The Fishal Olympics Boxing Thread

sligobhoy67 · 09-08-2008 10:43am

sweet boxing from Egan - definitely a trip - Egans ankle was caught on the instep of Jacksons foot.

Looks like he could get through to the finals - that 88/1 that I found doesnt look so bad now!

the Nigeria v Ghana fight was entertaining - I thought the Nigerian was cruising until he got tagged.

Missed the first four fights - anyone see Estada or DeGale?

Dodge · 09-08-2008 11:13am

sligobhoy67 wrote: »

Missed the first four fights - anyone see Estada or DeGale?

DeGale looked decent. He was 3-2 down after first round but stepped up and won well

Estrada fight was awkward. Really scrappy affair. He won easily but didn't impress

DubCul · 09-08-2008 11:46am

Egans next opponent didn't look great

FrankGrimes · 09-08-2008 12:20pm

Good man Egan, fair play and hope it gives the rest of the lads a bit of momentum to perform to the best of their abilities - that's all we can ask for and here's hoping their capable of medalling.

colly10 · 09-08-2008 1:42pm

Anyone know when RTE are showing more of the boxing today? It shows up in the listing when you click i, but im bored out of my mind here watching smimming waiting for them to show boxing.

cowzerp · 09-08-2008 1:56pm

i think most of our lads could medal, even joyce and barnes, it all depends on there form and there opponents form too!

joyce had trouble with his opponent before but if he beats him then its up in the air, barnes is still an unknown quantity and it remains to be seen how far he could go!

the rest can definetly medal if there on top of there games..who'd of said carruth would win gold and beat hernandez in the final?

Big Ears · 09-08-2008 2:22pm

cowzerp wrote: »

i think most of our lads could medal, even joyce and barnes, it all depends on there form and there opponents form too!

joyce had trouble with his opponent before but if he beats him then its up in the air, barnes is still an unknown quantity and it remains to be seen how far he could go!

the rest can definetly medal if there on top of there games..who'd of said carruth would win gold and beat hernandez in the final?

Joyce was beaten comfortably twice by Gyula Kate, 23-7 and 32-17. Those are huge point differences and in reality he has only a slightly better chance of upsetting World Championships and 2 time European Bronze medal winner as Julius Jackson had of beating Kenny Egan today.

Carruth mightn't have been favourite to win a Gold medal in 1992, but he had won a Bronze medal at the World Championships in 1989. He was always in with a good chance of a medal and an outside chance of Gold.

I'm fairly sure neither Barnes nor Joyce will be picking up a medal, Egan I'm pretty hopeful for after a great draw and while Sutherland and Nevin will both have to face Silver medal winners from the World Championships other than that their draws are fine. Sutherland is capable of getting revenge on Blanco but would rightfully be an underdog. Who knows what Nevin is really capable of.

cowzerp · 09-08-2008 2:51pm

Big Ears wrote: »

Joyce was beaten comfortably twice by Gyula Kate, 23-7 and 32-17. Those are huge point differences and in reality he has only a slightly better chance of upsetting World Championships and 2 time European Bronze medal winner as Julius Jackson had of beating Kenny Egan today.

i know that but if he gets through thats a major obstacle out of his way, and his odds will dramatically drop-i know he swimming againmst the tide but it would not be the 1st time fighters have raised there game for events such as the olympics! fingers crossed i'd say!

sligobhoy67 · 09-08-2008 2:53pm

cowzerp wrote: »

i know that but if he gets through thats a major obstacle out of his way, and his odds will dramatically drop-i know he swimming againmst the tide but it would not be the 1st time fighters have raised there game for events such as the olympics! fingers crossed i'd say!

who just beat regining world champion Abbos Atoev in his first fight???????? :eek::eek::D;)

walshb · 10-08-2008 8:18am

Joyce won 9-5 in a good fight. He boxed lovely and has a lovely style, however, he looked tired from rd 3 to the final bell.

I thought Atoev in the 81 kg weight was a silver medalist in Chicago?

