Squib rounds

judestynes · 16-12-2018 3:56pm #1

Ok so lesson learned and i got off pretty cheap i think. Was shooting PPU ammo all morning then tried the 1 box of American eagle I had and.... click ejected the round was intact just a light strike so onto the 2nd one click again ejected that and the same thing so called it a day and came home. Set to cleaning the piece and after breaking 1 cleaning rod eventually knocked a squib round out of the barrell. Lucky escape i think. Not sure was it the last PPU I fired or the american eagle either way I got off light

deerhunter1 · 16-12-2018 4:40pm

judestynes wrote: »

Ok so lesson learned and i got off pretty cheap i think. Was shooting PPU ammo all morning then tried the 1 box of American eagle I had and.... click ejected the round was intact just a light strike so onto the 2nd one click again ejected that and the same thing so called it a day and came home. Set to cleaning the piece and after breaking 1 cleaning rod eventually knocked a squib round out of the barrell. Lucky escape i think. Not sure was it the last PPU I fired or the american eagle either way I got off light

WOW you sure did

tikkamark · 16-12-2018 9:00pm

Did you not cop the bullet head missing when you ejected the 1st dodgy round?
You were very lucky either way

judestynes · 16-12-2018 10:00pm

tikkamark wrote: »

Did you not cop the bullet head missing when you ejected the 1st dodgy round?
You were very lucky either way

Both american eagle were intact when i ejected them so mustve been the last PPU

Kran · 16-12-2018 11:38pm

Would the barrel definitely explode in this case if another shot was fired? Anyone ever witness this?

crosshair1 · 17-12-2018 12:36am

Kran wrote: »

Would the barrel definitely explode in this case if another shot was fired? Anyone ever witness this?

Something would have to give, in normal circumstances the pressure is only maintained inside safe limits due to the bullet moving down the bore creating an increasing volume as the powder burns.
There are documented cases of 22lr destroying actions due to lodged bullets so in the case of centerfire rounds it would probably be an event that the shooter wouldnt walk away from.
It would worry me that the shooter pulled the trigger and got a click pop with no recoil and still continued to chamber 2 further rounds and attempt to fire them. It really must have lower than lotto odds of a positive outcome

BattleCorp · 17-12-2018 9:42am

Kran wrote: »

Would the barrel definitely explode in this case if another shot was fired? Anyone ever witness this?

Just google gun exploding in face. It's feckin scary.

The one below isn't very graphic, just a few scratches but it isn't pleasant viewing either. The guy got off very light.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lC4itKb7ioc

tac foley · 17-12-2018 9:34pm

If the rifle was a .22cal or a .17HMR then they usually blow the magazine out in pieces and distort the trigger guard. A couple of years back I saw a stack of five CZ rifles in this condition waiting to get collected by the importers, Edgar Bros. Each and every one was a .17HMR, that had been fired with a moderator on it. In each case it was CCI ammunition.

I took a photo of one of them to show the rep by email to notify them. Anyone wants it, please PM me for email connection.

However, none of their owners had tried to shoot the rifle multiple times after getting a 'click'.

tac foley · 17-12-2018 9:39pm

BattleCorp wrote: »

Just google gun exploding in face. It's feckin scary.

The one below isn't very graphic, just a few scratches but it isn't pleasant viewing either. The guy got off very light.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lC4itKb7ioc

This was a case where a BLACK POWDER inline rifle had been loaded with a nitro propellant of some kind - see any clouds of white smoke from a BP burn?

The poor sap in charge of it was VERY lucky not to have been taken to the local morgue.

Kran · 17-12-2018 10:45pm

tac foley wrote: »

If the rifle was a .22cal or a .17HMR then they usually blow the magazine out in pieces and distort the trigger guard. A couple of years back I saw a stack of five CZ rifles in this condition waiting to get collected by the importers, Edgar Bros. Each and every one was a .17HMR, that had been fired with a moderator on it. In each case it was CCI ammunition.

I took a photo of one of them to show the rep by email to notify them. Anyone wants it, please PM me for email connection.

However, none of their owners had tried to shoot the rifle multiple times after getting a 'click'.

Can you dumb this down for me. Are you saying the rifle or the ammunition malfunctioned or both seeing as it was all CZ’s and CCI ammo. User error had no part to play?

tac foley · 17-12-2018 11:34pm

All the ammunition in all the rifles was CCI's. Given that the sound of shooting is almost inaudible, the recoil is virtually undetectable, and the shooting was all done at night and there was no visible strike, each shooter had fired another shot, causing the Ka-Boom to take place. At no time was there any detectable damage to the barrel to be seen. I personally pushed a rod down each barrel to see where the obstruction was, and they all seemed to be about 7 - 8 inches up from the chamber. The thing to remember here in UK, like Ireland, is that the various models of CZ rifles used for close-in foxing in closed-in paddocks and the like outnumber almost everything else by a huge margin - almost everybody I know has one, and there are about 19,000 rural shooters in my county alone. Our four local gun stores probably sell a couple or three hundred a year of all models, maybe more.

At one time we had opened packages of CCI AND Winchester .17HMR taken back to the store where over half the cases had split necks. A number of people I shoot with retired their .17HMR rifles of ANY brand until the gun trade was sure that the problems had gone away. It took a while, as neither CCI nor Winchester felt the need for any action until a US-wide recall was instigated. Eventually that caught up over here in UK and the rest of Europe, and the dodgy ammunition lots were replaced by fresh stocks, but by then the damage had been done for many pest controllers.

