Direct Provision to be Abolished

excludedbin · 08-08-2020 2:32pm

TomTomTim wrote: »

Douglas Murray claimed in his book

The only part of your post that matters. Did he cite any evidence to back up his claim? Once again, it's easy for anyone to chat ****e on the internet (or even a book), it's quite another to have any evidence to back up the outrageous claims being made.

Higgins5473 · 08-08-2020 7:48pm

ronano wrote: »

My previous comment was posted and thanked but no one has given an explanation as to why the government are not following through on deportations.

My question was posted to try and understand why once the decision is made it is not followed through on?

In a nutshell, the system benefits a lot of different cohorts who are not in competition with one another from top to bottom, it’s an industry, a business. All those who benefit from it are not affected by it.

Kivaro · 10-08-2020 4:40pm

The Tanaiste was on RTE Radio 1 Morning Ireland early this morning to talk about the current Covid situation. The presenter told him near the end that she would like to ask him many other Covid-related questions but was running out of time, and for her last question she asked why Direct Provisions were not shut down.

Varadkar responded that "it was a lot easier said than done". He explained that the country is going through a major housing shortage and it would be difficult to find 7,000 or so new homes for those currently in Direct Provision. He also said that there is uncertainty with the numbers of asylum seekers coming into the country every year, so that is also very difficult to plan for.

The RTE presenter's response was ....................... nothing.
The liberal left and liberal elite groups in this country want Direct Provision gone, but have no practical solutions for its replacement. How fair is it for a Pakistani or African to fly into Dublin from Berlin, Paris, or London and immediately receive free lone accommodation as soon as they declare themselves an asylum seeker? Do we set aside 2,000 - 3,000 homes every year (or a good deal more) for asylum seekers yet to arrive on our shores?

I wonder if RTE presenters are paid a bounty when they mention the words Direct Provision on air, as it seems that is their primary mission objective these days.

Bonniedog · 10-08-2020 4:48pm

Is the DP centre in Newbridge closed given that it is a cluster of Covid cases?

Probably not.

You hit the nail on head regarding where all the "asylum" seekers will be put.

Land in Dublin and get a house! No wonder the Balbriggan gangs think we are a standing joke, to be abused in whatever way they see fit.

Geuze · 10-08-2020 4:51pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

Given that the state's own statistics show that well over 60% of asylum seekers are bogus and shown to be from minute they land, and without counting those who meander for years through appeals system or disappear - from Albania, Georgia, South Africa, Zimbabwe etc,

Where did you get the 60% figure from?

I thought it is much higher?

Are there any actually genuine AS?

TomTomTim · 10-08-2020 4:53pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

Is the DP centre in Newbridge closed given that it is a cluster of Covid cases?

Probably not.

You hit the nail on head regarding where all the "asylum" seekers will be put.

Land in Dublin and get a house! No wonder the Balbriggan gangs think we are a standing joke, to be abused in whatever way they see fit.

Following my previous post on locations of centers, I have a suspicion that the City West Hotel is currently being used to house these people. It's been rented by the government for the last few months, yet was underused due to the pandemic not being as bad as expected; so here's a government rented building with lots of room to house people that we know was previously underused. Considering all that, and the extra migrant traffic in the area, I don't think it's a big leap to make.

enricoh · 10-08-2020 5:39pm

Geuze wrote: »

Where did you get the 60% figure from?

I thought it is much higher?

Are there any actually genuine AS?

I heard a guy on local radio here who sat on the panel adjudicating on asylum seekers cases.
He was public enemy number one for the various quangos etc that make their living out of the industry as he didn't buy any bulls&#t stories. He was replaced off the panel with a yes man , no doubt we got more genuine ones in soon after!

Jizique · 10-08-2020 7:39pm

TomTomTim wrote: »

Following my previous post on locations of centers, I have a suspicion that the City West Hotel is currently being used to house these people. It's been rented by the government for the last few months, yet was underused due to the pandemic not being as bad as expected; so here's a government rented building with lots of room to house people that we know was previously underused. Considering all that, and the extra migrant traffic in the area, I don't think it's a big leap to make.

There was a PrimeTime Investigates on the timeshare part of CityWest and how the hotel owners were trying to force/encourage the owners to sell back to the hotel; there were bits of the programme ( which I didn’t watch in full) that would support your belief

Yellow_Fern · 10-08-2020 8:18pm

TomTomTim wrote: »

Following my previous post on locations of centers, I have a suspicion that the City West Hotel is currently being used to house these people. It's been rented by the government for the last few months, yet was underused due to the pandemic not being as bad as expected; so here's a government rented building with lots of room to house people that we know was previously underused. Considering all that, and the extra migrant traffic in the area, I don't think it's a big leap to make.