DubCul · 10-08-2008 8:51am

Very good win by Joyce, well worth getting up at 7.30 to see.

Dodge · 10-08-2008 9:45am

walshb wrote: »

I thought Atoev in the 81 kg weight was a silver medalist in Chicago?

No, he beat Beterbiyev 20-17 for gold. It was a bit of a shock at the time.

Fabulous win for Joyce. Up against Diaz of the Dominican Republic in the last 16

walshb · 10-08-2008 10:54am

You are correct. Damn commentators said he was a world silver medalist from Chicago.
I wasn't overly impressed at all with him. He lost yesterday to the Tajikistan fighter
There have been a few commentary errors regarding stats in the games so far, I have noticed

ROCKMAN · 10-08-2008 12:04pm

Two great results so far, Joyce a very good performance , This fight was won in the locker room, a big hats off to the coaching staff , They came up with a great tactical plan and far play to Joyce for executing it perfectly.

As for the commentators , Magee is making my ears bleed

Anyone catch England's Billy joe Saunders fight . Very impressive for a 18 year old against top class opponent , OK he has a very hard draw ,with a Cuban up next for him , but I think he would be one of the Stars of the games.

walshb · 10-08-2008 12:12pm

ROCKMAN wrote: »

Two great results so far, Joyce a very good performance , This fight was won in the locker room, a big hats off to the coaching staff , They came up with a great tactical plan and far play to Joyce for executing it perfectly.

As for the commentators , Magee is making my ears bleed

Anyone catch England's Billy joe Saunders fight . Very impressive for a 18 year old against top class opponent , OK he has a very hard draw ,with a Cuban up next for him , but I think he would be one of the Stars of the games.

Agreed about Magee. He is so bad. I listened to his commentary on Egan and it was dreadful, lacking any passion and info. He didn't even update us as the scores were piling up.
I think it's time for Jimmy to hang up his gloves, pardon the pun; but he's a little muddled I think and it's making for poor commentary.

cowzerp · 10-08-2008 1:19pm

Have to agree with you's on magee!
1 lad got knocked out and magee was saying its bad for boxing!
its boxing, the aim is to knock out your opponent, maybe he thinks these lads dont feel the shots.

i think he's a nice guy but he has to go, he's nothing to do with boxing either..

walshb · 10-08-2008 1:22pm

Paul, although I think Magee should be gone now, did you know boxing is his real passion and favorite sport and his number 1 sports athlete ever is Ali. He has huge admiration for the game and has been years covering it in the commentary box, however, lately he is becoming a bit farcical!

cowzerp · 10-08-2008 1:28pm

yeah i agree, its clear he's a fan but his knowledge is quite poor and he just sounds like your grandad doing commentary in your living room!

ps, I hate the computer scoring, it misses so many good punches, ring back the paper scoring...:(

walshb · 10-08-2008 1:31pm

Yes, he is muddled at this stage I think. The comp scoring I never liked and it's so unfair at times. Guys giving it their absolute all and almost winning, to be then told they scored maybe 2 points. Disgraceful!!

The most annoying part is when say a boxer gives his opponent a count in a rd that is close. The count given may not even register a score, the receiver of the count gets a rest and can still win the rd.

On paper, if you gave your opponnent a count in a rd that was close, you definitely won the rd by at least 1 point and possibly 2 points

DubCul · 10-08-2008 1:36pm

If you were around during paper scoring you would never want it back.

Judging was as biased as the Eurovision song contest:eek:

walshb · 10-08-2008 1:42pm

DubCul wrote: »

If you were around during paper scoring you would never want it back.

Judging was as biased as the Eurovision song contest:eek:

I was around for both and IMO, the paper, though far from perfect too, is better than the comp and fairer. I see far too many instances with the comp where boxers are scoring great shots and they are NOT registering. Body shots hardly ever count and like I mentioned above, a standing count might not even score a point; which is ridiculous.

