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Fluoride in tap water

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  • 18-06-2013 3:08pm
    #1
    whydave
    Registered Users Posts: 4,061 ✭✭✭


    So I have one point and two questions :
    Point: if we are now to pay for drinking water can we refuse if Fluoride is still added to it ?
    Question 1: what is the long term effect of adding Fluoride to tap/ drinking water ?
    Question 2 : can it be removed (home kit / filters) ?

    MODs if this is in the wrong place please move or delete
    Thanks David


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Comments

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    #2
    Zombienosh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,911 ✭✭✭Zombienosh


    You can buy a filter but its pretty expensive i think.
    I agree with your point if you have to pay for it surely you should have a choice.


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    #3
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    With a meter system we will only be paying for what we use so you could use the mains for the practical stuff and bottled for drinking.

    There is presently no evidence to suggest any adverse effects of water fluoridation at concentrations present in Irish water. Ironically the papers often cited by anti-water fluoridation advocates only show toxicity at high concentrations thereby proving safety at lower concentrations.

    Why filter it out it is good for your teeth.


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    #4
    FREETV
    Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭FREETV


    I know someone who works for the Dept of the Environment and he has confirmed to me about the research which I have done about the dangers of Fluoride on the internet is one hundred percent true. No lies, no bull****. :mad:


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    #5
    FREETV
    Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭FREETV


    jh79 wrote: »
    With a meter system we will only be paying for what we use so you could use the mains for the practical stuff and bottled for drinking.

    There is presently no evidence to suggest any adverse effects of water fluoridation at concentrations present in Irish water. Ironically the papers often cited by anti-water fluoridation advocates only show toxicity at high concentrations thereby proving safety at lower concentrations.

    Why filter it out it is good for your teeth.

    Fluoride rots your teeth and causes fluorosis of the teeth.
    It is carcinogenic and damages the bones and the brain.
    I know someone in the Dept of the Environment who has nodded to me when I asked the person about Fluoride, it is an industrial waste by product, therefore it is highly toxic!
    Ask any alternative dentists.


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    #6
    Catherinech
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭Catherinech


    I thought fluoride was good for teeth, well that is what they teach in school anyway, but please correct me i am interested to learn about these internet theories about it being damaging for the brain?


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    #7
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,231 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    There's alternative dentistry now too?!? Is it based on ancient eastern philosophies? Gum chakras? Calcium karma?

    I presume it doesn't work?


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    #8
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    FREETV wrote: »
    Fluoride rots your teeth and causes fluorosis of the teeth.
    It is carcinogenic and damages the bones and the brain.
    I know someone in the Dept of the Environment who has nodded to me when I asked the person about Fluoride, it is an industrial waste by product, therefore it is highly toxic!
    Ask any alternative dentists.

    Toxicity is dose dependent, concentrations seen in Irish water have not been shown to have any adverse effects. What role does your friend have in the dept, a scientist would never say an industrial waste by-product is by default toxic also.

    What is an alternative dentist?


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    #9
    FREETV
    Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭FREETV


    endacl wrote: »
    There's alternative dentistry now too?!? Is it based on ancient eastern philosophies? Gum chakras? Calcium karma? :D

    I presume it doesn't work?

    Holistic dentistry, do a google search like I did and educate yourself. :)


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    #10
    I am pie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,652 ✭✭✭I am pie


    I spoke to someone in DoE who said that the guy that nodded at you was wrong.

    I guess that statement has about as much credibility as yours.

    What remains once we agree that two vague statements with no evidence to substantiate them are a number of peer reviewed studies which state that the only possible toxicity risk is from concentrations vastly higher than those present in Irish water.

    Do you have anything substantial to present to us to the contrary here or is this more unsubstantiated scaremongering?

    ps..My mate in the DoE told me that you wouldn't have any evidence.

    See what I did?


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    #11
    FREETV
    Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭FREETV


    jh79 wrote: »
    Toxicity is dose dependent, concentrations seen in Irish water have not been shown to have any adverse effects. What role does your friend have in the dept, a scientist would never say an industrial waste by-product is by default toxic also.

    What is an alternative dentist?

    He has his own office in the Dept, he is a top Civil Servant. He has access to the paperwork.
    It accumulates over time and the damage is irreversible, I am sorry to say that it is true, we even bathe, shower and wash food with tap water so that is absorbed along with chlorine which damages cells when we are washing ourselves without expensive filters. Watering plants during fine weather and the food that we grow in our gardens is another example of absorption/chemicals being absorbed through the skin.

