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Intellectuals weigh in on Cancel Culture

  • 07-07-2020 10:46pm
    #1
    Silentcorner
    Registered Users Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭


    "Intellectuals" are speaking up...150 of them are anyway, including Salman Rushdie, JK Rowling....they warn us of the dangers illiberalism that is creeping into our society and culture, the intolerance.

    Anyway, it is nice for all these liberals to tell us what many have been pointing out for years, but the fact that they point to the danger of Donald Trump and his threat to democracy as an example (they don't explain exactly how he is a threat to democracy) is in of itself an illiberal statement to make....but it's odd in that Trump's speech on July forth was in complete agreement with them...they probably watched the CNN/Bloomberg/MSNBC/NYT etc version.

    When will the penny finally drop with these intellectual liberals that it is they that have created, participated in, profited from, and either encouraged or did nothing to stop this culture gaining a foothold in academia, media and the arts over the last decade at least.

    They mention "the right" a couple of times, they neglect to identify or even mention the people pulling down statues, rioting, protesting demanding allegiance to what is a hard left political movement (BLM) at this very moment in time.

    Feminism (this wave)/SJW culture is rooted in hard left ideology which US academia is drenched in, what did they think was going to happen?

    https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate/


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Comments

  • #2
    Junkyard Tom
    Registered Users Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    These organisations are private, capitalist, businesses with hierarchical power structures, what have you got against free market? You wouldn't be a filthy Marxist calling for a more horizontal control of enterprise would you?


  • #3
    gmisk
    Registered Users Posts: 31,825 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    I personally think Trump is a threat to democracy.

    He continues to push the unfounded claims of millions of illegals voting (3-5 million ..which his own commission has said is nonsense) (it will be handy if he loses) all the while Pence and his wife voted by mail...by using an address they haven't lived at for 4+ years.

    All the while gerrymandering continues unabated.
    Plus polling places in predominantly black areas have also been slashed massively.


  • #4
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Both ends of the spectrum are problematic. The middle ground, where the vast majority of people reside, has lost ground to the extremists. Anti intellectualism, feelings over facts, witch hunts, divisive rhetoric.

    It's ugly.


  • #5
    Gods Gift
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,713 ✭✭✭Gods Gift


    Weigh in.


  • #6
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    The American culture 'wars' are confusing, sad, and a sign of a very broken society.

    I'd like to think that the wonderful EU project will continue to display what has been the most successful humanity project that the world has ever seen.

    We are the 1%, dudes. The most educated, lucky, wealthy, peaceful, and content people who have ever existed.


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  • #7
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    All Empires fall.


  • #8
    RWCNT
    Registered Users Posts: 1,430 ✭✭✭RWCNT


    Can someone explain to me how the hard left takeover of higher education took place exactly?

    I'm not long out of higher education myself and my lecturers mainly stuck to the syllabus around business management and economics. Was the lecturer tapping out The Communist Manifesto in morse code on his desk the whole time and I just didn't notice?


  • #9
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    RWCNT wrote: »
    Can someone explain to me how the hard left takeover of higher education took place exactly?

    I'm not long out of higher education myself and my lecturers mainly stuck to the syllabus around business management and economics. Was the lecturer tapping out The Communist Manifesto in morse code on his desk the whole time and I just didn't notice?

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_long_march_through_the_institutions

    It's not a conspiracy and its not organised but it is a problem.

    something like 8 or 9 out 10 teachers and lecturers in the UK are labour voters. Nothing wrong with being a labour voter but when its quite out of step with the general population i think there's an issue. How much indoctrination is happening?


  • #10
    2u2me
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,693 ✭✭✭2u2me


    "This stifling atmosphere will ultimately harm the most vital causes of our time. The restriction of debate, whether by a repressive government or an intolerant society, invariably hurts those who lack power and makes everyone less capable of democratic participation."


  • #11
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    They're sharks. They smell blood in the water, so they're throwing out their opinions. They'll swing another direction if they smell blood elsewhere. ie. money/attention.

