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20-09-2019, 21:47   #4441
Ludo
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It isn't any worse than anything else he's already done.

He's literally keeping brown children in concentration camps and nothing happened.

If you consider the kinds of thing Republican representatives appear to care about, there's no reason to think this will make any difference to them.

I can't imagine any Republican "moderates" will deem this to be the final straw if they've been happy to chug the swill Trump has been serving up so far.

And then you have the base, who actively want an autocracy - either a white nationalist one, or a theocratic one - so they'll just want to know what dirt they found on Grandpa Joe.
I suspect you are dead right unfortunately. I hold out small hope that asking a foreign power to interfere again in a presidential election like this MIGHT cause a push back from "normal" Republicans, but probably not.
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20-09-2019, 21:49   #4442
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He didn’t actually say anything about withholding the 250 million during the phone call, though that funding definitely was an issue both parties were aware of, but he did ask the Ukraine president EIGHT times to get dirt on Biden
Has a tape or transcript been published?
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20-09-2019, 21:55   #4443
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Has a tape or transcript been published?
https://twitter.com/jimsciutto/statu...274190848?s=19
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20-09-2019, 22:05   #4444
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Ha ha that’s ridiculous ! He really does speak like a mob boss.... just like Michael Cohen said..... similar to how he spoke to Comey also.... I guess that kind of caution shows some level of intelligence by Trump
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20-09-2019, 22:14   #4445
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As someone said earlier, this entire presidency has been basically a middle-finger salute to anyone who thinks that Congress really has any power or oversight regarding the executive branch. It really makes no odds what Trump does at this point, he's basically untouchable because the Republicans in the Senate will never be seen to act against a Republican president.

The Dems should at least attempt impeachment. If they don't do anything and just mess around with these endless "hearings" it's basically setting this as the standard for future US presidencies and for a full-blown fascist regime in the States. Get elected, and you can act with impunity. Wait til Trump gets into full campaign mode. This election is going to make the previous one look like a pleasant afternoon in the park.
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20-09-2019, 22:28   #4446
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Ah, that's the point. The only real problem the Dems have is it isn't one of them in the WH.

They don't want to be creating standards they will regret when they inevitably get back in the WH.

So hum and haw and lots of hand ringing, but don't rock the boat too much as their time will come.
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20-09-2019, 22:44   #4447
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The Dems should at least attempt impeachment. If they don't do anything and just mess around with these endless "hearings" it's basically setting this as the standard for future US presidencies and for a full-blown fascist regime in the States. Get elected, and you can act with impunity. Wait til Trump gets into full campaign mode. This election is going to make the previous one look like a pleasant afternoon in the park.
Another potential benefit of impeachment hearings if they fail is that it will prove that the system is not working as intended and that there isn't really an emergency system for if the President is either a criminal and/or utterly incompetent.
That in turn might give the impetus to both houses (at least amongst those who aren't actively trying to create a fascist state) that measures need to be taken to give them some capacity for oversight.

If no impeachment takes place, you'd worry that even if the Democrats regain control of the government, excuses would be made that Congress never used the tools available to remove Trump.
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20-09-2019, 22:56   #4448
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He didn’t actually say anything about withholding the 250 million during the phone call, though that funding definitely was an issue both parties were aware of, but he did ask the Ukraine president EIGHT times to get dirt on Biden
I assume that the call was not short, seeing as how he felt the need to ask for the same thing 8 times. The question comes up: did the Ukrainian President say NO diplomatically several times to the request or does the repeated requests show that Don is really rattled about his re-election chances now?

Re the Lewandowski and Giuliani performances, as some-one else posted earlier, I think they are distraction to fill the media pages with B/S.

I was watching CNN earlier showing a poll result on the Dem runners, indicating there are 3 front-runners ahead of the others. The surprising thing is that it was a Fox News poll CNN were showing and quoting. Is it a sign that Fox News is being seen as partly or fully rehabilitated in terms of journalism?

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20-09-2019, 23:05   #4449
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Could you IMAGINE if Obama had done 0.00000000000000000000001% of what Trump has done since coming in to office what the republicans would have done!

This won't bring Trump down because the republicans are too scared he is going to light them up on Twitter.
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20-09-2019, 23:43   #4450
aloyisious
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US Secretary for Defence and Defence chairman/COS on CNN briefing media live now, US will be sending weapons support to SA and another Arab ally in the region, following on from the attack on SA oil. Troops will also be sent to SA. Sec Def said both Cruise and drone missile were used in the attack on SA.

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21-09-2019, 00:00   #4451
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So, the reporting since last night is zeroing in on a July call Trump had with Zelensky. According to most recent reports citing people familiar with the call, Trump asked specifically (8 times) for Ukraine to work with Giuliani on a Hunter Biden investigation. Those most recent reports say also that no mention was made of the $250 million.

So, the focus is on that July call. However, the Wall St Journal reported that when Atkinson met with the House Intelligence Committee on Thursday, "Mr. Atkinson declined to tell lawmakers the substance of the complaint or whether it involves the president, but he did say it involves more than one episode and is based on a series of events, according to several people who attended or were briefed on the meeting."

So Atkinson was updating the Committee on something that the whistleblower reported as having occurred multiple times within "a series of events" that "involves more that one episode". Based on last night's meltdown by Rudi on CNN, I reckon the whistleblower reported not just the Trump call, but also the multiple alleged meetings between Rudi and Ukranian officials. Now, Trump might not have referred to the $250 m in the July call, but given how he works (as detailed by Lewandowski in relation to the dictated notes for Jeff Sessions) I believe that Giuliani was the one who linked the promise (involving the $250m funding) with the demand for dirt on Biden. He was at pains last night to distance Trump from his dealings with Ukraine, thereby trying to provide POTUS with plausible deniability.

Rudi needs to be hauled up under oath by Congress to explain himself. And the bullying personal privilege and/or client privilege cannot be used, If he was acting on his own behalf and engaging with a foreign Government. I'd like to see Barry Berke getting a half hour with Rudi in front of the cameras on the Hill on this one...

Last edited by TomOnBoard; 21-09-2019 at 00:07.
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21-09-2019, 01:11   #4452
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This won't bring Trump down because the republicans are too scared he is going to light them up on Twitter.

This won't bring Trump down because he has an (R) beside his name, and nothing, nothing will make Republicans in the Senate take down a Republican president.
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21-09-2019, 01:13   #4453
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This won't bring Trump down because he has an (R) beside his name, and nothing, nothing will make Republicans in the Senate take down a Republican president.
It might not get him impeached but it might ruin his chances of winning re-election
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21-09-2019, 01:17   #4454
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It might not get him impeached but it might ruin his chances of winning re-election

HA HA HA!



Re-election, good one.
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21-09-2019, 08:52   #4455
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How does this affect Biden's chances of selection/election?
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