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Help with multi sat dish setup Astra@28.2E and EUTELSAT-W3A@7E

  • 19-04-2011 11:58pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 4,201 ✭✭✭


    Hi all,
    I'm looking to change the setup I currently have. I have a huge (prob 1m) Trax dish which has just one LNB on its arm directed to Astra at 28.2E Astra.

    I plan to have two LNBs installed, one still pointing at Astra @ 28.2E and another pointing at EUTELSAT W3A @ 7E.

    Is this possible? If so, how would you go about setting it up?

    I notice both sats are at different elevations, how to I compensate for that?

    Thanks in advance folks, any help is appreciated! :)


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 16,339 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Thats a 22deg spread should be doable on your dish you'll need to get a triax multiblock and do some modding by redrilling and flipping it to allow the correct elevation to be achieved.
    This 'technically' allows a 20degree spread but from looking at my pics in the 2nd link below I think you might just have enough length on the bar to get the spread if you don't drill the offset as far to the left as I did.
    My own spread is 19degrees but there is a bit of space still on the 28.2 side of the bar, whether its enough to get the extra 2deg you need.....I'm not sure ;)
    As for the Multiblock mod/offset Watty explains it better here
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=70992575&postcount=8
    Your best bet would be to align the dish on 16e and then add the multibar and align your LNBs, I have pics of what I did with my own TD88 here(Thanks to advice I got here ;) )
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=71146786&postcount=23
    All the best with getting your dish setup!

    Just looking at the footprints on lyngsat and a lot of the TPs on 7e seem to require a dedicated 1.2mtr+ dish in Ireland so it could be a non starter for a multi LNB setup.
    One of the more experienced heads here will give a fuller answer I'm sure


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭rob the satman


    if you re after what i think you are after on 7 degrees east, then 7 degrees east would have to be your prime focus as the transponder you are probably interested in are on a "Europe B" beam, offsetting Astra 2/Eurobird 1 might be a problem with the 22 degrees difference between the two, Astra 2 ok i think but the Eurobird 1 transponders are notorious for their not so good signal levels.
    a cheap way to try is to get a couple of these

    http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MULTI-LNB-HOLDER-3-LNBs-FITS-ALL-DISHES-/260766755412?pt=UK_ConEle_SatCableFreeview_RL&hash=item3cb6e8ea54#ht_1036wt_909

    two of these join together no problem, also easily moved up and down so that.s your elevation sorted, and easily bendable too, simply wraps around the centre lnb, , less hassle than modding a triax bracket, used them myself on more than one install, simples

    like i said for what you want at 7 degrees east , your dish needs 7 east as its prime focus.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,339 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    if you re after what i think you are after on 7 degrees east, then 7 degrees east would have to be your prime focus as the transponder you are probably interested in are on a "Europe B" beam, offsetting Astra 2/Eurobird 1 might be a problem with the 22 degrees difference between the two, Astra 2 ok i think but the Eurobird 1 transponders are notorious for their not so good signal levels.
    a cheap way to try is to get a couple of these

    http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MULTI-LNB-HOLDER-3-LNBs-FITS-ALL-DISHES-/260766755412?pt=UK_ConEle_SatCableFreeview_RL&hash=item3cb6e8ea54#ht_1036wt_909

    two of these join together no problem, also easily moved up and down so that.s your elevation sorted, and easily bendable too, simply wraps around the centre lnb, , less hassle than modding a triax bracket, used them myself on more than one install, simples

    like i said for what you want at 7 degrees east , your dish needs 7 east as its prime focus.

    +1 on those brackets, I actually completely forgot about those.
    And I never considered making 7e prime focus, but with the strength of 28.2 you have plenty of margin for that much offset.
    Told ya someone would know better ;)
    @Rob would a 22deg off prime focus have rain attenuation issues?? Even on 28.2?
    Just curious


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭rob the satman


    banie01 wrote: »
    +1 on those brackets, I actually completely forgot about those.
    And I never considered making 7e prime focus, but with the strength of 28.2 you have plenty of margin for that much offset.
    Told ya someone would know better ;)
    @Rob would a 22deg off prime focus have rain attenuation issues?? Even on 28.2?
    Just curious

    1metre dish, probably Astra 2 would be ok, the problem would be some of Euroird 1's transpoders, take a look at my site, http://robssatellitetv.webs.com
    look in the "uk tv in the uk and europe" it tells you a little about Eurobird 1 and it's problems reception wise, like i said previously, he would need 7 east as prime focus for what he's after (if i'm not mistaken it's rts1 and ortm), i've got those on a 80cm in NW wales, but tried offsetting 7 east with 13 east as priime focus and don't pick then up, OP is in Dublin so 1 meter should be ok, the brackets are cheap enough, worth trying, only other option is to get a minidish!!! or a bigger dish.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,138 ✭✭✭snaps


    I know of people aligned on 5 east with a 1.1m dish and offset for astra 2. as far as i know they dont have any major issues.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,201 ✭✭✭KeRbDoG


    banie01/rob the satman - thanks a million for the advice, I will first just redirect the dish just for 7E to ensure all is well and then think about the multi LNB setup :) I will be back!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭rob the satman


    KeRbDoG wrote: »
    banie01/rob the satman - thanks a million for the advice, I will first just redirect the dish just for 7E to ensure all is well and then think about the multi LNB setup :) I will be back!

    no worries, what does interest you so much at 7 east anyway? am i right?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,201 ✭✭✭KeRbDoG


    Testing an idea I have, might lead to nothing :cool:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭rob the satman


    I'm intrigued, can't you elaborate? maybe by PM if can't on here


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,201 ✭✭✭KeRbDoG


    Right, I'm going insane!
    I have the dish at the elevation of around 27.7°, I've set the LNB Skew to -9.6° and I've then slowly swung the dish threw an arch of about 90° while looking at my satfinder. I've picked up one sat but the box I'm testing with (a Sat dbox2) isn't finding anything when I scan for the Eutelsat W3A 7E.

