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Has ignoring red lights gotten a lot worse?

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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,337 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    To all the clowns on this forum that have suggested that I personally break red lights .....
    Classy
    I'm an experienced accident free driver of 30 years in the galway .
    And? There are dangerous drivers who have remained accident free throughout their driving life, and safe drivers who have been hit by others.
    I've driven over a million km in that time !!!
    How far you have driven is no reflection on how good a driver you are, plenty of long haul truckers who are brutal, and plenty of Sunday only drivers who are exceptional.
    Are ye sooo stupid that ye think a driver doing that sort of mileage is driving around breaking traffic lights AND IS JUST GETTING LUCKY???
    So you are or are not breaking lights, I am confused?
    I'm on this forum giving my opinion on what I've seen .
    Do not judge me or my driving ability when ye know neither !!!
    We don't and no one commented on it, what was said that anyone who thinks getting frustrated is a reasonable excuse to break the law is emphatically incorrect.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    Simple answer : Can have all the laws in the world, if you don't police them, they are pointless.
    I'd be well up for Gardai doing all road users for running lights. It'd quickly end if Gardai took it seriously for a few months and kept up a decent presence thereafter.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 658 ✭✭✭jjpep


    Simple answer : Can have all the laws in the world, if you don't police them, they are pointless.
    I'd be well up for Gardai doing all road users for running lights. It'd quickly end if Gardai took it seriously for a few months and kept up a decent presence thereafter.

    Even better, just add cameras. No need to pyscally have gardai present then


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    jjpep wrote: »
    Even better, just add cameras. No need to pyscally have gardai present then

    They won't get cyclists doing that.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,337 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    They won't get cyclists doing that.

    They actually could quite easily. If you imagine the amount of time this will free up and money it would generate in the first few months, the RLJ cameras could easily be programmed to take photo of cyclists. Most cyclists in many areas are creatures of habit due to commuting, social events etc. Collect data for a week. Put a few gardai on the side of the road and flag down everyone who passes that you have a photo for, and issue a FPN, it is not overly complicated and the fear factor will wipe out what is already a low level crime. Anyone who refuses the FPN or they don't trust with their statement of identity, sieze the bicycle and they can come collect with ID.

    They do it randomly already in bus lanes, this would be just far more targetted and enable Gardai to identify problem junctions very easily.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    CramCycle wrote: »
    They actually could quite easily. If you imagine the amount of time this will free up and money it would generate in the first few months, the RLJ cameras could easily be programmed to take photo of cyclists. Most cyclists in many areas are creatures of habit due to commuting, social events etc. Collect data for a week. Put a few gardai on the side of the road and flag down everyone who passes that you have a photo for, and issue a FPN, it is not overly complicated and the fear factor will wipe out what is already a low level crime. Anyone who refuses the FPN or they don't trust with their statement of identity, sieze the bicycle and they can come collect with ID.

    They do it randomly already in bus lanes, this would be just far more targetted and enable Gardai to identify problem junctions very easily.

    Sure you might as well put them there in the first place as bothering with that nonsense matching cyclists to photos? Nothing to stop plain clothed Gardai from radioing to a colleague further down the road to pull somebody in.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,837 ✭✭✭✭average_runner


    Sure you might as well put them there in the first place as bothering with that nonsense matching cyclists to photos? Nothing to stop plain clothed Gardai from radioing to a colleague further down the road to pull somebody in.

    That's a waste of resources.

    The best thing the government could do is put video cams on all the lights so when an accident does happen it can prove who cause it and then the injured party can take them to court.