The Asian restarant is open inside but there is sure a lot of traffic going into the complex. Id say about one every second min at this time and the security are not so friendly either.

Jizique wrote: »

There was a PrimeTime Investigates on the timeshare part of CityWest and how the hotel owners were trying to force/encourage the owners to sell back to the hotel; there were bits of the programme ( which I didn’t watch in full) that would support your belief

That is the vacant building at the back. The front hotel is more likely to have asslyum seekers in my opnion.

Gatling · 10-08-2020 9:18pm

Yellow_Fern wrote: »

The Asian restarant is open inside but there is sure a lot of traffic going into the complex. Id say about one every second min at this time and the security are not so friendly either.

I live two minutes away and haven't seen any major increase in traffic , regularly seeing ambulances and the odd car , security was tighted for the coivd admissions , haven't seen any newish arrivals hanging saggart or rathcoole either

Bonniedog · 11-08-2020 8:17am

Geuze wrote: »

Where did you get the 60% figure from?

I thought it is much higher?

Are there any actually genuine AS?

The 60%+ is from the DOJ's own figures regarding alleged places of origin of first applicants.

Purely on basis they are from states of safe return they should indeed be on the next flight home, or to wherever they flew or ferried from.

Yes, the overall figure of bogus applicants is much higher as we have seen from the number of "Syrians" who are from Pakistan and elsewhere. Whole thing is a bit of a cloud as once an appeal is allowed then the legal gravy train steams ahead and the number of illegals who are sent back is tiny.

Rest continue to live here either under appeal or just disappear into what is a whole other world in which the Irish state only makes contact where its denizens are caught doing something. The trafficking of sex slaves is a prime example, as is the use of slaves in grow houses.

Mad_maxx · 11-08-2020 9:33am

Kivaro wrote: »

The Tanaiste was on RTE Radio 1 Morning Ireland early this morning to talk about the current Covid situation. The presenter told him near the end that she would like to ask him many other Covid-related questions but was running out of time, and for her last question she asked why Direct Provisions were not shut down.

Varadkar responded that "it was a lot easier said than done". He explained that the country is going through a major housing shortage and it would be difficult to find 7,000 or so new homes for those currently in Direct Provision. He also said that there is uncertainty with the numbers of asylum seekers coming into the country every year, so that is also very difficult to plan for.

The RTE presenter's response was ....................... nothing.
The liberal left and liberal elite groups in this country want Direct Provision gone, but have no practical solutions for its replacement. How fair is it for a Pakistani or African to fly into Dublin from Berlin, Paris, or London and immediately receive free lone accommodation as soon as they declare themselves an asylum seeker? Do we set aside 2,000 - 3,000 homes every year (or a good deal more) for asylum seekers yet to arrive on our shores?

I wonder if RTE presenters are paid a bounty when they mention the words Direct Provision on air, as it seems that is their primary mission objective these days.

You have to remember that the morning Ireland presenter was not asking about DP due to the concerns of listener's, only a tiny minority give any thought to direct provision

Much of the time, the media are just talking to other members of their own media tribe on air

It's purely a media and NGO sector activist concern

Every day I realise I did the right thing in ceasing to pay my TV licence fifteen months ago

TomTomTim · 11-08-2020 3:19pm

Gatling wrote: »

I live two minutes away and haven't seen any major increase in traffic , regularly seeing ambulances and the odd car , security was tighted for the coivd admissions , haven't seen any newish arrivals hanging saggart or rathcoole either

It's odd. Google claims that they are open for business, yet Booking.com has no reviews since May. They was also an RTE article claiming that they state were considering canceling the rental contract. I personally have seen a lot more Africans in the general area since the easing of restrictions, mainly adults.

Gatling · 11-08-2020 3:34pm

TomTomTim wrote: »

I personally have seen a lot more Africans in the general area since the easing of restrictions, mainly adults.

Not in saggart or rathcoole .

There Africans living in the numerous estates around citywest and macuillium

11-08-2020 3:36pm

Like the banning of bedsits I am sure this has all been well thought out and planned for.

perfectkama · 11-08-2020 3:53pm

happening in other european countries adult males with governments hiding movements and numbers from its citizens it has to be co-ordinated.

Nigel Farage exposed a hotel housing same with muscle as security in a recent video featured here on another tread.

The question is why? it will cost especially when they can bring an extended family who are entitled to pensions for there elderly parents, medical, housing, schooling many allowances for integration and they can come and go to there original country when all benefits are secured.

