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Main driver of two cars?

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  • 11-07-2016 1:00pm
    #1
    Heyzelx
    Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭


    Is it possible to be the main driver of two cars? I'm 18 and I passed my driving test in March. My dad wants to buy me a car but would it be possible for him to be the main driver of my car and his own car and me to just be a named driver on my "own car"? It would significantly reduce my insurance as if I was to be insured under my dad it would cost €1100, but on my own it would be €7000? Does anyone know anything about how this works?


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    #2
    Alanstrainor
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 23,157 Mod ✭✭✭✭Alanstrainor


    Heyzelx wrote: »
    Is it possible to be the main driver of two cars? I'm 18 and I passed my driving test in March. My dad wants to buy me a car but would it be possible for him to be the main driver of my car and his own car and me to just be a named driver on my "own car"? It would significantly reduce my insurance as if I was to be insured under my dad it would cost €1100, but on my own it would be €7000? Does anyone know anything about how this works?

    What you are describing here is called fronting; and insurance companies are well aware of this method to get around expensive insurance for young drivers. So beware committing fraud is all I'll say, it could end very badly.


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    #3
    biko
    Registered Users Posts: 81,223 ✭✭✭✭biko


    7000? Sounds like you're looking at a high-risk car (large engine, import, etc)
    You'd probably be better off getting a car that fits the lower risk bracket and start building your own NCB until you can get a higher end car for a reasonable insurance.


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    #4
    noel100
    Registered Users Posts: 358 ✭✭noel100


    my daughter got a quote 2600 with axa on provisional in her name on 1.1litre when i was added as a name driver it came in at 1650 she has to use the driving safe app.


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    #5
    Liam McPoyle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,846 ✭✭✭✭Liam McPoyle


    Heyzelx wrote: »
    Is it possible to be the main driver of two cars? I'm 18 and I passed my driving test in March. My dad wants to buy me a car but would it be possible for him to be the main driver of my car and his own car and me to just be a named driver on my "own car"? It would significantly reduce my insurance as if I was to be insured under my dad it would cost €1100, but on my own it would be €7000? Does anyone know anything about how this works?

    €1100 on a second car with you as a named driver is fantasy premium amigo and you will not get it.

    The bonus can only be used on one car so taking a second policy means there would be no bonus to use on the new car.

    No bonus + second policy + young driver = you aren't fooling anybody.

    Even if you can actually get an insurer to quote (i garauntee that will prove difficult with the scenario you have outlined) using the oldest trick in the book you will be rated as the main driver because you will be the highest risk.

    You do not have a right to get cheaper insurance, that is something that is earned.

    Take the advice of the previous poster, get a smaller engined car and get it insured in your own name.

    Boxymo offer very competitive prices for first time policy holders so the excuses of old that young driver's cannot get on the road does not wash.


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    #6
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,088 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    Funny how thing like that in Ireland is considered as fronting and being a fraud, etc...
    While at the same time, in Poland thing like that (young unexperienced driver adding parent to a policy to reduce a cost) is commonly used, and very often promoted and advised by insurers.


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    #7
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,231 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    CiniO wrote: »
    Funny how thing like that in Ireland is considered as fronting and being a fraud, etc...
    While at the same time, in Poland thing like that (young unexperienced driver adding parent to a policy to reduce a cost) is commonly used, and very often promoted and advised by insurers.

    Adding a parent to a policy is not the same thing as pretending the policy is theirs. There's no problem with adding a parent.


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    #8
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,088 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    endacl wrote: »
    Adding a parent to a policy is not the same thing as pretending the policy is theirs. There's no problem with adding a parent.

    Well what I meant was, that by adding your parent to a policy, you are able to use their NCB which can be as much as 60% (or even 70% with some insurers).
    And there is no limit of using NCB only on one car like in Ireland, so a parent can use NCB on both their own car, and their son/daughter car at the same time.

    Example. I lived there when I was 19 - bought my first car.
    My dad had his own car, and used to pay about €40 for third party annual policy (that included 60% NCB - without it it would be around €100).
    I was quoted about €150. (normally would be about €120 but there was 25% increase due to my young age).
    By adding my dad to the policy (having policy issued in both our names) we could use his NCB, and therefore was able to reduce premium by 60% so I only paid around €60.


