End Irish anthem at GAA matches, demands DUP minister

kreuzberger · 26-03-2008 1:19pm

whilst id disagree with a lot of the fratton stuff , all of it in fact I remind myself that as an englishman he naturally enough has an anglo centric view of the world which is perfectly understandable. I have found him though open to being corrected and capable of fairmindedness on such occasions , which is also a typically english trait it must be said . Freds points do not contain any actual hatred for the Irish people, they are just a result of being misinformed and often underinformed and a natural desire to stick up for england . Thats quite natural and explainable given his background and makes for a good debate. But I firmly believe Fred likes the Irish people and harbours no malice towards them .
This militaristic and superiority stuff by Pathfinder which always seks to denigrate the Irish people , often on the most ridiculous premise , however is another kettle of fish which I find very objectionable . However its very easily countered .

Fratton Fred · 26-03-2008 2:50pm

kreuzberger wrote: »

whilst id disagree with a lot of the fratton stuff , all of it in fact I remind myself that as an englishman he naturally enough has an anglo centric view of the world which is perfectly understandable. I have found him though open to being corrected and capable of fairmindedness on such occasions , which is also a typically english trait it must be said . Freds points do not contain any actual hatred for the Irish people, they are just a result of being misinformed and often underinformed and a natural desire to stick up for england . Thats quite natural and explainable given his background and makes for a good debate. But I firmly believe Fred likes the Irish people and harbours no malice towards them .
This militaristic and superiority stuff by Pathfinder which always seks to denigrate the Irish people , often on the most ridiculous premise , however is another kettle of fish which I find very objectionable . However its very easily countered .

Don't mind McArmalite, he is harboring latent sexual feelings towards me. I get it all the time

people are naturally protective of their own, one of my favourite sayings is "No one likes to be told their kids are ugly".

I married an Irish women and chose to live in Ireland, my daughter was dressed in green and we all watched the parade in Dublin on St Patrick's day. I have no problem with nationalist feelings, or displays of patriotism, but why should I or my fellow Englishmen be prevented from doing the same.

My daughter is free to support Ireland or England the choice is hers, as long as it's not Man United

Pathfinder · 26-03-2008 8:58pm

kreuzberger wrote: »

whilst id disagree with a lot of the fratton stuff , all of it in fact I remind myself that as an englishman he naturally enough has an anglo centric view of the world which is perfectly understandable. I have found him though open to being corrected and capable of fairmindedness on such occasions , which is also a typically english trait it must be said . Freds points do not contain any actual hatred for the Irish people, they are just a result of being misinformed and often underinformed and a natural desire to stick up for england . Thats quite natural and explainable given his background and makes for a good debate. But I firmly believe Fred likes the Irish people and harbours no malice towards them .
This militaristic and superiority stuff by Pathfinder which always seks to denigrate the Irish people , often on the most ridiculous premise , however is another kettle of fish which I find very objectionable . However its very easily countered .

How do I "denigrate Irish people", I am Irish myself.

Your problem you totally connect being Irish with support for republicanism and anti Britishness.

You need to accept a significant number of people in Ireland are proud to be Irish and British.

Naming GAA halls after terrorists does not weaken our identity but simply reinforces our British-Irish identity.

Hagar · 26-03-2008 10:06pm

It is possibly to denigrate you own people.

This is a republic so support for republicanism isn't as alien as you might expect.

You need to accept that a great number of people here think of you as a troll.

One man's terrorist is another man's resistance fighter.
Many public buildings where I live are named after past members of the French Resistance. I'm sure the German's wouldn't have had the same respect for those people.

Le Burp · 26-03-2008 11:11pm

Hagar wrote: »

It is possibly to denigrate you own people.

This is a republic so support for republicanism isn't as alien as you might expect.

You need to accept that a great number of people here think of you as a troll.

One man's terrorist is another man's resistance fighter.
Many public buildings where I live are named after past members of the French Resistance. I'm sure the German's wouldn't have had the same respect for those people.

Well if you think he is a troll why dont you ban him for having dual accounts as he talks complete sh1te day in day out and is a Walter Mitty that needs help.

