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Pet insurance

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    #32
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    who are best for Dog insurance or is it like everything else, shop around and see what's on offer?


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    #33
    cocker5
    Registered Users Posts: 3,274 ✭✭✭cocker5


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    who are best for Dog insurance or is it like everything else, shop around and see what's on offer?

    No it’s not about what’s on offer, it’s about policy T&C’s... excess, max claim amount per year etc, direct claiming , exclusions etc

    From experience I had found Allianz to be the best .. been using them for over 14 years and no issues, have had substantial claims over the last 4 years .. quick repayment etc

    Cheapest is not always best .. you need to ensure your comparing like with like


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    #34
    Varta
    Closed Accounts Posts: 517 ✭✭✭Varta


    ILoveYourVibes wrote: »
    Don't get a pet without having pet insurance. And make sure you know what you are and are not covered for.

    GET YOUR PET INSURED YOUNG or they won't take them. And get them insured before they get sick.

    We have aviva pet insurance. Not sure I think they are the best though. But ours has had numerous things wrong so we cant change him as it would be tough to get someone else to insure him.

    Take a look at some of the quotes for procedures quoted by some posters, then look at the cost for similar procedures pre Allianz introducing and pushing pet insurance. The difference is staggering. Pet insurance, like human health insurance, is a licence for certain people to charge outrageous amounts of money and recommend procedures and treatments that are not necessarily required. Unfortunately, the genie is now out of the bottle.


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    #35
    tk123
    Registered Users Posts: 14,020 ✭✭✭✭tk123


    Varta wrote: »
    Take a look at some of the quotes for procedures quoted by some posters, then look at the cost for similar procedures pre Allianz introducing and pushing pet insurance. The difference is staggering. Pet insurance, like human health insurance, is a licence for certain people to charge outrageous amounts of money and recommend procedures and treatments that are not necessarily required. Unfortunately, the genie is now out of the bottle.

    Have you any examples?

    They're doing pet insurance at least 16 years because I got insurance for my cat 16 years ago... it's not unreasonable for prices of anything to go up in that amount if time? Sure how much was a packet of crisps when you were a kid compared to now like?


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    #36
    cocker5
    Registered Users Posts: 3,274 ✭✭✭cocker5


    Varta wrote: »
    Take a look at some of the quotes for procedures quoted by some posters, then look at the cost for similar procedures pre Allianz introducing and pushing pet insurance. The difference is staggering. Pet insurance, like human health insurance, is a licence for certain people to charge outrageous amounts of money and recommend procedures and treatments that are not necessarily required. Unfortunately, the genie is now out of the bottle.

    I don't agree with this at all I'm afraid... your vet can recommended a procedure, its up to the pet owner to do their own research and then decide if they wish to proceed... procedures are not carried out without approval.. from my experience. I don't believe vet charges outrageous prices when they know you have pet insurance... the prices are the prices... while agree they can be expensive they are linked to overheads, expenses, profit required etc same as any business


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    #37
    Varta
    Closed Accounts Posts: 517 ✭✭✭Varta


    cocker5 wrote: »
    I don't agree with this at all I'm afraid... your vet can recommended a procedure, its up to the pet owner to do their own research and then decide if they wish to proceed... procedures are not carried out without approval.. from my experience. I don't believe vet charges outrageous prices when they know you have pet insurance... the prices are the prices... while agree they can be expensive they are linked to overheads, expenses, profit required etc same as any business

    I never said that they up the price if they know you have insurance, I said that they upped their prices when insurance came in and became widespread. Even if vets had not increased their prices, the cost to the pet owner would have gone up anyway. Prior to insurance the pet owner would have paid the vet a fee for treatment, let's say €5, with insurance, the pet owner pays the insurer a fee, let's say €1, and the insurer pays the vet €5, that is now a total of €6 compared to the previous total of €5. This extra charge is borne by the pet owner, therefore veterinary bills have become more expensive. Add to that the loading by veterinary businesses since the introduction of insurance and you begin to see what it is all about. BTW I specifically say vet 'businesses' because it is becoming increasingly difficult to find a vet in practice for themself. These vet businesses are driven by profit. They have board meetings about how to increase profits. They run campaigns to increase profits. And they are aided and abetted by Allianz and other insurance companies in doing this. Rest assured, every bit of advice you hear from an Allianz endorsed vet will have a profit motive. Unfortunately, as I said earlier, the genie appears to be out of the bottle.


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    #38
    Alun
    Registered Users Posts: 21,418 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    Varta wrote: »
    Prior to insurance the pet owner would have paid the vet a fee for treatment, let's say €5, with insurance, the pet owner pays the insurer a fee, let's say €1, and the insurer pays the vet €5, that is now a total of €6 compared to the previous total of €5.
    Not sure where you're getting that from. I pay my vet directly and then claim back whatever I'm due, which is never 100% with own-risk and the percentage rule they apply to older pets.