Benny mcc · 18-12-2018 12:06am

All the federal 17hmr we shot of late had split shell shoulders after shooting. Well of a box of 50 definitely 30 would split on firing. Hornady from now on.

minktrapper · 18-12-2018 12:54am

You you clarify whether a bullet had lodged in the barrel or not Tac. In one post you are saying that no shooter had fired after hearing a click. In another post you are saying "Given that the sound of shooting is almost inaudible, the recoil is virtually undetectable, and the shooting was all done at night and there was no visible strike, each shooter had fired another shot, causing the Ka-Boom to take place".

garv123 · 18-12-2018 9:40am

Benny mcc wrote: »

All the federal 17hmr we shot of late had split shell shoulders after shooting. Well of a box of 50 definitely 30 would split on firing. Hornady from now on.

All made in the same factory by CCI..

garv123 · 18-12-2018 9:56am

I had just gotten a new mod for my 17, and when I was zeroing it I fired a few CCI rounds to see how they group, shot no 4, went off with an awful ban, followed by lots of pressure to my face, and left me lying on the ground deaf with a ringing in my ears for a few minutes. The bottom blew out of the case.
No bullet jammed in the gun and I had 4 shots on paper.

not a nice feeling, especially when a lefty is firing a right handed gun, your face is fully exposed to the weakest point of the action.

judestynes · 18-12-2018 11:04am

tac foley wrote: »

If the rifle was a .22cal or a .17HMR then they usually blow the magazine out in pieces and distort the trigger guard. A couple of years back I saw a stack of five CZ rifles in this condition waiting to get collected by the importers, Edgar Bros. Each and every one was a .17HMR, that had been fired with a moderator on it. In each case it was CCI ammunition.

I took a photo of one of them to show the rep by email to notify them. Anyone wants it, please PM me for email connection.

However, none of their owners had tried to shoot the rifle multiple times after getting a 'click'.

Light strikes are nothing new Tac. There was nothing to indicate one was a squib load. Anyway on my way now to buy a lotto ticket my luck is definately in

tac foley · 18-12-2018 12:32pm

Ah, but 'light strikes' where the empty case is ejected should surely have rung a few alarm bells?

tac foley · 18-12-2018 12:37pm

minktrapper wrote: »

You you clarify whether a bullet had lodged in the barrel or not Tac. In one post you are saying that no shooter had fired after hearing a click. In another post you are saying "Given that the sound of shooting is almost inaudible, the recoil is virtually undetectable, and the shooting was all done at night and there was no visible strike, each shooter had fired another shot, causing the Ka-Boom to take place".

Sorry for any confusion. I DID write - 'However, none of their owners had tried to shoot the rifle multiple times after getting a 'click'. By that I mean many times - multiple means many shots, not just one.

And quote - 'I personally pushed a rod down each barrel to see where the obstruction was, and they all seemed to be about 7 - 8 inches up from the chamber.'

They had each fired a shot with no visible response at the other end, thinking that they had missed. They then fired another shot with the unpleasant and dangerous result of doing so into a blocked bore - about 8" from the chamber. The resultant blowback wrecked the magazine and the trigger guard/floorplate.

judestynes · 18-12-2018 1:37pm

tac foley wrote: »

Ah, but 'light strikes' where the empty case is ejected should surely have rung a few alarm bells?

The empty cases werent ejected. They were fully intact

tac foley · 18-12-2018 2:13pm

...but you wrote that you knocked a squib round out of the barrel. I'm confused.

judestynes · 18-12-2018 2:30pm

tac foley wrote: »

...but you wrote that you knocked a squib round out of the barrel. I'm confused.

Only thing i can think that happened the last PPU round i fired was the squib. When i chambered the american eagle he primers were too hard to fire ot the bolt was out of battery because of the blockage so the pin didnt make full contact. Whatever the reason every star in the heavens lined up for me. I'll never bitch about being unlucky again

crosshair1 · 18-12-2018 5:23pm

What rifle & caliber was this?

judestynes · 18-12-2018 5:43pm

crosshair1 wrote: »

What rifle & caliber was this?

Ruger mini 14 .223

Benny mcc · 19-12-2018 3:12pm

The federal split shells. I take it that it's just the shell the problem is with as long as the bullets bo the job

tac foley · 19-12-2018 4:47pm

So long as they are found split AFTER ejection. Splits BEFORE firing can pose a real hazard for the shooter. Any such cartridge should NOT be fired under any circumstances.

Remember that that thin little piece of brass, and a few strategically-placed holes are all that stands between your face and ~50,000 psi hot gas.

tac foley · 19-12-2018 4:50pm

Benny mcc wrote: »

The federal split shells. I take it that it's just the shell the problem is with as long as the bullets bo the job

Benny, can I use your picture on a couple of US-based fora? And if so, can you give me the details of calibre/load/rifle et al?

Your name will NOT be mentioned.

Thanks.

Benny mcc · 19-12-2018 5:53pm

Yes tac. It's a .CZ 455 varmint barrel 17hmr. And all are federal premium V.Shok 17 grain. I just found one of the box's and it says hornady v-max on end of the box

tac foley · 19-12-2018 5:57pm

Benny mcc wrote: »

Yes tac. It's a .CZ 455 varmint barrel 17hmr. And all are federal premium V.Shok 17 grain. I just found one of the box's and it says hornady v-max on end of the box

Thanks, Benny. Do you have the lot number there on the packaging?

Benny mcc · 20-12-2018 12:12am

Only number I see is
40142 Rev B
MRP 8202029
If that's anything to go by

tac foley · 20-12-2018 1:21pm

Excellent!! Many thanks.

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Squib rounds

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