Again I will state he has dual a/c's Quis seprabit and this.. He posts inane bullsh1t which he finds on the net and bullsh1ts about being in the parachute regiment PMSL....Hagar do us all a favour and at least ban him from the Military section where I highlighted his total and utter sh1te talking...

Pathfinder your a complete and utter walter.... seek professional help as you live in another world you loser

K-9 · 27-03-2008 3:53am

There is no harm in disagreeing with republicanism/nationalism.

I have respect for Unionism/Loyalism too.

Pathfinders problem is, by his posts, he doesn't understand why he denigrates some Irish people.

He seems to want to believe the GAA is a Republican and Anti-British organisation. This, despite appearing to have little understanding of it.

John Inverdale when he was presenting the BBC coverage
of the Ireland V. England Rugby match last year, took time and effort to understand the significance. He went to AI Finals and attended Ulster GAA matches and clubs with Jarlath Burns, for a few years before. A true Englishman, fair and considerate!

He came to understand what the GAA is about. Amateurism, identity, culture, pride, sport etc. Nationalism yes, but in a good way. He understood why it identified with Nationalism and why it was so important. He also seen the beauty of Hurling, an honour for any man to see!

He didn't condemn, he sought to understand! Sums it up really!

Pathfinder needs to accept that what he views as terrorists, eg. Hunger strikers, aren't, to other people.

Pathfinder · 27-03-2008 2:20pm

Hagar wrote: »

It is possibly to denigrate you own people.

This is a republic so support for republicanism isn't as alien as you might expect.

You need to accept that a great number of people here think of you as a troll.

One man's terrorist is another man's resistance fighter.
Many public buildings where I live are named after past members of the French Resistance. I'm sure the German's wouldn't have had the same respect for those people.

Troll because Im not an Irish republican like them or you Hager ?

Once again I challenge the posters to back up their claim that I "denigrate Irish people"....wheres the quote ?

As for Republicans being resistance fighters, loyalists can claim the very same thing.

What was being discussed was the GAA taking unionist tax payers money via the lottery and govt grants and naming their stadiums after modern day terrorists.

My point is, the GAA, as it recieves govt grants has a moral duty to cater for the whole community.

Naming stadiums in this way increases division and is sectarian, ie its catering only for one section of the community.

Its no wonder unionists continue to see it as the sports wing of the PIRA.

Pathfinder · 27-03-2008 2:55pm

Le Burp wrote: »

Well if you think he is a troll why dont you ban him for having dual accounts as he talks complete sh1te day in day out and is a Walter Mitty that needs help.

Again I will state he has dual a/c's Quis seprabit and this.. He posts inane bullsh1t which he finds on the net and bullsh1ts about being in the parachute regiment PMSL....Hagar do us all a favour and at least ban him from the Military section where I highlighted his total and utter sh1te talking...

Pathfinder your a complete and utter walter.... seek professional help as you live in another world you loser

Seems to be its you who breaks the forum rules with name calling and personnal attacks, but as with others, I'm sure as a republican pet it wil be overlooked.

K-9 · 27-03-2008 4:27pm

Loyalists can indeed claim the same thing and do!

My point is, the GAA, as it recieves govt grants has a moral duty to cater for the whole community.

It doesn't, it has a responsibility to it's own members. Politicians have that duty and Govt. bodies.

Its no wonder unionists continue to see it as the sports wing of the PIRA.

That perception will not change if some grounds are renamed.

guinnessdrinker · 27-03-2008 5:16pm

Pathfinder wrote: »

My point is, the GAA, as it recieves govt grants has a moral duty to cater for the whole community.

Well by that logic, organisations such as the Orange Order should not recieve Nationalist tax payer money. Is it really practical though?

I don't object to the Orange Order receiving tax payers money btw. As was pointed out already in this thread, they have already received €250,000 this year already from the Irish government and there was no massive uproar when it was announced as far as I can remember.

Pathfinder · 27-03-2008 6:13pm

guinnessdrinker wrote: »

Well by that logic, organisations such as the Orange Order should not recieve Nationalist tax payer money. Is it really practical though?

I don't object to the Orange Order receiving tax payers money btw. As was pointed out already in this thread, they have already received €250,000 this year already from the Irish government and there was no massive uproar when it was announced as far as I can remember.