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    #39
    Varta
    Closed Accounts Posts: 517 ✭✭✭Varta


    Alun wrote: »
    Not sure where you're getting that from. I pay my vet directly and then claim back whatever I'm due, which is never 100% with own-risk and the percentage rule they apply to older pets.

    You are forgetting about the premium you pay. The premium is an additional cost to the treatment of the pet that wasn't there previously.


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    #40
    Choc Chip
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,442 ✭✭✭Choc Chip


    Not to drag this off-topic, but I genuinely dont think vets overcharge on the whole. Have a look at the cost of a hip replacement for a dog compared to a person and the animal is a staggering amount less.


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    #41
    Varta
    Closed Accounts Posts: 517 ✭✭✭Varta


    Choc Chip wrote: »
    Not to drag this off-topic, but I genuinely dont think vets overcharge on the whole. Have a look at the cost of a hip replacement for a dog compared to a person and the animal is a staggering amount less.

    The high cost of a human hip replacement is also an issue. And one that has been driven upwards by the involvement of insurance companies. Insurance is a gamble. Some people are more risk averse than others and are therefore more willing to pay or pay more to have cover. That's fine. The point I made is that insurance companies moving into the pet healthcare market drove up the cost of veterinary care for pet owners, as they did in the area of human health.


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    #42
    boomerang
    Registered Users Posts: 3,189 ✭✭✭boomerang


    lazeedaisy wrote: »
    our new Greyhound was 9 and had been a racing dog, so could not insure her.

    Just FYI, I know she was too old to insure in any case, but I had no problems getting insurance for my ex-racing rescue grey with Allianz.


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    #43
    boomerang
    Registered Users Posts: 3,189 ✭✭✭boomerang


    Would I recommend insurance? Hell yeah! Unbelievable peace of mind.

    Just don't feel gypped if you don't need to claim - consider yourself lucky!

    There will probably be a rise in the cost of your premium year on year as your pet ages and their risk of disease increases. I don't think that your premium will necessarily rise if you've had a claim. That's not been my experience.

    Also agree Allianz are the best - they have never quibbled with me, very transparent, easy to deal with over the phone and have always paid up promptly.

    All my dogs have been insured but my rescue grey has been the most expensive. Orthopaedic surgery a few years ago was €1400. This year, treatment and hospitalisation for two strokes, blood tests, MRI and CT scans ran the bill up into the thousands again. She is 10 so I had to pay the first 35% of treatment myself. Without the insurance however I could not have afforded this gold standard of care.


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    #44
    Taiga
    Registered Users Posts: 350 ✭✭Taiga


    Hubby had griped at me the last couple of years because we were paying for dog insurance and he reckoned it was a waste of our meagre resources. He's so glad I didn't listen to him as the bill in total this sad year was 1400, Allianze paid it no problem. We insured the new fella as soon as we could. It was such a relief.

    We could manage to put away some money weekly and keep it aside just in case, but to be honest we'd dip into it constantly because there's always something. If it's not the car, it's a new fridge, maybe a broken washing machine or the kids need something.

    We pay it monthly so find that handy. We don't mind now if we never have to claim. In fact I hope we don't. After being on the down side, I don't care how long we pay and don't need to claim.

    As an aside, with the random crap the new pup eats I'll be amazed if he gets through puppyhood with no vet drama!;)


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    #45
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,363 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Choc Chip wrote: »
    Not to drag this off-topic, but I genuinely dont think vets overcharge on the whole. Have a look at the cost of a hip replacement for a dog compared to a person and the animal is a staggering amount less.

    Generally I agree with you. We paid €250 for a spinal MRI for a teenager and €1700 for a cat MRI, which did identify a particular problem. Fortunately, insurance covered both, though Blue Insurance refused to pre-authorise, so I had to pay out for the cat and hope they would pay up in the end, which they eventually did.


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    #46
    Gael23
    Registered Users Posts: 12,086 ✭✭✭✭Gael23


    Out vet advised us against it because he said insurers put you through every hoop possible to avoid paying.
    He told us to save the money in the credit Union and always have a contingency fund for unexpected vet bills.


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    #47
    tk123
    Registered Users Posts: 14,020 ✭✭✭✭tk123


    Gael23 wrote: »
    Out vet advised us against it because he said insurers put you through every hoop possible to avoid paying.
    He told us to save the money in the credit Union and always have a contingency fund for unexpected vet bills.

    Your vet is wrong in the case of Allianz - I’ve never had an issue with claims and I don’t know anyone who has. I’ve heard stories about other insurers but it’s the same with your car or house insurance - some companies are better than others.


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    #48
    Sheep Shagger
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 6,216 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sheep Shagger


    We've recently got a pup and signed up for the monthly vet plan at €18 pm which covers a lot of things think we've saved a fair bit already with vaccinations etc.

    Am I right in thinking these really only cover day to day expenditure and if an operation etc was needed thats where insurance would come in?

