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Landlord keeping deposit

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    #32
    DubCount
    Registered Users Posts: 1,065 ✭✭✭DubCount


    Kevin Irving wrote: »
    If the LL ends the lease early, someone could end up homeless.

    Landlords dont make someone homeless. A lack of rental supply makes someone homeless. Please stop blaming individuals for a government problem. Government policy dictates supply, not individual landlords.

    A contract is a commitment between 2 adults. Tenants are just as capable of fulfilling their obligations as landlords are. Assignment may be to an individual of less financial means than the outgoing tenant and may not be adequate for the landlord.


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    #33
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,003 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    RossieMan wrote: »
    Are you a landlord dav? Your posts seem very bias towards the landlord point of view.

    I think you will find they are biased towards what the RTA legislation is. If this was a thread about a landlord throwing a tenant out of a fixed term tenancy 4 months early or without a valid reason/notice for termination, I would be pointing out what the posters rights are in that scenario as well.


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    #34
    RossieMan
    Registered Users Posts: 6,766 ✭✭✭RossieMan


    Dav010 wrote:
    I think you will find they are biased towards what the RTA legislation is. If this was a thread about a landlord throwing a tenant out of a fixed term tenancy 4 months early or without a valid reason/notice for termination, I would be pointing out what the posters rights are in that scenario as well.


    You haven't answered the question. I assume that's a yes so.


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    #35
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,351 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    RossieMan wrote: »
    Are you a landlord dav? Your posts seem very bias towards the landlord point of view.
    He is correctly stating the obligations of a tenant on a fixed contract how is that bias? Expecting a contract only to be binding on one side is however a bias view.


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    #36
    MacDanger
    Registered Users Posts: 2,351 ✭✭✭MacDanger


    amcalester wrote: »
    Pretty sure the RTA allows assigning a lease so this clause is unenforceable.

    OP should go through the process of finding a replacement, present everything to the landlord and if refused the RTB will award him his deposit back.

    This is correct.

    My wife and I were renting a house (entire house rather than a room in this case) a couple of years ago and wanted to break the lease (as my sister's house had become available). We enquired with the letting agency and they advised that we were required to tell the landlord that we wanted to break the lease but to offer to sublet the property for the same rent - she then had the option to take up our offer or allow us to break the lease.

    It's detailed in point # 2 here:

    https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/ending-a-tenancy/ending-a-fixed-term-tenancy/tenants-ending-a-fixed-term-tenancy/

    This is the letter I sent:
    Request to Terminate Fixed Term Lease
    To: LANDLORD NAME & ADDRESS

    Macdanger would like to request to terminate the fixed term lease on the he tenancy of the dwelling at ADDRESS on DATE.

    Alternatively, we request permission to sub-let the property from the remaining duration of the lease (until END OF LEASE DATE) at the same rate of monthly rent (€XXXX) in accordance with section 186 of the Residential Tenancies Act 2004.
    Signed:




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    #37
    kirving
    Registered Users Posts: 5,888 ✭✭✭kirving


    DubCount wrote: »
    Landlords dont make someone homeless. A lack of rental supply makes someone homeless. Please stop blaming individuals for a government problem. Government policy dictates supply, not individual landlords.

    The net result of a landlord ending a tenancy has the potential to be worse than the net result of a tenant ending a tenancy. The law recognises and accounts for this fact. I don't see the argument here.

    Please quote where I said that "landlords make people homeless" as you've implied, or blamed landlords for housing supply issues generally.

    Or are you just having a rant to yourself?
    DubCount wrote: »
    A contract is a commitment between 2 adults. Tenants are just as capable of fulfilling their obligations as landlords are. Assignment may be to an individual of less financial means than the outgoing tenant and may not be adequate for the landlord.

    As per my example, the car may be sold to someone of less financial means, who in turn defaults on a payment. Doesn't change the fact that the first owner can leave the PCP deal on a fair basis at any time, provided that the settlement is fair.

    You're seem to be arguing against assignment on principle(rather than a specific case, which I could understand), and attempting to enforce a contract despite potential external influences.

    I'm struggling to think of another business where this is an acceptable practice?


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    #38
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Kevin Irving wrote: »

    If the LL ends the lease early, someone could end up homeless.

    One of the risks of renting, they just have to get in with it and find somewhere else it buy if they want full security.
    Kevin Irving wrote: »
    What's your argument against assignment? That's like saying your shouldn't be allowed to sell your car until you've completed your PCP term. That is obviously nonsensical. You give the car back, pay the gap between finance/actual (in other words the tenants deposit) and everyone moves on.

    You aren’t allowed to sell your car while it’s on pcp. Hand it back and give up your full deposit with no comeback to any of it. It is also a poor comparison to renting.

    If I sign a 12 month contact for a utility I can’t get out without paying out the reminder of the contract for example which is a better comparison.


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    #39
    Samuel T. Cogley
    Registered Users Posts: 10,684 ✭✭✭✭Samuel T. Cogley


    Dav010 wrote: »
    Depends on the amount of deposit, if it is one month, then by the time you advertise and interview applicants, most of that will be gone.

    Maybe in Cavan but in Dublin no way. Regardless he would have had to do it anyway so legalities aside he's being unreasonable in my view.


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    #40
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,003 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Kevin Irving wrote: »

    I'm struggling to think of another business where this is an acceptable practice?

    There are many practices, and conditions which apply to tenancies which do not apply to other businesses, that is why it has its own legislation, the Residential Tenancies Act. The legislation is very specific about what rights tenants, and landlords have, and very importantly, the rules by which they must abide.

    It is specific on fixed term tenancies, what rules apply etc. You might feel the rules on assignment are unfair, but if you think more about it, it actually favours the tenant, if the LL refuses assignment, the tenant gets to walk away giving the minimum required notice.


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    #41
    Gasherbraun
    Registered Users Posts: 312 ✭✭Gasherbraun


    Dav010 wrote: »

    If you assign the lease and the landlord refuses the assignment, then you get to leave the fixed term early.

    The legislation states that the LL cannot 'unreasonably refuse an assignment'. If there are reasonable grounds to refuse that are not contrary to any other laws (typically discrimination) then a LL can refuse. Obviously the determination of what is reasonable can be hard to define.

    In relation to an earlier post a landlord cannot deny the tenant's right to assign - it is a statutory right so cannot be removed arbitrarily


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    #42
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,436 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    RossieMan wrote: »
    Are you a landlord dav? Your posts seem very bias towards the landlord point of view.
    RossieMan wrote: »
    You haven't answered the question. I assume that's a yes so.

    Mod Note

    RossieMan, do not badger a posted for details on their personal life.
    A poster posting legal law is not bias. Fact are facts.


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    #43
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,003 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »
    Maybe in Cavan but in Dublin no way. Regardless he would have had to do it anyway so legalities aside he's being unreasonable in my view.

    Assuming the deposit is equivalent to one month rent, everything is relative. The mitigated loss also includes rental income. Say for argument sake a property in Dublin rents for €2k a month, if it takes the LL 3 weeks to get a new tenant in then the loss is €1500 plus advertising. If it’s in Cavan it might be €500 per month but the same rules apply.

    Having said that, if the op allows viewings (which a lot don’t while there stuff is still in the property), then losses might be limited to advertising and whatever ancillary costs the landlord has incurred in getting a new tenant.


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    #44
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    Gasherbraun wrote: »
    The legislation states that the LL cannot 'unreasonably refuse an assignment'. y

    Thew law does not say that. A landlord can refuse to permit an assignment for any or no reason.


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