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ram to ewe ratio

  • 22-10-2019 9:42pm
    #1
    Lano Lynn
    Registered Users Posts: 491 ✭✭


    just wondering?

    was with a neighbour today watching rams out with 60 ewes he had noted that both rams mated the same ewes.

    in the past I have used two or more rams with groups of ewes and found some rams split off 'their' ewes and stick to one area in the field.


    now I run single rams with ewes for two cycles and then run a sweeper
    provided all rams are fertile this has worked well enough but if there is an issue with infertility it can be disappointing.


    in the first instance is each ram going to serve approx. 60 ewes
    it can be interesting if the rams are different breeds enabling real comparison between twins born to different sires.

    would it be better to use one ram first cycle then the other for second?


Comments

  • #2
    Green farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,005 ✭✭✭Green farmer


    I throw in one ram for the first week, then leave him there and add a fresh one for the second week. Let them work away. Week 3 throw in another one. That’s for 150 to 180 ewes. Always keeps lambing compact. You can see the influence of the second fellows lambs coming through in the lambing, so you know where you stand. You’ll still see the lambs of the first fellow coming through in later lambs, but not as many. My theory is to keep a fresh ram there at all times whenever the ewes need them.


  • #3
    wrangler
    Registered Users Posts: 11,055 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    Lano Lynn wrote: »
    just wondering?

    was with a neighbour today watching rams out with 60 ewes he had noted that both rams mated the same ewes.

    in the past I have used two or more rams with groups of ewes and found some rams split off 'their' ewes and stick to one area in the field.


    now I run single rams with ewes for two cycles and then run a sweeper
    provided all rams are fertile this has worked well enough but if there is an issue with infertility it can be disappointing.


    in the first instance is each ram going to serve approx. 60 ewes
    it can be interesting if the rams are different breeds enabling real comparison between twins born to different sires.

    would it be better to use one ram first cycle then the other for second?

    Yea, apparently if a ram doesn't smell another ram on a ewe he'll only serve her once. Experts say that a ram will look after 100 + ewes in single sire mating


  • #4
    wrangler
    Registered Users Posts: 11,055 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    Green farmer wrote: »
    I throw in one ram for the first week, then leave him there and add a fresh one for the second week. Let them work away. Week 3 throw in another one. That’s for 150 to 180 ewes. Always keeps lambing compact. You can see the influence of the second fellows lambs coming through in the lambing, so you know where you stand. You’ll still see the lambs of the first fellow coming through in later lambs, but not as many. My theory is to keep a fresh ram there at all times whenever the ewes need them.

    Do the rams not fight when you add another one, our rams even fight after shearing if we don't penthem up for 24hrs


  • #5
    Green farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,005 ✭✭✭Green farmer


    wrangler wrote: »
    Do the rams not fight when you add another one, our rams even fight after shearing if we don't penthem up for 24hrs

    Not so much fight, because they know each other well, but I notice whichever ram is dominant, will try and block the other lad from servicing a ewe. But with the amount of ewes in the field, there’s loads to go around. It’s more trying to make sure the rams don’t get tired and leave ewes unserved.


  • #6
    Bleating Lamb
    Registered Users Posts: 4,513 ✭✭✭Bleating Lamb


    Green farmer wrote: »
    Not so much fight, because they know each other well, but I notice whichever ram is dominant, will try and block the other lad from servicing a ewe. But with the amount of ewes in the field, there’s loads to go around. It’s more trying to make sure the rams don’t get tired and leave ewes unserved.

    Would there not be a danger that the first ram in with the big bunch of ewes would be ‘worn out’ after a week trying to serve them alone?

    What breeds of rams do you use?
    Way I work (not extolling virtues if it by any means)....is I let out the rams individually with around 40 ewes each.Paint chests with raddle.After 14-15 days I change raddle colours and leave rams as are for another fortnight.

    Then I swop the rams around just to cover off for scenario that one was infertile and change the raddle colour again,.
    Generally end up with a good compact lambing that lasts no longer than 3 weeks.


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  • #7
    Green farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,005 ✭✭✭Green farmer


    Bleating Lamb wrote: »
    Would there not be a danger that the first ram in with the big bunch of ewes would be ‘worn out’ after a week trying to serve them alone?

    What breeds of rams do you use?
    .

    The other way of looking at it is, If their worn out, they won’t be fighting each other. Also not all the ewes will come into season together. As others were saying, often see two or more rams tipping each ewe, repeatedly for the first day or two, until they tire abit. This year I’m using charolais rams and also trailing a Easycare on a separate small bunch to give the option of replacements.


  • #8
    Lano Lynn
    Registered Users Posts: 491 ✭✭Lano Lynn


    Green farmer wrote: »
    I throw in one ram for the first week, then leave him there and add a fresh one for the second week. Let them work away. Week 3 throw in another one. That’s for 150 to 180 ewes. Always keeps lambing compact. You can see the influence of the second fellows lambs coming through in the lambing, so you know where you stand. You’ll still see the lambs of the first fellow coming through in later lambs, but not as many. My theory is to keep a fresh ram there at all times whenever the ewes need them.

    in what way ?