    Until that happens, I have a dashcam on my car, to protect us from cars and bikes breaking red lights in case an accident happens.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,055 ✭✭✭Emme


    Yes, ignoring lights has got much worse. I regularly cross the road at Bow Lane coming from or going to Steeven's lane. It is terrifying. Cars break red lights there as a matter of routine. 4 or 5 cars often go through when the lights turn red.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,337 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Sure you might as well put them there in the first place as bothering with that nonsense matching cyclists to photos? Nothing to stop plain clothed Gardai from radioing to a colleague further down the road to pull somebody in.
    Now your just being facetious, Gardai routinely do this anyway. They take a day a month to sit in a bus lane somewhere in Dublin and randomly pick out people if they are bothered. With mine, they have a list of offences already documented, burden of proof provided, I am not sure what your issue with it is. I for one would think it would be great, the ANPR cameras on red lights and bus lanes, coupled with average speed calculators would reduce traffic law issues to near zero in a matter of months, improve public transport as it no longer competes with private cars in bus lanes and therefore speed up and become more predictable. Then the one time they do decide to do a bus lane check, they can just hover round the junction if needs be. Also use it to identify problem junctions, so that the targeting is no longer random but something useful.
    The other thing is it will finally show how little a problem it is in regards bicycles.
    That's a waste of resources.

    The best thing the government could do is put video cams on all the lights so when an accident does happen it can prove who cause it and then the injured party can take them to court.

    Until that happens, I have a dashcam on my car, to protect us from cars and bikes breaking red lights in case an accident happens.
    100%, red light ANPR cameras will lower the cases of red light jumping significantly within a few months. CCTV that can be used by Gardai in regards accidents saves alot of issues.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    Gardai do that anyway, dream on......
    As a pedestrian, often pushing a pram, I can tell you that "how little a problem it is in regards bicycles" is a complete load of me asre. I have had more close ones with cyclists at pedestrian crossings than any other road user. They are the most disrespectful, ignorant road users on the road. So believe your own nonsense that they are not a problem all you want but you are wrong.


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,337 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Gardai do that anyway, dream on......
    As a pedestrian, often pushing a pram, I can tell you that "how little a problem it is in regards bicycles" is a complete load of me asre. I have had more close ones with cyclists at pedestrian crossings than any other road user. They are the most disrespectful, ignorant road users on the road. So believe your own nonsense that they are not a problem all you want but you are wrong.

    Thanks for pigeon holing everyone together, maybe we are simply in different parts of the country but bar the students around UCD who are all colour blind and risk unaware, everywhere else on my 40km daily commute has a pretty high rate of compliance. Nonetheless, what i have suggested would be beneficial to you then. It would identify junctions where it is an issue, and get Gardai to target those junctions as they wouldn't be wasting time on motoring offences for which fines should be largely automated already, as they are in many other countries. I didn't say they were not a problem, just that they are not as big a problem as your anecdotes indicates. My own evidence could be biased as well, but my suggestion would solve alot of those issues out very quickly. Statistically it would appear not to be a major issue so until Gardai have resources freed to tackle it, it will remain less of a problem than you perceive it to be, but not one that should be ignored in areas where it may be an issue.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭TheShow


    its a very bad problem and something that all road users are guilty of.

    All Junctions between Wexford St/Cuffe St & Kevin St/Patrick St are particularly bad.

    Lights are red and everytime at least 3 to 4 cars still come through, even when the traffic from the other junction with the green light is moving out.

    Its a joke.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,756 ✭✭✭Dakota Dan


    People using pedestrian crossings should wait for the cars to stop to allow for the idiots that either can’t see the crossing or chance flying through it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 27,983 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Simple answer : Can have all the laws in the world, if you don't police them, they are pointless.
    I'd be well up for Gardai doing all road users for running lights. It'd quickly end if Gardai took it seriously for a few months and kept up a decent presence thereafter.


    Every hour that Gardai spend chasing cyclists is an hour not spent reducing the death toll on the roads. How much Garda resources do you want to divert away from reducing the death toll on the roads?

    Gardai do that anyway, dream on......
    As a pedestrian, often pushing a pram, I can tell you that "how little a problem it is in regards bicycles" is a complete load of me asre. I have had more close ones with cyclists at pedestrian crossings than any other road user. They are the most disrespectful, ignorant road users on the road. So believe your own nonsense that they are not a problem all you want but you are wrong.


