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Biden/Harris Presidency Discussion Thread

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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,639 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manach


    Water John wrote: »
    'has managed to combine an instinctive balancing act between isolation and interventatism to build up US power, re-assuring local allies and avoiding fresh military entaglements.' Manach.

    I'm sure the Kurds and the Palestinians will be forever grateful.

    I don't believe either of those two groups are American voters nor present a US vitial interest. I'm sure you might lobby power-bloc X to take an interest or is ot the usual cri de couer from a progressive that sometime must be done and then turnaround and complain about US imperialism.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,107 ✭✭✭TomOnBoard


    Manach wrote: »
    It is only on International matters that I've taken courses in and given that this is most likely going effect Ireland in world matters I'd comment on.

    The previous Democratic admin's foreign affairs, of which Biden played a significant part, had been summarised as by the academic Robert Signh as a major failure for the doctrine of "leading from behind". Between the failled sabilisation in Libya and the lost of prestige during the Syrian Civil war as numerous "red lines" were ignored, US political stock plummeted outside Western European leaders, who ironically were sidelined then by Obama's Pacific pivot.
    Trump on the otherhand, according to acedemics such as Colin Duech in his "Age of Iron Nationalism", has managed to combine an instinctive balancing act between isolation and interventatism to build up US power, re-assuring local allies and avoiding fresh military entaglements.

    So given the likely re-installation by Biden of the Obama era policy makers in a world grown more friable and unstable due to the Covid pandemics with the Biden administration yet again engaging in a "pantomine of outrage", it is likely US Global influence again plummets.

    I'm not saying it was great in 2016, but U.S. global influence is currently in the toilet compared to 4 years ago. ANY increased US global influence over the past 4 years was bartered for selfish motivations by/for Trump and his grifters.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,439 ✭✭✭✭briany


    While it's a historically notable milestone that Harris is the first woman (and one of colour) to be VP, I hope she doesn't lean on the identity politics because I believe this is something that has swayed swing voters against Democrats. She needs to be a capable politician first of all and not come off to voters as a finger-wagging member of the PC police.

    Bit of reconciliation needed now. Whether things swing back to the Republicans in 2022 or 24 is one thing, but political normalcy is the main hope now, whichever way the pendulum swings.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,370 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    Manach wrote: »
    Trump on the otherhand, according to acedemics such as Colin Duech in his "Age of Iron Nationalism", has managed to combine an instinctive balancing act between isolation and interventatism to build up US power, re-assuring local allies and avoiding fresh military entaglements.

    So given the likely re-installation by Biden of the Obama era policy makers in a world grown more friable and unstable due to the Covid pandemics with the Biden administration yet again engaging in a "pantomine of outrage", it is likely US Global influence again plummets.

    Let me say first off that I think the one bright spot in the Trump era was that he didn't start any fresh wars. He deserves to be commended for that especially when he no doubt had noted war monger John Bolton whispering in his ear for a period.

    Apart from that, American foreign policy was a shambles:
    • Destablization of institutions that the USA were pivotal in creating: NATO, WHO, G7 etc
    • Giving Autocratic regimes carte-blanche to behave as they wanted. Specifically China's behaviour in Hong Kong and Xinjiang
    • An unwillingness to crtiticise Russia for any reason while at the same time ripping up nuclear arms treaties kicking off another arms race
    • A completely one-sided intervention in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict (more so than previous administrations)
    • An utter disregard for Climate Change measures
    • Meeting with Kim Jong Un without pre-conditions and it not denting their nuclear ambitions in the slightest
    • Tearing up the Iran deal further de-stabilising the middle east
    • Presiding over the worst Covid response in the OECD. More of a Domestic policy failure but given that it's a global pandemic this also has international ramifications and sullies the reputation of the USA
    • Referring to African countries as sh1thole countries
    • Openly supporting Brexit


    The fact that their international reputation is so self-evidently worse then it was 4 years ago makes me automatically question the judgement or political leanings of any academic who says otherwise. For that reason I looked up Colin Duech to see what his background was. Wasn't surprised to find this:
    He has worked as a foreign policy advisor on several Republican presidential campaigns.

    link


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,921 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    4 years of not waking up and reading or hearing about some dumb **** the president said, wow

    Since 2016 it was like we fell into an alternate dark parallel universe (any of yee star trek fans?) where everything is upside down and being unshaven is cool.

