Haye vs Bellew

walshb · 07-03-2017 12:02pm

MD1990 wrote: »

Also Haye providing an update after getting surgery is not a big deal as you are trying to make it out to be.

I never mentioned Froch or anyone during the fight. I mentioned Sky as regards the post fight ring interview.

Sweet Science · 07-03-2017 12:05pm

walshb wrote: »

I never mentioned Froch or anyone during the fight. I mentioned Sky as regards the post fight ring interview.

The reason Sky didn't mention it is because of Matchroom . They want to build another Matchroom fighter up.

Look at Bellews twitter page today. Hinting at fighting Tyson Fury. The money machine keeps rolling.

As long as Sky and Matchroom and intertwined like they are at moment don't be surprised by anything.

It's the same as UFC and Fox Sports in the states .

blade1 · 07-03-2017 12:17pm

walshb wrote: »

Of course he was used. But he himself, his natural persona and presence sold the tickets. Very little had to be done. His look alone was the seller, and of course, his ring performances and fighting style, all natural and not at all embellished. That's a bit different than what I believe you are trying to show.

No the point was people on about the fake animosity between Haye and Bellew.
I said it was going on for donkeys years.
I used a few names off the top of my head and the weakest one was pinpointed by you and someone else to go against what I said.

walshb · 07-03-2017 12:29pm

blade1 wrote: »

No the point was people on about the fake animosity between Haye and Bellew.
I said it was going on for donkeys years.
I used a few names off the top of my head and the weakest one was pinpointed by you and someone else to go against what I said.

I wasn't getting at you to go against you. I just felt that the Tyson example was well off. He would be the most anti contrived riling fighter I could think of when he was competing at or close to his prime. The guy was juts a menace. Plain and simple.

blade1 · 07-03-2017 12:36pm

walshb wrote: »

I wasn't getting at you to go against you. I just felt that the Tyson example was well off. He would be the most anti contrived riling fighter I could think of when he was competing at or close to his prime. The guy was juts a menace. Plain and simple.

Yes, I didn't mean otherwise to come across.
If I sat down and thought about it I could have chosen probably loads of better examples.
I do feel he did lap up his baddest man on the planet persona though even if he was used by the people around him.

nacho libre · 07-03-2017 1:04pm

walshb wrote: »

We all knew he'd inform us of his injury at some stage. His not mentioning it post fight interview was not an act of class and sportsmanship, but actually dishonesty.

![/QUOTE]

If he had mentioned the injury the vast majority of people would see it as being ungracious in defeat, especially given few thought Bellew would win. There are countless examples of boxers not admitting to serious injury in defeat as a mark of respect to the winner.

He properly privately does believe the injury cost him, and he would be right to believe that as he was winning prior to the achilles rupturing.

I'm surprised you think Shane Mc Guigan was right to keep him in there as long as he did. How on one leg is he going to generate the power to land a knock out blow? Also it was risking making a bad injury even more severe by letting him continue on.

walshb · 07-03-2017 1:21pm

Have you me mixed up with someone else? I haven't mentioned Shane.

nacho libre · 07-03-2017 1:27pm

walshb wrote: »

Have you me mixed up with someone else? I haven't mentioned Shane.

Sorry. You're right, it was Pacman.

Blanco100 · 07-03-2017 3:09pm

Jesus that Adam Smith from Sky was insufferable the other night. "This is fascinating stuff" he must have said that about 20 times.

He talks some absolute sh*te. He sounded like he shot his load multiple times during the fight and quite frankly having seen him gazing lovingly at the fighters during the press conferences then it wouldnt surprise me if he had.

murphyebass · 07-03-2017 7:36pm

I haven't really followed the post match stupidity after the farce that it was but Haye is on the sky sports app bugging up a second fight with a potential third and people will remember the fights for decades to come. The man is actually deluded. Lol

Morrison J · 07-03-2017 7:47pm

murphyebass wrote: »

I haven't really followed the post match stupidity after the farce that it was but Haye is on the sky sports app bugging up a second fight with a potential third and people will remember the fights for decades to come. The man is actually deluded. Lol

Sadly your average boxing fan in the UK is just as deluded and the rematch will do stupidly big numbers.

murphyebass · 07-03-2017 7:49pm

Morrison J wrote: »

Sadly your average boxing fan in the UK is just as deluded and the rematch will do stupidly big numbers.