If they brought in a rule that a count resulted in an automatic 2 point score and the actual score, if registered, then it may be a whole lot better!

nacho libre · 10-08-2008 4:16pm

cowzerp wrote: »

yeah i agree, its clear he's a fan but his knowledge is quite poor and he just sounds like your grandad doing commentary in your living room!

ps, I hate the computer scoring, it misses so many good punches, ring back the paper scoring...:(

yes, it's why i'm not a huge fan of Olympic boxing rght now. I was watching a fight today where a man was landing with good jabs and yet he was getting no points for it. Annoying to watch.

Big Ears · 10-08-2008 4:30pm

Well John Joe Joyce showed me, I was giving the lad no chance based on previous form but he fought fantastically today better than any time ive seen him(granted I've only seen him a handful of times).

I think the cautious scoring of officials will help the Irish boxers, Sutherland may really benefit from this as a lot of his scoring shots are very clear where he may concede points from light shots. While the others mightn't be suited to this quite as much as Sutherland I still think it will benefit them over trigger happy judges.

It is a bit ridiculous at times though, you feel so sorry for some guys not scoring points when landing clean hard accurate shots. I thought the Namibian Kensuto possibly should have got the decision over Balanov. While Balanov is obviously the technically more gifted fighter, I thought Kasuto landed more numerous good hard shots and should of won.

Walshb I agree that there should be a points bonus for flooring a guy and for a standing count aswell. Maybe one for standing count, two for a knockdown.

'its boxing, the aim is to knock out your opponent, maybe he thinks these lads dont feel the shots.'

Don't tell the IOC that, after all these are bouts nowdays not fights and they'd much rather think of the amateurs as human fencing rather than a pugilistic contest.

I have to say I wasn't impressed with Demetrius Andrade the US Gold medal favourite at Welterweight. The Georgian really made it tough for him, and fair play to that guy too. Not only is he a pretty decent fighter but to put on a performance like that while your country is in serious conflict back home takes a lot of mental strength and he showed in the fight that he has bags of that.

walshb · 10-08-2008 5:00pm

The problem with the knockdown is it is dubious at times. If a man slips and the ref fails to notice and claims a KD, then that is unfair.

I think it is open for too much error. With the count, the ref almost always gets it right and steps in when a heavy shot or combo stuns an opponent bad, then again, I have seen counts in boxing all because a fighters head snapped back from a single shot, big deal:rolleyes:; it is still only a punch landing

It is strange really. There is no real solution as the ref can play such a part in a bout, and if MY RULE was brought in, it may well lead to further problems, like the ones I mentioned!

Hero Of College · 10-08-2008 6:49pm

Three problems with the Amateurs

1. 4X2. Its rubbish. Bring back 3 Threes.

2. The Computer. Its flawed, badly.

3. Its bent.

The Ukrainian I saw fight a Chinese guy.....he had to land 5 to get one. There was an African kid fighting a Mongol today...the African would throw 5, land 2, get nothing, and then the Mongol would fart and rack up points.

Its rotten.

5 judges each handing in a 10-9 card at the end. Use professional judges too. Its the only way.

alanceltic · 10-08-2008 8:09pm

Fair played to JJJ, i got a tenner on him to gold at 201:1, he has a sniff of a chance now. As for Jimmy Magee, what you guys need to understand is that for the vast majority of RTE's audience they are not boxing fans and Magees shortcomings to a boxing fan wouldnt be there for an average punter, he appeals to the middle of the road punter, like it or not,,, but I have to say that he isnt as bad as he is for the pro fights. Im fairly impressed with RTE's coverage, they are showing plenty of fights and the highlights on their website are very handy,,,,thumbs up from me..

FrankGrimes · 10-08-2008 8:52pm

Yep, good man JJJ you did yourself proud - no matter what happens from here on in beating an opponent in the Olympics that has beaten you in the past deserves much respect as it means you've conquered the mental aspect that is the ruin of so many strong competitors (e.g. the Irish guy in the shooting). Fingers crossed he drives on from here and keeps boxing clever to surprise us all with a medal.