    Now hopefully Brexit also unravels to its conclusion and politics can get back to its boring normalcy.

    I'm really looking forward to not having the US president on the news 4 times a day and only hearing from him when needed.

    The Trump administration was an assault on the senses for 4 years. Will be a nice rest.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 18,921 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Somehow I don't think it will run to as many threads as his predecessor.

    make politics boring again.

    How many threads did Obama go to? I would say this one will barely get out of the first thread before Election 2024.


  • Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭Limpy


    Manach wrote: »
    It is only on International matters that I've taken courses in and given that this is most likely going effect Ireland in world matters I'd comment on.

    The previous Democratic admin's foreign affairs, of which Biden played a significant part, had been summarised as by the academic Robert Signh as a major failure for the doctrine of "leading from behind". Between the failled sabilisation in Libya and the lost of prestige during the Syrian Civil war as numerous "red lines" were ignored, US political stock plummeted outside Western European leaders, who ironically were sidelined then by Obama's Pacific pivot.
    Trump on the otherhand, according to acedemics such as Colin Duech in his "Age of Iron Nationalism", has managed to combine an instinctive balancing act between isolation and interventatism to build up US power, re-assuring local allies and avoiding fresh military entaglements.

    So given the likely re-installation by Biden of the Obama era policy makers in a world grown more friable and unstable due to the Covid pandemics with the Biden administration yet again engaging in a "pantomine of outrage", it is likely US Global influence again plummets.

    The US had no business in Syria.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,832 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    Blowfish wrote: »
    That's a bit of a bizarre conclusion when you look at the various other measures passed. A bunch of states legalized various drugs, Florida increased their minimum wage to eventually hit $15, Arizona increased income tax for the wealthier, Nebraska added a gambling tax, with some of it going to addiction services, Utah expanded their income tax to allow it to pay for disability services for children etc.

    It seems that progressive policies have been pretty popular in this election, even in red states.

    People can like certain aspects of policy but have a fundamental issue with others that will stop them from voting for a 'progressive'.

    Voters can be pro-higher minimum wage but also anti abortion
    Voters can be pro-drug legalization but also want to keep their private healthcare coverage
    Voters can be pro-increased taxes for high earners but be against defunding the police

    Progressives definitely played a big part in the Biden victory but so did moderates. The problem moderate candidates understandably have is that progressives tend to give red meat to attack ads against them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 39,366 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Biden will have his hands full from the progressive wing on thru democrat party. I say that because it’s chair was just on MSNBC not taking blame for how the language if not the policy positions may have affected their house majority. Apparently without them the turnout wouldn’t have been what it was. So they have this mentality that joe Biden owes them is how I read that. And joe Biden wasn’t the preferred candidate of many progressives so there’s nothing to stop causing trouble for Biden.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,832 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    Biden will have his hands full from the progressive wing on thru democrat party. I say that because it’s chair was just on MSNBC not taking blame for how the language if not the policy positions may have affected their house majority. Apparently without them the turnout wouldn’t have been what it was. So they have this mentality that joe Biden owes them is how I read that. And joe Biden wasn’t the preferred candidate of many progressives so there’s nothing to stop causing trouble for Biden.

    Biden has an amazing shield with how the senate looks to turned out.

    At this point they are all pointing fingers at who is to blame for not quite getting another 'blue wave'. It is a pity all sides couldn't wait and enjoy the big victory but I think things will die down a bit once Biden rolls out some executive orders to fix what Trump put in place and the ideologues realise what is actually possible with a split government.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,342 ✭✭✭BluePlanet


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    Biden has an amazing shield with how the senate looks to turned out.

    At this point they are all pointing fingers at who is to blame for not quite getting another 'blue wave'. It is a pity all sides couldn't wait and enjoy the big victory but I think things will die down a bit once Biden rolls out some executive orders to fix what Trump put in place and the ideologues realise what is actually possible with a split government.

