What Is the real origin of the surname Miskimmins

Dun · 06-06-2011 5:59pm

No, they do not have to convert, and never have done. The Catholic party must promise to (a) stay within the church, (b) raise the children as Catholic, and (c) make sure that the non-Catholic party is aware of this well in advance of the marriage. This is for the marriage itself, afterwards sure it's anybody's game as to what they do.

owenc · 06-06-2011 6:06pm

Dun wrote: »

No, they do not have to convert, and never have done. The Catholic party must promise to (a) stay within the church, (b) raise the children as Catholic, and (c) make sure that the non-Catholic party is aware of this well in advance of the marriage. This is for the marriage itself, afterwards sure it's anybody's game as to what they do.

Thats hardly fair, what if the protestants want to baptise their children protestant? I think that matter has nothing to do with the catholic church and i think that they should remove that rule and let people practise whatever religion they like not what they say! Hmm and what does that mean?

Dun · 06-06-2011 6:11pm

They are free to do what they want afterwards. No excommunication, no annulment of marriage. Nothing. Again, this is way off topic, and I think we should leave it at that.

owenc · 06-06-2011 6:15pm

Dun wrote: »

They are free to do what they want afterwards. No excommunication, no annulment of marriage. Nothing. Again, this is way off topic, and I think we should leave it at that.

Well it clearly says above that they must raise their kids catholic.. but w/e i don't care about this matter i'm discussing family trees right now.

Dun · 06-06-2011 6:20pm

No, it says the Catholic party must promise it at the time of marriage. Even if s/he doesn't the marriage is still valid, just it's harder to get a priest to do it. And they're free to do whatever they want together afterwards. I've seen families in the census with mixed marriages, with all the boys raised as one religion and all the girls as another (to add a valid genealogy connection

)

owenc · 06-06-2011 6:22pm

Dun wrote: »

No, it says the Catholic party must promise it at the time of marriage. Even if s/he doesn't the marriage is still valid, just it's harder to get a priest to do it. And they're free to do whatever they want together afterwards. I've seen families in the census with mixed marriages, with all the boys raised as one religion and all the girls as another (to add a valid genealogy connection )

Well i still think that that is selfish of them what does it matter to them its not them that will have to suffer when they are older! Yes i know thats the way some of my family are on my mothers side... (my wide family like grandmothers etc not my parental one)

barbarax · 06-06-2011 7:32pm

Owen I have come to the conclusion that you are a wind up merchant.........but you do make me laugh. Have you found out yet how my Miskimmin family is related to yours?

owenc · 06-06-2011 10:14pm

Yours no but I'm sure if we can get them both traced back to Scotland that they would be from the same family.. Do you know were the planters cane from in your area who planted your area? My area was planted from the southwest of Scotland (only 20 miles from donaghdee) I think they highered tenants from roxboughshire , selkshire and kirkcudbrightshire ... My area is unique for my location because we were planted bt tenants from south Scotland and usually the down coast and south Antrim would get tenants from there most tenants here were from Ayrshire but we were unique and got south west Scotland .. Interestingly there were also some English tenants my g grandmothers family seem to be from warwickshire!? Have you any suspicions on were your Miskimmins are from? I suspect mines are somewhere in-between rixbourgj and selkshire ... Btw what way is yours Spelt again? I'll find out Soon when I goto proni! Edit: you can read up about Sir Thomas Phillis who created limavady well he brought over 25 English families and it would seem that my g grandmothers family Is one of them : http://www.ulsterancestry.com/ShowFreePage.php?id=111 as you can see there they are the Thomas smith in the swords and pikes is my ggggggg grandfather and I think he was from warwickshire but what's interesting is the family lived in the exact same townland ever since they had arrived And they did not once leave! But unfortunately my g grandmother was the last one to have the name and it is now extinct

barbarax · 06-06-2011 10:46pm

Owen I would suspect around the same area south west scotland, Donaghadee is the nearest point to Portpatrick in Scotland, apparently my both great grandas would have went over in the summer months to bring in the harvest. Like yourself my lot haven't moved out of the Donaghadee area, although my brother lives in Newtownards................8 miles away!!! I also researched my mother's maiden name Strain and same thing got back to 1750 still living in Donaghadee and still labourers. Strain came from Scotland as well. I got a lot of my info on the ancestry ireland site cost me a fortune. Also lady nearby transcripts church records for NIFHS and she got me all the church records.:cool:

owenc · 06-06-2011 10:55pm

barbarax wrote: »

