillings.

kingdumb · 11-03-2012 5:04pm

The council applies for part 8 planning for the route. As far as I know the council a due to submit this within the next couple of weeks, after that there is a 6 week consultation period. Hopefully all going well work will be able to start on the line during the summer.

stevielenihan wrote: »

what happenes now with the walkway now the the clearing work has been completed

kingdumb · 11-03-2012 5:08pm

I heard that too, you would think that CIE would be after them, yet another case of that organisation not protecting public assets I guess.

Any idea of what they would be worth carchaeologist ?

carchaeologist wrote: »

I was told that the guys clearing the pathway got paid with the rails.
Any truth in that I wonder.
All those rails would be worth a tidy sum of shillings.

stevielenihan · 11-03-2012 8:13pm

kingdumb wrote: »

The council applies for part 8 planning for the route. As far as I know the council a due to submit this within the next couple of weeks, after that there is a 6 week consultation period. Hopefully all going well work will be able to start on the line during the summer.

We have a long wait so ahead of us before work gets underway. how long will work take to complete once it gets underway?

Quaderno · 11-03-2012 8:29pm

kingdumb wrote: »

I heard that too, you would think that CIE would be after them, yet another case of that organisation not protecting public assets I guess.

Any idea of what they would be worth carchaeologist ?

Well, let's see.
With a little help from the distance tool provided by Google labs we can find out that the cleared stretch of track is pretty exactly 1.8km long (+- <10m). If we assume a single track with two rails that will make 3.6km of single rail.
Using Wikipedia we can further establish that european steel rails weigh between 40kg and 60kg per m, which would bring us to an overall amount of between 144 and 216 tonnes of steel.
Next I found a site called "scrap price index" which is being published by the European Steel Association. For "demolition scrap" they give a value of €319 per ton for February 2012, so this is quite up to date. I don't know how rails compare to demolition scrap in general, but I would expect it to be rather good and lasting steel at the upper end of the value bracket. So I assume for our estimation we can safely use the "demolition scrap" value without being too far off to the low side.
Now, using the lowest calculation for the overall weight we would arrive at 144 tonnes x €319 or just under €46,000. Using the higher estimates we would be looking at 216 tonnes x €319 or just under €69,000. I would think that we should expect a number somewhere in between those two values and quite certainly over €50,000, even for low grade steel.

carchaeologist · 11-03-2012 8:54pm

^What he said!! Lol!

kingdumb wrote: »

Any idea of what they would be worth carchaeologist ?

I would say that would be about right, good weight in those rails.
I would have bought a digger and dug them out myself if I had known that!:cool:
Still though, €50k is a bit strong for what is basically just a clearance job, I wonder is all the money paying for the pathway laying too?

lottpaul · 11-03-2012 9:11pm

Wasn't it a double track from Tralee to where the Fenit branch split off from the North Kerry line? (just beyond where the present clearance has finished) If so, then the amount of scrap rails - and value - would be doubled!

Or was the second track lifted when the N Kerry line was abandoned? Interesting to find out.

trail man · 11-03-2012 9:30pm

The second track limerick/kerry line was lifted in 89 and way back then and considered virtually worthless in scrap value...HAVENT THINGS CHANGED.:cool:.

stevielenihan · 11-03-2012 10:45pm

lottpaul wrote: »

Wasn't it a double track from Tralee to where the Fenit branch split off from the North Kerry line? (just beyond where the present clearance has finished) If so, then the amount of scrap rails - and value - would be doubled!

Or was the second track lifted when the N Kerry line was abandoned? Interesting to find out.

Lottopaul I think the 2nd track was lifted when the north kerry line was abandoned.

manoverboards · 12-03-2012 11:50pm

Apparently this was the same guy who was blocking the line only a few months ago !

Good to see this some things haven't changed in this country.

If those tracks were really worth that much, that's not too bad for 5/6 days work eh.

carchaeologist wrote: »

I was told that the guys clearing the pathway got paid with the rails.
Any truth in that I wonder.
All those rails would be worth a tidy sum of shillings.

kingdumb · 13-03-2012 5:30pm

Jaysus, that's without the base plates and screws too, they would probably add up to 8 or so tonnes.

Any idea what happened to the sleepers ?

Quaderno wrote: »

Well, let's see.
With a little help from the distance tool provided by Google labs we can find out that the cleared stretch of track is pretty exactly 1.8km long (+- <10m). If we assume a single track with two rails that will make 3.6km of single rail.
Using Wikipedia we can further establish that european steel rails weigh between 40kg and 60kg per m, which would bring us to an overall amount of between 144 and 216 tonnes of steel.
Next I found a site called "scrap price index" which is being published by the European Steel Association. For "demolition scrap" they give a value of €319 per ton for February 2012, so this is quite up to date. I don't know how rails compare to demolition scrap in general, but I would expect it to be rather good and lasting steel at the upper end of the value bracket. So I assume for our estimation we can safely use the "demolition scrap" value without being too far off to the low side.
Now, using the lowest calculation for the overall weight we would arrive at 144 tonnes x €319 or just under €46,000. Using the higher estimates we would be looking at 216 tonnes x €319 or just under €69,000. I would think that we should expect a number somewhere in between those two values and quite certainly over €50,000, even for low grade steel.

kingdumb · 13-03-2012 5:32pm

I heard that too !

manoverboards wrote: »

Apparently this was the same guy who was blocking the line only a few months ago !

