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Smart Intruder Alarms

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Superfoods


    I just got a quote to upgrade the HKC alarm. So to install the GSM unit is 180 plus vat.....expensive but could just take it

    The problem is the 8 euro per month rental. Is that for real?


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,350 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Superfoods wrote: »
    I just got a quote to upgrade the HKC alarm. So to install the GSM unit is 180 plus vat.....expensive but could just take it

    The problem is the 8 euro per month rental. Is that for real?

    Yep, right!! It is what has put me right off HKC, good Irish company, but I feel this should come out of the box for free for such an expensive alarm system. Alarm systems that cost just €200 do it for free. So €70 a year, or whatever it is is a bit much IMO.

    I suppose this is what you end up with a near monopoly on the pro install market.

    Irish Gunner, yes a HKC system is in or around that price. If you decide to go down that route, then I always recommend getting three quotes. You mightn't pay a lot less, but you might get extra sensors thrown in, it doesn't sound like you are getting lots of sensors.

    BTW What is the name on your old Chinese alarm?

    You could of course leave your old bell box in place if you go down the Ring route, just as a fake deterrent. But I can't think of any direct way to hook it up to Ring Alarm, though perhaps something might be possible via Home Automation and API's, haven't really looked into it.

    Shefwedfan, smartzone.ie are an official partner for Ajax in Ireland. I'm not sure if they will do exactly what you want, but might be worth checking with them.

    BTW If using the new Ajax box to take over existing wired sensors, I'm not sure if shock sensors will still work as shock sensors (detect glass being tampered with), I think they may only work as basic window open/close sensors. Not 100% sure about this, it depends on the features of the Ajax system.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Superfoods


    bk wrote: »
    Yep, right!! It is what has put me right off HKC, good Irish company, but I feel this should come out of the box for free for such an expensive alarm system. Alarm systems that cost just €200 do it for free. So €70 a year, or whatever it is is a bit much IMO.


    That's a rip off.....not happy with that.


    Seen the Ajax system. Seemingly it can integrate with existing systems. I have all wired sensors and then a few motion sensors. Anyone know which unit I need to install to integrate?


    Is it uartBridge or ocBridge Plus? any local installers?


  • Registered Users Posts: 222 ✭✭bifl


    Seriously thinking about the Ajax, although I am setup for pre-wired in the house. Should I stick with pre-wired if that is the case? Are there pre-wired Ajax equivalents?

    The other questions I have is what are the requirements for locating the Ajax control module. I would like a dual GSM and broadband control panel for redundancy but my problem is I have poor GSM signal in the house generally. Is there anything with Ajax to help extend the GSM receiving range?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,677 ✭✭✭Irish Gunner


    Irish Gunner, yes a HKC system is in or around that price. If you decide to go down that route, then I always recommend getting three quotes. You mightn't pay a lot less, but you might get extra sensors thrown in, it doesn't sound like you are getting lots of sensors.

    BTW What is the name on your old Chinese alarm?

    You could of course leave your old bell box in place if you go down the Ring route, just as a fake deterrent. But I can't think of any direct way to hook it up to Ring Alarm, though perhaps something might be possible via Home Automation and API's, haven't really looked into it.

    Guy I use is reliable and reasonable and been using him for years just wanted to see prices

    For the ring can it work with Hue so if it goes off lights will flash.

    Also keeping existing alarm if that goes off and I'm not home it can't detect this from sounds or anything. I still want to keep existing alarm for time been until we win the Lotto:-) Just want something to compliment it and when we do win the lottery then look at new Alarm options

    Current alarm don't know name or model. Just installer and he didn't know either. My alarm installer didn't recognise it either not a brand name

    Not sure if anyone recognise it from picture

    https://photos.app.goo.gl/9mUrB5785g8hUQMw6

    Seen a few Ajax starter packs but for price they are probably just as good to pay for HKC install


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Superfoods


    Guy I use is reliable and reasonable and been using him for years just wanted to see prices

    For the ring can it work with Hue so if it goes off lights will flash.