Owen I would suspect around the same area south west scotland, Donaghadee is the nearest point to Portpatrick in Scotland, apparently my both great grandas would have went over in the summer months to bring in the harvest. Like yourself my lot haven't moved out of the Donaghadee area, although my brother lives in Newtownards................8 miles away!!! I also researched my mother's maiden name Strain and same thing got back to 1750 still living in Donaghadee and still labourers. Strain came from Scotland as well. I got a lot of my info on the ancestry ireland site cost me a fortune. Also lady nearby transcripts church records for NIFHS and she got me all the church records.:cool:

Yes I would think then that are families in Scotland are probably the same ones and they broke up over the years.. Yes I can see Scotland from my house too infact right Now I can
see the lighthouse flashing at islay mind you I'm seeing a different side of Scotland to you! Yes
I think it's amazing that the families have stayed in the exact same area and it's even more
amazing that my g grandmothers family coming over from England and living on the exact
(I'm serious ) farm for well over 300 years without moving they mustve Been very close and at
the same time mad coming over here from england (why you'd move here from England!) I
think they're half mad especially with the woodkern and all it mustve been very scary! I
couldnt believe they were living in the exact same farm for 300 years ever since they got off
the boat from England when I did the family tree! My DNA test would be interesting to see!

pinkypinky · 06-06-2011 11:17pm

Guys - I know I'm not the forum mod but this is straying really off topic,
and frankly I think it's run its course as well. If you are related, I think you should take your conversation to private email.

Pinky

owenc · 06-06-2011 11:22pm

pinkypinky wrote: »

Guys - I know I'm not the forum mod but this is straying really off topic,
and frankly I think it's run its course as well. If you are related, I think you should take your conversation to private email.

Pinky

Hi that's alright we can pm! Can you please delete it then as I don't want other family members finding this and harassing me! Yes it's not fair they're awful !

bobthefarmer · 07-06-2011 8:50pm

owenc wrote: »

I don't know either I have family In America and they are the complete opposite to us they are complete nutters and they support Celtic and all this... They have all converted to be catholics because you see you aren't "Irish" if you aren't catholic! And there's one of them who's a republican type person and he's doing the tree and he's trying to link us up with this family Down south when we have absolutely no links with down south whatsoever he also thinks we used to be catholic I think my ancestors would roll under their graves if they heard him?! He thinks we aren't ulster scots aswell because our name Is I'n the Irish form but I don't care because we are ulster scots whether he likes it or not especially when they are I'n the muster rolls! And I hate it when you goto America and some ones will say o my ggg ggg grand uncle is from cork seriously I lce closer to Scotland and I couldn't give a crud! Americans dont seem to know much about northern Ireland anyway!?

Owen, Some of us (Americans) are lovers of history. You are right when you say most do not know anything of Northern Ireland. Most (98%) could not determine Ireland is not part of the UK. Don't include me in the batch. I do not wear green on Saint Patty's day and call myself Ire'sh for a day, give it a rest, and lets proceed with history, not dwellin on angst against others. What is a "Republican Type" in your lingo?

My name and the names of many Americans (Canadians, Mexicans, included) comes from Ulster. We typically apply the Term "Scots-Irish" (or Scotch-Irish as I prefer) to people from the Plantation Era of Northern Ireland. Likely 250,000 had reached the shores of the Colonies prior to the War for Independence (1776-1781). These people were supporters of the Revolution and fought for independence, just as NI has fought for theirs for many years. It is not kind to consider us in a generalization. We are unique to the core and raised by our beliefs. Many Presbyterian, Methodist, Baptists, Lutherans, Mennonites, Quakers, Adventists, Assembly, and Yes, some Catholic (admittedly few) have backgrounds like mine.

I do not know a lot about history of modern Northern Ireland, but I do know that you too have languished too long without independence. I remember the skirmishes you had, when I was a youth.

bobthefarmer · 07-06-2011 9:26pm

pinkypinky wrote: »

Guys - I know I'm not the forum mod but this is straying really off topic,
and frankly I think it's run its course as well. If you are related, I think you should take your conversation to private email.

