Corona Virus

a148pro · 15-02-2021 11:27pm

random_banter wrote: »

Really really loved the laugh at the end! Fair play!

I was more worried about the cough at the start

"AND HE WAS COUGHIN JOE AND SPEAKING GERMAN AND HE LOOKED LIKE HE WAS HAVIN FUN JOE"

random_banter · 11-03-2021 6:02pm

Have booked a week's accommodation in Tignes Val Claret for December with a good cancellation policy.

it's definitely lifted the spirits doing the planning, and it's nice to have something to look forward to. It will be my first time there.

Will it happen? I feel positive about it at the moment. But we will see.

PCeeeee · 11-03-2021 8:12pm

random_banter wrote: »

Have booked a week's accommodation in Tignes Val Claret for December with a good cancellation policy.

it's definitely lifted the spirits doing the planning, and it's nice to have something to look forward to. It will be my first time there.

Will it happen? I feel positive about it at the moment. But we will see.

Fair play.

a148pro · 11-03-2021 9:13pm

random_banter wrote: »

But we will see.

It will only not happen if people like us allow it to not happen. There is not nor could there be any justification for locking down for that long to protect so few people. Its high time the BS was called on all this.

trashcan · 12-03-2021 1:02am

a148pro wrote: »

It will only not happen if people like us allow it to not happen. There is not nor could there be any justification for locking down for that long to protect so few people. Its high time the BS was called on all this.

If vaccinations get to 70-80% of the population then I’d agree. I couldn’t see any justification for restrictions at that stage.

BarryNumber1 · 12-03-2021 10:45am

PCeeeee wrote: »

Fair play.

Fair play indeed, it IS something to look forward to. Hope it works out

a148pro · 12-03-2021 11:40am

trashcan wrote: »

If vaccinations get to 70-80% of the population then I’d agree. I couldn’t see any justification for restrictions at that stage.

I can't see the argument for not opening up once all vulnerable people are vaccinated, but I would like to see a realistic analysis of deaths / hospitalisation / long covid to inform that debate.

That would have to be balanced with the effects of lockdown - deaths, or rather lost years of life due to premature death which is a much more accurate assessment of the damage, due to non diagnosis, non treatment as waiting lists grow, non provision of services in future as the 20 billion plus cost of lockdown results in health cut backs, suicides and impeded health generally due to mental health issues, loss of life expectancy due to people losing out on educational opportunities, rising poverty.

Plus some kind of figure to reflect the loss of quality of life for 5 million people for this long.

None of this analysis takes place. Today's irish times editorial calls for govt to be brave and face down calls to open golf courses. Have you ever heard the like of it? With no scientific evidence whatsoever to support outside transmission in any meaningful amount?

There's no discussion, rte and mainstream media just trot out the govt line, finger point at anyone who dares to question, martin feeley is sacked on the spot for calling for a debate. People have been paralysed by fear to the complete ousting of rationality or science. Meanwhile lockdown is annihilating our youth and our society.

It's absolutely disgusting what's happening and hopefully will be called out as such in the fullness of time.

BarryNumber1 · 12-03-2021 3:13pm

@a148pro, lots of that true, but dependent on a strong government. We are wishy washy, when our Taoiseach has to be told not to go to the U.S. for St Patrick's day; as opposed to making a decision on it himself, then that's a sign. Same with the influx into the country, just look at the Leitrim funeral recently and no obvious controls over that. Optics wise, it looks very bad.

I do hope Golf is opened up. I don't golf myself but that paves the way for other outdoor activities which I do do, a lot of that is purely geared towards helping fitness for snowboarding (hiking, etc). I do "get" why it's closed down though... Optics and a few wank3rs will mess it up for everyone. I know some of the cases reporting in the news, and there's no mention of how they caught covid... the "we've no idea where we caught it". Well, i know. It was the trip abroad by a family member because they weren't going to let Covid get in the way of them enjoying Christmas, or the quiet few pints in the pub over Christmas in the back of beyonds and the pub owner turned a blind eye. Next thing, the whole pub is infected. That stuff is definitely a two-fingers to the rest of us.

What does that mean for next Winter, I'm going to say it will be influenced more by what our European colleagues do than us. Our approach is our boat will rise with the European tide. If slow vaccine roll-out continues across the EU, I'd imagine there's a whole bunch of angry italians or germans or yellow vesters and they'll kick off, and they generally get noticed. That might set some clarity for their leaders. The Irish goal should be to maximise our efforts to get Vaccines, do whatever is required, beg-borrow-and-steal, talk to the Chinese/Russians directly- we can always tell them no thanks afterwards... because in a few months the issue will be boosters and when can we get those. The thought of the secondary effects of all this (depression, ignored 2nd/3rd levels, poverty, hospital backlogs of serious cases) is truly horrifying.

Then again, 5 to 10m vaccines may be delivered and distributed to these shores by October.

random_banter · 12-03-2021 6:22pm

BarryNumber1 wrote: »

What does that mean for next Winter, I'm going to say it will be influenced more by what our European colleagues do than us. Our approach is our boat will rise with the European tide. If slow vaccine roll-out continues across the EU, I'd imagine there's a whole bunch of angry italians or germans or yellow vesters and they'll kick off, and they generally get noticed. That might set some clarity for their leaders. The Irish goal should be to maximise our efforts to get Vaccines, do whatever is required, beg-borrow-and-steal, talk to the Chinese/Russians directly- we can always tell them no thanks afterwards... because in a few months the issue will be boosters and when can we get those. The thought of the secondary effects of all this (depression, ignored 2nd/3rd levels, poverty, hospital backlogs of serious cases) is truly horrifying.