    Motorists kill one pedestrian each week on average, over 40 each year. Pedestrian deaths by motorists are the one category where the death rate is increasing. Cyclists by contrast haven't killed a pedestrian in Ireland for more than 15 years. We must have dramatically different definitions of 'disrespectful'.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,426 ✭✭✭ZX7R


    Without trying to blame the victim, it is important to note that a green light doesn't mean GO. It means proceed if it is safe to do so.
    In this case it was not safe for the biker to proceed.
    I do believe that the car driver is the one who should be held responsible for the incident.
    You are correct in green means go if safe to do so in Ireland,but said accident did not happen in Ireland ,had a discussion about it on another bike forum the law there was different green means go


  • Registered Users Posts: 416 ✭✭rosmoke


    Foreigner living here for a while, noticed too that drivers here don't really understand the legislation, most important stopping at amber if safe to do so/red lights or signaling in roundabouts for example, this one it just happens in every roundabout with every single driver.
    No one knows how to use the indicator in roundabouts here, no one!


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,355 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    Every hour that Gardai spend chasing cyclists is an hour not spent reducing the death toll on the roads. How much Garda resources do you want to divert away from reducing the death toll on the roads?
    .


    Chasing cyclists implies that it is one thing or another. In the course of their duties gardai should enforce the law on cyclists, a large proportion of whom are delinquent, while of course also enforcing the law on other citizens. In the same way Gardai should not neglect burglars and only concentrate on murderers.


  • Registered Users Posts: 672 ✭✭✭Ashleigh1986


    CramCycle wrote: »
    Thanks for pigeon holing evheryone together, maybe we are simply in different parts of the country but bar the students around UCD who are all colour blind and risk unaware, everywhere else on my 40km daily commute has a pretty high rate of compliance. Nonetheless, what i have suggested would be beneficial to you then. It would identify junctions where it is an issue, and get Gardai to target those junctions as they wouldn't be wasting time on motoring offences for which fines should be largely automated already, as they are in many other countries. I didn't say they were not a problem, just that they are not as big a problem as your anecdotes indicates. My own evidence could be biased as well, but my suggestion would solve alot of those issues out very quickly. Statistically it would appear not to be a major issue so until Gardai have resources freed to tackle it, it will remain less of a problem than you perceive it to be, but not one that should be ignored in areas where it may be an issue.
    What are on about !!!
    At least most of us motorists STOP AT RED TRAFFIC LIGHTS !!
    MOST CYCLISTS TOTALLY IGNORE ANY TRAFFIC LIGHT and it's not just around universities that this happens .


  • Registered Users Posts: 620 ✭✭✭LeChienMefiant


    What are on about !!!
    At least most of us motorists STOP AT RED TRAFFIC LIGHTS !!
    MOST CYCLISTS TOTALLY IGNORE ANY TRAFFIC LIGHT and it's not just around universities that this happens .
    Cars do not stop for red lights where I live, some do but many don't. Often three or more will go through before one stops. It's just one of the reasons why people are sick to death of private car traffic in the city.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,211 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    Dakota Dan wrote: »
    People using pedestrian crossings should wait for the cars to stop to allow for the idiots that either can’t see the crossing or chance flying through it.

    Was just about to cross a pedestrian crossing outside the kid's school in Portmarnock.. one foot on the road and the lights started flashing orange.. both waiting cars took off through the crossing without looking left or right for pedestrians (me). Only eyes on the traffic lights like they were on an F1 grid.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 27,983 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    What are on about !!!
    At least most of us motorists STOP AT RED TRAFFIC LIGHTS !!
    MOST CYCLISTS TOTALLY IGNORE ANY TRAFFIC LIGHT and it's not just around universities that this happens .

    Are you sure about that Ashleigh?
    http://kerrycyclingcampaign.org/but-all-drivers-break-the-lights


  • Registered Users Posts: 27,983 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Chasing cyclists implies that it is one thing or another. In the course of their duties gardai should enforce the law on cyclists, a large proportion of whom are delinquent, while of course also enforcing the law on other citizens. In the same way Gardai should not neglect burglars and only concentrate on murderers.

    It literally is one thing or another. At any one time, a Garda can only deal with one incident. So my question stands - how much Garda time do you want to divert away from reducing the death toll on the roads to be chasing cyclists instead?