    Also keeping existing alarm if that goes off and I'm not home it can't detect this from sounds or anything. I still want to keep existing alarm for time been until we win the Lotto:-) Just want something to compliment it and when we do win the lottery then look at new Alarm options

    Current alarm don't know name or model. Just installer and he didn't know either. My alarm installer didn't recognise it either not a brand name

    Not sure if anyone recognise it from picture

    https://photos.app.goo.gl/9mUrB5785g8hUQMw6

    Seen a few Ajax starter packs but for price they are probably just as good to pay for HKC install

    https://ifttt.com/connect/ring/hue
    Seems some integration with Ring Doorbell but not with alarm from what I can see

    The Yale Smart Alarm does link in with Hue


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators Posts: 23,901 Mod ✭✭✭✭Clareman


    The Yale links with Hue directly, it also can send emails which you can use to trigger other events or you can hook up to their APIs, there's a few repositories on Github with scripts which do a lot


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,350 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Yep I've got my Yale linked to my Hue lights, very nice feature IMO.

    It looks like Ring doesn't officially connect to Hue, but I see mention of it working via a third party app https://www.simplecommands.com, but no guarantee on that.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,350 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Superfoods wrote: »
    Seen the Ajax system. Seemingly it can integrate with existing systems. I have all wired sensors and then a few motion sensors. Anyone know which unit I need to install to integrate?

    Is it uartBridge or ocBridge Plus? any local installers?

    They have just launched a new product, not out yet, but it would allow you to take over those sensors:

    https://ajax.systems/products/multitransmitter/

    Only thing, if your wired sensors are shock sensors, I'm not certain that they would continue to work as shock sensors, they might only work as simple open/close sensors.

    The uartBridge or ocBridge Plus are for connecting Ajax sensors to your old system, rather then the other way around.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Superfoods


    bk wrote: »
    They have just launched a new product, not out yet, but it would allow you to take over those sensors:

    https://ajax.systems/products/multitransmitter/

    Only thing, if your wired sensors are shock sensors, I'm not certain that they would continue to work as shock sensors, they might only work as simple open/close sensors.

    The uartBridge or ocBridge Plus are for connecting Ajax sensors to your old system, rather then the other way around.


    Thanks, I was confused by the documentation on the Bridge. Mind you it is not hard to confuse me. The multitransmitter looks the job. I guess a standard alarm guy could fit?


    Where do people buy this kit? I have contacted the Irish company who do monitoring etc but I don't expect to be cheap and I don't expect them to re-use existing.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,070 ✭✭✭dam099


    Superfoods wrote: »
    https://ifttt.com/connect/ring/hue
    Seems some integration with Ring Doorbell but not with alarm from what I can see

    I found the IFTTT doorbell integration had terrible lag, lights could come on 15 seconds to minutes after the bell push. I used Stringify for a while until it shut down but havent bothered trying IFTTT to see if it has improved any.


  • Registered Users Posts: 461 ✭✭garion


    Superfoods wrote: »

    Where do people buy this kit? I have contacted the Irish company who do monitoring etc but I don't expect to be cheap and I don't expect them to re-use existing.


    I ordered my Ajax from Spain via https://best-alarm-system.eu/. I believe someone else in boards has used this reseller in Latvia - https://www.megateh.eu.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,308 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    I've used both of the above. The Latvians were cheaper but the Spanish were quicker and you can haggle with them. Their chat will give you a 10% discount. However at the time, megateh.eu were still cheaper on some items, hence using both.


  • Registered Users Posts: 222 ✭✭bifl


    bifl wrote: »
    Seriously thinking about the Ajax, although I am setup for pre-wired in the house. Should I stick with pre-wired if that is the case? Are there pre-wired Ajax equivalents?

    The other questions I have is what are the requirements for locating the Ajax control module. I would like a dual GSM and broadband control panel for redundancy but my problem is I have poor GSM signal in the house generally. Is there anything with Ajax to help extend the GSM receiving range?

    One more question on the Ajax. Can you set it based on your phone location. I have a logitech camera which does this currently and find it very useful. You walk away and it self arms as it were.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,267 ✭✭✭mcgovern


    bifl wrote: »
    One more question on the Ajax. Can you set it based on your phone location. I have a logitech camera which does this currently and find it very useful. You walk away and it self arms as it were.

    It doesn't arm automatically but you can set it to remind you (notification) to arm when you leave.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Superfoods


    Any massive advantage of the AJAX DoorProtect and the Plus? i know one has the vibrations but is that really required?


