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18-02-2020, 09:19   #91
Boredstiff666
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It is that which makes the term 'terrorist' redundant and meaningless.

The whole idea in conflict/war is to be the more effective 'terror'ist. Create enough terror and you win.
This is true in one respect because the V1 and V2 rockets were actually 'terror' weapons........unstoppable bombs which could rain down on civilians anywhere anytime.

Not sure in total war though if civilians would buckle and if they did the war would end.

Besides it didn't work because in the countries the Germans invaded it just galvenised the public against the Germans. Same in the UK. The attitude was give em back what they give us.

So where does the 'terror' element win?

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18-02-2020, 12:45   #92
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I dont doubt anything you say but nobody has ever explained why all these people had such a hatred of Irish people that they would send the army into Ulster on the sheer pretense of stopping catholic people being burnt out of their homes and killed just so they could shoot them at will. Doesn't make any sense at all.

Being as about 30% of the British population at that time was Irish, why all this hate to go to Ireland and kill them?

Regards Bloody Sunday. When there are shots going off. You honestly cant tell where they are coming from. The sound of bullets close to you and ricochets.

It was just racism - and British superiority complex. ''The Irish not fit to govern themselves,' and they are useful cannon fodder in Britain's wars, hardworkers who are good at digging roads etc. You see the same kind of rhetoric and attitude towards the Windrush generation, Gurkas, Asians etc. from Tory Governments.



Can you just get it into your head that the presence of the British Army was requested by the unionist Stormont Government. One of the reasons for Chichester-Clarke's resignation was because Heath/Maudling would not send enough troops to Northern Ireland.



As for Bloody Sunday - Tell that to a court of law if you didn't know what was going on around you. Whats the problem? Is the British justice system not fair and just?
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18-02-2020, 12:48   #93
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I dont know about that. With regards to Dresden and such, the Germans had already targeted British and other countries civilians. Also deliberately making weapons that only targeted civilians.

In NI there was no real NI military. Only a gang of civilians claiming to be something followed by reprisal gangs of civilians claiming to be something.

The UDR were a gang of civilians? Thats a new one!
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18-02-2020, 16:53   #94
 
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Yeah and theres lots of stories about all sorts but the year is 2020. So you can either believe and tear yourself asunder with hate on conspiracies of the past which no one on this planet can prove let alone do anything about................or you can move on and put it to bed.

I would have thought being as those troops had just returned from another hell hole (Aden 1967) that banging around Ulster in a few Landrovers wouldnt be up to much.

Most of those people (anybody involved) now are entering their final years. What can you do? Pursue people to the grave while the leaders get away scot free because they were or now have become politicians........so for some unknown reason are immune.......or move on.

If you are going to go after some soldiers that are almost 80. Then you had better go after every single terrorist as well and not leave anybody out.

I dont know what the answer is but living in the past isnt it.
Fella on Pat Kenny today telling the story of how his eleven year old brother was shot in the back of the head with a plastic bullet from a few feet away as he walked with his hands in his pockets. The man that fired that lied about it and wouldn't let anyone assist the boy as he lay unconscious. That soldier is a child killer and should be pursued and jailed. Should have happened in 1982 but the lapse in time shouldn't let him evade prosecution. The British army is morally repugnant for what they did in the north and other countries
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18-02-2020, 17:04   #95
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Fella on Pat Kenny today telling the story of how his eleven year old brother was shot in the back of the head with a plastic bullet from a few feet away as he walked with his hands in his pockets. The man that fired that lied about it and wouldn't let anyone assist the boy as he lay unconscious. That soldier is a child killer and should be pursued and jailed. Should have happened in 1982 but the lapse in time shouldn't let him evade prosecution. The British army is morally repugnant for what they did in the north and other countries
The IRA put bombs in pubs and killed innocent non political, non military people to pieces. Irish, English, Scots, Welsh, American, and other nationalities. Those people who planted those bombs still walk free. As do the ones who killed children with same.

