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Hamas mass-murderer Ahlam al-Tamimi

135678

Comments

  • #62
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,966 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    political analyst wrote: »
    The difference is that Israeli military operations were not intended to kill civilians -


    ...in my eye. You've heard of the policy "mowing the grass"? When Israel decides to incur into Gaza, do you wonder why they give the operations names like "Days of Penitence?"

    political analyst wrote: »
    I did no such thing. It's possible that the sharpshooter was aiming that militants who were throwing missiles and thus didn't intend to hit the wheelchair-bound person.


    So you support lads chucking a few stones being gunned down? Do you think they should do the same in NI when trouble breaks out?

    ...yet, he managed to miss by hitting a civillian square in the head. It's a defining feature of the IDF over decades that their misses with direct rifle fire nearly always hit in the head. Like the good old days in Gaza, when one of the best ways to get killed was to mark yourself out as a UN worker. Their heads seemed to be bullet magnets too.
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/suffolk/4534620.stm


    Shooting those who mark themselves as civillians or medics is a proud tradition that continues to this day
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/27/israeli-soldiers-kill-teenage-palestinian-medic-near-bethlehem





    Also schoolgirls seem to be legitimate targets

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/oct/06/israel



    https://www.smh.com.au/world/middle-east/palestinian-family-blames-israeli-sniper-for-deaths-of-two-children-20040524-gdizh5.html



    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/nov/24/israel


  • #63
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,966 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    political analyst wrote: »
    It wouldn't have happened if the Arab nations hadn't tried to destroy Israel. Israel didn't start the conflict and thus can't be the aggressor.




    Nonsense. It's been colonising the area since 1967 - an act of aggression and colonialism.


    political analyst wrote: »
    I


    Israel's self-defence is not thuggery.


    ...building semi-detatched housing in occupied land is "self defence" now?


    Israels actions are the ugly face of colonialism, the best comparison lying with Apartheid era South Africa. There are two tiers of laws and treatment for those living in the occupied territories - one for the colonists and one for the colonised.


  • #64
    Royal Irish
    Registered Users Posts: 2,401 ✭✭✭Royal Irish


    One could argue that because Israel has mandatory conscription and everyone is expected to fight even after their time in the military if needs be, that no Israeli is a civilian.


  • #65
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,966 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    The apartheid nature of the regime, writ large

    The full position paper please support our work
    donate
    Collective punishment contradicts the right to personal liberty and the right to fair trial. It is prohibited by international humanitarian law, which grants the military commander the authority to act in the occupied territory, and which establishes that punishment of an offense must be grounded in individual responsibility.
    This position paper presents two cases that vary in time, place, cause and effect. In both cases, the Israeli army collectively penalizes a large population that did nothing wrong and denies innocent people their right to freedom of movement.
    https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/files.yesh-din.org/Collective+Punishment/Collective+punishment+English.pdf


  • #66
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,966 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    The slow but steady annexation of Palestinians land to the benefit of Israeli colonists


    Soon after the Palestinian Authority put the cities and towns of the occupied West Bank under COVID-19 lockdown in late March, Amer Abu Hijleh received a call from a fellow farmer telling him that Israeli settlers were working his land.
    Abu Hijleh, 56, hung up and immediately left his home in the village of Deir Istiya, and drove toward his land, located in Area C of the West Bank next to the Israeli settlement of Yakir. Upon arrival, Abu Hijleh discovered that settlers had begun digging a hole in the ground after uprooting some shrubbery.
    https://www.972mag.com/settlers-area-c-occupation/?fbclid=IwAR0QvqgAztwkAkRSJVI_q6bA5_85oRd8KlSPfu5dyR4dkNFc1gpCDzAkkyA


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  • #67
    rapul
    Registered Users Posts: 1,038 ✭✭✭rapul


    All I can say is ****ing disgraceful.

    "why are you angry it's just a swimming pool for our children"

    On stolen land.


  • #68
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,436 ✭✭✭political analyst


    Odhinn wrote: »
    ...in my eye. You've heard of the policy "mowing the grass"? When Israel decides to incur into Gaza, do you wonder why they give the operations names like "Days of Penitence?"