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    #9
    Liam McPoyle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,846 ✭✭✭✭Liam McPoyle


    CiniO wrote: »
    Funny how thing like that in Ireland is considered as fronting and being a fraud, etc...
    While at the same time, in Poland thing like that (young unexperienced driver adding parent to a policy to reduce a cost) is commonly used, and very often promoted and advised by insurers.

    Its considered fronting / fraud in the uk too.

    In what logical way should any insurer allow a young inexperienced driver the benefit of having the same amount of experience as someone that has earned a full bonus themselves?

    It makes no sense whatsoever.


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    #10
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,088 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    Saul T Nutzz wrote: »
    Its considered fronting / fraud in the uk too.
    I know that.
    It's probably has much to do with fact, that both countries have insurance systems which pay lots of attention who actually drives a car (f.e. requirement of having all drivers named on policy, and open driving policies being fairly rare).
    In what logical way should any insurer allow a young inexperienced driver the benefit of having the same amount of experience as someone that has earned a full bonus themselves?

    It makes no sense whatsoever.

    It does. (in Poland anway).
    Person who is willing to sign up for policy together with other person (f.e. father signing up with son, so father's NCB can be used) is putting himself at risk of loosing this NCB
    If son crashes the car, father is going to loose his NCB on both cars (son's and father's).

    Generally as there is no such thing as named drivers, and every policy is open drive allowing anyone with valid driving licence (irrespective of age) to drive a car, insurers can't base premium on risk based on driver, but only on risk of policy holder.
    If there were no claims for many years, that just means that policy holder (vehicle owner - same thing - as it's vehicle owners responsibility to purchase a policy on a car) is responsible in regards of who he let's his car being driven by. And therefore deserves to have NCB.

    If father is happy to give his NCB to son, and risk loosing it in case son crashes, then insurers are happy with that as well.


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    #11
    FrStone
    Registered Users Posts: 720 ✭✭✭FrStone


    I've an issue with this, if the new car is put in your father's name but essentially you will be the main driver, try being honest about that with insurance companies and you will find you won't get a quote. They will tell you that as the car is not in your name you can't be the main driver.

    They can't have it both ways.


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    #12
    Liam McPoyle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,846 ✭✭✭✭Liam McPoyle


    FrStone wrote: »
    I've an issue with this, if the new car is put in your father's name but essentially you will be the main driver, try being honest about that with insurance companies and you will find you won't get a quote. They will tell you that as the car is not in your name you can't be the main driver.

    They can't have it both ways.

    They will tell him the policy should be taken in his own name.....


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    #13
    FrStone
    Registered Users Posts: 720 ✭✭✭FrStone


    Saul T Nutzz wrote: »
    They will tell him the policy should be taken in his own name.....

    I've tried that with both liberty and aviva they will tell you to change the owner of the car. They told me the main driver has to be the owner of the car....


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    #14
    Liam McPoyle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,846 ✭✭✭✭Liam McPoyle


    FrStone wrote: »
    I've tried that with both liberty and aviva they will tell you to change the owner of the car. They told me the main driver has to be the owner of the car....

    Of course the policy holder has to be the registered owner, the only exception is for a spouse / partner ie I could insure my wife's car (she is the registered owner) in my name with no issue.

    It makes no sense to try and get a policy for something you own, in someone else's name.

    What legitimate reason could there be for it?


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    #15
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,088 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    Saul T Nutzz wrote: »
    Of course the policy holder has to be the registered owner, the only exception is for a spouse / partner ie I could insure my wife's car (she is the registered owner) in my name with no issue.

    It makes no sense to try and get a policy for something you own, in someone else's name.

    What legitimate reason could there be for it?

    To buy a policy in someone else's name probably not.
    But to buy a policy and assign someone else as main driver surely yes.

    F.e. older person owns a car, but doesn't feel confident driving anymore, or possibly had licence revoked due to health reasons, so he/she needs someone to drive the car for them. F.e. child, grandson, carer, etc...