    Amazing shield?
    Do you mean that Biden and the Dems get to lamely blame Mitch McConnell for getting nothing done, and hope that the electorate agree with them in 2 years time?


  • Registered Users Posts: 21 Jo jo the eskimo


    Why do folks like john kasich and mitt Romney get so much air time to tell Democrats what to do next? The 70 million votes were for Trump, nobody whats what the establishment Republicans are selling.
    Meanwhile after the progressive candidates show how its done in swing states, AOC has to come on and defend herself


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,553 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    looksee wrote: »
    Picking on an actual statistic out of that lot, where does the 2% come from?
    Since (according to YouGov) she's the 8th most popular Democrat amongst all Americans at 40% approval rating, I'd say that figure came out of the same place as the rest of the nonsense posted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,832 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    BluePlanet wrote: »
    Amazing shield?
    Do you mean that Biden and the Dems get to lamely blame Mitch McConnell for getting nothing done, and hope that the electorate agree with them in 2 years time?

    Lamely? I was responding specifically regarding progressives and this is a fact. A 50-50 split would have been a mess to keep both progressives and moderates happy. Now if they have to make deals with moderate GOP in the senate then it becomes more palatable than making the same deal with moderate Dems.

    Regarding your broader point, I agree that getting nothing done will be a difficult selling point in 2 years.


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,065 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Listening to Joe Manchin on CNN this morning, any radical moves like expanding the SC, ending the super majority etc won't be getting his vote. So winning the 2 in Georgia won't be swinging the US radically to the left. The GOP will be using the fear factor so as not to give the Senate to the Dems. All the Dems have to do is point to Joe Manchin.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,165 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Captain Brett Crozier of the USS Theodore Roosevelt knowingly risked his career for the safety of his troops. His actions were heroic, and he was sacked for them. I'm sure there have been many people who have been wrongfully removed from office under Trump, this is just one of them, and I really hope he is rewarded for his bravery and commitment to his troops.

    Even the CNO, who initially was inclined to reinstate Crozier, reversed his opinion after the investigation was completed. Crozier screwed up. The report is publicly available online, it's written in 'plain English'. The short version is only 88 pages long, even if you don't, for some reason want to read the full 1,897 page version.
    Short: https://www.secnav.navy.mil/foia/readingroom/HotTopics/TR%20INVESTIGATION/TR%20CI%20Report%20with%20CNO%20Endorsement%20(Redacted%20for%20release).pdf
    Long: https://www.secnav.navy.mil/foia/readingroom/SitePages/Home.aspx?RootFolder=%2Ffoia%2Freadingroom%2FHotTopics%2FTR%20INVESTIGATION&FolderCTID=0x012000C9F89F68DF40E744A067873ECF6220C0&View=%7B854CB8F6%2D5C90%2D46E6%2DA4A1%2D11FD0F9B23C6%7D

    Troop care is important. But it's not the only thing. And as video of his departure showed, it wasn't all that effective, either.
    Blowfish wrote: »
    That's a bit of a bizarre conclusion when you look at the various other measures passed. A bunch of states legalized various drugs, Florida increased their minimum wage to eventually hit $15, Arizona increased income tax for the wealthier, Nebraska added a gambling tax, with some of it going to addiction services, Utah expanded their income tax to allow it to pay for disability services for children etc.

    It seems that progressive policies have been pretty popular in this election, even in red states.

    Look at the flip side. California voted against affirmative action. It rolled back union labor rights. (There's a long story behind that one, the unions loved the law, but independent contractors like uber drivers hated it). Illinois flat rejected a progressive income tax on folks who make over $250k. (On a related note, Texas recently made a Constitutional amendment to prohibit income tax of any sort). You have to be careful about ascribing 'progressive/conservative trends' to specific policies in various States.
    Foxtrol wrote: »
    People can like certain aspects of policy but have a fundamental issue with others that will stop them from voting for a 'progressive'.