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,337 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    What are on about !!!
    At least most of us motorists STOP AT RED TRAFFIC LIGHTS !!
    MOST CYCLISTS TOTALLY IGNORE ANY TRAFFIC LIGHT and it's not just around universities that this happens .

    Most of US motorists? I am a motorist, this isn't an us vs them thing, most cyclists are motorists. Visit Galway quite a bit, if you think a majority of motorists stop at red lights in Galway your not too awake when going around that city, the only safe thing about going around Galway is that congestion is so bad that. Plenty of poor drivers who never end up in an accident over there, same as Dublin.
    Also why the shouting, you seem to be getting really annoyed. Maybe this is why you get frustrated at traffic lights and understand why people break red lights. Driving for years myself and don't understand the need for it, I just leave earlier when driving, it's pretty simples.
    I've explained why people break red lights .
    It's down to pure frustration of waiting for a red light to turn green and only lasting 5 seconds when it does change .
    Complain to your local council if you think there is a fault with the timings, they can alter them if they agree or find an issue.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,756 ✭✭✭Dakota Dan


    rosmoke wrote: »
    Foreigner living here for a while, noticed too that drivers here don't really understand the legislation, most important stopping at amber if safe to do so/red lights or signaling in roundabouts for example, this one it just happens in every roundabout with every single driver.
    No one knows how to use the indicator in roundabouts here, no one!

    That must have been you that I spotted coming around the roundabout the other day with your indicator on :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users Posts: 27,983 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko




  • Registered Users Posts: 672 ✭✭✭Ashleigh1986



    Andrew .... Regarding those statistics... Where there the same amount of cyclists / taxis / private cars / pedestrians etc etc ????
    I sincerely doubt it .
    Far more private cars on the road than cyclists so therefore of course more cars would break lights than cyclists !!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,818 ✭✭✭donvito99


    I see cyclists going through red lights all the time yet I've never seen this cause any traffic or impede pedestrian's safety in any material way. But in the news it's wall to wall "Pedestrian dies after collision with car".

    TBH cyclists should be permitted to break red lights so long as they don't endanger anyone's safety i.e. absolute priority for pedestrians. They're basically just pedestrians who figured out a way to travel longer distances without walking. People who make the effort reduce congestion on a bicylcle shouldn't be forced to meet the same requirements as someone in a car causing; congestion, wear on the road surface and death/serious injury on our roads on a daily basis.

    If you removed cars from the equation, would there be a need for traffic lights? They exist purely to control the traffic and high speeds brought about by cars.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 47,977 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    driving earlier today, i braked for an amber light (this was not a 'last millisecond amber', i'd plenty of time to see it) and the car behind me swung out to the left (i was in the right lane on a two lane road) and gunned it to get past me, sailing through the red in the process.
    we were 20m from the front door of a garda station; that's how little motorists fear being caught.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 47,977 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    i mentioned this junction earlier in the thread, and the last few times i've been through it in the mornings have been comical:
    https://www.google.com/maps/@53.3525367,-6.2251663,19.25z

    i approach it from the northwest in the mornings, and take the right towards the east link. it's rare you get the green light in the process, so you usually end up waiting a minute or so.
    the last three mornings i've been there, cars coming from the port tunnel direction have sailed through the lights seconds after they've turned red, and also in the process, gunning it to do so - so not only are they breaking the red, they're actually driving noticeably faster than they would be through a green. it's farcical.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,276 ✭✭✭✭fullstop


    i mentioned this junction earlier in the thread, and the last few times i've been through it in the mornings have been comical:
    https://www.google.com/maps/@53.3525367,-6.2251663,19.25z

    i approach it from the northwest in the mornings, and take the right towards the east link. it's rare you get the green light in the process, so you usually end up waiting a minute or so.
    the last three mornings i've been there, cars coming from the port tunnel direction have sailed through the lights seconds after they've turned red, and also in the process, gunning it to do so - so not only are they breaking the red, they're actually driving noticeably faster than they would be through a green. it's farcical.

    That junction and the one at the point are examples of ridiculous sequencing. I’ve often sat at both for 2-3 mins when coming from the port tunnel with maybe one car coming through the junction from East Wall Road or Sheriff Street


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