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65 year old man dies in UK jobcentre

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Comments

  • #62
    c.p.w.g.w
    Registered Users Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    katiek102010 wrote: »
    I lived in Kent, 3 bed end of terrace. Mortgage 1000k pm, childcare 500 for morning and after school. Ctax was 180pm plus water 60, gas and elec

    Thought water included in the council tax...Christ the Brits love to tax the bayjaysus out of its people...My point was my uncle lives in a fairly rough spot, think there was murder only last week, and his council tax was a good chunk of money


  • #63
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,840 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    katiek102010 wrote: »
    Tell you what why don't we just euthanise every one at the first sign of a grey hair or illness. Will that suit your ideology

    no, that would be wrong, many have contributed! Many scum out there, nothing but parasites off the taxpayer, popping out the next generation of dole rats as we speak!


  • #64
    salonfire
    Registered Users Posts: 3,078 ✭✭✭salonfire


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    You do realise our bailouts went to largely French and German banks, yea?

    And thanks god it did.

    I did not lose a cent in what I had deposited in the bank thanks to the bailout.

    I was able to use that deposit to buy a house cheaply thanks to the crash.

    Without the bailout, it could have been very much different.


  • #65
    salonfire
    Registered Users Posts: 3,078 ✭✭✭salonfire


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    Thought water included in the council tax...Christ the Brits love to tax the bayjaysus out of its people...My point was my uncle lives in a fairly rough spot, think there was murder only last week, and his council tax was a good chunk of money

    They pay much less in Income tax though so it's probably not much worse than here


  • #66
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,840 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    salonfire wrote: »
    And thanks god it did.

    I did not lose a cent in what I had deposited in the bank thanks to the bailout.

    I was able to use that deposit to buy a house cheaply thanks to the crash.

    Without the bailout, it could have been very much different.

    we should have just let the bank burn! Who needs a banking system? :rolleyes:

    what happened was morally corrupt, no disputing that!


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  • #67
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,779 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    Idbatterim wrote:
    yeah, I also realise tens of billions were borrowed, to keep our status as europes most impressive welfare state! Its great now that everything else is world class here, transport, housing, health etc, that we can start throwing money like its going out of fashion, to those with no intention of ever working, margaret cash etc, people that are just so deserving of other citizens money!


    You ll actually find policies such as austerity have had more of a negative effect on the services you mentioned than anything else


  • #68
    katiek102010
    Registered Users Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭katiek102010


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    Thought water included in the council tax...Christ the Brits love to tax the bayjaysus out of its people...My point was my uncle lives in a fairly rough spot, think there was murder only last week, and his council tax was a good chunk of money


    It's like that all over, water is not included unfortunately. We were screwed though we had 2 water companies, water in and then waste. Had to pay both. Also they love their service charges. Councils don't take over estate roads or lighting now. Have to pay those on top, usually a grand a year


  • #69
    katiek102010
    Registered Users Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭katiek102010


    salonfire wrote: »
    They pay much less in Income tax though so it's probably not much worse than here

    It's the same in income tax for the avg worker. High earners and CT is lower


  • #70
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,345 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    katiek102010 wrote: »
    Along with many others. I have a relative who worked as a teacher over. She did her time and had to retire but got her job back on temp 0hr contracts. She is in her 60's.

    She had a stroke last year, in a wheelchair as lost the use of her left side. Speech extremely poor. Just been declared fit for work.

    I don't believe that for a second. If what you said is true she easily qualifies for disability benefits. They will even provide money to adapt her housing through the HSE.


  • #71
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,088 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Scoundrel wrote: »
    Heartless bastards maybe some of the posters here want to work till they die but most normal people would like a few years of retirement I dont think that's too much to ask from a first world country.

    I'm curious, how do you know that he had ever worked?

    Plenty of people in jobcentres here probably couldn't tell the difference between retirement and their current lives...


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  • #72
    katiek102010
    Registered Users Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭katiek102010


    Ray Palmer wrote: »
    I don't believe that for a second. If what you said is true she easily qualifies for disability benefits. They will even provide money to adapt her housing through the HSE.

    The HSE don't cover the UK. It is the UK system we are talking about


  • #73
    myshirt
    Registered Users Posts: 5,245 ✭✭✭myshirt


    OSI wrote: »
    Any chance of a reliable source?

    I don't really see the issue with his age to be honest. Plenty of people dying in their 20s every day, should we all retire at 19?

    I admire you spirit but it would take some minister for finance to deliver that!


