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Puppy House (un)Training

  • 18-09-2019 9:34pm
    #1
    observer2u
    Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭


    Hi there,

    I am looking for some advice. We have a 17 week old beagle pup who we have been keeping in a confinement area while we are not in the house or at night complete with her crate and puppy pads etc. She is very good at peeing on the puppy pad only but ultimately I want her to start to associate peeing with outside only. We bring her out regularly and she will pee when we do but still randomly pees in the house when not in her confinement area....including on her day bed. She does not seem to associate peeing with outside. Prior to getting the confinement pen, she was crated at night which had some initial success with not peeing during the night but then she started wetting her bed. Since then we got a confinement area to help with training and while it has been good for alot of things, house training for peeing has gone backwards.

    Firstly - should we start locking crate at night and take up puppy pads from confinement area??. She is on her own for 2 days a week (bar lunch time walks for an hour) so I assume she would still need puppy pads during the day on the days when she is at home.....or would we assume that she could hold it for the 4 hour periods when we are not home.

    Note that she will never soil(poop) inside and actively goes to the door if she wants to poop which she does outside.

    We have been taking her to training and she's very good to learn at all other items but peeing seems to be an issue for her. She also pees alot with excitement when she but I assume she will grow out of this.


    Regards
    B


Comments

  • #2
    cocker5
    Registered Users Posts: 3,274 ✭✭✭cocker5


    OP you need to ditch the puppy pads ..

    They are confusing your pup.. they are telling her it’s fine to go inside.

    You need to set ur alarm clock and get up twice a night for 2 weeks then once a night on the 3rd week.. bring the dog outside, say a key word is ‘toilet’ or whatever and say nothing else ..
    say this word until she goes then praise her ... stay our until they go toilet

    do this during the day also when you bring the dog out .. praise when they go outside .. ignore when they go inside

    Key is be consistent


  • #3
    observer2u
    Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭observer2u


    Thanks for getting back to me. So your advice is to lock her in the crate at night and do the mid night bathroom breaks until she learns to hold it?

    To be honest be had been doing this but stopped when she was in the confinement area overnight as all advice seemed to say to put down a puppy pad.

    What do you suggest for leaving her during the day? Nothing down for her?


  • #4
    cocker5
    Registered Users Posts: 3,274 ✭✭✭cocker5


    observer2u wrote: »
    Thanks for getting back to me. So your advice is to lock her in the crate at night and do the mid night bathroom breaks until she learns to hold it?

    To be honest be had been doing this but stopped when she was in the confinement area overnight as all advice seemed to say to put down a puppy pad.

    What do you suggest for leaving her during the day? Nothing down for her?

    Honestly puppy pads are a nightmare to house train with .. they give her mixed signals - remove them completely

    Yes at night get up twice (no pads) stay out with her until she goes .. praise her when she does.
    Over the weeks reduce to once per night .. then no nightmare breaks

    During the day .. you mention someone is home except the 2 days per week .. those days she’s getting out at lunchtime .. 4 hours should be fine for her to hold it .. ignore her if she goes inside, pick her up straight away and bring outside.. give the que word .. ie toilet.. only day that word until she goes .. then praise again

    Before u go to work make sure she has enough time out the back to do her business etc

    How big is the confinement area?


  • #5
    observer2u
    Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭observer2u


    Hi there,

    the confinement area is approx 1.5m wide in both directions. We also have a back garden which is secure and have a insulated kennel which I plan to have as her long term sleeping arrangement (I suppose when she's older).

    My original preference was to leave her out back on the days when she is by herself but that again seems to be advised against by others from what I read.

    What do you think.... would you leave her inside in a confinement area (which she is almost able to get out of) or outside with the kennel open and a bed inside?

    Thanks
    B


  • #6
    cocker5
    Registered Users Posts: 3,274 ✭✭✭cocker5


    observer2u wrote: »
    Hi there,

    the confinement area is approx 1.5m wide in both directions. We also have a back garden which is secure and have a insulated kennel which I plan to have as her long term sleeping arrangement (I suppose when she's older).

    My original preference was to leave her out back on the days when she is by herself but that again seems to be advised against by others from what I read.