    I can't understand why my grandmother (if she lived here) couldn't put me as a main driver on her car, which she doesn't drive herself anymore, but might need someone to do shopping for her, bring her to the doctors, etc...


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    #16
    Liam McPoyle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,846 ✭✭✭✭Liam McPoyle


    CiniO wrote: »
    To buy a policy in someone else's name probably not.
    But to buy a policy and assign someone else as main driver surely yes.

    F.e. older person owns a car, but doesn't feel confident driving anymore, or possibly had licence revoked due to health reasons, so he/she needs someone to drive the car for them. F.e. child, grandson, carer, etc...

    I can't understand why my grandmother (if she lived here) couldn't put me as a main driver on her car, which she doesn't drive herself anymore, but might need someone to do shopping for her, bring her to the doctors, etc...

    Insurers do allow that in the circumstances you describe.

    I have put cars on cover with the policy holder being excluded from driving due to a medical condition, one guy for example had quite severe cerebral palsy and his primary carer was noted as the main driver and the policy holder excluded from driving.


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    #17
    FrStone
    Registered Users Posts: 720 ✭✭✭FrStone


    Saul T Nutzz wrote: »
    Of course the policy holder has to be the registered owner, the only exception is for a spouse / partner ie I could insure my wife's car (she is the registered owner) in my name with no issue.

    It makes no sense to try and get a policy for something you own, in someone else's name.

    What legitimate reason could there be for it?

    There are huge amounts of reasons why the main driver may not be the owner. A parent with a spare car allowing their child drive it to but not actually giving the child the car.

    Until insurers cop on and realise everything isn't black and white people will continue to put the main driver down as the owner as they don't allow you do it any other way.


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    #18
    Liam McPoyle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,846 ✭✭✭✭Liam McPoyle


    FrStone wrote: »
    There are huge amounts of reasons why the main driver may not be the owner. A parent with a spare car allowing their child drive it to but not actually giving the child the car.

    Until insurers cop on and realise everything isn't black and white people will continue to put the main driver down as the owner as they don't allow you do it any other way.

    If its all above board then why wouldn't someone transfer the ownership rather the trying to pull the wool over the insurance companies eyes?

    You say there are huge amounts of reasons why this may be done and have mentioned one.

    Can you name 4 more valid reasons why the main driver would not be the registered owner?


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    #19
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,088 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    Saul T Nutzz wrote: »
    If its all above board then why wouldn't someone transfer the ownership rather the trying to pull the wool over the insurance companies eyes?

    If father/mother want to let their son/daughter use their car, but don't want to give it to them.
    Might be expensive car, and passing ownership could have financial consequences.
    I.e person who is registered owner could sell the car and grab a cash.


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    #20
    Liam McPoyle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,846 ✭✭✭✭Liam McPoyle


    CiniO wrote: »
    If father/mother want to let their son/daughter use their car, but don't want to give it to them.
    Might be expensive car, and passing ownership could have financial consequences.
    I.e person who is registered owner could sell the car and grab a cash.

    That's the same answer as he has already given tbh.

    I'd argue that if mammy and daddy are able to afford to give junior full time use of an expensive car then they are able to afford to pay insurance at the correct rates.


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    #21
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,088 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    Saul T Nutzz wrote: »
    That's the same answer as he has already given tbh.

    I'd argue that if mammy and daddy are able to afford to give junior full time use of an expensive car then they are able to afford to pay insurance at the correct rates.

    But that's what we were talking about.
    It was said that insurers would refuse to offer insurance when it's declared that main driver will be a young son of the vehicle owner.

    It's not really about premium rate, but just about being able to obtain a policy.

    If parents want to give their child ability to drive their car, but don't want to give car ownership to their child, they can't really do it due to unability to insure that car.


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    #22
    Blazer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,415 ✭✭✭✭Blazer


    Axa allow you to be the main policy holder on 2 cars but you cannot add names drivers to multi car policies.
    I had 2 policies with my au pair down as a named driver on one and Axa'a audit team flagged it and had her removed. I either had to remove her completely or make her the main driver on one of the cars which was €2500 so er no thanks


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