  • #74
    nkl12xtw5goz70
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,497 ✭✭✭nkl12xtw5goz70


    Scoundrel wrote: »
    The deceased reportedly suffered from diabetes and was clearly not well, but officials at the centre had nonetheless deemed him ‘fit for work.’

    Having diabetes doesn't mean you can't work.


  • #75
    realitykeeper
    Registered Users Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭realitykeeper


    katiek102010 wrote: »
    https://theliberal.ie/man-dies-inside-a-job-centre-shortly-after-being-deemed-fit-for-work/amp/

    Over the last few years UK have been increasing the retirement age. It is currently 65 years 6 months and due to increase again on 1st Jan.

    The poor man died just after he was declared fit to work.

    He's not the first and won't be the last. This is the system our current government are keen to bring in here.

    I would like to see the abolition of forced retirement.


  • #76
    blueshade
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 428 ✭✭blueshade


    OSI wrote: »
    Any chance of a reliable source?

    I don't really see the issue with his age to be honest. Plenty of people dying in their 20s every day, should we all retire at 19?

    Not about this particular case but a few years ago there was a programme on British TV, not sure if it was panorama, but it was about how the government was sending people on disability payments or who had made a claim for disability payments, to Health Experts who were being paid bonuses for every person they took off benefits. It came out because of a whistleblower exposing what was going on.

    The emphasis was on cutting numbers, it didn't matter how ill someone was. They had stopped taking a claimants GP's opinion into account too. Benefit payments in Britain are much lower than in Ireland. The people working in these assessment centres aren't patient centred, they are employed with the specific aim of cutting numbers. Now when they receive bonuses for cutting numbers the emphasis is on personal enrichment not honest assessment.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/may/24/scandal-block-disabled-people-benefits-access-assessments

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/benefits-uk-disability-assessment-company-report-finds-government-cuts-a8208271.html

    These are just a couple of articles on the current system. Many people who receive payments are from low income backgrounds and who won't appeal if they aren't granted the payment. I think people working in Job Centres have to put up with a lot of personal abuse and are under a huge amount of pressure so I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't notice. It isn't there fault that the Medical Assessment side of things is fooked up.


  • #77
    Drifter50
    Registered Users Posts: 617 ✭✭✭Drifter50


    realitykeeper wrote: »
    I would like to see the abolition of forced retirement.

    So how does a person who is worn out get to retire. So long as he /she are not ill then they have to keep going to work. Its hard to survive on €200 odd per week


  • #78
    wakka12
    Registered Users Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    Well, I cant say I agree its the right thing that the age of retirement is increasing. But at the same time, it seems like youre making out that 65 year olds are frail oul grannies and grandads incapable of it. 65 is just out of middle age and in the 21st century the vast majority of 65 year olds are completely healthy and able bodied, a woman that age who looks after her health could easily have a third of her life still ahead of her. That man in the article is an exception and was probably simply an unhealthy person,his age was quite irrelevant, it is very unusual to die at 65 and I doubt the fact that he was working had much if any influence on his death. Honestly if he was retired Id imagine he would have still died at that age anyway.


  • #79
    blueshade
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 428 ✭✭blueshade


    Drifter50 wrote: »
    So how does a person who is worn out get to retire. So long as he /she are not ill then they have to keep going to work. Its hard to survive on €200 odd per week

    Here you have to retire at 65 then claim Job Seekers benefit for a year until you reach pension age. The Job Centre pretends that you're seeking a job, you pretend to be looking for a job and all the while you've been forced to retire from your job losing a stable income and now reduced to 200 euro a week. It's a fooking farce. A lot of people would like to continue to work or maybe to work part time but they're forced out.


  • #80
    Drifter50
    Registered Users Posts: 617 ✭✭✭Drifter50


    blueshade wrote: »
    Here you have to retire at 65 then claim Job Seekers benefit for a year until you reach pension age. The Job Centre pretends that you're seeking a job, you pretend to be looking for a job and all the while you've been forced to retire from your job losing a stable income and now reduced to 200 euro a week. It's a fooking farce. A lot of people would like to continue to work or maybe to work part time but they're forced out.

    Also a lot of people are so worn out by 60 /65 they would love to retire but they have to keep working to pay the mortgage \bills etc etc.
    How can anyone think its a good idea to force someone to retire when its clear they are not going to be able to pay their way without a job, then lose their house, then be forced into asking the state to look after them. Thats a mess and its starting to happen all over the shop. Does`nt sound to me that there is many posters hear who have had to face harsh reality of life which is being forced to look for a job again after the age of 50 and face continued rejection from 25 year olds who are interviewing them.