Good to see this some things haven't changed in this country.

If those tracks were really worth that much, that's not too bad for 5/6 days work eh.

stevielenihan · 20-03-2012 8:32pm

Has the planning applaction been sutmitted yet?

kingdumb · 31-03-2012 3:51pm

Seems there is another walk on the line tomorrow:

http://traleetofenitcycleway.wordpress.com/2012/03/28/walk-the-line-3/

stevielenihan · 01-04-2012 9:19pm

The walk was great today and lets try to force the council to get the planning applaction throuhg quciker and get the rest of the line to fenit cleared so we can walk it

Quackster · 13-04-2012 1:38pm

Clearing the rest of the line is going to be a bit more difficult, considering that one reprehensible individual just outside Mounthawk has built a concrete yard for parking his trucks across the line.

See on google maps here: http://maps.google.ie/maps?hl=en&ll=52.289161,-9.730952&spn=0.001409,0.004128&t=h&z=19

And further down the line at Spa, another has extended their front drive and garden over the line: http://maps.google.ie/maps?hl=en&ll=52.280983,-9.801862&spn=0.00141,0.004128&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=52.280963,-9.801619&panoid=afx0WcVfqo5mzeiOubdKsg&cbp=12,252.66,,0,7.89

Fortunately what these chancers don't seem to realise is that the Tralee/Fenit line, having been established by an act of the Westminster Parliament which has never been repealed, makes it immune to squatters' rights and no length of squatting is going to change that!

stevielenihan · 16-04-2012 9:44pm

Quackster wrote: »

Clearing the rest of the line is going to be a bit more difficult, considering that one reprehensible individual just outside Mounthawk has built a concrete yard for parking his trucks across the line.

See on google maps here: http://maps.google.ie/maps?hl=en&ll=52.289161,-9.730952&spn=0.001409,0.004128&t=h&z=19

And further down the line at Spa, another has extended their front drive and garden over the line: http://maps.google.ie/maps?hl=en&ll=52.280983,-9.801862&spn=0.00141,0.004128&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=52.280963,-9.801619&panoid=afx0WcVfqo5mzeiOubdKsg&cbp=12,252.66,,0,7.89

Fortunately what these chancers don't seem to realise is that the Tralee/Fenit line, having been established by an act of the Westminster Parliament which has never been repealed, makes it immune to squatters' rights and no length of squatting is going to change that!

Ya i see your point there. That will make it hard for them to build the walk all the way out to fenit.

kingdumb · 18-04-2012 11:10am

Would be good to know how the council are progressing on the Mounthawlk to Fenit section of the line, maybe Kerry County Council could comment ?

Kerry County Council · 19-04-2012 11:52am

kingdumb wrote: »

Would be good to know how the council are progressing on the Mounthawlk to Fenit section of the line, maybe Kerry County Council could comment ?

Currently we are finalising a few details and would expect to lodge the Part 8 (planning application) for the Rock Street to Mounthawk Section within the fortnight.

We are continuing discussions with residents and other parties in relation to the Mounthawk-Fenit section.

kingdumb · 19-04-2012 11:13pm

Thanks for the update, good to hear the project is still moving along. When would you expect the part 8 to be lodged for the Mounthawk-Fenit section ?

Kerry County Council wrote: »

Currently we are finalising a few details and would expect to lodge the Part 8 (planning application) for the Rock Street to Mounthawk Section within the fortnight.

We are continuing discussions with residents and other parties in relation to the Mounthawk-Fenit section.

Quackster · 19-04-2012 11:49pm

Continuing discussions??

Please tell us you will be taking more aggressive actions to deal with these deviants who are illegally blocking the line because local people are getting rather peeved off with the utter lack of progress at this stage.

trail man · 20-04-2012 7:53am

These things take time...maybe lots of time..progress can be slow...getting things done behind the scene is equally important..the southerntrail took years to move on in some cases...usually the big farmers and well to do property owners were the worst offenders with regard to putting obstacles in the way of what in the longterm would be of great benefit to the community ..which ultimately included themselves and their familys..........STICK WITH IT.anything worth having dosent come easy..

kingdumb · 20-04-2012 5:32pm

There is a conference in the ITT tomorrow on cycling tourism in Kerry, there will be speakers from both the Western Greenway (Mayo) and the Southern Trail (Limerick and hopefully Kerry soon) should be of interest

Details here:

http://kerrybicyclefestival.org/bspoke-developing-cycle-tourism-in-kerry/550/

kingdumb · 18-05-2012 9:47am

The part VIII planning application was submitted to Tralee Town Council for the Tralee urban part of the route.

kingdumb · 18-05-2012 3:08pm

Did you hear the one about the new Kerry cycle path ?

It is expected to increase the demand for parking spaces !

* From the minutes of April’s meeting of Tralee Town Council.

Tralee to Fenit Greenway

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