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Peter Mark price gouging

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,993 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    screamer wrote: »
    The truth is they are charging more because they can’t squeeze enough people into their salons, so now, a bum on a seat will pay extra for the privilege. As for color corrections unless someone has made a total horses arse of their hair that’s a pile of junk too. It’s nothing to do with extra product or time, it’s reduced capacity meaning that if they average half the clients they used to, those clients will pay twice the price. I don’t agree with it at all, it is total gouging. I learned to highlight my own hair and they can keep their high prices, I’ll do DIY, for a quarter the cost.

    Its not price gouging...

    So you expect a hairdresser to work at a loss? Colour corrections can take 4-5 hours...

    Just look all over instagram to see people making a balls of their hair...

    I did a bit of work with a hairdressers a few years back...(not cutting, just business driven)

    The costs associated with colouring someone's hair was mind-boggling, as was the time required as its basically a chemical reaction and takes time...

    I suggested itemized bills/invoices just to show where the money went and increase transparency to the clients, when implemented it stopped a lot of complaints about the costs...

    Peter Marks operate on the high street, have much bigger overheads...Now i'm show their suppliers give them better deals but imagine their rent & insurance bills compared to a hairdressers down some side street or retail park in a residential estate


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭GinSoaked


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    Its not price gouging...

    So you expect a hairdresser to work at a loss? Colour corrections can take 4-5 hours...

    Just look all over instagram to see people making a balls of their hair...

    I did a bit of work with a hairdressers a few years back...(not cutting, just business driven)

    The costs associated with colouring someone's hair was mind-boggling, as was the time required as its basically a chemical reaction and takes time...

    I suggested itemized bills/invoices just to show where the money went and increase transparency to the clients, when implemented it stopped a lot of complaints about the costs...

    Peter Marks operate on the high street, have much bigger overheads...Now i'm show their suppliers give them better deals but imagine their rent & insurance bills compared to a hairdressers down some side street or retail park in a residential estate

    So you are saying a trained hairdresser will stay with a customer for 4-5 hours and do nothing else?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,126 ✭✭✭screamer


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    Its not price gouging...

    So you expect a hairdresser to work at a loss? Colour corrections can take 4-5 hours...

    Just look all over instagram to see people making a balls of their hair...

    I did a bit of work with a hairdressers a few years back...(not cutting, just business driven)

    The costs associated with colouring someone's hair was mind-boggling, as was the time required as its basically a chemical reaction and takes time...

    I suggested itemized bills/invoices just to show where the money went and increase transparency to the clients, when implemented it stopped a lot of complaints about the costs...

    Peter Marks operate on the high street, have much bigger overheads...Now i'm show their suppliers give them better deals but imagine their rent & insurance bills compared to a hairdressers down some side street or retail park in a residential estate

    they can cut staff to cut costs, half the clients equals half the staff..... but I expect to see a lot closing down after the initial surge they’ll have between staff who will open on the side and take clients with them and people not willing to pay the ridiculous prices.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,993 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    GinSoaked wrote: »
    So you are telling a trained hairdresser will stay with a customer for 4-5 hours and do nothing else?

    With the current restrictions they can't just pop between clients as easily...

    If peroxide takes 30 minutes to develop, the hairdresser will need to change PPE, disinfect work station...Lets say that 5 minutes, between each client...The hairdresser has 20 minutes...What they can do in that time is limited in the Post-CoVid world...

    In the past the hairdresser would move between 2-3 clients in that time, doing cuts, maybe blow drys, washes etc...But with limited capacity and ppe rules and disinfection rules its very hard to work on numerous clients at the same time

    Also 4-5 hours is a big correction or change...Depending on loads of factors...

    If its just cuts that very different, but will colours there is lot of waiting...

    I know my barber, has to leave 5 minutes between appointments, disinfect the chair and all equipment, wear all new ppe and that for each client...Those all affect costs


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,993 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    screamer wrote: »
    they can cut staff to cut costs, half the clients equals half the staff..... but I expect to see a lot closing down after the initial surge they’ll have between staff who will open on the side and take clients with them and people not willing to pay the ridiculous prices.

    You cut staff number, you in affect cut the capacity of clients you can take...Most places will be open 6 days a week now for extended hours to cope with demand and adhere to the guidelines


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,126 ✭✭✭screamer


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    You cut staff number, you in affect cut the capacity of clients you can take...Most places will be open 6 days a week now for extended hours to cope with demand and adhere to the guidelines

    Exactly, you’ll be able to take less clients so you need less staff...... that’s exactly my point. So staff cuts will be needed.
    If there’s not enough hours in the day to get everyone through the door well charging extra can’t fix that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,993 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    screamer wrote: »
    Exactly, you’ll be able to take less clients so you need less staff...... that’s exactly my point. So staff cuts will be needed.
    If there’s not enough hours in the day to get everyone through the door well charging extra can’t fix that.