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,350 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    mcgovern wrote: »
    It doesn't arm automatically but you can set it to remind you (notification) to arm when you leave.

    My Yale does the same (notify you, but not arm) and I think this is actually better then auto-arming for alarms. I actually also have the same Logitech cameras.

    The problem with geo-fencing is the size of the area. I find I can get up to 500 meters from my home, before it sends the notification/arms.

    That might be ok if you are always driving too and from work. But if I just visit one of my neighbours or even the shop/pub/restaurant across the road, it still thinks you are at home and won't arm.

    As a result I prefer to get into the habit of always arming/disarming at the keypad in the hall. The notification is then a handy tool to remind me if I leave in a rush and forget to have armed it.
    Superfoods wrote: »
    Any massive advantage of the AJAX DoorProtect and the Plus? i know one has the vibrations but is that really required?

    Haha, ask that question over on the security form and they will eat you alive :D

    They have a strong opinion that shock sensors are very important.

    Imagine you have a big glass patio door and put a basic open/close sensor on it. Someone could smash the glass and just walk through the hole without actually triggering the open/close contact.

    Of course a PIR inside the house might catch them and eventually trigger the alarm, but they would already be deep into the house.

    A shock sensor protects against this by sensing someone trying to interfere with the glass. By smashing it or cutting it or removing it or even just tapping it to test. It allows the alarm to be triggered earlier.

    So yes, better to have a shock sensor then not have it, but depends on if you are willing to pay the extra or not. I admit my Yale system doesn't have shock sensors, it is simple open/close sensors only and it doesn't bother me too much, but might bother others a lot more.

    Keep in mind that Ajax has other perimeter sensors that might work better depending on your home.

    They have sensors that can hear the sound of breaking glass and they have external PIR's that might do a better job of protecting your home then shock sensors. But that depends on your property and needs.


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    bk wrote: »
    They have a strong opinion that shock sensors are very important.

    I would agree that inertia shock sensors are very important. For the record I do not install alarms anymore nor do I have any commercial interest in intruder alarms whatsoever. However, I have installed literally hundreds of intruder alarms and during this time I have been at a home following a burglary, so I have seen how entry was gained. In every case I saw it was not in any way "technical". A door or window was forced open or a window was smashed. So in each case I saw a shock sensor would have generated an alarm before a window or door was forced open / smashed or before access was made possible. It is also possible that had an alarm been fitted that had an imposing looking bell box such as a Pyronix Delta it may have acted as a sufficient deterrent

    I find that people that dismiss inertia shock sensors either have very limited experience with intruder alarms or are commercially aligned with systems that do not support them.
    Imagine you have a big glass patio door and put a basic open/close sensor on it. Someone could smash the glass and just walk through the hole without actually triggering the open/close contact.

    Exactly.
    Or they could remove the glass which os quite a simple and quick exercise for many PVC windows.
    Of course a PIR inside the house might catch them and eventually trigger the alarm, but they would already be deep into the house.

    PIR in a home are a great addition, but they have some major drawbacks:

    1) They must be switched off when you are in the home to allow complete freedom of movement for the occupants.
    2) They are only triggered when it is too late, i.e. the intruder has already gained entry to your home. In many senses “the horse has already bolted”.
    A shock sensor protects against this by sensing someone trying to interfere with the glass. By smashing it or cutting it or removing it or even just tapping it to test. It allows the alarm to be triggered earlier.


    Yes, sort off.

    Below is an analogy of how inertia shock sensors work:
    Think of a plastic box 1/2 full of very small ball bearings with a metal plate on each end. When rested the resistance between the metal plates is very low as all of the ball bearings are touching each other and the plate at each end. The intruder alarm constantly monitors this resistance. Now imagine the box is shaken from a vibration. These tiny ball bearings bounce around and momentarily fly into the air. For a brief moment they no longer touch each other. When in the air the resistance between the metal plates becomes very high (as air has a high resistance). This indicates that a vibration has been detected. What the alarm does is it measures two things:
    1) The time duration that the resistance is high, this is known as "gross attack".
    2) The frequency of the high / low resistance, this is known as "pulse count".

