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Ethiopian Airlines Crash/ B737MAX grounding

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Comments

  • #1082
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    None, all 737.


  • #1083
    Inquitus
    Registered Users Posts: 13,729 ✭✭✭✭Inquitus


    Graham wrote: »
    None, all 737.

    Aye Icelandair, Ryanair, Southwest airlines, and I am sure others, are all pretty much tied to the Max as they either exclusively operate 737's or intend to after getting rid of their older 757's. Puts them in a bit of a pickle.


  • #1084
    Bob24
    Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    Inquitus wrote: »
    Aye Icelandair, Ryanair, Southwest airlines, and I am sure others, are all pretty much tied to the Max as they either exclusively operate 737's or intend to after getting rid of their older 757's. Puts them in a bit of a pickle.

    Yes ... having only one airplane type is obviously cheaper and easier to operate, but putting all you eggs in the same basket does come with a risk.


  • #1085
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Ryanair have previously demonstrated they will cancel growth plans and return funds to shareholders rather than 'overpay' for aircraft. One of the advantages to such a young fleet is they're not under pressure to replace existing aircraft.

    Given the cyclical nature of the airline industry they know it's just a case of biding their time until Boeing hit a sticky more receptive patch.

    They are absolute masters at timing their orders to maximise value to Boeing.


  • #1086
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 33,866 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Graham wrote: »
    Add in the fact Ryanair were playing Boeing off against both Airbus and COMAC.

    Airbus publicly told them to get stuffed though :)
    Graham wrote: »
    "The company blamed the Max grounding and delivery delays for its profit warning."

    It's always somebody else's fault!

    Life ain't always empty.



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  • #1087
    show me the money.1
    Registered Users Posts: 261 ✭✭show me the money.1


    Did Ryanair not buy new Airbus planes for Laudamotion?


  • #1088
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    They did indeed SMTM1.

    It would be really interesting to discover if that decision was based on strategy or history.

    Either way, I'd say it's given Boeing something to mull over.


  • #1089
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 14,983 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    FAA now saying it will be December before Max is cleared to fly
    Boeing’s 737 Max aircraft, grounded since March after two fatal crashes in five months, should be back in the air by December, a top U.S. regulator said.

    It’s not possible to give an exact date as work progresses on safety fixes to the aircraft, Ali Bahrami, the Federal Aviation Administration’s associate administrator for aviation safety, said in an interview Wednesday at a conference in Cologne, Germany.

    While the FAA is “under a lot of pressure,” he said the Max will be returned to service “when we believe it will be safe,” following reviews of the design, flight testing and other checks. Bahrami was reluctant to provide a timeline, but asked whether the plane would resume service this year or next, he said remarks by Boeing Chief Executive Officer Dennis Muilenburg projecting a return by the end of 2019 sounded correct.


  • #1090
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    I'm sure the FAA are under intense political pressure. Given what has recently been in the media about Elaine Chao, the US department of transportation looks to be led by corruption and business interest. And there's this: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-ethiopia-airlines-trump/ties-between-boeing-and-trump-run-deep-idUSKBN1QT2MQ


  • #1091
    Blut2
    Registered Users Posts: 2,904 ✭✭✭Blut2


    Wow. The FAA are definitely going to be giving an optimistic assessment too, and can't speak for Europe/China. So it will actually probably be well into 2020 before its cleared globally. Almost a year grounded...


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  • #1092
    josip
    Registered Users Posts: 13,632 ✭✭✭✭josip


    So why is the share price only down slightly on that news given that the 737 accounts for roughly 30% of Boeing's revenue?


  • #1093
    troyzer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    josip wrote: »
    So why is the share price only down slightly on that news given that the 737 accounts for roughly 30% of Boeing's revenue?

    Most of it is priced in already. The consensus seems to be that their drop was a bit too much considering they still own the largest share of an oligopoly and their only competitor is incapable of taking advantage.


  • #1094
    Thirdfox
    Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    Slightly off topic but still related - is this what people were concerned about in relation to the dreamliner?

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/jun/15/boeing-dreamliner-b787-safety-fears


  • #1095
    john boye
    Registered Users Posts: 1,492 ✭✭✭john boye


    Thirdfox wrote: »
    Slightly off topic but still related - is this what people were concerned about in relation to the dreamliner?

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/jun/15/boeing-dreamliner-b787-safety-fears

    No but it's mentioned about halfway through the article. The bit about the grounding in 2013.


  • #1096
    Panrich
    Registered Users Posts: 3,763 ✭✭✭Panrich


    Thirdfox wrote: »
    Slightly off topic but still related - is this what people were concerned about in relation to the dreamliner?

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/jun/15/boeing-dreamliner-b787-safety-fears

    There seems to be an unwillingness to address the issue raised there by either Boeing or the regulators and it smacks of we can’t ground another Boeing aircraft. It’s worrying to read that Boeing seem to be still pursuing policies that in the face of it are to speed up production as a priority.
    Replacing quality control inspectors with ‘smart technology’ sounds off-key given recent events.