    Any pointers?

    Pic attached the of elevation setting of the dish

    Anyone have a method of creating a 'services.xml' for just the Eutelsat W3A 7E services?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 594 ✭✭✭rurs


    http://satellites-xml.eu/

    I can get the Europe A beam on a TD54, so you should have no trouble with a bigger dish.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭rob the satman


    KeRbDoG wrote: »
    Right, I'm going insane!
    I have the dish at the elevation of around 27.7°, I've set the LNB Skew to -9.6° and I've then slowly swung the dish threw an arch of about 90° while looking at my satfinder. I've picked up one sat but the box I'm testing with (a Sat dbox2) isn't finding anything when I scan for the Eutelsat W3A 7E.

    Any pointers?

    Pic attached the of elevation setting of the dish

    Anyone have a method of creating a 'services.xml' for just the Eutelsat W3A 7E services?

    satellite installation makes people go crazy, sometimes its easier to take one step back to take two steps forward, before you started your dish was pointing at 28 east, put the dish back there, then in small steps, find first astra 19 deg east, then find hotbird 13 east (both are easy to find from astra 28 deg east), then it should not be difficult to find 7 east, dont bother with the lnb skew, leave the lnb centre, these satellites come in without skewing,
    when you get to looking for 7 east, aim for french channel M6 suisse, you might be wise inputting its frequency (11.283v sr 27.500) into your receiver, then you can fine tune 7 east with frequency, 10.722 h sr22.000,


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,201 ✭✭✭KeRbDoG


    rurs wrote: »
    http://satellites-xml.eu/

    I can get the Europe A beam on a TD54, so you should have no trouble with a bigger dish.

    That site only creates the scanning satellites.xml file and not the services.xml file.
    Will keep trying, threw a services.xml file together to use;
    <zapit>
            <sat name="Eutelsat W3A (7.0E)" diseqc="0">
                    <transponder id="4e20" onid="64" inversion="2" frequency="10721000" symbol_rate="22000000" polarization="0" fec_inner="3" system="0" modulation="1">
                            <channel service_id="1" name="BBC Persian" service_type="01"/>
                            <channel service_id="12" name="MZ TV" service_type="01"/>
                    </transponder>
            </sat>
    </zapit>
    


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,201 ✭✭✭KeRbDoG


    OK, so I've now confirmed that my dish is pointing Azimuth (magn.) 168.0° - I get a signal on the finder, i fine tune it as much as possible and I'm not receiving anything on the pre-set channels I put in OR during a channel search.

    How much does it cost for a sat installer? :)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 679 ✭✭✭polyfusion


    Have just been outside trying to get W3A on a 60cm Sky dish, and could get both the Europe A and B beams, some TPs at the same time (10721 H and 11283 V for example), but found myself having to move the dish slightly to get other TPs, which in turn would knock out some of the other TPs I had before.

    My dish is far from ideal though, because in addition to the limited skew available on this dish (it's the 8+ year old style, with the LNB that clicks into 3 or 4 positions, and optimised for 28E), and it's size, where the LNB holder/shroud part sticks into the LNB arm, there is quite a bit of play there, I could see the signal improve or worsen as I moved the LNB about.

    Fairly certain I could get both A and B beams at the same time with an 80cm. The problem you have with an even larger dish is that it's harder to get exactly right. Small movements of the dish have larger effects with bigger dishes.

    Wasn't too difficult to home in on though, started at 13E, and moved the dish appropriately from there. Could hear the increase in tone on the beeper as it zeroed in on 7E. Just did a blind/auto scan when I got there.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭rob the satman


    KeRbDoG wrote: »
    OK, so I've now confirmed that my dish is pointing Azimuth (magn.) 168.0° - I get a signal on the finder, i fine tune it as much as possible and I'm not receiving anything on the pre-set channels I put in OR during a channel search.

    How much does it cost for a sat installer? :)

    do what i said in an earlier post, put your dish back where it was at 28 degrees east, then i can talk you through finding 7 east. you should be able to find it as you had it there before.

    alternatively, go to http://dishpointer.com
    it used google earth to help you align your dish
    put your address in there
    pick the satellite you want
    click on earth
    then zoom in on your house where your satellite dish is
    wherever your dish is located at your property, place a marker
    then it will show you exactly where you should point your dish

    you might want to check the lnb/diseqc settings on your receiver too, make sure everything is in order
    like previous poster said, you should find this satellite no problem,
    on astra 1 19 east and astra 2 28 east a some of the frequencies use the same symbol rates, i.e. 11.778V, 11.953H, so if you use dishpointer and then input one of those two frequencies, you should be able to find one of those two satellites, then we can work from there,
    like i told you in earlier post, go one step back to go two steps forward,
    do that and then get back to me,if you point. doing that, you should find one of the high power cluster of satellites which are all relatively close together.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,201 ✭✭✭KeRbDoG


    Thanks for the advice folks!

    Looks like either my LNB just isn't up for it or something is blocking my line of sight but I don't think the building is.

    I've an installer dude coming who says he will have a quick look/survey to see if it can be done and do the work for me :) I will be watching the dude to pick up tricks for when I move


  • Registered Users Posts: 75 ✭✭Ghostleader


    I have 7E's stronger transponders, i.e. the one's that carry RTS1 for the 3pm EPL's etc on my multi LNB on a 80cm mesh ISS dish, see here:

    PICT0015.jpg:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭rob the satman


    rts blackburn vs boltom later at 3


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