AH Gone to the Dogs

nkl12xtw5goz70 · 16-01-2020 11:33am

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

By saying the problem stems from 12 male moderators is just a thinly veiled way of saying all men are misogynists.

That's nonsense. I don't believe all men are misogynists. However, I also don't believe it's defensible in the year 2020 to have the site's largest forum moderated by a team of 12 men and no women. The optics of that ratio look terrible. The very existence of a large all-male moderating team also gives credence to some female posters' belief that AH is a male-dominated fiefdom where issues of misogyny and sexism won't be taken seriously.

Fr_Dougal · 16-01-2020 12:02pm

Raconteuse wrote: »

Dunno what to tell you. If you can't see how misogyny is at the root of relentless gender-based attacks (all the standard terms for that purpose like gold digger, social climber, bitch etc for no reason other than she's female because there isn't any evidence to support these claims) that's your right.

I mean if there was evidence for the above, it wouldn't be gender based, it would be behaviour and character based, but there isn't.

A lot of those comments were coming from women. Is that misogyny?

From what I can see, a couple of posters here were asked for examples of misogyny that they reported and still haven’t provided them.

Mods can’t be omnipresent, they need posters to help them deal with the crap and report posts. If you’re not reporting posts you have no right to come to feedback and complain that there’s no moderation.

The thread that has misogyny, once reported, was dealt with swiftly.

But that’s not good enough, because men aren’t capable of spotting misogyny because they’re...male.

So the very same people who are complaining about misogyny are making sexist remarks themselves.

You couldn’t make it up.

Raconteuse · 16-01-2020 2:29pm

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

A lot of those comments were coming from women. Is that misogyny?

Crikey, I already covered this in detail yet you repeat it? Yes. It is.

From what I can see, a couple of posters here were asked for examples of misogyny that they reported and still haven’t provided them.

From what you saw earlier. You don't know what has happened since.

Mods can’t be omnipresent, they need posters to help them deal with the crap and report posts. If you’re not reporting posts you have no right to come to feedback and complain that there’s no moderation.

People were constantly reporting posts and nothing was being done - that was the problem. It is now being addressed, as has been acknowledged. The thread has now moved to a different place of posters demanding that we explain ourselves and picking everything apart and even claiming I'm a misandrist! But plus ca change...

The thread that has misogyny, once reported, was dealt with swiftly.

Yes it was. As acknowledged.

But that’s not good enough, because men aren’t capable of spotting misogyny because they’re...male.

So the very same people who are complaining about misogyny are making sexist remarks themselves.

Stop pretending that I didn't explain myself in that regard. It looks spiteful as hell. That was in relation to what Permabear and anewme said about there being no female moderators and the bullsh1t allegations that followed - that they were claiming all men are misogynists. The twisting and dishonesty here are incredible. All they meant was more female moderators might spot misogyny more easily. It's pure and utter trying to get one over me to say that that's sexist of me. And the irony - denial of certain misogyny yet then pretending to be insulted when I say maybe I see it more easily because I'm female.

It's being sorted now anyway - thanks mods. This thread has gone to a different place of just picking apart and twisting what we say. Quelle surprise.

Raconteuse · 16-01-2020 2:36pm

Arghus wrote: »

I don't know how people can deny that there's a problem with misogyny in AH and further afield. There absolutely is. Now, okay, misogyny is just one of the many flavours of bile usually on display, but that doesn't mean that people who complain about it don't have a point.

This in a nut-shell. Just because people don't (or won't) see it because it doesn't affect them (so misandrist of me apparently!) doesn't mean it wasn't there.

It's being looked into now anyway.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 16-01-2020 5:09pm

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

Probably explains why you can’t see your own misandry.

That makes the kind of sense that doesn’t.

EmmetSpiceland · 16-01-2020 5:16pm

It’s tough being a male in “After Hours” these days.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 16-01-2020 5:21pm

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

A lot of those comments were coming from women. Is that misogyny?

From what I can see, a couple of posters here were asked for examples of misogyny that they reported and still haven’t provided them.

Mods can’t be omnipresent, they need posters to help them deal with the crap and report posts. If you’re not reporting posts you have no right to come to feedback and complain that there’s no moderation.

The thread that has misogyny, once reported, was dealt with swiftly.

But that’s not good enough, because men aren’t capable of spotting misogyny because they’re...male.

So the very same people who are complaining about misogyny are making sexist remarks themselves.

You couldn’t make it up.

Yes, women can be misogynists. You asked that before but nobody replied. Yes, misogynist comments can come from women.

Examples have been provided. The jostle stone thread. Did you not read those posts? That thread has thankfully been closed.

Another example - a user was threadbanned from the Harry and Meghan for repeated misogynistic comments. Something was done there too. That’s great. It was probably down to reporting.

But the jostle stone thread wasn’t closed until it was brought up on this thread. It shouldn’t have to come to that. And I can’t speak for anyone else, but I’m reluctant to report too many posts as I fear a “Yer wan again” ennui. I don’t want reporting often to be held against me. People are human and I could see that happening.

But anyway, you can’t say that examples weren’t given. They were. I don’t know if you skimmed over them. If so, that’s on you. Examples were given.

Raconteuse · 16-01-2020 5:51pm

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Yes, women can be misogynists. You asked that before but nobody replied. Yes, misogynist comments can come from women.

I answered him when he asked it first. I said I think it's even worse when it comes from women. He then took issue with that, so I clarified further.

Don't want to start some spat with Dougal as he's a decent guy and great contributor but I don't think he is being the fairest on this thread.

I've no doubt I'm definitely a "yer wan again" person but I really don't care.

This issue is being addressed anyway. All good.

anewme · 16-01-2020 8:11pm

For feedback on the jostle stone thread, I noted it here as evidence of the level of misogyny that exists on boards. Given that people here were saying "nah, you must be imagining it, I can see no misogny on boards. I'd have to really look for it. " Well, there it was, a whole thread of it in all it's gory glory. I had reported it separately , so the mods in did a swift clean up, so by the time most people saw it, half the posts had been deleted. I hope enough people did see it all before it got decimated, as it was a perfect example of what people are referring to.

Beasty · 16-01-2020 10:15pm

anewme wrote: »

For feedback on the jostle stone thread, I noted it here as evidence of the level of misogyny that exists on boards. Given that people here were saying "nah, you must be imagining it, I can see no misogny on boards. I'd have to really look for it. " Well, there it was, a whole thread of it in all it's gory glory. I had reported it separately , so the mods in did a swift clean up, so by the time most people saw it, half the posts had been deleted. I hope enough people did see it all before it got decimated, as it was a perfect example of what people are referring to.

So you are acknowledging the mods are dealing with things that get reported, which was my point earlier in the thread. Unlike the other poster, who did provide a single example from over a month ago, you have not yet provided me with examples of things you have reported that you feel have not been dealt with appropriately

MrMusician18 · 18-01-2020 4:08am

Ah here, the problem with AH is due to it being over run by a handful of individuals that are clearly controlling multiple accounts. And they are using these accounts for hostile right wing takeover of the forum.

It isn't misogyny on behalf of the volunteer mods, but the volume of posts and the number of problem accounts that's the issue. A few years ago I was very vocal about the standard of moderation in AH, back then it was far too strict. It's loose now, one might say too loose but I don't think that's the real issue now.

Moderation in a busy form needs to be paid. Volunteers cannot be expected to act consistently or indeed care about standards.

AH Gone to the Dogs

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