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19-01-2007, 12:30   #31
Zoney
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Originally Posted by Navan Junction
I think the N3 will be left to rot like th old N1
The old N roads are reclassified as R roads, which though it's fun to be cynical, means they aren't quite left to rot. R roads in general have been attracting more maintanance year by year for the past decade. Some councils are better at maintaining R roads than others. Some of the ones in county Carlow are top class. The ones leading out from Limerick are reasonably well surfaced and signposted.

Many R roads now have a decent surface and well-defined verge (i.e. edge of road isn't falling into the ditch and has yellow dashed lines), as well as proper signage, even ADS in some cases.

However, I guarantee you that once the Nenagh Limerick dual carriageway is opened, the old N7 (which will be another part of the R445) will be the highest quality R road in the whole country - it's been repaved the whole way between Limerick and Nenagh (the last section was still being worked on before Christmas), has full hard shoulders for much of the route (and has reduced ones rather than none at narrower parts), has barriers on the edge of the road, even climbing lanes in places! The main reason it's dangerous still is the volume of traffic using it.
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19-01-2007, 13:15   #32
Navan Junction
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The old N1 wouldn't be as well maintained as that.

The N3 isn't particularly well looked after, though a mile or so of it was resurfaced north of Dunshaughlin before Christmas.

It isn't being cynical for the sake of it - MCC don't have the funds do anything much and the roads around Navan are very messy in places too.

TBH, if the N3 as a primary route isn't particularly well maintained now, I can't see that changing for the better when the M3 is built.

The point about the N1 is that you can use it free as far as Sth Drogheda. The M3 will be tolled at it's very start at the Blackbull so the (soon to be) old N3 will probably still see alot of use
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19-01-2007, 15:21   #33
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Originally Posted by Navan Junction
It isn't being cynical for the sake of it - MCC don't have the funds do anything much and the roads around Navan are very messy in places too.
Meath County Council are receiving €55,892,600 this year for upgrades, this compares very favorably with say, Tipperary NR (where most of Limerick-Nenagh falls) which is getting €4,740,000.

Of course, perhaps all that means is that you will finally be starting to see serious improvement in Meath this year.

Both council areas are getting about the same for maintanance, about one and a half million euro.

Limerick County Council are getting a whopping huge glob of money for upgrades this year; over €100 million.
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22-01-2007, 11:03   #34
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Originally Posted by rcunning03
Will the M3 be better than the new part of the N2, which I think is one of the best roads in the country ?
N2 = 3 lane, N3 = 2 lane most likely.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Navan Junction
Incidently, the N2 was apparently aligned to facilitate a visit to Slane by Victoria, formerly queen of England. Which is why it was so straight - can't remember where I picked that up
I think you might have crossed wires there. AFAIK, the N2 was an old toll road, well before Victoria's time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoney
Tipperary NR (where most of Limerick-Nenagh falls) which is getting €4,740,000. ... Limerick County Council are getting a whopping huge glob of money for upgrades this year; over €100 million.
Is LCC managing the Limerick-Nenagh contract?
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22-01-2007, 11:17   #35
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Originally Posted by Victor
N2 = 3 lane
Only as far as the first junction (2.5k?)
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Originally Posted by Victor
AFAIK, the N2 was an old toll road, well before Victoria's time.
I'll check - have a book on the history of turnpikes - it may have been realligned. I'll check it in the interests of trivia..
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22-01-2007, 17:50   #36
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Originally Posted by Ham'nd'egger
it gives the taxpayer "Value for Money"
You don't actually believe that line, do you? Yes, it costs the NRA less up front, but some estimates put the cost to drivers of the M3 at over €1 billion after all the tolls have been paid. It would make more sense if the developer was paid a fixed amount over the life of the PPP contract (30 years?) and all tolls went to the NRA.
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18-02-2007, 23:30   #37
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Been off these boards for a while but good to see the same old arguments are still being bashed out - just read this thread and surprised no one has come up with the same old (and very valid) point that our planners at a national level couldn't plan their way out of a paper bag. I see in todays Sunday Times (PAGE 6 NEWS SECTION) they are talking about the outer orbital road from drogheda - Navan - Trim - Kilcock (N4 intersection) then to Naas (link with M7), great stuff - then take a close look at the map - it will mean 4 dual carriageways running north south through Meath within twenty miles of each other - the issue about the M3 has less to do with Tara (although this is an international disgrace), but more to do with why they ( the brilliant public sector bench marked planners) didn't plan one motorway on a north south axis through meath (ie the N2) with spur roads to Navan and Drogheda. If the N2 is upgraded to decent standard dual carriageway - it won't take long for consumers (ie motorists) who should use the M1 or M3 pay per view motorways to swing across to the N2 and drive south to the M50 on the free to view N2. Of course when they get to the M50 it will be the same as ever -

S0 why not take the train ...oh sorry I forgot .... there isn't one.
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18-02-2007, 23:44   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by westtip
the issue about the M3 has less to do with Tara (although this is an international disgrace), but more to do with why they ( the brilliant public sector bench marked planners) didn't plan one motorway on a north south axis through meath (ie the N2) with spur roads to Navan and Drogheda.
Quite simply because the N1/N2/N3 is controlled by different councils. Fingal built the M1 as far east as possible to suit commuters (voters) in the coastal towns.
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18-02-2007, 23:48   #39
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Originally Posted by Victor
Quite simply because the N1/N2/N3 is controlled by different councils. Fingal built the M1 as far east as possible to suit commuters (voters) in the coastal towns.

Ah well Victor there you go you summed it up why it has been so badly planned by mentioning the c word - councils - the quality of which leaves a great deal to be desired.
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19-02-2007, 00:12   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
Quite simply because the N1/N2/N3 is controlled by different councils. Fingal built the M1 as far east as possible to suit commuters (voters) in the coastal towns.
National roads are the responsibility of the NRA, not the local councils.
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19-02-2007, 00:24   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoney
National roads are the responsibility of the NRA, not the local councils.
Its not quite that simple. The NRA is mainly a funding and research & standards agency. It doesn't select routes and doesn't design roads.

Last edited by Victor; 19-02-2007 at 00:27.
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19-02-2007, 09:45   #42
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The Regional Design Offices aren't all county-specific either.
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25-10-2018, 09:29   #43
cournioni
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m3 scam

Has anyone noticed that the car only toll booth on the m3 promps you to pay 2.20 instead of 1.40.If you throw in the incorrect amount will they refund the difference to you, or?
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25-10-2018, 11:40   #44
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If its coming up at 2.20, your vehicle is being identified automatically commercial. 1.40 is for passenger cars only; anything on goods tax is 2.20

If this is incorrect you need to contact the toll operator so they can figure out what's going wrong.
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25-10-2018, 15:19   #45
cournioni
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Originally Posted by L1011 View Post
If its coming up at 2.20, your vehicle is being identified automatically commercial. 1.40 is for passenger cars only; anything on goods tax is 2.20

If this is incorrect you need to contact the toll operator so they can figure out what's going wrong.
We used the car only bay with height restriction, so it should not be classed as commercial, but they are still charging for commercial. If this was one of the other bays, then that explanation would be feasible. I have heard of this happening to other vehicles using the M3 tolls and it seems to be exclusive to the M3.
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