    The sensitivity of gross attack and pulse count can be adjusted to (from memory) around nine different levels of sensitivity to fine tune your windows / doors.

    The rested resistance of old inertia shock sensors can climb over time so they need to be replaced. A high quality professional wired shock sensor will cost around €8 and I am told that the wireless version of same is around €35 (as they are after my time I never bought these). When installed properly on any modern professional alarm system they are very reliable. Unfortunately they are frequently poorly installed which leads to many believing that they are unreliable.

    I admit my Yale system doesn't have shock sensors, it is simple open/close sensors only and it doesn't bother me too much, but might bother others a lot more.

    For those that live in an apartment with no vulnerable / accessible windows shock sensors bring very little to the party.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,267 ✭✭✭mcgovern


    Anyone with Ajax using Motion Protect? I have 4 of them and they seem to be next to useless, not sure if it's the devices or me doing something wrong.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,662 ✭✭✭Duke of Url


    Pulled the trigger and submitted my Order today for a self install.

    Ordered from here - https://www.megateh.eu/


    AJAX | Hub 2
    AJAX | Space Control
    AJAX | Door Protect
    AJAX | Street Siren
    AJAX | Leaks Protect
    AJAX | Fire Protect
    AJAX | Home Siren
    AJAX | Key Pad
    AJAX | Panic Button


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Superfoods


    In regards to the inertia. I had replied yesterday but I think boards had some issues.

    Based on initial price I think to cover the house it would cost an additional 400 euro for the inertia. Now I already have CCTV cameras and the 400 would allow me to buy at least another 2 with spare change. The house already has internal motion sensors and the plan would be to re-use. Also the external motion sensors would be something I would like to add to the system. SO yes I would love everything to have inertia but the money I think would be better spent on an entire security system


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Superfoods


    Pulled the trigger and submitted my Order today for a self install.

    Ordered from here - https://www.megateh.eu/


    AJAX | Hub 2
    AJAX | Space Control
    AJAX | Door Protect
    AJAX | Street Siren
    AJAX | Leaks Protect
    AJAX | Fire Protect
    AJAX | Home Siren
    AJAX | Key Pad
    AJAX | Panic Button


    Im confused by the hubs, which is best to go for? thanks


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,350 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Hehe, the conversation about shock sensors is always fun ;)

    Of course it is better to have shock sensors as an option, then not too. They absolutely have a place in a security systems along with all the other sensors.

    As you say though, the conversation over on the other forum can get too fundamental IMO. The conversation seems more driven by a particular installers favoured system and whether it supports shock sensors or not, rather then if someone actually needs them and the pros and cons.

    I think some see shock sensors as some silver bullet, while overlooking other options like External PIR's, curtain PIR's, glass break sensors, point to point sensors, etc. Again mostly because of the options that their preferred system offers.

    I'm delighted to see a DIY system like Ajax, that offers shock sensors, but also offers so many other options too, like mentioned above.

    I absolutely object to people who say that a system without shocksensors is useless. I find that argument completely bull.

    PIR's will still trigger your system, it will still frighten a burglar away, it will still wake you at night and it will still send you notifications. Sure the burglar may well have gotten further into your home before triggering the alarm, they may do more damage and may grab something on the way out.

    But most people don't care too much about that, afterall that is what you have home insurance for. What worries most people is not knowing that someone is sneaking around downstairs when the kids are in bed next door. An alarm without shocksensors will still wake you. Somewhat later, sure, but it still does the job.

    I think what you miss in this conversation is the cost of shock sensors. Now I know this doesn't apply to you 2011, given your background in installing alarm systems and your access to wholesale pricing, you can install a professional alarm system with shock sensors at cost price.

    But for most people that isn't an option. Most people don't have your skills in this area or your access to wholesale prices.

    For most people the choice is between a DIY Yale or Ring system with no shocksensors for about €300 or a pro installed system with shock sensors for more then €1000.

    Are shock sensors worth 20% or 30%, sure, of course. Are they worth 3 to 4 times more? Hmm.. that I'm not convinced of, maybe it is for some people, but not for me.

    And a lot of people simply can't afford a €1000+ alarm system, they simply don't have that money. Over 50% of homes have no alarm system, because most people can't afford it. I'd argue that a €300 system for them is better then non at all.