  • #9
    eorna
    Registered Users Posts: 408 ✭✭eorna


    Is it true that if you have more than 1 ram in the field you will get more lambs, as the ewes be covered more times or just an old wives tale??


  • #10
    Green farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,005 ✭✭✭Green farmer


    Lano Lynn wrote: »
    in what way ?

    Sorry Lano, just meant it gives you different mile stones, that you see during lambing. For the first 1/3 of lambing you’d see Lleyn. when you got to the 2/3 mark, you’d see charly lambs dropping. Then a week later, you’d see another breed and you knew you were nearly finished.


  • #11
    Lano Lynn
    Registered Users Posts: 491 ✭✭Lano Lynn


    eorna wrote: »
    Is it true that if you have more than 1 ram in the field you will get more lambs, as the ewes be covered more times or just an old wives tale??

    as a ram vendor I firmly believe the old wives
    and coupled with the maxim that a u should pay 6 to 10 times the lamb price on a ram

    so buyers please buy at least twice as many rams


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  • #12
    Lano Lynn
    Registered Users Posts: 491 ✭✭Lano Lynn


    Green farmer wrote: »
    Sorry Lano, just meant it gives you different mile stones, that you see during lambing. For the first 1/3 of lambing you’d see Lleyn. when you got to the 2/3 mark, you’d see charly lambs dropping. Then a week later, you’d see another breed and you knew you were nearly finished.

    does the fact that there are less sheep in the shed not indicate u r nearly finished:D

    but know what u mean though I withdrew all my white rams and turned out a black ram yet I had almost a full week of white lambs being born after the first black lamb was born.


  • #13
    Green farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,005 ✭✭✭Green farmer


    Lano Lynn wrote: »
    does the fact that there are less sheep in the shed not indicate u r nearly finished:D

    .

    I got too tired and too old for that type of work. These days they just them do the work themselves out in the field.


  • #14
    Lambman
    Registered Users Posts: 1,041 ✭✭✭Lambman


    First year here putting 2 rams out at the start together here and it's going horrible slow. Must be the ewes as I never seen the 2 texel fighting or stopping each other from tipping. Have charollais running with hoggets then and there also very slow he has a ram lamb with him that I never put a marker on as didn't see any point as charollais is fertility tested anyway.


  • #15
    wrangler
    Registered Users Posts: 11,055 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    Lambman wrote: »
    First year here putting 2 rams out at the start together here and it's going horrible slow. Must be the ewes as I never seen the 2 texel fighting or stopping each other from tipping. Have charollais running with hoggets then and there also very slow he has a ram lamb with him that I never put a marker on as didn't see any point as charollais is fertility tested anyway.

    When did you put out the rams with the ewes
    You can be unlucky in that the ewes were on heat the week before you introduced the rams.


  • #16
    Lambman
    Registered Users Posts: 1,041 ✭✭✭Lambman


    Them 2 groups Saturday the 5th no repairs so far off the ones that did tip and the rest coming better now this week which should be start off 2nd cycle.


  • #17
    JayBally
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭JayBally


    I only have a small flock of 30 ewes i have a milford RAM lamb and a Charollais Ram lambs running in two separate groups of 15 - do Ram lambs produce the same amount of lambs per ewe as a mature ram?


    Also how long would you wait before joining the two groups?


    Does anyone here change the colour of the raddle weekly?



  • #18
    rushestofork
    Registered Users Posts: 2 ✭rushestofork


    My plan is to put the 3 rams I have ,2x hoggets and a 3yr old out together. Thing is I have only 35 ewes. What would people's opinion be on the pros and cons? They're well settled in together for a couple of months at this stage. My aim is to get everything wrapped up as quickly as possible but what are the dangers people might see in it?



  • #19
    rushestofork
    Registered Users Posts: 2 ✭rushestofork


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118046386#Comment_118046386

    I never seen a noticeable difference in litter size between ram lambs and rams but probably wouldn't have a big enough sample to give you a definite answer.

    If it was me I'd switch rams after first cycle then join for third if they are use to each other. Hopefully not be too much to be fighting over at that stage anyway. If however you see one ram covering alot in the second cycle maybe let him in with the lot.

    As to colour change at the end of each cycle is plenty 16-17 days. But I have done it more often to try batch better at lambing. Also have done it weekly some years as the weekend was my only chance to do it. Trouble might be getting enough colours that'll not just turn into an indistinguishable mess



  • #20
    Jd310
    Registered Users Posts: 59 ✭✭Jd310


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118048499#Comment_118048499

    Very little id think, its ideal to run an uneven number of rams as if two were fighting one another the other ram would be tipping a ewe in heat which could be missed by the two rams too busy fighting.



  • #21
    Tileman
    Registered Users Posts: 1,126 ✭✭✭Tileman


    I agree I’ve 3 rana but put small few with one belcare as trying to get replacements from them. Two other Charolais with main flock and although they are together all year older lad spends all day knocking the other lad off the ewes.

    odd number better off



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