    Try looking for a job in retail, either they are looking for a 20 year old aspiring actress from Madrid or an IT consultant from India. The rest of us locals don`t stand a chance


  • #81
    blueshade
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 428 ✭✭blueshade


    Drifter50 wrote: »
    Also a lot of people are so worn out by 60 /65 they would love to retire but they have to keep working to pay the mortgage \bills etc etc.
    How can anyone think its a good idea to force someone to retire when its clear they are not going to be able to pay their way without a job, then lose their house, then be forced into asking the state to look after them. Thats a mess and its starting to happen all over the shop. Does`nt sound to me that there is many posters hear who have had to face harsh reality of life which is being forced to look for a job again after the age of 50 and face continued rejection from 25 year olds who are interviewing them.

    Try looking for a job in retail, either they are looking for a 20 year old aspiring actress from Madrid or an IT consultant from India. The rest of us locals don`t stand a chance

    Exactly. That or they want agency staff or youngsters who'll work on zero hours contracts for peanuts.


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  • #82
    realitykeeper
    Registered Users Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭realitykeeper


    Drifter50 wrote: »
    So how does a person who is worn out get to retire. So long as he /she are not ill then they have to keep going to work. Its hard to survive on €200 odd per week

    Some people will be worn out at an earlier age than others but why force someone to retire if they don`t want to. People who work longer can opt to pay into a pension and increase their income when they choose to retire. Many of those who cannot work beyond 65 have made poor lifestyle choices by smoking/drinking and such. That is their fault.


  • #83
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,779 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    realitykeeper wrote:
    Some people will be worn out at an earlier age than others but why force someone to retire if they don`t want to. People who work longer can opt to pay into a pension and increase their income when they choose to retire. Many of those who cannot work beyond 65 have made poor lifestyle choices by smoking/drinking and such. That is their fault.


    I'd be interested to see the actually statistics you observed to make such an opinion, can you point me towards them? Thank you


  • #84
    oLoonatic
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭oLoonatic


    Article on the liberal, no thanks.


  • #85
    Infini
    Registered Users Posts: 4,573 ✭✭✭Infini


    Liberal = Automatic ignore for being utter guttertrash, they even beat out the Daily Fail and thats an achievement in itself.


  • #86
    Drifter50
    Registered Users Posts: 617 ✭✭✭Drifter50


    realitykeeper wrote: »
    Some people will be worn out at an earlier age than others but why force someone to retire if they don`t want to. People who work longer can opt to pay into a pension and increase their income when they choose to retire. Many of those who cannot work beyond 65 have made poor lifestyle choices by smoking/drinking and such. That is their fault.

    Where do you get this sort of idea from ? Like I said most people work because of necessity in order to pay their bills / mortgage / kids education etc etc. A percentage of people work for altruistic reasons or because heaven forbid that they like it. Also most people in this position are so cash strapped that paying their mortgage/rent/bills etc is taking all their income and some more, the idea if paying into a pension or AVI`s I think they are called are so completely off the scale that its ridiculous to suggest. Your earnings potential goes downhill for most after the age of 40 and even more rapidly after the age of 50. As for smoking and drinking, hah. Would they wish they could afford spare cash to but smokes, remember a 20 pack is €13 now and most drinks are €6/€7. So on the rare occasions they ( a couple mind ) can get out to socialise in a pub they need €50 for 3 drinks. Try taking that out of your state pension.

    Yep, I thought so.


  • #87
    Steer55
    Closed Accounts Posts: 226 ✭✭Steer55


    I knew a person once (back in the good times) at age 58, who got a 20 year mortgage for €150,000. I asked them did they not think how this money would be paid back, considering they were 7 years from retirement and the answer was, shure they tried to get me to to borrow €200,000 but I refused. No one should ever get themselves into such a position where they will have to carry a mortgage into their mid sixties or later.


  • #88
    Drifter50
    Registered Users Posts: 617 ✭✭✭Drifter50


    Steer55 wrote: »
    I knew a person once (back in the good times) at age 58, who got a 20 year mortgage for €150,000. I asked them did they not think how this money would be paid back, considering they were 7 years from retirement and the answer was, shure they tried to get me to to borrow €200,000 but I refused. No one should ever get themselves into such a position where they will have to carry a mortgage into their mid sixties or later.
    In an ideal world Yes, but remember the mess we were all in 10/12 years ago. That tore the rugs out from under a lot of people. I have a mortgage that will end when I am 71


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