    What do you think.... would you leave her inside in a confinement area (which she is almost able to get out of) or outside with the kennel open and a bed inside?

    Thanks
    B

    To be honest 17 weeks is still very young to leave outside for the two days u guys are working - plus there’s always the risk of theft from your garden etc. I understand you have a secure garden but beagles are super smart and scale very high fences so for me I wouldn’t leave any dog unattended in the garden for long periods of time .. have you considered doggie day care ? For those 2 days? Great way to socialize your pup too

    OP was your intention to have her sleeping outside every night? Beagles are a smooth coat breed .. even with a nice insulated kennel I would suspect she’ll be cold .. again consider the fence scaling and theft as mention above.

    Beagles are also howlers so I would imagine if sleeping outside and disturbed (cat on fence) the dog would howl the neighborhood down .. not being negative just my thoughts.

    Anyway if I’m honest OP I hate the thought of dogs sleeping outside, my dogs are 💯 part of my family etc so sleeping in the kitchen so I can’t advise you to put her sleeping outside I’m afraid ..

    If you ditch the puppy pads and go back to basics - putting her outside after she eats, drinks, plays and at night.. say the key word, praise she will be trained in no time - beagles are super smart dogs

    Consistency .. for weeks / months will sort the issue out.

    Post a pic of your lovely pup OP


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  • #7
    observer2u
    Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭observer2u


    Hi there,

    I've taken your advice and removed puppy pads totally and have seen a great improvement....especially during the day....still one or two slip ups but thats to be expected.

    As we had originally been locking her in her crate at night and coming down to let her out once, I've gone back to that but on both nights since starting this again, I've literally had to lift her out of her sleep to bring her out so moving on the alarm 15mins every night to see if she can actually make it through the night.

    To clarify, we send her to doggy day care 3 days a week and she's at home the other 2 (to rest as much as anything as day care won' take a puppy 5 days a week) I expect there to be slip ups during the day but all good, at least we are back on track.

    thanks so much for your advice......don't know you have any tricks for addressing separation issues? Picture attached below.


  • #8
    One More Toy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,761 ✭✭✭One More Toy


    Doggos


  • #9
    cocker5
    Registered Users Posts: 3,274 ✭✭✭cocker5


    observer2u wrote: »
    Hi there,

    I've taken your advice and removed puppy pads totally and have seen a great improvement....especially during the day....still one or two slip ups but thats to be expected.

    As we had originally been locking her in her crate at night and coming down to let her out once, I've gone back to that but on both nights since starting this again, I've literally had to lift her out of her sleep to bring her out so moving on the alarm 15mins every night to see if she can actually make it through the night.

    To clarify, we send her to doggy day care 3 days a week and she's at home the other 2 (to rest as much as anything as day care won' take a puppy 5 days a week) I expect there to be slip ups during the day but all good, at least we are back on track.

    thanks so much for your advice......don't know you have any tricks for addressing separation issues? Picture attached below.

    Photos didn’t attach.. maybe try again?

    So glad to hear you guys are back on track!

    With regard to the night time if she’s sleeping through and no wee / poo in the morning then let her sleep through .. maybe at the nighttime she fine - you make that call.

    Ahh ok doggie day care is great for her .. agree she needs the 2 days to sleep / rest.

    If she is suffering from separation anxiety try the following - leave on radio some back ground noise for her, can you leave like a blanket / jumper with your scent on it ? Can give her comfort..

    Can you do a 15 mins walk / sniff before work? May help settle her

    Always stay calm when your leaving and when your return if you make too much of a fuss / big deal can cause her to feel insecure when alone

    Try pet rescue remedy .. add to her water might relax her a bit

    Build up leaving her over time even at the weekends .. leave her for one hour at a time then build up ..

