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21-01-2019, 12:35   #181
ohnonotgmail
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Originally Posted by markodaly View Post
I would not be against that idea per say, but it would be wildly unpopular with the majority of parents. And parents vote.

I sympathise with parents who want to put their kids into an ET school and cannot get a place but to turn the blame from the government to religious-run schools is just idiotic.

Would it really? What do you base that on? I imagine most parents wouldn't give a monkeys.
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21-01-2019, 13:42   #182
markodaly
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Would it really? What do you base that on? I imagine most parents wouldn't give a monkeys.
Surveys carried out confirm this. Most parents are happy with the way the school system is run and what ethos they are run under. Dont let the idea of a loud minority overrule the facts on this.
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21-01-2019, 13:50   #183
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Surveys carried out confirm this. Most parents are happy with the way the school system is run and what ethos they are run under. Dont let the idea of a loud minority overrule the facts on this.

I dont suppose you have any links to such surveys?
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21-01-2019, 16:01   #184
It wasnt me123
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I dont suppose you have any links to such surveys?
Google IONA - I'm sure you'll get loads of "independent" surveys saying Catholicism is fab
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21-01-2019, 16:43   #185
Hotblack Desiato
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Calling for a constitutional amendment to seize all the private property, owned by various religious orders and institutions, without compensation is certainly motivated by being an anti-religious bigot.
It seems personal attack is the only weapon in your armoury.

I can call for a constitutional referendum on whatever topic I like, thanks. Whether people agree with me or not is up to them.

This is nothing to do with bigotry, it's about the state having ownership of assets it funded.

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You also said earlier you do not trust ANY priest or nun, tarring them all with one brush.
Provide a link. Nice of you strip away any and all context. I note you ran away and stopped posting here the last time I asked you to substantiate a nasty claim you made against me.

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Its fine that you hate the people in the Catholic church
I hate the organisation, and anyone within it who condones or covers up grave wrongdoing or was willing to look the other way.

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Then why does the state not provide more money to a) fund more educate together schools or b) buy the property of national schools owned by religious bodies?
Senior figures within the Dept of Education appear determined to resist the demands of both the public and successive ministers of education for reducing religious control of education.

If Dept Education had got their way, Educate Together would never have been established in the first place.

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Why not seize schools via payment? Why do you want the state to seize this land without compensation if the issue is not funding?
The state is already paying to run the schools, it in most cases fully funded the building of them, but it foolishly gave away control and ownership to religious bodies. That's an injustice against the public interest which needs to be rectified.
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08-06-2019, 22:06   #186
Hasschu
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I was born and raised in Listowel, I left in the mid fifties, the day after my last day in secondary school. My take on public opinion in Ireland is that it was largely shaped by the 1840's Famine and widespread poverty up to about 1960. Merely survive was what most people endeavoured to do. The Government was as poor as the people and it should be no surprise that they gladly handed over responsibility for health, education, welfare to both the Catholic Church and the Church of Ireland. Admittedly the state largely funded those activities but there was a saving in the order of 20% + or -. One should also keep in mind that corruption in government was quite common. I distinctly remember delivering brown paper envelopes to politicians of both stripes and also that a high ranking police officer (Garda) was paid regularly. The payment was for signing off on an application to import plywood, my mother used to refer to the Police Officer as "dat thieven effer" and stronger as he raised the amount demanded over time. Public opinion wrt to poor people in general and unwed mothers in particular could only be described as barbaric. My father drank with a couple of Solicitors and I heard many times that the closing argument in court cases was "Your honour, my client has a one way ticket to Euston in his pocket and his sister in London has promised to take care of him. The sentence usually was "Bound over to keep the peace for 1 year" case closed. We sent the unwed mothers to Laundries and young men to England. If all the dissatisfied young people in Ireland had been forced to stay there revolution would have been inevitable. It is not popular to draw attention to the fact that emigration of the poor to England and middle class to the U.S. and Australia was what allowed the Irish government to govern irresponsibly with the Church as its major propaganda vehicle keeping raw emotions in check.