Theres a difference between relgious orgs and sporting orgs.

If the OO order should have to recieve Catholics then Catholic orgs should accept Protestants. ?....its actually a very different logic, then sayng a sporting org which recives tax payers money should cater for the whole community.

Pathfinder · 27-03-2008 6:17pm

:pac:

Seanies32 wrote: »

Loyalists can indeed claim the same thing and do!

My point is, the GAA, as it recieves govt grants has a moral duty to cater for the whole community.

It doesn't, it has a responsibility to it's own members. Politicians have that duty and Govt. bodies.

Its no wonder unionists continue to see it as the sports wing of the PIRA.

That perception will not change if some grounds are renamed.

It has a moral duty to foster good community relations and use tax payers money in a non sectarian way.

Not to further create antagonism and mistrust and further sectarian triumphalism.

guinnessdrinker · 27-03-2008 6:40pm

Pathfinder wrote: »

Theres a difference between relgious orgs and sporting orgs.

If the OO order should have to recieve Catholics then Catholic orgs should accept Protestants. ?....its actually a very different logic, then sayng a sporting org which recives tax payers money should cater for the whole community.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean. There is of course a difference between religious organisations and sporting organisations but the Orange Order are not a religious organisation its just an institution that doesn't cater for non protestants. The GAA allows members of all faiths to join.

Pathfinder wrote: »

:pac:

It has a moral duty to foster good community relations and use tax payers money in a non sectarian way.

Not to further create antagonism and mistrust and further sectarian triumphalism.

Shouldn't every organisation, sporting or otherwise foster good community relations?

As for sectarian triumphalism, I'm not sure the GAA as an organisation can be accused of this in fairness to them. Maybe there was some incidents of sectarian triumphalism in the past, I don't recall any though certainly not on the scale of something like forcing a parade down an area its not wanted in, like Drumcree and being triumphalist about it afterwards.

Hagar · 27-03-2008 7:56pm

Pathfinder wrote: »

Troll because Im not an Irish republican like them or you Hager ?

No, because you seem to go out of you way to antagonise people.

Pathfinder wrote: »

Its no wonder unionists continue to see it as the sports wing of the PIRA.

Sports wing of the PIRA :eek::D, move post to to Humour, move poster to Dr. Demento.

Pathfinder wrote: »

It has a moral duty to foster good community relations and use tax payers money in a non sectarian way.

Not to further create antagonism and mistrust and further sectarian triumphalism.

Could you have said that with a straight face 20 years ago when Unionists controlled everything and trampled on the Nationalists and used their pet police force to enforce their sectarian hatred on a defenceless community? Defenceless except for the PIRA that is, nobody else stood between them and regular sectarian violence and attacks. The sad truth is that the RUC and the BA couldn't be depended on to protect them. They had to do it themselves.

Pathfinder · 27-03-2008 10:06pm

Hagar wrote: »

No, because you seem to go out of you way to antagonise people.

Sports wing of the PIRA :eek::D, move post to to Humour, move poster to Dr. Demento.

Could you have said that with a straight face 20 years ago when Unionists controlled everything and trampled on the Nationalists and used their pet police force to enforce their sectarian hatred on a defenceless community? Defenceless except for the PIRA that is, nobody else stood between them and regular sectarian violence and attacks. The sad truth is that the RUC and the BA couldn't be depended on to protect them. They had to do it themselves.

You know so much about the defenders of the Catholic community, you forgot to mention the PIRA killed more then 700 and maimed thousands of Catholics.

You also forgot to mention it was the British army who defended the Catholic community from pogrom when the IRA were no where to be seen.

I suggest you read some objective history and who knows maybe oneday pay NI a visit.

As for your bias moderation and threats to ban while others are allowed to break the roles, well lets just say thats a reflection on you not me.

Hagar · 27-03-2008 10:12pm

I lived and worked there during the troubles. Can you say the same?

The PIRA killed 700 Catholics and maimed thousands more? :eek:
Take just one more puff and pass it on.

As for your bias moderation and threats to ban while others are allowed to break the roles, well lets just say thats a reflection on you not me.

What are you talking about?