    It can take months and sometimes longer for a dog to get over being alone sometimes they never adapt it’s hard for them for the 1st 8/10 weeks if their lives they were surrounded by their litter mates etc it just takes time

    Give her a teddy

    Google stuffed Kong’s - this can help take her mind off it .. don’t use food too rich until she’s house trained 100% .. use low fat cream cheese , pop in freezer and give it to her just before u leave .. this will distract etc


  • #10
    Sheepdish1
    Registered Users Posts: 618 ✭✭✭Sheepdish1


    observer2u wrote: »
    Hi there,

    the confinement area is approx 1.5m wide in both directions. We also have a back garden which is secure and have a insulated kennel which I plan to have as her long term sleeping arrangement (I suppose when she's older).

    My original preference was to leave her out back on the days when she is by herself but that again seems to be advised against by others from what I read.

    What do you think.... would you leave her inside in a confinement area (which she is almost able to get out of) or outside with the kennel open and a bed inside?

    Thanks
    B

    Hi OP, at this age their bladders aren’t fully developed. She needs to be supervised and will start to see her sniffing and possibly circling an area when she is about to pee. Use rewards ( chicken, ham) when she has finishing doing her wee outside. Crating at night will make it less likely but you need to give breaks every few hours.
    When you think about it toddlers are in nappies for years but we expect puppies to catch on after only a few weeks which is asking a lot :)

    Puppy pads teach the puppy wee by texture, they are easy for us but confusing for them so get rid of them.

    Don’t give out when she’s done a wee inside and don’t ever use crate or back garden for punishment as you want her to have a good association with them . By the time we find the wee the puppy has no idea why we are saying “no don’t do that”.

    She could be in a crate but only up to four hours at time. The day she’s on her own all day Should be broken up with someone visiting if possible.

    Beagles are great dogs but are not suitable to be left in back gardens in my opinion. Apart from the risk of it being stolen, They don’t like being left on their own for long periods of time.... they can be bellow quite a lot and can become destructive. If on their own they should be left with something to do.

    Eg scatter feed food and let them find it, get an enrichment toy that is safe to leave unsupervised.


  • #11
    tk123
    Registered Users Posts: 14,019 ✭✭✭✭tk123


    Just to add... it's normal for a puppy to not want to be alone and this is something you work on ie building up the time they're comfortable with in their on-going initial puppy training - I don't think I'd class this as "separation anxiety" as such BUT if you're worried seek the help of a qualified APDT behaviourist. Often people can be well meaning but slightly out of touch with modern thinking in the advice they give. One of my dogs DOES have separation anxiety and I've been given some terrible advice over the years by people who would have more of an old school approach - luckily I knew it was rubbish and ignored them lol :p


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  • #12
    Sheepdish1
    Registered Users Posts: 618 ✭✭✭Sheepdish1


    tk123 wrote: »
    Just to add... it's normal for a puppy to not want to be alone and this is something you work on ie building up the time they're comfortable with in their on-going initial puppy training - I don't think I'd class this as "separation anxiety" as such BUT if you're worried seek the help of a qualified APDT behaviourist. Often people can be well meaning but slightly out of touch with modern thinking in the advice they give. One of my dogs DOES have separation anxiety and I've been given some terrible advice over the years by people who would have more of an old school approach - luckily I knew it was rubbish and ignored them lol :p

    Yeah it’s always good to get professional opinion! Some people say to just ignore them when crying but I would find it hard to ignore anything crying for hours, it reminds me people advising parents to let a baby “cry it out” and seems a little old school. Puppies are only babies really!


  • #13
    observer2u
    Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭observer2u


    Thanks for all the replies. Photo now attached.

    Ironically she's had a poor tummy for the last few nights so midnight bowel movements have been at an all time high! :( However she's out the other side of it now.

    In relation to the separation issues, Yes perhaps your right in that she may not be too bad but we find that even to leave her alone for 10 minutes to go have a shower send her into a barking frenzy. I'v attempted to train her by starting with going for a minute and increasing etc. but she gets stressed almost instantly so its hard to build up any progression. On the days we go to work, she does calm down after a while and we always ensure that someone is home during the day to walk her etc. so for me its just about how I build up her confidence to be alone even for short periods. She's fine about it when going to bed at night but any other time sends her mental.


  • #14
    cocker5
    Registered Users Posts: 3,274 ✭✭✭cocker5


    observer2u wrote: »
    Thanks for all the replies. Photo now attached.

