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05-05-2019, 10:35   #1
Zorya
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Woman Loses Job for Holding Gender Critical Opinions.

Maya Forstater is a internationally renowned researcher on Tax Avoidance, who worked until recently at the London office of the Centre for Global Development (CGD) think tank.

In March she wrote an article calling for open debate about the consequences of Gender Self ID, particularly with respect to the implications for women. She says womanhood is defined by biological fact not by feeling.

This is the article.
https://medium.com/@MForstater/inter...x-eb9de927c787

She has been fired from her position on the grounds that she used ''offensive and exclusionary language'' and that she is ''fear-mongering''.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/t...omen-tpqgnm9vj

Quote:
Forstater said: “I support transgender people’s human rights and I believe that trans people are vulnerable, but no one group should overrerule others. I lost my job for speaking up about women’s rights, in a careful way and in a tone of ordinary discussion and disagreement. I worked for a think tank and I thought you ought to be able to think and talk about things. I found out I was wrong about that.”

She is backed by Index on Censorship, whose director, Jodie Ginsberg, said: “From what I have read of her writing, I cannot see that Maya has done anything wrong other than express an opinion that many feminists share — that there should be a public and open debate about the distinction between sex and gender.”
Quote:
In an email, a CGD manager said: “You stated that a man’s internal feeling that he is a woman has no basis in material reality. A lot of people would find that offensive and exclusionary.”
She is taking her employer to court to argue that ...

Quote:
no one should be discriminated against for having gender critical views, and talking about them.

If we can establish that gender critical beliefs are protected under the Equality Act 2010, this would help protect others who are afraid of losing their jobs because of the beliefs they hold, and also those facing belief discrimination outside the employment field.
https://www.crowdjustice.com/case/fired-maya/

When people are so gleeful about certain opinions being censored on internet platfroms, remember that censorship can extend exponentially. Their opinions censored today, yours tomorrow. Their job today, yours tomorrow.

Biological facts are now a reason for censorship and job loss.
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05-05-2019, 10:41   #2
spurious
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Thought crime.
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05-05-2019, 10:47   #3
Princess Consuela Bananahammock
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Agh we just finished with the last gender thread!!!

I honestly don't see how bloody hard it is to use pronouns without making a ****ing political point.

That said, someone's viewpoints should not be used for employment proceedings unless a) they advocate violence or extreme hate-speech, or b) they bring them into the workplace environment and start using it as soapbox.
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05-05-2019, 10:49   #4
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Ah, so there’s the consequences of free speech I keep hearing about. Good to see it in action.
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05-05-2019, 10:51   #5
Zorya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Princess Consuela Bananahammock View Post
Agh we just finished with the last gender thread!!!

I honestly don't see how bloody hard it is to use pronouns without making a ****ing political point.

That said, someone's viewpoints should not be used for employment proceedings unless a) they advocate violence or extreme hate-speech, or b) they bring them into the workplace environment and start using it as soapbox.
The gender threads will continue Princess because it is a major human rights issue in the present time. The erasure of women and especially lesbians is ongoing so the discussions should continue.

The issue is not about mere pronouns, that is completely reductive. You would have to read the source material to see its scope. It is about bodily integrity, safe spaces, fairness in sports, among other important issues. No one gives a continental damn about mere pronouns.
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05-05-2019, 10:52   #6
El_Bee
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She should have thought about that before having illegal opinions.
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05-05-2019, 10:52   #7
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What is her view on lesbians sharing space and services that women use?
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05-05-2019, 10:56   #9
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Originally Posted by YFlyer View Post
What is her view on lesbians sharing space and services that women use?

Are you kidding around?
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05-05-2019, 10:59   #10
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'This can lead to situations where lesbians face social pressure to have sex with men who identify as women'

Do women have a mind of their own?
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05-05-2019, 10:59   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zorya View Post

Are you kidding around?
Read her article.
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05-05-2019, 11:00   #12
Princess Consuela Bananahammock
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zorya View Post
The gender threads will continue Princess because it is a major human rights issue in the present time. The erasure of women and especially lesbians is ongoing so the discussions should continue.
Yeah, I know, I wasn't being serious!

Quote:
The issue is not about mere pronouns, that is completely reductive. You would have to read the source material to see its scope. It is about bodily integrity, safe spaces, fairness in sports, among other important issues. No one gives a continental damn about mere pronouns.
When I say "right" pronouns, I mean the requested ones. The person in the body is going to be in a better position to know which pronouns are the most apt. But believe me, it starts with the pronouns.

What I believe we're talking about here is TERF as opposed to gender identity. I've heard it argued (although not really researched it, to be fair so am not condoning the opinion) that it's just another form of transphobia.
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05-05-2019, 11:04   #13
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A man cannot turn himself into a woman, no matter what the progressive Taliban types want us to believe.
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05-05-2019, 11:06   #14
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It’s starting to look like women are the losers in this. They are further down the hierarchy of victimhood than they once were.
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05-05-2019, 11:10   #15
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While this is a really important topic, and one she should certainly not have lost her job for, this thread is just going to descend in to the usual Transpeople bashing.

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Originally Posted by Brendan Delaney View Post
A man cannot turn himself into a woman, no matter what the progressive Taliban types want us to believe.
Oh wait, there it is.
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