Why are freighters full of Africans not arriving in cork (nearest port from africa)

enricoh · 12-08-2020 7:26am

Another day another 120m spent on the gift that keeps on giving - direct provision.
Let's just end this madness, give all the spoofers an amnesty and rig them up in housing with full dole. It's going to happen anyway!
If we had a single politician in government with a spine deportations would be providing the required living space and distances.

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMibGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlyaXNodGltZXMuY29tL25ld3MvcG9saXRpY3MvY292aWQtMTktbGVhZHMtdG8tMTIwbS1vdmVycnVuLWluLWRpcmVjdC1wcm92aXNpb24tYnVkZ2V0LTEuNDMyNzg5NNIBdWh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlyaXNodGltZXMuY29tL25ld3MvcG9saXRpY3MvY292aWQtMTktbGVhZHMtdG8tMTIwbS1vdmVycnVuLWluLWRpcmVjdC1wcm92aXNpb24tYnVkZ2V0LTEuNDMyNzg5ND9tb2RlPWFtcA?hl=en-IE&gl=IE&ceid=IE%3Aen
https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEGfeFgNr5n2pv1vQ9nxS5soqGAgEKg8IACoHCAowyNLTATDN-jUwjbOhAQ?hl=en-IE&gl=IE&ceid=IE:en

Jizique · 12-08-2020 8:30am

enricoh wrote: »

Another day another 120m spent on the gift that keeps on giving - direct provision.
Let's just end this madness, give all the spoofers an amnesty and rig them up in housing with full dole. It's going to happen anyway!
If we had a single politician in government with a spine deportations would be providing the required living space and distances.

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMibGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlyaXNodGltZXMuY29tL25ld3MvcG9saXRpY3MvY292aWQtMTktbGVhZHMtdG8tMTIwbS1vdmVycnVuLWluLWRpcmVjdC1wcm92aXNpb24tYnVkZ2V0LTEuNDMyNzg5NNIBdWh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlyaXNodGltZXMuY29tL25ld3MvcG9saXRpY3MvY292aWQtMTktbGVhZHMtdG8tMTIwbS1vdmVycnVuLWluLWRpcmVjdC1wcm92aXNpb24tYnVkZ2V0LTEuNDMyNzg5ND9tb2RlPWFtcA?hl=en-IE&gl=IE&ceid=IE%3Aen
https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEGfeFgNr5n2pv1vQ9nxS5soqGAgEKg8IACoHCAowyNLTATDN-jUwjbOhAQ?hl=en-IE&gl=IE&ceid=IE%3Aen

Not just €120m, but €120m over budget.
You can see why Trump got elected and also why Brexit happened; this is completely nuts, particularly at a time when the economy is destroyed.
They really need to “drain the swamp” and defund all the NGOs who are driving this bus.

DelaneyIn · 13-08-2020 11:19pm

enricoh wrote: »

Another day another 120m spent on the gift that keeps on giving - direct provision.
Let's just end this madness, give all the spoofers an amnesty and rig them up in housing with full dole. It's going to happen anyway!
If we had a single politician in government with a spine deportations would be providing the required living space and distances.

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMibGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlyaXNodGltZXMuY29tL25ld3MvcG9saXRpY3MvY292aWQtMTktbGVhZHMtdG8tMTIwbS1vdmVycnVuLWluLWRpcmVjdC1wcm92aXNpb24tYnVkZ2V0LTEuNDMyNzg5NNIBdWh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlyaXNodGltZXMuY29tL25ld3MvcG9saXRpY3MvY292aWQtMTktbGVhZHMtdG8tMTIwbS1vdmVycnVuLWluLWRpcmVjdC1wcm92aXNpb24tYnVkZ2V0LTEuNDMyNzg5ND9tb2RlPWFtcA?hl=en-IE&gl=IE&ceid=IE%3Aen
https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEGfeFgNr5n2pv1vQ9nxS5soqGAgEKg8IACoHCAowyNLTATDN-jUwjbOhAQ?hl=en-IE&gl=IE&ceid=IE%3Aen

That’s serious coin. One things for sure, there are a lot of folk getting very wealthy on the back of all this. Asylum isn’t a humanitarian policy for displaced people.

It’s an industry. Landlords, hoteliers, catering companies, legal eagles, NGOs etc. all need the current setup to remain the same or the numbers to increase; their livelihoods rely on it!

JP Liz V1 · 14-08-2020 2:39am

How many do we take in a year?

14-08-2020 10:46am

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

How many do we take in a year?

As many that get off a plane and claim they are in fear of their lives and need to apply really.