    So you support lads chucking a few stones being gunned down? Do you think they should do the same in NI when trouble breaks out?

    ...yet, he managed to miss by hitting a civillian square in the head. It's a defining feature of the IDF over decades that their misses with direct rifle fire nearly always hit in the head. Like the good old days in Gaza, when one of the best ways to get killed was to mark yourself out as a UN worker. Their heads seemed to be bullet magnets too.
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/suffolk/4534620.stm


    Shooting those who mark themselves as civillians or medics is a proud tradition that continues to this day
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/27/israeli-soldiers-kill-teenage-palestinian-medic-near-bethlehem





    Also schoolgirls seem to be legitimate targets

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/oct/06/israel



    https://www.smh.com.au/world/middle-east/palestinian-family-blames-israeli-sniper-for-deaths-of-two-children-20040524-gdizh5.html



    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/nov/24/israel

    If Palestinian protestors don't want themselves or medics to be shot then they shouldn't throw stones.

    By the way, Northern Ireland was - and still is - part of a democratic country, the UK. Gaza is merely part of a failed state with a nominally recognised but corrupt government. Being Palestinian is an artificial national identity that had no meaningful existence before the Six-Day War.


  • #69
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,436 ✭✭✭political analyst


    Odhinn wrote: »
    Nonsense. It's been colonising the area since 1967 - an act of aggression and colonialism.






    ...building semi-detatched housing in occupied land is "self defence" now?


    Israels actions are the ugly face of colonialism, the best comparison lying with Apartheid era South Africa. There are two tiers of laws and treatment for those living in the occupied territories - one for the colonists and one for the colonised.

    Occupied from which country? The West Bank hasn't legally belonged to any country since 1948. If the Arab nations hadn't invaded in 1967 ......

    A comparison to apartheid South Africa while claiming the Israeli presence in the West Bank makes no sense because Palestinians in the West Bank (except for Jerusalem) never had Israeli citizenship because they were never residents in recognised Israeli territory but disenfranchised black people in South Africa were recognised as citizens of South Africa.

    As for al-Tamimi, any time she has spoken about her crime when interviewed it is as if she's becoming sexually excited.


  • #70
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,966 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    political analyst wrote: »
    If Palestinian protestors don't want themselves or medics to be shot then they shouldn't throw stones. .


    They shoot and kill anyone they feel like, not just stone throwers, as I showed with a few links there.

    They should lie down then, and be walked over by the occupation forces?
    political analyst wrote: »
    By the way, Northern Ireland was - and still is - part of a democratic country, the UK. Gaza is merely part of a failed state with a nominally recognised but corrupt government. Being Palestinian is an artificial national identity that had no meaningful existence before the Six-Day War.


    A nonsense, as the Palestinian identity pre-dates WW1.

    political analyst wrote: »
    A comparison to apartheid South Africa while claiming the Israeli presence in the West Bank makes no sense because Palestinians in the West Bank (except for Jerusalem) never had Israeli citizenship because they were never residents in recognised Israeli territory but disenfranchised black people in South Africa were recognised as citizens of South Africa.

    Intellectual dishonesty. The population in the West Bank is essentially under Israeli control and occupation, and Israel operates a two tier legal system, settler only areas, roads and so on. It also does nothing to protect palestinians from settler/colonist violence
    https://testimonies.yesh-din.org/en/

    https://www.btselem.org/?fbclid=IwAR1NoFtzUmLe1A5OpBHmgvIvAulkV56DM1fO3v6nH-EX7jhj1qvE8FSQdzo


  • #71
    alchemist33
    Registered Users Posts: 10,969 ✭✭✭✭alchemist33


    political analyst wrote: »
    If Palestinian protestors don't want themselves or medics to be shot then they shouldn't throw stones.

    By the way, Northern Ireland was - and still is - part of a democratic country, the UK. Gaza is merely part of a failed state with a nominally recognised but corrupt government. Being Palestinian is an artificial national identity that had no meaningful existence before the Six-Day War.