True. Don't get me wrong I'm probably as casual as they come but the Brezeale fight the previous week was epic in comparison

Alf Veedersane · 07-03-2017 7:57pm

Fighter with few options for a decent payday plugs a rematch.

I, for one, am massively surprised.

nacho libre · 07-03-2017 8:06pm

pac_man wrote: »

T

And that leads me onto this point, From watching the fight back again, Bellew didn't land anything significant and Haye didn't take too many shots. We're talking about cruiserweight who has slightly above average punching power.

.

Sometimes a fighter can be too brave for his own good. With some injuries the coach has to go against the wishes of the fighter. As we saw recently with Brook.

Haye was on one leg, and letting him continue risked his career. McGuigan should have over ruled his fighter and pulled him out.

Also there was little chance of Haye getting Bellew out of there, given the fact he could easily see what coming from Haye after the injury occurred.
It wasn't a fair contest after the sixth round.

Alf Veedersane · 07-03-2017 8:14pm

nacho libre wrote: »

Sometimes a fighter can be too brave for his own good. With some injuries the coach has to go against the wishes of the fighter. As we saw recently with Brook.

Haye was on one leg, and letting him continue risked his career. McGuigan should have over ruled his fighter and pulled him out.

Also there was little chance of Haye getting Bellew out of there, given the fact he could easily see what coming from Haye after the injury occurred.
It wasn't a fair contest after the sixth round.

If he thought there was a chance he could land a big one then you take a chance. If Haye was young and a risk would jeopardise fights & paychecks...but Haye is 36 and while they thought he had a puncher's chance, it was a fair enough call.

If it had been Frampton, different ball game.

walshb · 07-03-2017 8:55pm

pac_man wrote: »

Dishonesty seems like a strange word to use in this context. I'm still kinda muddled by the point you're trying to make. Do you accept that the injury hindered his performance, yes or no? If you do accept that it has, what difference does it make as to weather he mentions it immediately after a fight.

I don't think it is a strange word to use. With the injury being so obvious, as well as it really appearing to affect him, his not mentioning it comes across dishonest/deceptive.

nacho libre · 07-03-2017 10:21pm

pac_man wrote: »

He wasn't getting a beating, that's the point I'm trying to make. If he was, take him out. We're talking about Bellew here who has been down numerous times in his career at LHW, i'd take the chance. To use a cliche particularly with heavyweights, one punch can change a fight, just like Danny Williams below.

He wasn't taking a beating, but he was risking his career by the fight being prolonged, if he is in his early twenties, you might argue it would be worth the risk. At 36, the chances him of coming back from it are even harder.
It stopped being a contest for me when he was on one leg. Bellew could see everything coming, so the chances of Haye landing a knockout punch was very slim. Also Bellew has shown much better punch resistance at the higher weights than at light heavyweight.

walshb · 07-03-2017 10:26pm

Shane being criticised for not pulling Haye doesn't make sense to me. He wasn't taking a beating and was still firing shots. Plenty of examples of reckless cornermen allowing their fighters out rd after rd to take a beating, with and without injuries. Haye and Shane are not comparable.

nacho libre · 07-03-2017 10:46pm

walshb wrote: »

Shane being criticised for not pulling Haye doesn't make sense to me. He wasn't taking a beating and was still firing shots. Plenty of examples of reckless cornermen allowing their fighters out rd after rd to take a beating, with and without injuries. Haye and Shane are not comparable.