Pinky

We still can go on a bit, hold your horses.
This is just getting amusing.
bob the Ulster Farmer
:pac:

owenc · 07-06-2011 10:42pm

Well ok then if you insist! I just hope my relatives don't find this or it'll be he'll!!

owenc · 07-06-2011 10:46pm

Oh and barbarax we have worked it out it turns out his gggggg grandfather and my ggg grandfather are brothers and his ggg grandfather converted and changed To be a catholic and changed the name!! And yes his gggggg grandfather is equivalent to my ggg grandfather despite the fact that he is 30 years older than me or something ... I always find that interesting how younger folk can be closer to the aulder folk than the actual auld folk are!! Because in my line if I trace back to my gggggg grandfather I will get into the 1690s while he's in the 1810s I must be more Scottish than him in the Muskimmins line by the sounds of things!!

owenc · 07-06-2011 11:17pm

Oh and bob well to me a republican is someone who wants a united Ireland, is obsessed with the Irish culture, obsessed with galeic and obsessed with Irish music Now dependibg on your qualities i might not Say you are one but most of the tine when I see a person Wearing a Gaelic top I think so.. And what is that all about it's as if they are wearing it to say to the Protestants in your face!! The Protestants do it too with rangers tops! Yes northern Ireland people are really that pathetic! Anyway let's get back to the Muskimmins! Oh and the Americans when I go over I just let them get on with it because i couldn't be bothers explaining everything muhuhua

owenc · 08-06-2011 8:06am

Barvarax I have looked In the 1841 and 1851 census and it seems that the name is very common In Wigtownshire so I'm probably from one of those families for definate and you probably are too! http://freecen.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl theres a clan of them In mochrume so we maybe relayed to them... Btw don't be putting In Miskimmons because it won't work that is the northern Ireland version of the name put In the Scottish version which is cumming... I'm very surprised as I thought there was no cumming In Wigtownshire! The proni estate records will hopefully tell me which one of from though!

Dades · 08-06-2011 11:53am

This thread is hideously off topic but since most of the off-topicness revolves around the OP himself, I don't see the harm in letting it flow.

If someone want a seperate discussion moved out of this thread let me know.

bobthefarmer · 09-06-2011 12:05am

Dades wrote: »

This thread is hideously off topic but since most of the off-topicness revolves around the OP himself, I don't see the harm in letting it flow.

To bring things in order, here is what I have learned. The original name is Miskimmin and it comes from Lowland Scotland, likely from one or more planters from 1610-1704, or from later immigrations from Scotland. Once in Ulster, some added an "s" for plurality (ha!) or others had their names shortened to an Irish version as Cummins (if Protestent or Presbyterian) or Cummings (if Catholic). Is that about right?

Let me tell you how this name has digressed in America. The first pioneer settler (we think was David Miskimmins in 1748, but could be proven wrong) spelled his name Miskimmins, but signed it around 1796 as Miskimen. His son's used a variety of signatures on this same document as Miskimins, Miskimin, Miskimen, but not Miskimon. Other later immigrations did use the later Miskimon, but we do not find it within our family group. Many times, in a variety of names, regardless of country of lineage, the double consonants and final s was dropped from names, for a new Americanized simple spelling. It was supposed to be easier on the reader, but really it was the lax spelling habits on the frontier. Our family currently uses no less than four spellings (Miskimens, Meskimen, Miskimins, and Miskimen, in increasing order of usage). There were later immigrations, especially in Canada that kept the original spelling with and without an s.

We also see Miskimmins and Miskimmons in Scotland. How many have moved from Ulster to Scotland?

That is my synopsis to bring this thing full scall back on track. Can anybody correct me on it? We want to keep the moderators happy:D Bob the Ulster Planter

owenc · 09-06-2011 7:06am

Here you go: http://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Miskimmon as you can see it means son of comyn which is basically cumming so anyone who the name probably had Scottish ancestors who were cumming and changed to that spelling! Oh and they say it's Irish well it's irish but the people who have it are of Scottish descent bit Irish descent it's confusing! Oh and you said about the religion thing well the Presbyterians wouldve used cummins because that's a variant of Miskimmins which is a variant of cumming then the Anglicans wouldve used Cummings because that's the English version... You'll probably not get this but it's worth a try! Here's a little bit about the clan and as you can see miskimmins is there: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clan_Cumming and just so you don't get it again your ancestors wouldve used cumming which is the Scottish version once they got to ni they wouldve changed it to Miskimmins which means son of comyn and then they may have kept it or changed it and that's why we are In this situation! As you can see the name is of highland origin but it is distributed all over Scotland bur don't be looking there because no planters cane from there it is highly likely that yours came from
The same area as mines because of where we were planted from

barbarax · 09-06-2011 7:44am

bobthefarmer wrote: »

Dades wrote: »

This thread is hideously off topic but since most of the off-topicness revolves around the OP himself, I don't see the harm in letting it flow.