    To paraphrase your opening post, what did those medics ever do to the IDF to deserve being killed?

    There's plenty of blame to throw around, and innocents' deaths to mourn, in the middle east, and this sort of hypocrisy is one reason its still going on.


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  • #72
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,436 ✭✭✭political analyst


    alchemist33 wrote: »
    To paraphrase your opening post, what did those medics ever do to the IDF to deserve being killed?

    There's plenty of blame to throw around, and innocents' deaths to mourn, in the middle east, and this sort of hypocrisy is one reason its still going on.

    Nothing - the IDF didn't intend to kill them.

    Hamas and other Palestinian militant groups put them in harm's way. It's like, let's say, if a bank security guard in the US opens fire on a robber and an innocent person is fatally hit by the bullet instead, the robber would be guilty of felony murder.


  • #73
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,436 ✭✭✭political analyst


    Odhinn wrote: »
    They shoot and kill anyone they feel like, not just stone throwers, as I showed with a few links there.

    Those links tell one side of the story.
    Odhinn wrote: »
    They should lie down then, and be walked over by the occupation forces?
    Not lying down in front of bulldozers would be a start.







    Odhinn wrote: »
    A nonsense, as the Palestinian identity pre-dates WW1.

    No difference between them and other Arabs in what was then the Ottoman Empire.


  • #74
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,966 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    political analyst wrote: »
    Those links tell one side of the story.
    They tell about children gunned down by aimed sniper fire. Do please tell me the 'other side'



    political analyst wrote:
    Not lying down in front of bulldozers would be a start.


    Again - what do you suggest they do?




    political analyst wrote: »
    No difference between them and other Arabs in what was then the Ottoman Empire.




    Arab identity is not some homogenous mass.


  • #75
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,966 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    political analyst wrote: »
    Nothing - the IDF didn't intend to kill them.

    Hamas and other Palestinian militant groups put them in harm's way. It's like, let's say, if a bank security guard in the US opens fire on a robber and an innocent person is fatally hit by the bullet instead, the robber would be guilty of felony murder.




    Absolute rubbish.


  • #76
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,983 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    political analyst wrote: »
    If Palestinian protestors don't want themselves or medics to be shot then they shouldn't throw stones.

    nope, murdering someone is not a valid response to stone throwing, suggesting that protesters are responsible for being slaughtered because is victim blaming gibberish.
    the IDF and them alone are the only ones responsible for slaughtering people just because.
    political analyst wrote: »
    By the way, Northern Ireland was - and still is - part of a democratic country, the UK.

    only via the threat of force, and democracy didn't really exist in NI until the last coupl of decades.
    + the british government via their loyalist proxis and the british army were well known for allowing and even facilitating and supporting the killing of civilians.
    so the comparisons are valid.
    political analyst wrote: »
    Gaza is merely part of a failed state with a nominally recognised but corrupt government. Being Palestinian is an artificial national identity that had no meaningful existence before the Six-Day War.

    israel is a state which claims to be democratic, but which is really an aparthide sectarian expansionist state, who's goal is to ultimately take as much land as it can get on the basis of a book told them it belongs to them, who breaches international law on such a level that other countries in the area are made to look reasonable dispite themselves engaging in horific abuses.
    Being israely is an identity that had no meaningful existence before 1948 itself.
    well you did decide to play this game.

    shut down alcohol action ireland now! end MUP today!



  • #77
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,983 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    political analyst wrote: »
    Occupied from which country? The West Bank hasn't legally belonged to any country since 1948. If the Arab nations hadn't invaded in 1967 ......

    A comparison to apartheid South Africa while claiming the Israeli presence in the West Bank makes no sense because Palestinians in the West Bank (except for Jerusalem) never had Israeli citizenship because they were never residents in recognised Israeli territory but disenfranchised black people in South Africa were recognised as citizens of South Africa.