Then again, 5 to 10m vaccines may be delivered and distributed to these shores by October.

I'll be interested to see how this vaccine passport situation develops too. I'm not opposed to it in theory, since there are already other places in the world where you require certain vaccinations to travel to, but it will be a problem if vaccine access isn't available and people do want to travel next winter.

I'd agree with the sentiment here - by next winter, based on what we currently know about vaccine efficacy in populations where mass vaccination has occurred, I don't see how the restrictions could be as harsh. Other than a variant which overcomes the vaccine which doesn't seem to have happened so far...

The lack of data frustrates me too. We should be watching the hospitalisations and serious illness metrics and not focusing on case counts alone from here on.

Anyway I wasn't trying to gloat the fact that I've speculatively booked a trip, more so trying to inspire others to have something to look forward to. With so many protected/refundable ways to book now, it's a little easier to dream about a snow trip that might actually happen next season without the financial risk.

PCeeeee · 12-03-2021 6:30pm

random_banter wrote: »

I'll be interested to see how this vaccine passport situation develops too. I'm not opposed to it in theory, since there are already other places in the world where you require certain vaccinations to travel to, but it will be a problem if vaccine access isn't available and people do want to travel next winter.

I'd agree with the sentiment here - by next winter, based on what we currently know about vaccine efficacy in populations where mass vaccination has occurred, I don't see how the restrictions could be as harsh. Other than a variant which overcomes the vaccine which doesn't seem to have happened so far...

The lack of data frustrates me too. We should be watching the hospitalisations and serious illness metrics and not focusing on case counts alone from here on.

Anyway I wasn't trying to gloat the fact that I've speculatively booked a trip, more so trying to inspire others to have something to look forward to. With so many protected/refundable ways to book now, it's a little easier to dream about a snow trip that might actually happen next season without the financial risk.

I didn't think you were gloating. It cheered me up. I have been lucky enough to be in Switzerland this winter and the thought of barren winter next year is too bad to think about.

maddness · 12-03-2021 7:59pm

a148pro wrote: »

I can't see the argument for not opening up once all vulnerable people are vaccinated, but I would like to see a realistic analysis of deaths / hospitalisation / long covid to inform that debate.

That would have to be balanced with the effects of lockdown - deaths, or rather lost years of life due to premature death which is a much more accurate assessment of the damage, due to non diagnosis, non treatment as waiting lists grow, non provision of services in future as the 20 billion plus cost of lockdown results in health cut backs, suicides and impeded health generally due to mental health issues, loss of life expectancy due to people losing out on educational opportunities, rising poverty.

Plus some kind of figure to reflect the loss of quality of life for 5 million people for this long.

None of this analysis takes place. Today's irish times editorial calls for govt to be brave and face down calls to open golf courses. Have you ever heard the like of it? With no scientific evidence whatsoever to support outside transmission in any meaningful amount?

There's no discussion, rte and mainstream media just trot out the govt line, finger point at anyone who dares to question, martin feeley is sacked on the spot for calling for a debate. People have been paralysed by fear to the complete ousting of rationality or science. Meanwhile lockdown is annihilating our youth and our society.

It's absolutely disgusting what's happening and hopefully will be called out as such in the fullness of time.

I’m the furthest person from an antivaxier and believe totally in the science.
However I actually think that this government have massively let us down and this will be remembered for generations.
The vulnerable will all be vaccinated by summer and all of us by autumn and I’ll be skiing in December.

a148pro · 12-03-2021 9:28pm

BarryNumber1 wrote: »

What does that mean for next Winter, I'm going to say it will be influenced more by what our European colleagues do than us.

I think this is key. I cannot see mainland European populations putting up with a second winter without skiing, be it the people whose livelihoods depend on it in resorts or the populations in the cities who would go regularly. Ireland will lag behind that but will eventually align in terms of what travel is permissible.

a148pro · 12-03-2021 9:34pm

random_banter wrote: »

The lack of data frustrates me too. We should be watching the hospitalisations and serious illness metrics and not focusing on case counts alone from here on.

Twitter is good for this, there's a lot of good numbers people crunching stuff. Also HIQA and Health Surveillance Protection Centre websites are excellent.

When you look at the data broadly lockdown doesn't really make sense, or at least, it makes a hell of a lot less sense than you think, or the government want you to think.

PCeeeee · 12-03-2021 10:15pm

a148pro wrote: »

I think this is key. I cannot see mainland European populations putting up with a second winter without skiing, be it the people whose livelihoods depend on it in resorts or the populations in the cities who would go regularly. Ireland will lag behind that but will eventually align in terms of what travel is permissible.

You're dead right. Ireland will follow what is being done in Europe. Dare I say it but they will be under pressure to do so.

BarryNumber1 · 12-03-2021 10:52pm

random_banter wrote: »

The lack of data frustrates me too.

I'm not sure what's going on here. In an age where there is data everywhere, I can't locate a comprehensive data extract of Irish cases, hospitalisations, ICUs and so on. I track this with the app alright, but would prefer a feed or REST source or something. That does away with the hassle of writing down the data daily. I'm going to presume it's there somewhere but just obfuscated.

Rew · 13-03-2021 10:41am

Were a million miles from skiing in this thread at this stage, there are plenty of places you can go to hash out the rights and wrongs of the gov response and plans

Corona Virus

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