It makes a lot of sense to me to pull a fighter out when he risks long term injury, or a possible career ending one, in a fight he has a slim hope of winning due to said injury, regardless of whether he is taking a beating or not.
I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this.

walshb · 07-03-2017 10:53pm

nacho libre wrote: »

It makes a lot of sense to me to pull a fighter out when he risks long term injury, or a possible career ending one, in a fight he has a slim hope of winning due to said injury, regardless of whether he is taking a beating or not.
I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this.

I get the point about living to fight another day. I just think that in the moment Shane and Haye probably really felt they could turn it around.

SHOVELLER · 08-03-2017 5:16am

Paulie officially retires. No real surprise but nice write up below. Having seen him fight and meeting him in Vegas seems like a nice chap and has obviously grown up from the loose mouth and wild hair!

http://www.boxingscene.com/paulie-malignaggi-magic-man-decides-call-it-day--114327?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Halloween Jack · 08-03-2017 9:08am

SHOVELLER wrote: »

Paulie officially retires. No real surprise but nice write up below. Having seen him fight and meeting him in Vegas seems like a nice chap and has obviously grown up from the loose mouth and wild hair!

http://www.boxingscene.com/paulie-malignaggi-magic-man-decides-call-it-day--114327?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Despite all the tawdriness boxing still inspires great writing and generates great stories like no other sport.

That_Guy · 08-03-2017 12:16pm

So I decided to spend my morning catching up on this shíte. Why did I do this to myself?

Sky should be ashamed of themselves for hyping that farce as any sort of victory for boxing.

Haye actually showed a bit of bravery in continuing on and even winning a few rounds on one leg. Bellew unable to finish a fighter with zero offence on one leg over 6 rounds...

I want to love boxing as I once did but fights like this would turn you off the sport.

Eddie Hearn and Sky are some shower altogether.

StringerBell · 08-03-2017 1:08pm

That_Guy wrote: »

So I decided to spend my morning catching up on this shíte. Why did I do this to myself?

Sky should be ashamed of themselves for hyping that farce as any sort of victory for boxing.

Haye actually showed a bit of bravery in continuing on and even winning a few rounds on one leg. Bellew unable to finish a fighter with zero offence on one leg over 6 rounds...

I want to love boxing as I once did but fights like this would turn you off the sport.

Eddie Hearn and Sky are some shower altogether.

What did you think of the Thurman/Garcia fight?

A Little Pony · 08-03-2017 2:41pm

Its the entertainment business, of course fighters are going to up it to sell the fights. As Tyson Fury once said, if people aren't interested, then it doesn't mean anything. You need to sell the fight, get people talking about it, investing in it with money and general interest.

nacho libre · 08-03-2017 2:52pm

That_Guy wrote: »

So I decided to spend my morning catching up on this shíte. Why did I do this to myself?

Sky should be ashamed of themselves for hyping that farce as any sort of victory for boxing.

Haye actually showed a bit of bravery in continuing on and even winning a few rounds on one leg. Bellew unable to finish a fighter with zero offence on one leg over 6 rounds...

I want to love boxing as I once did but fights like this would turn you off the sport.

Eddie Hearn and Sky are some shower altogether.

Sure these contrived grudge matches are nothing new and they are not unique to matchroom, but they are one of the best at marketing them. I could understand this annoyance if you were new to boxing. However any long time fans complaining about this it's hard to fathom. Also in the last month there has been some great fights. The pick being the heavyweight clash in Alabama a couple of weeks ago

PeterTheNinth · 08-03-2017 7:34pm

Ger Gilroy saying that Tony Bellew is on OTB tonight. I wonder will they tell Tony about what they were saying about him not being able to beat a one legged man.

Sweet Science · 08-03-2017 8:48pm

Haye's operation with Achilles. If you're any way squeamish probably best not to click on the link.

https://twitter.com/Natpirks/status/839465400958070785

Haye vs Bellew

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