    As for al-Tamimi, any time she has spoken about her crime when interviewed it is as if she's becoming sexually excited.

    if the arab nations hadn't defended themselves in 1967 then chances are israel would have expanded into them, if not then then definitely by now.
    comparison to apartheid South Africa is absolutely valid, because israel decided to steal these people's lands and brutalise them and give them no rights. the fact they aren't israely citizens doesn't invalidate the comparison, the comparison remains valid because the treatment of both outfits against those they deem to be lesser then them because, is similar if not the same.
    political analyst wrote: »
    Nothing - the IDF didn't intend to kill them.

    Hamas and other Palestinian militant groups put them in harm's way. It's like, let's say, if a bank security guard in the US opens fire on a robber and an innocent person is fatally hit by the bullet instead, the robber would be guilty of felony murder.

    except they did, they fired specifically at them.
    the IDF deliberately opened fire on them dispite knowing who they were, they chose to do it.
    there is no comparison between this and your bank robber situation as in america such a situation is a point of law, whereas the IDF are engaging in deliberate breaches of law.

    shut down alcohol action ireland now! end MUP today!



  • #78
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,983 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    political analyst wrote: »
    Those links tell one side of the story.

    they don't, they tell the actual story.
    there is mountains of stuff to show the IDF'S behaviour.
    political analyst wrote: »
    Not lying down in front of bulldozers would be a start.

    a start for what? essentially rolling over and allowing the occupiers to steal everything they own?
    given the bulldozers belonging to the brutalising, occupation forces are coming to demolish these people's homes just because they want the land, then why shouldn't the owners of those homes resist this from happening?
    can i come along with a bulldozer tomorrow and demolish your home and take your land? if i did what would you do about it? what do you think would happen to me if you decided to just do nothing?
    i would definitely be arrested, that is an absolute certainty and rightly so.
    actually, i probably would get shot by the ERU.
    political analyst wrote: »
    No difference between them and other Arabs in what was then the Ottoman Empire.

    ah yes, the old nonsense trope "shur they're all da same begorra"
    well nope, there are many different identities among arab people.

    shut down alcohol action ireland now! end MUP today!



  • #79
    Auguste Comte
    Registered Users Posts: 1,143 ✭✭✭Auguste Comte


    political analyst wrote: »
    If Palestinian protestors don't want themselves or medics to be shot then they shouldn't throw stones.

    Summary execution without trial by state forces for civillian protesters who might throw stones that represent no possible threat to anyone.

    Idf, the terrorist enforcers of a terrorist state.


  • #80
    Auguste Comte
    Registered Users Posts: 1,143 ✭✭✭Auguste Comte


    political analyst wrote: »
    If Palestinian protestors don't want themselves or medics to be shot then they shouldn't throw stones.

    Summary execution without trial by state forces for civillian protesters who might throw stones that represent no possible threat to anyone.

    Idf, the terrorist enforcers of a terrorist state.


  • #81
    Zebra3
    Registered Users Posts: 13,848 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    political analyst wrote: »
    Not lying down in front of bulldozers would be a start.

    Are these the Israeli bulldozers that are outside Israel destroying people's homes?


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  • #82
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,436 ✭✭✭political analyst


    end of the road wrote: »
    nope, murdering someone is not a valid response to stone throwing, suggesting that protesters are responsible for being slaughtered because is victim blaming gibberish.
    the IDF and them alone are the only ones responsible for slaughtering people just because.
    It's not murder - it's justified retaliation against combatants (that's what the stonethrowers are!) in a warzone.

    The protesters are guilty of sheer stupidity. It's obvious that you are antisemitic.


  • #83
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,436 ✭✭✭political analyst


    end of the road wrote: »
    except they did, they fired specifically at them.
    the IDF deliberately opened fire on them dispite knowing who they were, they chose to do it.
    there is no comparison between this and your bank robber situation as in america such a situation is a point of law, whereas the IDF are engaging in deliberate breaches of law.

    There's no credible testimony to support that accusation. What you're saying about the Israel Defence Forces is classic 'blood libel'.


  • #84
    rapul
    Registered Users Posts: 1,038 ✭✭✭rapul


    political analyst wrote: »
    It's not murder - it's justified retaliation against combatants (that's what the stonethrowers are!) in a warzone.

    The protesters are guilty of sheer stupidity. It's obvious that you are antisemitic.