    Overheads are fixed costs in most cases, so they don't change, rent, rates, insurance...Cutting staff who you have work is isn't a good business decision

    Well my barber is booked for 3 weeks straight already, his actually able to give all his staff full time hours for the next 3 months due to extended opening hours...

    Peter Marks is fairly well booked too so they don't need to cut staff...

    To accommodate the staff & guidelines many places will open an extra day or 2 a week


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,651 ✭✭✭US2


    So if you coloured it yourself during lockdown = extra fees

    Or if you left it alone and your hair grew 2cms = extra fees.


    Why didnt they just put the extra fees across the board?

    I'm a man but lockdown has made me realise I waste 25e a month on haircuts , the wife has given me 3 fine cuts since march


  • Registered Users Posts: 111 ✭✭sunshinew


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    With the current restrictions they can't just pop between clients as easily...

    If peroxide takes 30 minutes to develop, the hairdresser will need to change PPE, disinfect work station...Lets say that 5 minutes, between each client...The hairdresser has 20 minutes...What they can do in that time is limited in the Post-CoVid world...

    In the past the hairdresser would move between 2-3 clients in that time, doing cuts, maybe blow drys, washes etc...But with limited capacity and ppe rules and disinfection rules its very hard to work on numerous clients at the same time

    Also 4-5 hours is a big correction or change...Depending on loads of factors...

    If its just cuts that very different, but will colours there is lot of waiting...

    I know my barber, has to leave 5 minutes between appointments, disinfect the chair and all equipment, wear all new ppe and that for each client...Those all affect costs

    Then that's what they should have used as their explanation for price hikes.... Explain the reduced capacity Vs viability of business.... Not blame the customer for their hair growing!!!! It's farcical.

    I go to Peter Marks for a trim about 4 times a year, get my hair dyed about twice a year. I put in those wash out dyes at home all the time, go in with roots 3 inches long...and never, ever been charged more. They would have had way more understanding from the public if they had taken the approach that the new way of working is costing them loads more money in overheads, instead of blaming the customer.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,200 ✭✭✭beachhead


    Peter Marks were always a ripoff.Never needed Covid to empty a person's account.Apprentices spend more time on the hair compared to "experienced" stylist in my opinion.Go bald or get a Sinead.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,126 ✭✭✭screamer


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    Overheads are fixed costs in most cases, so they don't change, rent, rates, insurance...Cutting staff who you have work is isn't a good business decision

    Well my barber is booked for 3 weeks straight already, his actually able to give all his staff full time hours for the next 3 months due to extended opening hours...

    Peter Marks is fairly well booked too so they don't need to cut staff...

    To accommodate the staff & guidelines many places will open an extra day or 2 a week

    I’m not going to bother arguing with you over it, but it’s a basic thing less work is less staff, regardless they’re booked out, there’s now a limit on productivity, and the more staff in a salon the fewer clients they’ll be able to accommodate with social distancing, so there will be no need for 20 staff in a salon to work on 6 clients... that’s unnecessary overhead and cost right there, and unjustified to charge extra to clients. Business models will need to change and be more streamlined, gouging will only get them so far.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,629 ✭✭✭jrosen


    Most salons I would imagine will be working at less capacity. They will be loosing every second seat to maintain distance between clients and staff, they wont be able to use every basin like the normally would. Staff wont be able to all be in the color room at once. Some salons are also opening later, opening on their Monday they would usually close to try and accommodate customers. Less customers per day doesnt equal needing less staff. The staff will take longer to get through each client therefore less able to accommodate their usual client numbers per day.

    But hey this is what the public wanted wasnt it, what the IHF wanted too. Salons back open. This comes at a cost.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,993 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    screamer wrote: »
    I’m not going to bother arguing with you over it, but it’s a basic thing less work is less staff, regardless they’re booked out, there’s now a limit on productivity, and the more staff in a salon the fewer clients they’ll be able to accommodate with social distancing, so there will be no need for 20 staff in a salon to work on 6 clients... that’s unnecessary overhead and cost right there, and unjustified to charge extra to clients. Business models will need to change and be more streamlined, gouging will only get them so far.

    Each Hairdresser is only allowed 1 client in the salon at the time(depending on how you interpret the guidelines) so for a big colour change of 4 hours you need to cover overhead, ppe, colours etc & hairdressers wage...

    I'm not defending the cost of womens hair, its very expensive, but the colours, treatments, highlights etc cost a decent chuck of money...My mother gets her hair coloured, it required 4 tubes of colour @ €5-6 each and it takes roughly 90-120 minutes


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,369 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    I see a well known barbers where I line (Kilkenny ) advertising men’s haircuts have gone up to €25!
    Now I’m not sure how much they charged previously but can’t imagine it was any more than the €12-18 range. Fair enough the ppe needed but seems like an extremely steep price increase.
    Thing is once these higher prices come in they tend to stick around. €25 for a mans haircut is very expensive on a regular basis. I pay half that usually


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,099 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    €25 would be extremely dear even compared to other places increased prices; if its the price for a conventional cut. Skin fades could be costing that much though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,369 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    L1011 wrote: »
    €25 would be extremely dear even compared to other places increased prices; if its the price for a conventional cut. Skin fades could be costing that much though.