    From what I can see insurance doesn't cover day yo day stuff, do people pay for both or is it a case of you have insurance for an older dog only?


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    #49
    Cherry Blossom
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Regional North West Moderators Posts: 6,928 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cherry Blossom


    These vet plans are a bit of a gimmick for the vets benefit mostly. All they cover in most cases is vaccinations and one check up a year. The checkup comes free when I get my yearly vaccinations done. Different vets have different plans so you’d need to check with your own vet what it covers.

    Insurers will not insure older dogs that have not been insured before. I always insured young horses and pups for the first year as these are more accident prone/ likely to eat something needing surgery to remove etc. After that I put the value of the insurance premium aside for a rainy day. When I started doing this I had three horses and two dogs so I would have been spending a sizeable chunk of money on pet insurance. I have never dipped into my pot for routine appointments, neutering, teeth cleaning etc. And my pot now exceeds the maximum payout an insurer will make for any one condition. Actually for treatments that would cost that amount I’d be seriously considering recovery time by the pet and how much pain and suffering would be caused during that time. A lot of posters wouldn’t agree with me here but I’m of the opinion that there are a lot worse things than death both for humans and pets alike. I’m a supporter of assisted euthanasia in humans for example.

    Anyway, I digress. If you can’t afford to pay out for a big operation on a pet or are not good at saving, you should have pet insurance. It’s one thing having a pet euthanised to alleviate suffering but entirely another to have a pet euthanised because you can’t afford treatment for them.


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    #50
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,363 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Gael23 wrote: »
    Out vet advised us against it because he said insurers put you through every hoop possible to avoid paying.
    He told us to save the money in the credit Union and always have a contingency fund for unexpected vet bills.

    We're paying €10 per month for our 1 year old cat on Blue Insurance. We've already claimed over €2k (mostly MRI) and expect to claim more than €2k more over the summer for surgery, bringing us over the €4k lifetime cover limit.

    It would take a lot of tenners in the credit union to get to €4k. I'm hugely relieved that we were able to do the right thing to get her problem diagnosed and hopefully fixed up, without worrying about money.


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    #51
    Sam W
    Registered Users Posts: 344 ✭✭Sam W


    Sheep Shagger wrote: »
    We've recently got a pup and signed up for the monthly vet plan at €18 pm which covers a lot of things think we've saved a fair bit already with vaccinations etc.

    Am I right in thinking these really only cover day to day expenditure and if an operation etc was needed thats where insurance would come in?

    From what I can see insurance doesn't cover day yo day stuff, do people pay for both or is it a case of you have insurance for an older dog only?

    I have both the pet plan and pet insurance for our Cockapoo.

    The pet plan is a bit excessive but it’s good to be able to bring the dog to the vet for whatever small issue you find and don’t have to worry about doing online research yourself. It covers only unlimited checkups though and not treatment, so you still have to pay for scans, surgeries and drugs, which is where the insurance comes in.


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    #52
    Sheep Shagger
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 6,216 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sheep Shagger


    Thanks all, this is the pet plan we are on.

    https://www.villagevets.ie/free-visits

    As a pup it's covered his monthly checkups, 12 week vaccination and some drugs (with a 12 euro surcharge) so so far it's been good value for money.

    Will have a think about the insurance, thought I had read that anything diagnosed was only covered for 12 months ? As a pup we should have time to still insure and fingers crossed it's not needed.


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    #53
    Sam W
    Registered Users Posts: 344 ✭✭Sam W


    Sheep Shagger wrote: »
    Thanks all, this is the pet plan we are on.

    https://www.villagevets.ie/free-visits

    As a pup it's covered his monthly checkups, 12 week vaccination and some drugs (with a 12 euro surcharge) so so far it's been good value for money.

    Will have a think about the insurance, thought I had read that anything diagnosed was only covered for 12 months ? As a pup we should have time to still insure and fingers crossed it's not needed.

    We have Village Vet’s pet plan as well. Good for a puppy (as you will have so many different small issues that you want the vet to take a look), but once the pup is fully grown, it’s less likely that you need to visit them that often. Still we visited the vet for around 6-7 times in the last year so 220 euro isn’t too bad.

    For insurance, we have our plan with PetInsurance.ie. They have 3 levels of insurances. The medium level covers the same condition for 12 months. The top level covers it for lifetime.

    We bought the medium level but in hindsight we should have gone for the top level. Some progressive issues like hip replacement will require more scans and eventually a surgery over more than a year’s time.


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    #54
    tk123
    Registered Users Posts: 14,020 ✭✭✭✭tk123


    Whatever you're doing make sure you have quick access to cash either way as not all vets will do direct claim for insurance and we can't always plan ahead... We unfortunately found ourselves at ucd emergency :( at the weekend and had to pay in full. I'd never be without insurance, the pet plan is not for me as I don't buy food from the vet or use flea/worm treatments.


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