Where do we go with this?
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18-02-2020, 17:07   #96
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The IRA put bombs in pubs and killed innocent non political, non military people to pieces. Irish, English, Scots, Welsh, American, and other nationalities. Those people who planted those bombs still walk free. As do the ones who killed children with same.

Where do we go with this?
The governments involved lead the way on a full truth recovery process. I mean 'lead it' by fronting up on what their involvement was and who was guilty.
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18-02-2020, 17:17   #97
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The loyalists & British Army did not blow heads off kids, abduct & butcher innocents. At least not before the PIRA came along.

So please, defend the IRA bombing shopping streets in England & killing children?
Or IRA 'Fundraisers' murdering members of AGS.
You do know that there were other organisations & other ways to defend the rights of Catholics in northern Ireland?
Need to look up some history, PIRA didn't exist in 1969! Brits were sent in to protect Catholics from loyalists
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18-02-2020, 17:17   #98
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Ireland should never have been split up . We should all have stayed in the United Kingdom or all have been part of an United ireland . It was a fudge from day one and has caused thousands of deaths on all sides . Why should the people of Armagh and Tyrone live under British rule as opposed to the people of Meath and kildare ?

If many of us lived in Armagh or Tyrone we ourselves would have joined the IRA .
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18-02-2020, 17:23   #99
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Ireland should never have been split up . We should all have stayed in the United Kingdom or all have been part of an United ireland . It was a fudge from day one and has caused thousands of deaths on all sides . Why should the people of Armagh and Tyrone live under British rule as opposed to the people of Meath and kildare ?

If many of us lived in Armagh or Tyrone we ourselves would have joined the IRA .
In 1916 half the country wanted to stop part of the UK.

Ireland is such a mess of wild independence claims and Loyalty to people who dont want to know.

But the idea that Britain just wanted to use Irish people as target practice is a new one.
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18-02-2020, 17:36   #100
 
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In 1916 half the country wanted to stop part of the UK.

Ireland is such a mess of wild independence claims and Loyalty to people who dont want to know.

But the idea that Britain just wanted to use Irish people as target practice is a new one.
The British Army switched from the use of rubber to plastic bullets in tbe late 70s early 80s. They tried to keep quiet the fact that they were testing them on pigs in Britain in case of upsetting the animal rights groups there. Yet had no qualms about maiming, disfiguring and killing children with them in Ireland. They switched even knowing that the new plastic bullets had a much worse impact on victims. If that is not target practice what is
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18-02-2020, 17:39   #101
 
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Originally Posted by Boredstiff666 View Post
The IRA put bombs in pubs and killed innocent non political, non military people to pieces. Irish, English, Scots, Welsh, American, and other nationalities. Those people who planted those bombs still walk free. As do the ones who killed children with same.

Where do we go with this?
Let them be prosecuted in front of a court. If a deal is reached to agree early release for their crimes then that bridge can be crossed. But they need to be prosecuted otherwise let the state acknowledge that they gave their security forces a licence to kill with impunity
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18-02-2020, 17:46   #102
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The British Army switched from the use of rubber to plastic bullets in tbe late 70s early 80s. They tried to keep quiet the fact that they were testing them on pigs in Britain in case of upsetting the animal rights groups there. Yet had no qualms about maiming, disfiguring and killing children with them in Ireland. They switched even knowing that the new plastic bullets had a much worse impact on victims. If that is not target practice what is
Is that just another conspiracy theory?
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18-02-2020, 17:48   #103
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Let them be prosecuted in front of a court. If a deal is reached to agree early release for their crimes then that bridge can be crossed. But they need to be prosecuted otherwise let the state acknowledge that they gave their security forces a licence to kill with impunity
Did not the terrorists kill with impunity? They still walk among us.
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18-02-2020, 17:48   #104
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Is that just another conspiracy theory?
It isn't in essence.
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18-02-2020, 17:54   #105
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MOD: Not up to standard for the History Forum, no sources, just a lot of claims. If anyone is interested in continuing the discussion I'm not against starting a new thread, but it will be heavily moderated since this is such a contentious topic and unsubstantiated claims, soapboxing, or off-topic posts will be removed.
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