14-08-2020 11:24am

gilberto_eire wrote: »

As many that get off a plane and claim they are in fear of their lives and need to apply really.

Apart from the 1 in 5 who get deported, after appeals fail. The rest remain.

Gatling · 14-08-2020 5:06pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Apart from the 1 in 5 who get deported, after appeals fail. The rest remain.

I don't even think it's 1 in 5 , 60,000 came through dp and we've only deported 1,400 ( many of the deported are students not in the asylum process)

2.3 % deported (not all asylum seekers) so it's likely even lower that again

Sean.3516 · 14-08-2020 5:13pm

One way to improve our asylum system might be to assess people's claims BEFORE they come to Ireland.

One of the biggest problems with Direct Provision is that we bring people into the country before we have the slightest clue as to whether or not they are legitimate refugees. They have to stay in those hotels indefinitely while we assess their claims and the process is far more convoluted than it ought to be.

Assessing them before they get here would also be a lot more humane seeing as nobody wants to send the folks back to their own countries after they've been here for a while, yet at the same time we cannot incentivise erroneous asylum claims by allowing them to stay.

Seems pretty common sense.

Gatling · 14-08-2020 5:32pm

Sean.3516 wrote: »

One of the biggest problems with Direct Provision is that we bring people into the country before we have the slightest clue as to whether or not they are legitimate refugees.

We don't bring refugees here and put them into dp,they come here off their own back traveling through multiple safe African countries then through multiple safe European countries before deciding to come here to claim asylum.

We do bring some Syrians under a UN arrangement (nobody else )

Sean.3516 · 14-08-2020 6:04pm

Gatling wrote: »

We don't bring refugees here and put them into dp,they come here off their own back traveling through multiple safe African countries then through multiple safe European countries before deciding to come here to claim asylum.

We do bring some Syrians under a UN arrangement (nobody else )

Isn't there some sort of international provision stating that refugees must claim asylum in the first safe country in which they arrive?

Sorry but you don't get to claim to be a refugee in fear of your life while at the same time being selective in what country you choose to claim asylum in.

If what your saying is true then the entire system is a scam and should be immediately and totally abolished

14-08-2020 6:16pm

Sean.3516 wrote: »

One way to improve our asylum system might be to assess people's claims BEFORE they come to Ireland.

That would be nice except that most arrive in Ireland and claim asylum on arrival. Very few are announcing themselves at an Irish consulate in a foreign country.

One of the biggest problems with Direct Provision is that we bring people into the country before we have the slightest clue as to whether or not they are legitimate refugees. They have to stay in those hotels indefinitely while we assess their claims and the process is far more convoluted than it ought to be.

Assessing them before they get here would also be a lot more humane seeing as nobody wants to send the folks back to their own countries after they've been here for a while, yet at the same time we cannot incentivise erroneous asylum claims by allowing them to stay.

Seems pretty common sense.

It would make more sense to house them all in a dormitory complex built for purpose, and put to work on the grounds (manufacturing, services etc), so that they can pay their way, while their claims were processed. They're going to arrive in Ireland to claim Asylum, but we can move the whole process away from the people seeking to make money from it, and into a more organised system, that pays somewhat for itself. At the same time, education can be provided, and their needs met without allowing them access to the rest of the country.

But yes, the claims process needs to be changed with only one appeal being allowed, and the process streamlined. If a claim and subsequent appeal are denied, that person should be banned from entry to Ireland for life. Thus cutting out the majority who might return later for another try. We really do need a harder stance on migration, especially against those who are bogus.

perfectkama · 14-08-2020 6:28pm

once they get residency the flood gates open for family to join them and all the welfare benefits total farce and a massive financial burden on the state

Bikerman2019 · 14-08-2020 6:38pm

Gatling wrote: »

Not in saggart or rathcoole .

There Africans living in the numerous estates around citywest and macuillium

Macuillium particularly. I drove in there the other night and literally, gangs of coloured people and not a single white person in sight. I am in a lot of the estates as far as rathcoole and they are NOTHING like Macuillium

Spanish Eyes · 14-08-2020 6:38pm

perfectkama wrote: »

once they get residency the flood gates open for family to join them and all the welfare benefits total farce and a massive financial burden on the state

No one in any party seems to care or see this anymore. Frightened of the R word I suspect.

Whereas if they did tighten up things and just observed their UN obligations and refugee obligations too, ie you have one appeal and if it's unsuccessful, back home for you. I think most people would support them.

I haven't met or spoken to ANYONE who supports the free arrival of people from wherever and being put up at our expense, and the lengthy process, and well you know the rest.

Legal profession may have a big say in all this though, along with DP providers.

Direct Provision to be Abolished

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