    There is big money in the sale of the bags of that crap from industry that is put in the water in waterworks and I will never pay for chlorinated and fluoridated tap water.

    http://www.fluoridealert.org/issues/health/pineal-gland/

    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/01/20/fluoride-denialism.aspx


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    #12
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,231 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    FREETV wrote: »
    Holistic dentistry, do a google search like I did and educate yourself. :)

    Holistic dentistry? For fixing holes in your teeth? What if you don't have holes in your teeth? Because you regularly visit actual dentists?


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    #13
    King Mob
    Registered Users Posts: 25,226 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    FREETV wrote: »
    Fluoride rots your teeth and causes fluorosis of the teeth.
    It is carcinogenic and damages the bones and the brain.
    Fluoride does not rot your teeth. Fluorosis is a discoloration of the teeth, and while severe cases can look pretty nasty, the teeth of the sufferers themselves are very healthy and have very few caries.
    The level of fluoride in Irish drinking water is below the amount needed to cause Fluorosis.
    At safe levels it is not carcinogenic and does not damage anything.
    FREETV wrote: »
    I know someone in the Dept of the Environment who has nodded to me when I asked the person about Fluoride,
    Could you provide some sort of evidence for this?
    FREETV wrote: »
    it is an industrial waste by product, therefore it is highly toxic!
    It being an industrial waste byproduct does not make it immediately toxic.
    Toxicity is dependent on how much of dose there is.

    Water can be an industrial waste byproduct and it can be very toxic.
    FREETV wrote: »
    Ask any alternative dentists.
    But they would have a very clear financial interest in telling people about the dangers of fluoride while offering treatments and products and devices that would supposedly allow people to undo the supposed damage caused by fluoride and/or remove it from their water.

    Why are these alternative dentists immune to the same corrupting influences that make mainstream dentists lie about the effects and dangers of fluoride?


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    #14
    whydave
    Registered Users Posts: 4,061 ✭✭✭whydave


    I know someone who knows someone who was in Navada that doesn't mean he can get a spaceship!;)
    I don't want Fluoride in my water thus the point and questions !
    Any help ?
    David
    whydave wrote: »
    So I have one point and two questions :
    Point: if we are now to pay for drinking water can we refuse if Fluoride is still added to it ?
    Question 1: what is the long term effect of adding Fluoride to tap/ drinking water ?
    Question 2 : can it be removed (home kit / filters) ?

    MODs if this is in the wrong place please move or delete
    Thanks David


  • Options
    #15
    King Mob
    Registered Users Posts: 25,226 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    jh79 wrote: »
    What is an alternative dentist?
    endacl wrote: »
    Holistic dentistry? For fixing holes in your teeth? What if you don't have holes in your teeth? Because you regularly visit actual dentists?
    From what I gather alternative dentists/holistic dentists are similar to other alternative health practitioners. As in they supply dubious treatments that purport to be more effective/less harmful than the mainstream ones because they use less scary chemicals etc.

    I think in addition to opposing fluoride, alternative dentists also warn of the dangers of fillings that contain mercury while also just happening to offer services to remove and replace such fillings.


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    #16
    King Mob
    Registered Users Posts: 25,226 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    whydave wrote: »
    Question 1: what is the long term effect of adding Fluoride to tap/ drinking water ?
    Question 2 : can it be removed (home kit / filters) ?

    1. At the dosage in Irish (and other developed countries with water fluoridation) there is no adverse long term effects.

    2. Any kits or filters marketed by people who oppose fluoridation would have no guarantee of working as advertised and would be very hard to find information on whether they actually did or not.


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    #17
    pog it
    Registered Users Posts: 2,912 ✭✭✭pog it


    This happens a lot where I live but at the weekend we had an awful lot of water coming out of the tap really chalky and milky in colour.

    I left some in a glass and after a while it changed to a normal clear colour with a bit of fizz in it. Does anyone know what this is?
    The water was literally really chalky and milky when it first came out of tap so much so that we could not drink it.


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    #18
    Sunhill
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭Sunhill


    That is perfectly pure water which was being pumped at too high a pressure. The cloudy stuff is just microscopic bubbles, though their appearance is very deceptive. when the bubbles disperse the water is clear because it contains nothing else.


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    #19
    pog it
    Registered Users Posts: 2,912 ✭✭✭pog it


    Cheers for that Sunhill. Great to know that! Would you drink it straight from the tap yourself when it comes out cloudy like that or do you wait for it to clear?


