So what Captain or Commander do you think had the had the biggest influence in events

AMKC · 01-09-2019 4:48pm #1

that effected the Federation and that would be remembered long after they had happened a bit like WW1 or WW2?

For me its between Picard or Sisko but thinking about it I think it would be Sisko that they would still be talking about more in 2 3 hundred years time.

If it was not for Sisko the Federation, the Klingons, Romulans and no doubt every other race in the Alpha Quadrant would have been ruled by the Dominion.

Sure Picard stopped the Borg and a few other threats but none of them as big and bad as the Dominion and I say that even do Picard is my favorite Star Trek Captain.

Evade · 01-09-2019 5:31pm

The problem is we know almost nothing of the Enterprise's involvement in the Dominion war. It's likely Picard and co. had as much of an impact on their front as Sisko and co. did in theirs.

But that aside, I might still give the edge to Sisko for introducing purpose built warships escort vessels to Starfleet. Especially since it seems to have started a trend, see the Prometheus.

01-09-2019 5:39pm

Picard : He had a fitting death too.

_Kaiser_ · 01-09-2019 6:36pm

Sisko for sure... the Bajoran sector and the wormhole was the key to the war and it was his role in convincing the Prophets to interfere in preventing the Dominion's reinforcements getting through that was the beginning of the end for them.

If they had, it would have been game over for the Federation and the Alpha Quadrant. Once the Dominion lost DS9, access to the wormhole, and Dukat it was all downhill (the brief resurgence caused by the Breen alliance notwithstanding) from there.

AMKC · 01-09-2019 10:32pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Picard : He had a fitting death too.

I think your mixing him up with Data.

Foweva Awone · 02-09-2019 7:35am

AMKC wrote: »

I think your mixing him up with Data.

How did Data die?

TheValeyard · 02-09-2019 8:01am

Foweva Awone wrote: »

How did Data die?

Horribly

pixelburp · 02-09-2019 9:01am

Hard to look past Sisko: by dint of the nature of DS9, his station was at the centre of events that dictated the course of the Federation, Klingon
& Cardassian Empires, Bajor & the Dominion. The commander / captain of that station had to not only play politician between all those factions, steering them as best he could, but later the Tip of the Spear when all out war broke out between the Fed. and Dominion. Then there was the little matter of being a literal god / prophet by series' end.

Picard & Kirk might have had episode-to-episode adventures where they helped or guided many small planets (do we include the Nazi or Gangster planets here? lol), but in terms of sheer scale and the overall path & destiny of the galaxy - it has to be Benjamin.

Bloody good cook too, which gets an extra nod from me

pah · 02-09-2019 9:05am

If the question is who will be remembered hundreds of years afterwards then whatever admiral claimed to be running the operation from the top.

Kiith · 02-09-2019 11:39am

Tough to decide between Picard and Sisko, but i'd have to say Picard.

Picard was instrumental in stopping the Borg from assimilating Earth (on two different occasions). His knowledge of how the Borg work and ways to defeat them gave Riker/Crusher the info to stop them the first time, and his knowledge of the Cube stopped them the 2nd time. He also was instrumental in stopping them from erasing Starfleet from the timeline entirely. His work with the Klingons also helped keep them as allies for a long time, and stopped the Romulans from getting a huge amount of influence over the empire.

Sisko stopped the Dominion from over-running the Alpha Quadrant by getting the Prophets to stop the Dominion reinforcements coming through the wormhole. If that had happened, there was very little any of the AQ races could have done to stop the Dominion, and there probably would have been an attack (and obliteration) on Earth in the very near future.

Evade · 02-09-2019 11:44am

I think it's fair to say Picard had the benefit of a little divine intervention too.

AMKC · 02-09-2019 7:31pm

Evade wrote: »

I think it's fair to say Picard had the benefit of a little divine intervention too.

You mean Q I take it?

Evade · 02-09-2019 7:51pm

AMKC wrote: »

You mean Q I take it?

I do.

odyssey06 · 02-09-2019 7:52pm

Evade wrote: »

I think it's fair to say Picard had the benefit of a little divine intervention too.

What does a god need with a starship captain?
...

brainfreeze · 06-09-2019 3:25pm

Evade wrote: »

The problem is we know almost nothing of the Enterprise's involvement in the Dominion war. It's likely Picard and co. had as much of an impact on their front as Sisko and co. did in theirs.