K-9 · 27-03-2008 11:07pm

Pathfinder wrote: »

:pac:

It has a moral duty to foster good community relations and use tax payers money in a non sectarian way.

Not to further create antagonism and mistrust and further sectarian triumphalism.

You really should take this up with the British Govt.

You still don't get the point. You may view it as sectarian, their members don't!

The Orange Order is viewed as sectarian by many. They have the same responsibilities then?

McArmalite · 28-03-2008 11:39am

Le Burp wrote: »

Well if you think he is a troll why dont you ban him for having dual accounts as he talks complete sh1te day in day out and is a Walter Mitty that needs help.

Again I will state he has dual a/c's Quis seprabit and this.. He posts inane bullsh1t which he finds on the net and bullsh1ts about being in the parachute regiment PMSL....Hagar do us all a favour and at least ban him from the Military section where I highlighted his total and utter sh1te talking...

Pathfinder your a complete and utter walter.... seek professional help as you live in another world you loser

I agree 100%, the fella is a complete Walter and Paisleyite bigot. Yeah, he may post under Quis Seprabit (the motto of the UDA), but he has also been accused of posting under the username of Vesp, who used to have postings on this forum which always sought to insult and denigrate nationalists from the six counties. God knows I'm no saint, but this fella adds nothing to a discussion and as you say " he talks complete sh1te day in day out and is a Walter Mitty that needs help.
"
As fro his statement " Its no wonder unionists continue to see it as the sports wing of the PIRA. " Well that's just a paraphrase of the lovely Sammy Wilson of the DUP when the unionists opposed a reception in Belfast for the Antrim hurling team when they reached the All Ireland final a few years back and typical of how he " He posts inane bullsh1t which he finds on the net ".

walrusgumble · 28-03-2008 2:27pm

McArmalite wrote: »

I agree 100%, the fella is a complete Walter and Paisleyite bigot. Yeah, he may post under Quis Seprabit (the motto of the UDA), but he has also been accused of posting under the username of Vesp, who used to have postings on this forum which always sought to insult and denigrate nationalists from the six counties. God knows I'm no saint, but this fella adds nothing to a discussion and as you say " he talks complete sh1te day in day out and is a Walter Mitty that needs help.
"
As fro his statement " Its no wonder unionists continue to see it as the sports wing of the PIRA. " Well that's just a paraphrase of the lovely Sammy Wilson of the DUP when the unionists opposed a reception in Belfast for the Antrim hurling team when they reached the All Ireland final a few years back and typical of how he " He posts inane bullsh1t which he finds on the net ".

vesp? ay i was wondering where he went to

Hagar · 28-03-2008 5:37pm

Pathfinder wrote: »

You also forgot to mention it was the British army who defended the Catholic community from pogrom when the IRA were no where to be seen.

University of Hamburg wrote:

pogrom:
An organized persecution or extermination of a national, religious or ethnic minority, especially the Jews.
Via Yiddish from Russian: destruction, from po- like + grom thunder.

So you are openly admitting the the Catholic Nationalist community was saved by the British Army from "an organized persecution or extermination of a national, religious or ethnic minority" by the Protestant Unionists while the RUC couldn't / wouldn't / didn't stop it?
That's some admission.

walrusgumble · 31-03-2008 8:49am

intially, the army was brought in to bring peace and order, as the nationalists, even the moderate, did not, due to fear, wish to have the ruc and the b specials into their community as they dealt with them differently to the protestants. (as promised by the secretary, Heath - of course he said one thing to one community and another to the other) The british were initally welcomed, families even brought tea out to them, army lads start going out with the girls. however, all of this was to the disguist of a minority of protestant/loyalist community, between that and of course derry in 1969 (bloody friday) and a number of other blunders, the army became enemies - ala battle of the bog side. (obviously not as straight forward as this, and i assume you are aware of this - this is just to try and see if the op meant this)

Archebald · 31-03-2008 6:04pm

thre should be no question or even thought about taking away the national athem from the gaa circuit because if we rightly remember why the gaa was set up for in the first place

and lets not forget about the tipperaray player gunned down in croke park on the original bloody sunday,,so takin away the national athem would take away our history

End Irish anthem at GAA matches, demands DUP minister

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