    Ironically she's had a poor tummy for the last few nights so midnight bowel movements have been at an all time high! :( However she's out the other side of it now.

    In relation to the separation issues, Yes perhaps your right in that she may not be too bad but we find that even to leave her alone for 10 minutes to go have a shower send her into a barking frenzy. I'v attempted to train her by starting with going for a minute and increasing etc. but she gets stressed almost instantly so its hard to build up any progression. On the days we go to work, she does calm down after a while and we always ensure that someone is home during the day to walk her etc. so for me its just about how I build up her confidence to be alone even for short periods. She's fine about it when going to bed at night but any other time sends her mental.

    She’s a beauty! I hope she’s feeling better now!

    Ok with regard to building up her confidence when leaving her to say have a shower .. try distracting her.. leave on the radio (some noise) consider a stuffed kong (any pet shop will sell Kong’s) this will distract her and keep her occupied when u leave her .. when u come back into the room don’t make too much of a big deal ... just go about things normally

    Does she have any teddies? Again can be great company again the kong brand do good sturdy teddies ..

    Give her a blanket with your smell on it ... pop it on ur bed for a few nights


  • #15
    MayoSalmon
    Registered Users Posts: 2,240 ✭✭✭MayoSalmon


    puppy pads are literally the stupidest invention ever created...


  • #16
    tk123
    Registered Users Posts: 14,019 ✭✭✭✭tk123


    MayoSalmon wrote: »
    puppy pads are literally the stupidest invention ever created...

    For toilet training maybe but I use them under and behind my dogs bowls to contain the food splattered and they work great lol :pac:


  • #17
    Choc Chip
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,442 ✭✭✭Choc Chip


    MayoSalmon wrote: »
    puppy pads are literally the stupidest invention ever created...

    They're deadly if you have pups that are too young to go outside yet...


  • #18
    terrydel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,881 ✭✭✭terrydel


    observer2u wrote: »
    Hi there,

    I've taken your advice and removed puppy pads totally and have seen a great improvement....especially during the day....still one or two slip ups but thats to be expected.

    As we had originally been locking her in her crate at night and coming down to let her out once, I've gone back to that but on both nights since starting this again, I've literally had to lift her out of her sleep to bring her out so moving on the alarm 15mins every night to see if she can actually make it through the night.

    To clarify, we send her to doggy day care 3 days a week and she's at home the other 2 (to rest as much as anything as day care won' take a puppy 5 days a week) I expect there to be slip ups during the day but all good, at least we are back on track.

    thanks so much for your advice......don't know you have any tricks for addressing separation issues? Picture attached below.

    Do you have anyone who could visit her on those two days? At a set time even just to let her out to pee.
    We've one just coming up to a year, he was so easy to house train, he's really clever but the fact we have a 3 year dog who's already house trained helped more than anything, he just copied her. Consistency is key as others have said, bring them out til they do it then lots of praise.


  • #19
    terrydel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,881 ✭✭✭terrydel


    MayoSalmon wrote: »
    puppy pads are literally the stupidest invention ever created...

    Not if you have a dog with incontinence.


  • #20
    MayoSalmon
    Registered Users Posts: 2,240 ✭✭✭MayoSalmon


    terrydel wrote:
    Not if you have a dog with incontinence.

    Yeah and back in the real world where 99% of dogs don't...


  • #21
    MayoSalmon
    Registered Users Posts: 2,240 ✭✭✭MayoSalmon


    tk123 wrote:
    For toilet training maybe but I use them under and behind my dogs bowls to contain the food splattered and they work great lol


    So your dog is eating where it smells like piss and **** to them.....okay pal


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  • #22
    Cherry Blossom
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Regional North West Moderators Posts: 6,928 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cherry Blossom


    MayoSalmon wrote: »
    Yeah and back in the real world where 99% of dogs don't...
    MayoSalmon wrote: »
    So your dog is eating where it smells like piss and **** to them.....okay pal

    MayoSalmon, I don't know what your problem is but there is a definate condescending undertone in these two posts. Adjust your attitude please. You are required to address other posters with respect and civility.

    Do not reply to this post on thread,

    Thanks,
    CB.


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