    I'm delighted to see €300 systems like Yale and Ring enter the market, because it makes alarm systems more accessible to more people. Is the protection they offer perfect, no? But it is far better then nothing.

    Then you have to ask are expensive shocksensors more important then IP cameras?

    Like my option was to buy a pro system with shock sensors for about €1200 and no IP cameras, as that would have totally blown my budget.

    Instead I went with my Yale system for about €400 (I bought lots of extra sensors) and then spent another €300 or 8 IP cameras (mix of Yi and Logitech Cicrle). Total cost about €700

    Personally I feel that this gives me a far superior security setup then a pro system with shock sensors on it's own and still about another €500 in my pocket.

    So I think it is far more complicated conversation then shock sensors good, not having them bad. Really it depends and that is without talking about using external PIR's, which I think can be more useful for many homes.

    Having said all that, I'm delighted to see Honeyell and Ajax offer shock sensors on their systems, along with many other sensors and I'd love to see Yale/Ring to add them as an option too.

    After all the more choice and options the better.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,350 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Superfoods wrote: »
    In regards to the inertia. I had replied yesterday but I think boards had some issues.

    Based on initial price I think to cover the house it would cost an additional 400 euro for the inertia. Now I already have CCTV cameras and the 400 would allow me to buy at least another 2 with spare change. The house already has internal motion sensors and the plan would be to re-use. Also the external motion sensors would be something I would like to add to the system. SO yes I would love everything to have inertia but the money I think would be better spent on an entire security system

    Haha, exactly my own view. Just as I posted in a long post above pretty much saying the same. Inertia sensors are definitely nice to have, but they are just one part of an overall security system and you have to balance the extra cost of them versus say spending that money on another part of the system like cameras.

    I personally opted for a system without shock sensors for one with lots of cameras myself.

    It is a balancing act.


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Superfoods wrote: »
    Now I already have CCTV cameras and the 400 would allow me to buy at least another 2 with spare change.

    Overt CCTV cameras are a great deterrent is this what you are planning?
    Obviously these will not trigger an intruder alarm so if ignored or otherwise dealt with (hoodie) they will not activate the intruder alarm.
    The house already has internal motion sensors and the plan would be to re-use.

    Makes sense but as per my last post they have some limitations that you need to be aware of.
    Also the external motion sensors would be something I would like to add to the system.

    This is not advisable. The reason this is not normal practice is this approach is highly likely to generate frequent false alarms.

    The alternative is something like this. I have used similar devices (carefully placed) in to cover large outdoor areas. It is essentially a transmitter & receiver with tamper and dry contacts.
    SO yes I would love everything to have inertia but the money I think would be better spent on an entire security system

    That is your call, each installation has to be assessed depending on risk, budget etc.. There is not a one size fits all solution.

    The reality is that often "DIY systems" actually cost more than professional systems that have these important security features as standard. My advice would be to buy a system that can take advantage of shock sensors so that you have the option of fitting them at a later date should you wish. In my view the ability of a security system to work with Philips Hue should not be considered anything like as important as the ability to have analysed zones.

    For me it is essential that my intruder alarm is extremely robust, has descent battery back up, multiple communications paths, has camera PIR's, generates no false alarms, provides a great visual deterrent and can be controlled via an app. Everything after that is just a bit of fun so I treat it accordingly.
    bk wrote: »
    I personally opted for a system without shock sensors for one with lots of cameras myself.

    Yes, but you live in an apartment. So vulnerable windows may be less of an issue.

    With respect, you will also find that when you fit many intruder alarms professionally and learn from this that your view on what is most appropriate and what works best will change :)
    It is a balancing act.

    Agreed.
    There is not a one size fits all solution.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Superfoods


    2011 wrote: »
    Overt CCTV cameras are a great deterrent is this what you are planning?
    Obviously these will not trigger an intruder alarm so if ignored or otherwise dealt with (hoodie) they will not activate the intruder alarm.



    Makes sense but as per my last post they have some limitations that you need to be aware of.



    This is not advisable. The reason this is not normal practice is this approach is highly likely to generate frequent false alarms.

    The alternative is something like this. I have used similar devices in carparks that are surrounded by railings with a locked gate in car dealerships to cover large areas. It is essentially a transmitter & receiver



    That is your call, each installation has to be assessed depending on risk, budget etc.. There is not a one size fits all solution.