    Voters can be pro-higher minimum wage but also anti abortion
    Voters can be pro-drug legalization but also want to keep their private healthcare coverage
    Voters can be pro-increased taxes for high earners but be against defunding the police

    Progressives definitely played a big part in the Biden victory but so did moderates. The problem moderate candidates understandably have is that progressives tend to give red meat to attack ads against them.


    This. The BBC recently did a brief report on why Hispanics are starting to leave the Democrat fold. https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-54861000
    Consider latino tradition and culture, and look at the common associations with the Democrats.

    Related note: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/nov/07/how-democrats-latino-voters-texas-border-towns
    Although residents in the valley lean left in terms of partisanship, “many people actually bleed red” ideologically, McNeely said. Some of that boils down to religious beliefs, with large contingents of Catholics and Protestant evangelicals in the area.
    [...]
    Ocañas, for example, views border patrol agents as protectors, not enemies, and she balked at the criticism they have faced on the job.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,832 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    This. The BBC recently did a brief report on why Hispanics are starting to leave the Democrat fold. https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-54861000
    Consider latino tradition and culture, and look at the common associations with the Democrats.

    Related note: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/nov/07/how-democrats-latino-voters-texas-border-towns
    Although residents in the valley lean left in terms of partisanship, “many people actually bleed red” ideologically, McNeely said. Some of that boils down to religious beliefs, with large contingents of Catholics and Protestant evangelicals in the area.
    [...]
    Ocañas, for example, views border patrol agents as protectors, not enemies, and she balked at the criticism they have faced on the job.

    Yeah, the GOP have done a fantastic job with their messaging of using these hot button topics to create firewalls while allowing their moderates the space to not be stuck on the wrong side of them.

    It is really incredible how they can be on the wrong side of public opinion on so many issues yet thread the needle successfully. A lot of it is likely due to their policies being keeping things the way they are rather than change that dems are promoting, the latter being much easier to twist to scare people.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,370 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    Illinois flat rejected a progressive income tax on folks who make over $250k.

    I hadn't heard about this. It sounds bonkers. Can this be classified under the old saying:

    "Most Americans believe that they are temporarily embarrassed millionaires"?


    I can't think of a single European country where that measure would fail.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,165 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    I hadn't heard about this. It sounds bonkers. Can this be classified under the old saying:

    "Most Americans believe that they are temporarily embarrassed millionaires"?


    I can't think of a single European country where that measure would fail.

    https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/chicago-politics/illinois-graduated-income-tax-proposal-where-vote-on-amendment-stands/2363905/

    Illinois currently has a 4.95% income tax, flat rate. The referendum was to allow increases on that for high earners. There are some subtleties to the background, such as repeated recent tax hikes with little to show for it, and the fact that it's a Constitutional amendment, and Americans, as a general rule, are averse to amending Constitutions unless it's to add protections.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,340 ✭✭✭✭rossie1977


    Hispanics have always voted Republican in decent numbers

    2016, 28% voted Republican
    2012, 27% voted Republican
    2008, 31% voted Republican
    2004, 44% voted Republican
    2000, 35% voted Republican

    2020 demos are not out yet but I doubt they differ greatly from 2018 midterms where 29% of all Latinos voted Republican.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 33,377 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    (On a related note, Texas recently made a Constitutional amendment to prohibit income tax of any sort). You have to be careful about ascribing 'progressive/conservative trends' to specific policies in various States.


    [/i]

    With no income tax how are they getting funding for things like fixing roads or military spend?

    I know its wealthy state for various reasons not withstanding oil. but in terms of constant fixed spend surely income tax is needed


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,081 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    listermint wrote: »
    With no income tax how are they getting funding for things like fixing roads or military spend?

    I know its wealthy state for various reasons not withstanding oil. but in terms of constant fixed spend surely income tax is needed

    Sales tax and excise of various kinds for Texas; and individual cities/towns/incorporated communities have other taxation.

    There can be huge variances in what each state taxes or not.


  • Registered Users Posts: 33,377 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    L1011 wrote: »
    Sales tax and excise of various kinds for Texas; and individual cities/towns/incorporated communities have other taxation.

    There can be huge variances in what each state taxes or not.