Magee does wreck my head sometimes but other times I can see why someone with only a passing interest in boxing would like him but he is a bit off his game at the moment. I was watching a very handy Croatian beat a very, very weak Samoan at light-heavy. Croatian nails him with a big right hook to the temple, Samoan starts staggering about the ring then Jimmy says he may be acting. The lad ends up stumbling across the ring and falling on his face. Jimmy says 'if he's not acting this is very serious'. What the f**k? Who goes to the Olympics to make an eejit of themselves by jumping on the canvas (ref should have caught him btw). Turned out to be one of the worst knockouts I've seen in amateur - he wasn't moving for several minutes and it was pretty concerning, hope he's alright.

The scoring system is a joke, there's got to be a better way. The fact they can't take back a point if the ref warns the boxer for slapping is just inexplicable. It's far too subjective and weighed against throwing combinations - why bother punching in bunches when the old lads judging won't be fast enough on the button to score more than 1 or 2 shots? It brings the sport into disrepute as nobody has any confidence that the best man will win.

Hero Of College · 10-08-2008 9:23pm

FrankGrimes wrote: »

Yep, good man JJJ you did yourself proud - no matter what happens from here on in beating an opponent in the Olympics that has beaten you in the past deserves much respect as it means you've conquered the mental aspect that is the ruin of so many strong competitors (e.g. the Irish guy in the shooting). Fingers crossed he drives on from here and keeps boxing clever to surprise us all with a medal.

Reminded me of Carruth in the Olimps when he won the Gold. He just fought such a smart fight. Well done

FrankGrimes wrote:

Magee does wreck my head sometimes but other times I can see why someone with only a passing interest in boxing would like him but he is a bit off his game at the moment. I was watching a very handy Croatian beat a very, very weak Samoan at light-heavy. Croatian nails him with a big right hook to the temple, Samoan starts staggering about the ring then Jimmy says he may be acting. The lad ends up stumbling across the ring and falling on his face. Jimmy says 'if he's not acting this is very serious'. What the f**k? Who goes to the Olympics to make an eejit of themselves by jumping on the canvas (ref should have caught him btw). Turned out to be one of the worst knockouts I've seen in amateur - he wasn't moving for several minutes and it was pretty concerning, hope he's alright.

I saw that fight but I saw it on the BBC.....Magee should be shot for saying that. That Samoan took an awful lot of clean shots before the stoppage.

FrankGrimes wrote:

The scoring system is a joke, there's got to be a better way. The fact they can't take back a point if the ref warns the boxer for slapping is just inexplicable.

Yeah......Woodhall was alluding to that. Its like nailing a guy with a low blow- even if a point comes off, he's still winded.

FrankGrimes wrote:

It's far too subjective and weighed against throwing combinations - why bother punching in bunches when the old lads judging won't be fast enough on the button to score more than 1 or 2 shots? It brings the sport into disrepute as nobody has any confidence that the best man will win.

One clean right is all I would be looking to land. The only reason you should punch in combo is to stop the other guy getting off. There was a Zambian fighting a Mongolian today and if it was scored on a 10-9 system then the Zambian would have got a draw or at a win. He would chase the Mongolian, rough him up, land a half a dozen times and then get cauught with one and lose the point. Of course the fact that the whole thing is bent doesn't help but for what it is worth Computer scoring is total sh!te.

Dodge · 10-08-2008 10:06pm

The scoring system is the best there is. Seriously, can nobody remember how bad things were before hand. As Big ears said its not about fighting anymore, its about landing clean punches. The amateur and pro game are totally different.

Hero Of College · 11-08-2008 12:33am

Dodge wrote: »

The scoring system is the best there is. Seriously, can nobody remember how bad things were before hand. As Big ears said its not about fighting anymore, its about landing clean punches. The amateur and pro game are totally different.

Yeah- but should they be totally different????

The Fishal Olympics Boxing Thread

Comments