    The reality is that often "DIY systems" actually cost more than professional systems that have these important security features as standard. My advice would be to buy a system that can take advantage of shock sensors so that you have the option of fitting them at a later date should you wish. In my view the ability of a security system to work with Philips Hue should not be considered anything like as important as the ability to have analysed zones.

    For me it is essential that my intruder alarm is extremely robust, has descent battery back up, multiple communications paths, has camera PIR's, generates no false alarms, provides a great visual deterrent and can be controlled via an app. Everything after that is just a bit of fun so I treat it accordingly.


    Ok my issue with HKC is the recurring cost. If I want to buy the equipment they are probably more or less the same cost. But if I go with Ajax I can have monitoring for zero at the moment. Maybe they will charge in future but who knows.

    Paying 8 euro per month to monitor is just price gouging in my opinion.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,662 ✭✭✭Duke of Url


    Superfoods wrote: »
    But if I go with Ajax I can have monitoring for zero at the moment. Maybe they will charge in future but who knows.

    Where do I find this information?

    I thought with Ajax you monitor yourself rather then a company.


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Superfoods wrote: »
    Ok my issue with HKC is the recurring cost.

    Forget HKC. I did not even mention HKC.

    If you want to avoid HKC’s €5 monthly monitoring recurring cost simply go Siemens or Ajax.
    Paying 8 euro per month to monitor is just price gouging in my opinion.

    It is €5, not €8. If you are paying €8 then the additional €3 is paid to your alarm installer.
    I don’t like paying for this service either but this covers all costs incurred for the world SIM card in the alarm.


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    bk wrote: »
    Obviously not simple PIR's but motion sensors specifically designed for outdoor use

    That is what I alluded to in my last post.
    Yep pretty cool, Ajax has support for those type of sensors too.

    I think you are under the impression that I have an issue with Ajax Alarms.
    Let me clarify, I don't. From what I have seen I am impressed although I have no direct experience with them.

    I do not share the view of many on the Home Security Forum do, which is that HKC is the only sensible solution. Many other professional systems tick the box for me.
    A sly and sad dig there about Hue. Really uncalled for!

    I think you are taking general comments as something that is aimed specifically at you. Forget about Yale, HKC, you and me. There is a bigger picture.
    - intruder alarm is extremely robust - Check, I'm extremely impressed with how robust my Yale alarm has worked.

    Robust is relative.
    Based on the systems you have direct experience with other intruder alarm systems what are you comparing it to?
    - multiple communications paths - No, the Yale doesn't have this unfortunately. Just one comms path. I'd prefer if it did, but living in an apartment, cutting the broadband connection is not an option for a burglar, so not a big deal for me.

    This can easily be added if a dry contact changes state or an output goes high in the event of an alarm activation.
    - provides a great visual deterrent - Check, a nice big yellow Yale bell box :D

    I think this is a matter of opinion.
    I do, but it is ground floor, with four big floor to ceiling windows right next to a path :D

    I'm still not concerned at all.

    I am glad you feel secure.
    Highly visible logitech circle external camera overlooking the patio. Extra internal cameras.

    These sound like a great addition.
    Glass is high security glass and is internally beaded. I'm pretty damn well covered :)

    That sounds fab.
    Yeah, like the professional alarm installer from a well known company in Dublin who installed my HKC 812 panel directly above the keypad behind a door that was on a entry timer :rolleyes:

    I see you are angry about this poor install of a dated panel, however I am not sure what your point is.

    I am all for DIY but I think advice has to go beyond defending what you have personally purchased at all costs. Your anti inertia shock sensor position seems to be based on Yale not being able to support these devices.
    I don't think this attitude of, you aren't an installer, so your opinion doesn't count is helpful at all. It doesn't allow for fair and honest discussion.

    Speaking as someone that is not an installer I couldn't agree more.

    However, having installed many an intruder alarm in the past and having worked on my tools as a time served electrician / controls technician for well over decade I believe that I have learnt a thing or two.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,720 ✭✭✭degsie


    Professional alarm installers are very defensive about their corner of the home security market and woe betide those diy enthusiasts who dare encroach!


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