    It just mans haircut so I assume a short back and sides and cut on top.
    Top trendy Dublin barbers maybe but seems excessive to me. I wouldn’t pay that for a cut unless it was something exceptional
    https://www.facebook.com/141843474859/posts/10158448458674860/


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,099 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Yeah, that's not going to go well for them I'd think!


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,369 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    L1011 wrote: »
    Yeah, that's not going to go well for them I'd think!

    Your man tries to be fairly high profile (got a haircut there once, thought it was ****e, your man full of ****e) and it was more expensive than my usual spot.
    Not sure how representative the price increase are nationally but thats a massive increase


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    Haven't read all the posts but before Covid if you went to PM having spent your previous whole life using box colours, you were not charged extra to 'fix it'. And you never got berated for it either. I know as I was often that person and I know many other women who did the same. The extra charge now is due to them having to take less customers per day/week, nothing to do with the state of anyone's hair.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 154 ✭✭Flimsy_Boat


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    Haven't read all the posts but before Covid if you went to PM having spent your previous whole life using box colours, you were not charged extra to 'fix it'. And you never got berated for it either. I know as I was often that person and I know many other women who did the same. The extra charge now is due to them having to take less customers per day/week, nothing to do with the state of anyone's hair.

    This is the crux of the issue. Peter Mark is not being transparent, they are blaming clients for their own struggle in the down economy.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,045 ✭✭✭silver2020


    road_high wrote: »
    I see a well known barbers where I line (Kilkenny ) advertising men’s haircuts have gone up to €25!
    Now I’m not sure how much they charged previously but can’t imagine it was any more than the €12-18 range. Fair enough the ppe needed but seems like an extremely steep price increase.
    Thing is once these higher prices come in they tend to stick around. €25 for a mans haircut is very expensive on a regular basis. I pay half that usually

    Unfortunately their rent hasn't decreased, nor rates, nor electricity etc.

    But they probably can only fit half the clients at a time, so there has to be a recalculation of cost and what has to be charged.

    Any premium barbers has always been €16-€20.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭GinSoaked


    silver2020 wrote: »
    Unfortunately their rent hasn't decreased, nor rates, nor electricity etc.

    But they probably can only fit half the clients at a time, so there has to be a recalculation of cost and what has to be charged.

    Any premium barbers has always been €16-€20.

    Doesn't have to work that way. One local place has put dividers between the chairs and doing twice the normal work. Usually 1-3 girls working with 6 chairs now they have had five working the couple of times I've walked past. Five working on a Tuesday morning at 10am when you would normally have two girls sat round talking won't take that long to pay for the overheads and extra PPE.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,045 ✭✭✭silver2020


    GinSoaked wrote: »
    Doesn't have to work that way. One local place has put dividers between the chairs and doing twice the normal work. Usually 1-3 girls working with 6 chairs now they have had five working the couple of times I've walked past. Five working on a Tuesday morning at 10am when you would normally have two girls sat round talking won't take that long to pay for the overheads and extra PPE.

    That may be one place, but I'd prefer a place that had far more distancing.

    In above, it possibly means the staff are on top of each other all day. And they may be flat out for a couple of weeks, but what will it be like after that?


    At the same time, if I'm paying €18-€20 I expect a proper cut and not just a blade thrown about.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭GinSoaked


    silver2020 wrote: »
    That may be one place, but I'd prefer a place that had far more distancing.

    In above, it possibly means the staff are on top of each other all day. And they may be flat out for a couple of weeks, but what will it be like after that?


    At the same time, if I'm paying €18-€20 I expect a proper cut and not just a blade thrown about.

    Hard to get more social distancing than a 2 meter deep floor to ceiling screen between each chair.

    Plenty of money to be made in a couple of weeks that would probably be as much trade as they'd normally do in 6 or more weeks. Most salons are normally only busy at the weekend and the ones my mother used to run traditionally closed on Monday and had not much more than a skeleton staff apart from Friday and Saturday when everyone worked and part timers came in. They did plenty of work during the week but nothing like the work at the weekend.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,484 ✭✭✭Allinall


    Got my hair cut in the local village barber yesterday.

    He put up his prices for a blade cut from €10 to €12.

    I told him he missed a trick and was still too cheap. Should have gone for €15.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭GinSoaked


    Allinall wrote: »
    Got my hair cut in the local village barber yesterday.

    He put up his prices for a blade cut from €10 to €12.

    I told him he missed a trick and was still too cheap. Should have gone for €15.

    Hope you gave him at least a €3 tip :D


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