    Ah the oul antisemitic comment comes out, can't say a bad word about the IDF and how they take precise shots at children and medics without that old chestnut, you have lost any credibility.
    Your clearly an Israeli keyboard warrior

    Are children playing on a beach combatants?


  • #85
    Auguste Comte
    Registered Users Posts: 1,143 ✭✭✭Auguste Comte


    political analyst wrote: »
    It's not murder - it's justified retaliation against combatants (that's what the stonethrowers are!) in a warzone.

    Don be silly now. First, it's not a war zone, it's a vicious illegal, hostile occupation. Civillian protesters are not combatants stones or not.


  • #86
    Auguste Comte
    Registered Users Posts: 1,143 ✭✭✭Auguste Comte


    [quote="political

    The protesters are guilty of sheer stupidity. It's obvious that you are antisemitic.[/quote]

    You obviously don't know the difference between antisemitism and anti zionism/facism.


  • #87
    riffmongous
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,623 Mod ✭✭✭✭riffmongous


    political analyst wrote: »
    It's not murder - it's justified retaliation against combatants (that's what the stonethrowers are!) in a warzone.

    The protesters are guilty of sheer stupidity. It's obvious that you are antisemitic.

    One sentence combatants, the next protesters again because you know yourself even how stupid it sounds to refer to them as combatants


  • #88
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,966 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    political analyst wrote: »
    There's no credible testimony to support that accusation. What you're saying about the Israel Defence Forces is classic 'blood libel'.

    We have countless numbers of well documented incidents when the IDF has targeted civillians and children. Theres nothing 'blood libel' about it.

    Do you support the colonisation of the West Bank, Arab East Jerusalem, Golan etc


  • #89
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,983 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    political analyst wrote: »
    It's not murder - it's justified retaliation against combatants (that's what the stonethrowers are!) in a warzone.

    The protesters are guilty of sheer stupidity. It's obvious that you are antisemitic.


    it's murdering of civilian protesters. that is what happened.
    stone throwers and protesters are not combatants, so again victim blaming gibberish.
    the protesters are guilty of stone throwing, nothing more. stone throwing generally isn't being punishable by being murdered in most countries.
    calling out a state for breaching international law via colonisation, land theft, ethnic cleansing and more is not anti-semetic or anti any religion.
    criticising saudi arabia or iran for their abuses would be islamaphobic going on your logic.
    the anti-semetic trope doesn't work any more, nobody is scared any more of being called anti-semetic when they know and everyone else knows they aren't and that is as it should be.
    political analyst wrote: »
    There's no credible testimony to support that accusation. What you're saying about the Israel Defence Forces is classic 'blood libel'.

    it's not classic blood liable, but classic fact.
    the testimony to the fact that they were deliberately killed by the israely army is credible and plenty of it exists.

    shut down alcohol action ireland now! end MUP today!



  • #90
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,436 ✭✭✭political analyst


    riffmongous wrote: »
    One sentence combatants, the next protesters again because you know yourself even how stupid it sounds to refer to them as combatants

    There's peaceful protest and there's violent protest.


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  • #91
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,436 ✭✭✭political analyst


    end of the road wrote: »
    it's murdering of civilian protesters. that is what happened.
    stone throwers and protesters are not combatants, so again victim blaming gibberish.
    the protesters are guilty of stone throwing, nothing more. stone throwing generally isn't being punishable by being murdered in most countries.
    calling out a state for breaching international law via colonisation, land theft, ethnic cleansing and more is not anti-semetic or anti any religion.
    criticising saudi arabia or iran for their abuses would be islamaphobic going on your logic.
    the anti-semetic trope doesn't work any more, nobody is scared any more of being called anti-semetic when they know and everyone else knows they aren't and that is as it should be.



    it's not classic blood liable, but classic fact.
    the testimony to the fact that they were deliberately killed by the israely army is credible and plenty of it exists.

    Stone-throwing is thuggery. Those who were shot got what they deserved.

    As for your comparison to Islamophobia, did the Muslim people as a collective group suffer what the Jewish people suffered in the 1930s and 1940s?


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