Having said this I must add that I have a grandson enrolled in a highly rated Primary/Secondary Choir school run by an Irish descended Cardinal and founded by an Irish priest in 1937. The pupils are mostly Asian because the entry is by competitive exam, there are only two Irish descendants in a class of 23. The Cathedral was built in the 1860s' by the famine Irish with substantial funding by French Canadians. I hope I have not shocked too many of you.
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16-06-2019, 01:27   #187
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Yet another RTÉ Documentary on One was broadcast today. It had echoes of Peggy McCarthy's story - except this time it's from as recently as 1985:


Documentary on One:The Case of Majella Moynihan

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In 1985, an unnamed female Garda was threatened with dismissal from An Garda Síochana for giving birth to a baby outside of wedlock. What led to those dismissal charges utterly changed her life. Majella Moynihan has remained silent - until now (2019)
This evening, one of the most read stories on The Irish Times website reports on a statement tonight from the current Garda Commissioner apologising:

Commissioner apologises to former garda investigated over premarital sex

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When she was 22, Ms Moynihan was charged with breaching the force’s disciplinary rules for the transgression of having premarital sex with another garda, becoming pregnant and having a child.

Transcripts from an internal Garda hearing from the time reveal an aggressive line of questioning by senior officers, scrutinising the young woman’s sexual history, and her use of contraceptives.

Faced with dismissal for bringing discredit to the force, Ms Moynihan only kept her job at the intervention of the archbishop of Dublin, who feared firing her would lead to more gardaí travelling to England for abortions, if they became pregnant outside of marriage.

Ms Moynihan was born in Kanturk, Co Cork in 1962, and in 1983 joined An Garda Síochána.

Training in Templemore, Co Tipperary, she met another Garda recruit, who she had had a previous relationship with. The pair started seeing each other again and Ms Moynihan became pregnant.

In correspondence, a district officer in Store Street Garda station told a chief superintendent Ms Moynihan was “honest, dependable and willing”. The officer said: “I am particularly impressed by her devotion to duty while pregnant.”

She gave birth to the baby, David, in Galway Regional Hospital in May 1984, and gave him up for adoption.

“I felt and I still feel that I was pressurised into it . . . From the time that I told the authorities in the Garda Síochána that I was pregnant, that’s the one thing that was kept being mentioned: Was adoption, adoption, adoption,” Ms Moynihan told RTɒs Documentary on One.
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16-06-2019, 01:30   #188
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I've listened to that Doc on one from today and sweet ****ing jesus even in 1985 Ireland was ****ed up.
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16-06-2019, 01:46   #189
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And given how the Gardai acted in the kerry baby case(kerry division of ****ing mensa) it's not surprising that this woman was treated the way she was. I hope she fleeces the guards for all she can get. I mean imagine a woman today being disciplined for getting pregnant ?
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16-06-2019, 01:54   #190
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Originally Posted by Hotblack Desiato View Post
We should have a constitutional amendment and seize all national schools without compensation
The Criminal Assets Bureau should have been sent in long ago to seize all Church property with a view to compensating its victims generously.
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16-06-2019, 04:35   #191
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Jawdropping. Imagine, the Commissioner travelling to the Archbishop's palace to decide on the fate of a young woman because she had a child out of wedlock. Sickening.

I'm glad that woman got her apology in the end, but ffs, what kind of country were we at all?
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16-06-2019, 11:23   #192
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Jawdropping. Imagine, the Commissioner travelling to the Archbishop's palace to decide on the fate of a young woman because she had a child out of wedlock. Sickening.

I'm glad that woman got her apology in the end, but ffs, what kind of country were we at all?
Would the apology have happened and as fast if it wasn’t the current commissioner ?
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17-06-2019, 22:45   #193
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Would the apology have happened and as fast if it wasn’t the current commissioner ?
He still owes an apology himself to the survivors and families of the Miami showband. Read your history.
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