  • #1097
    billie1b
    Registered Users Posts: 3,804 ✭✭✭billie1b


    Graham wrote: »
    None, all 737.

    Airbus also now, 18 A320’s and 3 A321’s, operated by Lauda, handled and owned by Ryanair


  • #1098
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Was mentioned a few posts back billie1b. Are those aircraft all owned by Ryanair now and operated under the Ryanair AOC?

    Either way, you're correct. Ryanair essentially now have a A320 sub-fleet.


  • #1099
    billie1b
    Registered Users Posts: 3,804 ✭✭✭billie1b


    Graham wrote: »
    Was mentioned a few posts back billie1b. Are those aircraft all owned by Ryanair now and operated under the Ryanair AOC?

    Either way, you're correct. Ryanair essentially now have a A320 sub-fleet.

    Yeah they are, they’re a subsidiary of Ryanair holdings, ran and owned by Ryanair, they will also be putting in further orders of the A320 family


  • #1100
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    I don't think that Lauda counts as a mixed Ryanair fleet, I mentioned it before:-
    GM228 wrote: »
    I don't think Lauda (as it's called now) counts as Ryanair running a mixed fleet, Lauda is still a separate airline with Ryanair Holdings as the parent company.

    The Ryanair we know (as in the airline company Ryanair DAC) is not the parent company of Lauda, rather it's Ryanair Holdings (Ryanair PLC), who are also the holding company for Ryanair.

    There is a difference between Ryanair DAC and Ryanair PLC, it is just like Aer Lingus and IAG, it would be akin to saying Aer Lingus operates Embraer aswell because BA have them which is also under IAG.

    Ryanair and Lauda are two separate airlines operated by the same parent/holding company, no different to Aer Lingus, BA etc under IAG.


  • #1101
    cnocbui
    Registered Users Posts: 19,674 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Lol!
    On day one of the show, Boeing did not announce a single new order for any of its airplanes, while Airbus recorded orders and options for 123 planes, according to the aviation consulting firm IBA.iQ.

    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/06/17/boeing-records-zero-new-plane-orders-as-paris-air-show-starts-slow.html


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  • #1102
    john boye
    Registered Users Posts: 1,492 ✭✭✭john boye


    cnocbui wrote: »
    Lol!



    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/06/17/boeing-records-zero-new-plane-orders-as-paris-air-show-starts-slow.html

    Slightly different today!


  • #1103
    kmart6
    Registered Users Posts: 15,172 ✭✭✭✭kmart6


    john boye wrote: »
    Slightly different today!
    20 Dreamliners for Korean if people are wondering.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/06/18/boeing-lands-its-first-new-order-for-airplanes-at-the-paris-air-show.html


  • #1104
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    200 737Max for IAG
    "I have great confidence in Boeing and great confidence in the Max. It will make a great addition to our fleet," says IAG chief executive Willie Walsh.

    "This has been a tough negotiation," he adds. "It's a good deal for us and I hope a good deal for Boeing."

    https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/paris-iag-signs-for-200-max-jets-459119/


  • #1105
    john boye
    Registered Users Posts: 1,492 ✭✭✭john boye


    Graham wrote: »
    200 737Max for IAG



    https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/paris-iag-signs-for-200-max-jets-459119/

    Would be amazed if this ever comes to fruition but it's a great boost for the Max programme nonetheless.


  • #1106
    Blut2
    Registered Users Posts: 2,904 ✭✭✭Blut2


    The FT today had an article on it:

    https://www.ft.com/content/e8e017f4-91d5-11e9-aea1-2b1d33ac3271

    Paywalled, but the most interesting highlight is:
    Although the order is valued at $24bn at list prices, IAG will have received discounts. Analysts suggested the actual value of the deal could be worth around $11bn.

    Thats a pretty steep discount - 55% off.


  • #1107
    Tenger
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 9,720 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tenger


    That’s “Ryanair c. 2002” levels of discount!


  • #1108
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Meanwhile in a non descript conference room in Swords, a small battalion of HR bods are mulling over the potential consequences of IAG slurping vast quantities of 737 flight crew out of the market.


  • #1109
    Tenger
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 9,720 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tenger


    Graham wrote: »
    Meanwhile in a non descript conference room in Swords, a small battalion of HR bods are mulling over the potential consequences of IAG slurping vast quantities of 737 flight crew out of the market.
    Not just ‘out of the market’, out of their current contracts!


  • #1110
    plodder
    Registered Users Posts: 7,124 ✭✭✭plodder


    Graham wrote: »
    200 737Max for IAG



    https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/paris-iag-signs-for-200-max-jets-459119/
    That's one up for Willie Walsh. fair play to him. I'd say MOL is fuming - being outdone at his own game. Not just on getting a big discount, but announcing it with nolittle regard to the prevailing sense of gloom about the aircraft.


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  • #1111
    nsa0bupkd3948x
    Closed Accounts Posts: 783 ✭✭✭nsa0bupkd3948x


    Two people in work have said they're not going to fly BA anymore since they buy unsafe aircraft.

    Obviously wrong on many levels but interesting to hear.


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