To bring things in order, here is what I have learned. The original name is Miskimmin and it comes from Lowland Scotland, likely from one or more planters from 1610-1704, or from later immigrations from Scotland. Once in Ulster, some added an "s" for plurality (ha!) or others had their names shortened to an Irish version as Cummins (if Protestent or Presbyterian) or Cummings (if Catholic). Is that about right?

Let me tell you how this name has digressed in America. The first pioneer settler (we think was David Miskimmins in 1748, but could be proven wrong) spelled his name Miskimmins, but signed it around 1796 as Miskimen. His son's used a variety of signatures on this same document as Miskimins, Miskimin, Miskimen, but not Miskimon. Other later immigrations did use the later Miskimon, but we do not find it within our family group. Many times, in a variety of names, regardless of country of lineage, the double consonants and final s was dropped from names, for a new Americanized simple spelling. It was supposed to be easier on the reader, but really it was the lax spelling habits on the frontier. Our family currently uses no less than four spellings (Miskimens, Meskimen, Miskimins, and Miskimen, in increasing order of usage). There were later immigrations, especially in Canada that kept the original spelling with and without an s.

We also see Miskimmins and Miskimmons in Scotland. How many have moved from Ulster to Scotland?

That is my synopsis to bring this thing full scall back on track. Can anybody correct me on it? We want to keep the moderators happy:D Bob the Ulster Planter

I would agree with you Bob Miskimmin is the proper spelling, however I believe it comes from Skimmin the Mi added later. In Scotland there were also Skimming which is more likely where the Cumming comes from Skimmin went to Cummin the Mi is a bit like the Mc/Mac in Scottish, I would not see myself as Scots Irish, rather Ulster Scot.;)

owenc · 10-06-2011 4:26pm

Oh and i have just recently bought the scotch irish origins book i don't know if yous would be intrested but i attached it. It has several muster rolls and my ancestor is in page 49 under lady mcclellands churchlands the surname is very close to miskimmins as you can see, lady mcclelland is a montgomery from the ards peninsula and she married robert mcclelland who owned the haberdashers and the clothworkers located in coleraine borough her lands were just above the clothworkers estate, she highered tenants from kirkcudbrightshire it says so we must be from there! It has been a good source as i have been able to find three of my families in the muster rolls and work out where they originated just by looking at the area it is magnificent! Whats interesting is in Coleraine the Scots outnumbered the irish by 4 times to 1! Immigration was so frequent that they had to introduce a ferry system!

mod: [removed link to book]

barbarax · 10-06-2011 6:33pm

Hi Owen thanks for posting this will have to print it out and read it properly. Where did you get it do they have the same for Antrim and Down, I would be interested in buying them.:cool:

owenc · 10-06-2011 7:01pm

barbarax wrote: »

Hi Owen thanks for posting this will have to print it out and read it properly. Where did you get it do they have the same for Antrim and Down, I would be interested in buying them.:cool:

Erm i don't think so unfortunately because the records are very sparse in county down. The only reason we have records in because the londonderry plantation was more important so they had to record everything. You could probably get the muster rolls though.

barbarax · 10-06-2011 7:23pm

do you have a family tree done out Owen. The Samuel and Susanna are these your ancestors

owenc · 10-06-2011 7:30pm

barbarax wrote: »

do you have a family tree done out Owen. The Samuel and Susanna are these your ancestors

Yes gggggg grandparents why?? Where did you see that? I think he was born about 1730. The william is my ggggg grandfather.

barbarax · 10-06-2011 8:00pm

when I first started doing the family tree they were the first Miskimmin I found on the family search site

owenc · 10-06-2011 8:05pm

barbarax wrote: »

when I first started doing the family tree they were the first Miskimmin I found on the family search site

Awk rite well i never knew that because i had to goto the church records to get that info! Can you provide a link because i canny find them on familysearch?

barbarax · 10-06-2011 8:44pm

owenc wrote: »

Awk rite well i never knew that because i had to goto the church records to get that info! Can you provide a link because i canny find them on familysearch?

sorry Owen it wasn't familysearch it was emerald ancestors:o

What Is the real origin of the surname Miskimmins

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