    Aye I get that but surely income tax is stable for the most part.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,081 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    I didn't say it was sensible!


  • Registered Users Posts: 27,939 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    On a visit to Vermont - a bastion of sensible-ness - it was dark and raining and we were driving through the outskirts of Burlington, VT. The traffic lights and other signal and advertising lights were on but were dazzling and reflecting off the road surface and it was ridiculously difficult to see. I asked why there were no streetlights and was told - people don't like paying taxes so choices have to be made, and this area chose not to have street lights!


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,921 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    I'm really looking forward to not having the US president on the news 4 times a day and only hearing from him when needed.

    The Trump administration was an assault on the senses for 4 years. Will be a nice rest.

    2 days!

    I got 2 days!

    Pompeo's statement can't be brushed off surely as him misspeaking?


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,165 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    listermint wrote: »
    With no income tax how are they getting funding for things like fixing roads or military spend?

    I know its wealthy state for various reasons not withstanding oil. but in terms of constant fixed spend surely income tax is needed

    The Texas point of view, as I have had it explained to me, is that it does not want to penalise anyone for working by taxing them for making their living. But if you're going to own a piece of the State, then you have a vested interest and stake, so you're going to pay property tax. As a result, property taxes here are quite high compared to a high income tax state like California. On the other hand, it also means that my household tax bill is very steady, regardless of if I have a good year or if my wife works or not, and the revenues are pretty steady from my household, if I'm unemployed or not. So for example, last year, my tax bill wasn't too much off what I paid in California, I was the sole earner. On the other hand, this year, with my wife working, our tax bill is much less than we would have been paying in California.

    The other important thing is that the US is quite decentralised. Not only does the State collect taxes, so do the county and city (if you're in a city). So, for the sales tax, for example, the State collects a percentage, the county collects a percentage, and the city collects a percentage. On the other hand, I believe all property tax goes to the lowest level at which you live. (City if you're in a city, county if you're unincorporated). Motor Vehicle registration (Your annual car tax) is set at the State level by the DMV, but collected by the county. County roads are maintained by the county out of its budget. City roads are maintained by the city out of its budget. Ditto police services, State, County or City. And so on.

    The military's a bit unusual. The Texas State Guard and all its equipment and property is purely paid for out of the State budget. The Texas National Guard and its equipment is mainly paid out of Federal funds as a reserve of the Army, unless the Governor calls it out without federal approval, in which case it is paid for by State funds. (Disasters, riot control, etc, mainly).

    So, here's where the money in my area comes from. I'm in the city.

    State:
    jClCJM0.png
    County
    MzEcMBG.png
    City
    bxRwACu.png

    Hope that helps. Oh, CPS is the city version of ESB, it does both electricity and gas. It's owned by the city, its customers don't have to be city residents, it covers a large multi-county area.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 12,778 Mod ✭✭✭✭Zascar


    What can we expect from the Biden Administration's policy for the Middle East? I'm seeing many people skeptical about Biden's foreign policy will praise the fact that Trump started no new wars and fostered peace in the middle east never seen before - like deals between Israel and UAE & Bahrain etc.. They also say going back into the Iran deal will be a disaster and end up with Iran getting nukes which I don't understand, and that Democrats will be a disaster for middle eastern policy and relations. I'm an Expat in the UAE and should be scared apparently - I'm wondering if there is any truth in this? What can we expect over the next 4 years from Biden/Harris compared to Trump and the Republicans?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,742 ✭✭✭10000maniacs


    Is the Trump administration trying to install a dictatorship? First step, turn the secret service into yes men with loyalty tests and firing everybody in the Pentagon who don't agree with their policies, and second, try to get the military on side and attacking the chain of command. Hope I'm wrong.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,553 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    Is the Trump administration trying to install a dictatorship? First step, turn the secret service into yes men with loyalty tests and firing everybody in the Pentagon who don't agree with their policies, and second, try to get the military on side and attacking the chain of command. Hope I'm wrong.
    You would have to wonder at the desperation behind such a move. It is literally unthinkable. So either they're not trying to do this, or they are because the alternative is worse for them.


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