    As Silentcorner said, they've been notably silent while normal people online were talking about it all, but now they decide to make some kind of stand? (although I suspect they're still humming and hawing over many issues, or being remarkably vague in others... seems they're more political than being concerned with social issues)

    Meh. Intellectuals are for the most part a thing of the past. Instead, we've got economists who have a better clue about what's going on, and are willing to make some kind of stand.


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  • #12
    Silentcorner
    Registered Users Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭Silentcorner


    It's at the stage that in the US in particular, you could do real damage to yourself in you go to university, besides the high college fees and associated debt that is...

    Can anyone way in with a suggestion on how I correct the thread title?


  • #13
    jam_mac_jam
    Registered Users Posts: 4,704 ✭✭✭jam_mac_jam


    I think they are right. Maybe we should have seen it sooner. I didn't. I thought it was just crazy people on Twitter.

    Maybe if those that are considered more left wing or "liberal" say it there will be more push back against the mass hysteria that is going on.

    Are you angry that they agree with you? Or is this I told you so?

    Fair enough, I hope many people on the left are realising what's happening and try and stop it.


  • #14
    lalababa
    Registered Users Posts: 1,726 ✭✭✭lalababa


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_long_march_through_the_institutions

    It's not a conspiracy and its not organised but it is a problem.

    something like 8 or 9 out 10 teachers and lecturers in the UK are labour voters. Nothing wrong with being a labour voter but when its quite out of step with the general population i think there's an issue. How much indoctrination is happening?

    The Tories have been running down the educational system over the last 15 years by slowly making it all but private...academy schools... Lowest buck wins. Tis of absolute no wonder why (if true) the educators are voting labour.


  • #15
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    lalababa wrote: »
    The Tories have been running down the educational system over the last 15 years by slowly making it all but private...academy schools... Lowest buck wins. Tis of absolute no wonder why (if true) the educators are voting labour.
    Yeah I get that


  • #16
    2u2me
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,693 ✭✭✭2u2me


    Deleted User wrote: »
    As Silentcorner said, they've been notably silent while normal people online were talking about it all, but now they decide to make some kind of stand? (although I suspect they're still humming and hawing over many issues, or being remarkably vague in others... seems they're more political than being concerned with social issues)

    To be fair you had a group of intellectuals (IDW) professing about this stuff for a long time. They were smeared with all sorts of names, racist, sexist, grifters etc.. etc..

    E.g. Sam Harris, Jordan Peterson, Brett & Eric Weinstein, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Claire Lehmann, Douglas Murray, Maajid Nawaz, Steven Pinker, Michael Shermer, etc.. etc..


  • #17
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    2u2me wrote: »
    To be fair you had a group of intellectuals (IDW) professing about this stuff for a long time. They were smeared with all sorts of names, racist, sexist, grifters etc.. etc..

    E.g. Sam Harris, Jordan Peterson, Brett & Eric Weinstein, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Claire Lehmann, Douglas Murray, Maajid Nawaz, Steven Pinker, Michael Shermer, etc.. etc..


    Peterson is the worst sort of spoofer. I wouldn't have him in the same sentence as Harris or Pinker.


  • #18
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,569 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    RWCNT wrote: »
    Can someone explain to me how the hard left takeover of higher education took place exactly?

    I'm not long out of higher education myself and my lecturers mainly stuck to the syllabus around business management and economics. Was the lecturer tapping out The Communist Manifesto in morse code on his desk the whole time and I just didn't notice?

    A lot of Irish third level institutions are very vocational oriented, but you still plenty egregious examples. To apply for a grant with the Irish research council you are pressured to make a gender statement, regardless of what field you are in. Many and all UCD hires now are marked during assessment on their diversity. We have centres of equality studies, gender studies and black studies. We have vice presidents of diversity in most of them now. I would say Irish universities have been left wing for decades, but incrementally have moved from Cultural liberalism to intolerantly progressive.


  • #19
    2u2me
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,693 ✭✭✭2u2me


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    Peterson is the worst sort of spoofer. I wouldn't have have in the same sentence as Harris or Pinker.

    I'd say he had a greater impact on contemporary culture as an intellectual than the other two.

    His opposition to compelled speech and cancel culture resonated with people.


  • #20
    emo72
    Registered Users Posts: 6,185 ✭✭✭emo72


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    Peterson is the worst sort of spoofer. I wouldn't have have in the same sentence as Harris or Pinker.