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    #20
    FREETV
    Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭FREETV


    http://www.fluoridealert.org/issues/health/pineal-gland/
    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/01/20/fluoride-denialism.aspx

    Experts know, it is widely known if you just do even a little research.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBZRb-73tLc


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    #21
    King Mob
    Registered Users Posts: 25,226 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    FREETV wrote: »
    http://www.fluoridealert.org/issues/health/pineal-gland/
    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/01/20/fluoride-denialism.aspx

    Experts know, it is widely known if you just do even a little research.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBZRb-73tLc
    Ok, but why should we trust those experts.

    Plenty of experts say the exact opposite to them, so why should we trust folks like Mercola over the majority of experts?


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    #22
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    FREETV wrote: »
    http://www.fluoridealert.org/issues/health/pineal-gland/
    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/01/20/fluoride-denialism.aspx

    Experts know, it is widely known if you just do even a little research.

    A website like fluoride alert is hardly going to be partisan, anyways they tend to misrepresent the data and fail to take concentration into account.

    In your opinion which single piece of research is the most "damning" from your perspective?


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    #23
    FREETV
    Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭FREETV


    I mentioned the PSTV documentary on youtube to which I have linked.The Civil Servant in the DOE will not drink tap water as he has the knowledge about what is good or bad for a person and the environment, it is in most toothpastes and mouthwashes also, why to make money.

    In the same way that we are living in a debt based economy con, fluoride is also another con.
    There is no need for it to be put in the water. Hitler used it to control the Jews in the death camps.
    It is present in Prozac and some rat poisons. It dumbs people down and makes them acquiescent and believe the muck on Irish television and current affairs.


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    #24
    goz83
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭goz83


    They say the pineal gland is also our third eye ( though a few jokers will snigger and disagree ). If fluoride calcifies the gland, it would be very hard to measure, because plenty of stuff in our diets do a much better job of this. Carbonated drinks for a start.


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    #25
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    FREETV wrote: »
    I mentioned the PSTV documentary on youtube to which I have linked.The Civil Servant in the DOE and he will not drink tap water as he has the knowledge about what is good or bad for a person and the environment, it is in most toothpastes and mouthwashes also, why to make money.

    Can you link to a single piece of research that shows toxicity either short or long term at 1ppm levels?


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    #26
    FREETV
    Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭FREETV


    How much evidence do you guys need I wonder?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbj4zdYZnJc

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eou_UMhHlm4


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    #27
    HurtLocker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭HurtLocker


    FREETV wrote: »
    How much evidence do you guys need I wonder?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbj4zdYZnJc

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eou_UMhHlm4

    Maybe something from the WHO or a government organisation.


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    #28
    King Mob
    Registered Users Posts: 25,226 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    FREETV wrote: »
    Hitler used it to control the Jews in the death camps.
    This is a myth invented by people opposed to fluoridation.
    http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2011/oct/06/critics-water-fluoridation/truth-about-fluoride-doesnt-include-nazi-myth/
    FREETV wrote: »
    It is present in Prozac and some rat poisons.
    So is water.
    FREETV wrote: »
    It dumbs people down and makes them acquiescent and believe the muck on Irish television and current affairs.
    There is zero evidence of this.

    However it is ironic that you are accusing others of being dumbed down and believing what they are told, by stating facts from suspicious experts who seem very dishonest and stingy with evidence.


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    #29
    FREETV
    Registered Users Posts: 1,673 ✭✭✭FREETV


    I guess because I don't get paid by the Government and nor will I ever want to that is why I like to inform people of the truth, even if there are those who try to misinform and believe that they know better. I don't believe that every researcher/whistleblower out there advocating that fluoride should be taken out of water is telling lies or doing it just to make money.


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    #30
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,231 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    HurtLocker wrote: »
    Maybe something from the WHO or a government organisation.
    Government is sneaky and can't be trusted. They're always out to take over the world, Pinky and the Brain style. While evidence provided by government may be perfectly acceptable in other fora, it doesn't fly in here.

    :D


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    #31
    King Mob
    Registered Users Posts: 25,226 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    FREETV wrote: »
    I guess because I don't get paid by the Government and nor will I ever want to ever so I like to inform people of the truth, even if there are those who try to misinform.
    But it seems like the people you are putting forward as experts have a lot to gain from misinforming people about fluoride.

    I don't understand why you reject the mainstream science on this issue because mainstream scientists might have something to gain, but then immediately believe everything from alternative sources who have just as much to gain.
    FREETV wrote: »
    I don't believe that every researcher/whistleblower out there advocating that fluoride should be taken out of water is telling lies or doing it just to make money.
    But you believe that every scientist who disargees with you is telling lies and is in it for the money?

    How do you tell the difference between the ones who are telling the truth and those who are misinforming to make money?


This discussion has been closed.
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