Incredibly doubtful, Sisko was literally running the war effort. When fleets did take part in offensives, all ships reported to the defiant, regardless of rank.

Also we know exactly what they got up to during that time period, during the peak of the dominion war the enterprise was out doing enterprisey stuff, like welcoming the Evora into the federation.

Evade · 06-09-2019 3:42pm

brainfreeze wrote: »

Incredibly doubtful, Sisko was literally running the war effort. When fleets did take part in offensives, all ships reported to the defiant, regardless of rank.

Sisko was a high ranking officer in one of the busier fronts but he wasn't running the war singlehandedly. There were multiple fronts, at least a dozen Starfleet fleets, and thousands of ships.

Other ships reporting to Sisko is just a quirk of him being a main character. In the episode where Worf is on trial for destroying a civilian Klingon ship Chief O'Brien implies he was next in command of the Defiant after Worf despite there being half a dozen officers on the bridge.

brainfreeze wrote: »

Also we know exactly what they got up to during that time period, during the peak of the dominion war the enterprise was out doing enterprisey stuff, like welcoming the Evora into the federation.

Two or so weeks of a years long war. We know almost nothing of what they did for the rest of the war. Let's not forget that during the peak of the Dominion War the senior staff of DS9 took days of to have a baseball game, plan a casino heist in the holosuite, and a myriad of other things.

LeBash · 06-09-2019 3:43pm

They all would have been hugely significant.

Surely Archer, despite being my least favourite series. First Captain in deep space, stopped the lads who killed 8 million in the first inter galactic attack on earth. He is to space as Columbus was to Europe and the US.

Janeway probably second, first (actually the second counting the episode where the lads were using aliens as fuel) Captain in the Delta quadrant, and therefore would have had many more first contacts. Flew through Borg space, defeated an enemy the Borg couldn't, discovered several new faster than warp technologies. Reintegrate Maquis members into Star Fleet. Set up a Star Fleet ambassador in the Delta quadrant. Met with several members of the Q and involved in stopping the civil war in the Continueium. Was in the Continueium. Had a ridiculously annoying voice, less preferable than Pike and his beeping. should I go on?

brainfreeze · 06-09-2019 4:02pm

Evade wrote: »

Other ships reporting to Sisko is just a quirk of him being a main character. .

If we are going down that route, then this conversation is pointless as we can literally dismiss anything due to it being a TV show. Then we might a swell just state the obvious, the Enterpise didn't feature much during the dominion wars because they were also making feature films during that time period and in between the actors had other jobs. But that's pointless for Canon discussions.

Lets avoid that and just stick to what is stated in the TV Shows and Movies. Anything else is just imagination.

All ships reported to the Defiant. If Picard was as equal as you say he was in the war, then he would have been present during the signing of the peace treaty with representatives of the founders. Yet he wasn't, it was star fleet command, and Siskos command crew.

The Enterprise E didn't even exist at the start of the war, they were still building it after the destruction of enterprise D, so I honestly don't believe their actions could be equal even if they wanted to be. They were literally grounded. It's the entire reason Worf transferred.

Not only that it's a known joke in Star Trek that the Enterprise missed the dominion war. They even continued that with Discovery.

Evade · 06-09-2019 4:32pm

brainfreeze wrote: »

If we are going down that route, then this conversation is pointless as we can literally dismiss anything due to it being a TV show. Then we might a swell just state the obvious, the Enterpise didn't feature much during the dominion wars because they were also making feature films during that time period and in between the actors had other jobs. But that's pointless for Canon discussions.

Lets avoid that and just stick to what is stated in the TV Shows and Movies. Anything else is just imagination.

That's why I originally wrote we don't know because we don't.

brainfreeze wrote: »

All ships reported to the Defiant. If Picard was as equal as you say he was in the war, then he would have been present during the signing of the peace treaty with representatives of the founders. Yet he wasn't, it was star fleet command, and Siskos command crew.

The President of the Federation wasn't there either which seems like a bit of an oversight unless Starfleet finally had a successful coup off screen, third times the charm and all.

brainfreeze wrote: »

The Enterprise E didn't even exist at the start of the war, they were still building it after the destruction of enterprise D, so I honestly don't believe their actions could be equal even if they wanted to be. They were literally grounded. It's the entire reason Worf transferred.

It did. The war proper didn't start until the end of season 5 and First Contact takes place around the middle of season 5.

So what Captain or Commander do you think had the had the biggest influence in events

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