    I on the the other hand think Peterson is great. Never heard a bad word out of his mouth.


  • #21
    pjohnson
    Registered Users Posts: 23,137 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    Gods Gift wrote: »
    Weigh in.
    Its a very impressive Darwin to start of a thread about "intellectuals"


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  • #22
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,569 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    Peterson is the worst sort of spoofer. I wouldn't have have in the same sentence as Harris or Pinker.

    He has over 13,000 citations in academic papers. He has a H index of 54. https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=wL1F22UAAAAJ&hl=en&oi=ao

    You cant fake that. You can't to that without being in a top percentile of academics.

    Steven Pinker is brilliant, but fundamentally he isnt as multidisciplinary, like Peterson. Not lesser or anything but different.


  • #23
    Geuze
    Registered Users Posts: 13,051 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    RWCNT wrote: »
    Can someone explain to me how the hard left takeover of higher education took place exactly?

    I'm not long out of higher education myself and my lecturers mainly stuck to the syllabus around business management and economics. Was the lecturer tapping out The Communist Manifesto in morse code on his desk the whole time and I just didn't notice?

    In business and economics it would not be so evident.


  • #24
    Silentcorner
    Registered Users Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭Silentcorner


    pjohnson wrote: »
    Its a very impressive Darwin to start of a thread about "intellectuals"

    Start off.


  • #25
    jam_mac_jam
    Registered Users Posts: 4,704 ✭✭✭jam_mac_jam


    2u2me wrote: »
    I'd say he had a greater impact on contemporary culture as an intellectual than the other two.

    His opposition to compelled speech and cancel culture resonated with people.

    I agree. I don't like him or some of his ideas however he has resonated with a lot of people and has raised interesting questions.


  • #26
    pjohnson
    Registered Users Posts: 23,137 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    Silentcorner wrote: »
    Start off.

    I didnt want to appear lefty/unintellectual so I thought best to misspell ;)


  • #27
    Silentcorner
    Registered Users Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭Silentcorner


    pjohnson wrote: »
    I didnt want to appear lefty/unintellectual so I thought best to misspell ;)

    I did the same once...I think I got away with it!!


  • #28
    Junkyard Tom
    Registered Users Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    Peterson's political waffling is hilariously bad. Lobster behaviour means hierarchy in humans is 'natural' and postmodern Neo-Marxists have taken over the academia etc?

    It's just a load of age-old reactionary guff repackaged and sold to people with views they want confirmed by a 'credible' academic.


  • #29
    2u2me
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,693 ✭✭✭2u2me


    Do you still agree with this post Tom?
    Junkyard Tom wrote: »
    Sorry I find it difficult to give a shite about internal US College politics six thousand miles away and I find it odd that you do as a non-American.

    Also, you seem to be citing very tenuously linked events like newspaper articles about the IDW and a college professor and then inferring a grand conspiracy by a 'leftist faction' - you're joining random dots to try to make out a word that isn't there i.e. 'conspiracy'.

    Do you think the worldwide protests, riots and cultural revolution we're seeing is still a conspiracy?


  • #30
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    Junkyard Tom wrote: »
    Peterson's political waffling is hilariously bad. Lobster behaviour means hierarchy in humans is 'natural' and postmodern Neo-Marxists have taken over the academia etc?

    It's just a load of age-old reactionary guff repackaged and sold to people with views they want confirmed by a 'credible' academic.


    I've agreed with something Paul Murphy posted on Twitter, and Junkyard Tom posted on Boards.



    What a strange day.


    :D


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  • #31
    Geuze
    Registered Users Posts: 13,051 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    RWCNT wrote: »
    Can someone explain to me how the hard left takeover of higher education took place exactly?

    I'm not long out of higher education myself and my lecturers mainly stuck to the syllabus around business management and economics. Was the lecturer tapping out The Communist Manifesto in morse code on his desk the whole time and I just didn't notice?

    I don't know about "hard-left", but plenty of Greens and Labour.

    Spend time in any uni and you will see:

    diversity / inclusion
    seminars on these sorts of issues
    unconscious bias training
    bias/supports towards bogus AS
    women's studies / gender studies


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