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Roots Ireland Update

  • 20-07-2010 8:30am
    #1
    Ponster
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,911 Mod ✭✭✭✭


    For those who have yet to receive their newsletter e-mail....


    Advanced Search

    The Advanced Search adds a number of fields to the search criteria for Birth/Baptism and Marriage records and changes the way you pay to view the full details of these records.

    The new search facility is available on a pilot basis for searching the data of the following counties only: Cavan, Fermanagh, Galway West, Kildare, Kilkenny, Tipperary North, Tyrone, and Westmeath.

    With Baptism/Birth searches, in addition to all the search fields in the Standard Search, you can now also search by Mother's First Name and Mother's Surname, by combining this with the Father's First Name and Surname it allows you to easily find all siblings within the same family.
    With Marriage searches, in addition to all the search fields in the Standard search, you can now search by Spouse's First Name, Spouse's Surname, Father's First Name (please note that the names of parents may not been recorded in the original record).


    When using the Advanced Search option you cannot purchase individual records unless only one match is located. You will be able to purchase the entire record set located at a reduced cost. By entering as much detail into the search form as possible you can narrow your search to produce as few as matches as possible. You can then decide to purchase all these records at a reduced cost.

    http://www.rootsireland.ie/


Comments

  • #2
    sweet-rasmus
    Registered Users Posts: 3,126 ✭✭✭sweet-rasmus


    And it seems if you have not purchased anything with your account, but have searched stuff, they deactivate your account?! Bit odd.


  • #3
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    Hello that site is great! I found my surname in the baptisims going away back to 1650, none before that but it has a different spelling, "cumming" mines is cummins currently, but i hear that cumming is the scottish form... now what do i do about these records its £5 per record and i don't want to spend that to find out that that isn't the right person!?! Have you ever done it, whats in the record??? Is there a way of going back each person?? Until you get back to 1600 whatever?


  • #4
    pinkypinky
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,614 Mod ✭✭✭✭pinkypinky


    Owenc,

    I haven't used it in its new format but I found it quite difficult to guess who was my most likely ancestor when looking at the records - I've wasted quite a bit of money on one branch trying to find them. I got a transcript (without a scan of the original document) of the church record. I suspect there was a crucial typo on that transcript and have to get myself to Monkstown CoI church at some stage to check the original register. It's from 1902 and the good folk at the Representative Church Body Library (who hold old CoI registers) told me that 1902 is too recent for them to have it yet!

    Pinky

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • #5
    Ponster
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,911 Mod ✭✭✭✭Ponster


    I also haven't used the new site but I've probably given them about €100 with a 75% success rate.

    It's possible to narrow a search down to a specific parish which makes it much more sure that you're on the right track.


  • #6
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    pinkypinky wrote: »
    Owenc,

    I haven't used it in its new format but I found it quite difficult to guess who was my most likely ancestor when looking at the records - I've wasted quite a bit of money on one branch trying to find them. I got a transcript (without a scan of the original document) of the church record. I suspect there was a crucial typo on that transcript and have to get myself to Monkstown CoI church at some stage to check the original register. It's from 1902 and the good folk at the Representative Church Body Library (who hold old CoI registers) told me that 1902 is too recent for them to have it yet!

    Pinky

    Ok, i checked all the births right upto 1740 from 1650 and every single one of them were church of ireland, that may be my family the only problem is i don't know if they came from derry to magilligan then to coleraine??? What do you suggest i do as there is no way of working this out?! what is on the record thing that you buy?


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  • #7
    Ponster
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,911 Mod ✭✭✭✭Ponster


    You can see samples here.


  • #8
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    Ponster wrote: »
    You can see samples here.

    Hmm ok thanks I'll have to do more research before buying that maybe get upto that church...


  • #9
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    Ok i'm quite certain that those people are my relatives, but i can't go and buy the record because they may not be. So i need to slowly go back, the only problem is there is no record of james cummins baptisim, he was born in 1810 and died in 1895, there is a record of his death, but that is useless, there is also no record of his marriage or burial... the church also dosen't have many records of my family at all most of them are after 1850, nor does the other presbyterian church down the road. So how do you suggest i find out about his parents, as i could definately connect him to them if i found out were his father was baptised in... i think his father is john cummins, and i found one marriage in that coi church but i have no proof.. i'm maybe thinking he was coi and then converted.


  • #10
    pinkypinky
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,614 Mod ✭✭✭✭pinkypinky


    Ok. What date did he get married? If it was post April 1845, there would be a civil record of it and that would give his father's name? Also, do you know who he married? Marriages often took place in the bride's parish, if it was a different one.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • #11
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    pinkypinky wrote: »
    Ok. What date did he get married? If it was post April 1845, there would be a civil record of it and that would give his father's name? Also, do you know who he married? Marriages often took place in the bride's parish, if it was a different one.

    Ok he married a woman called rachel, i have no idea what her surname was and he may have married after 1845 considering he was born in 1810 and then again he may not have as marriages were early back then, where do you go to get the cival record? Is it searchable?


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  • #12
    shanew
    Registered Users Posts: 2,777 ✭✭✭shanew


    owenc wrote: »
    Ok he married a woman called rachel, i have no idea what her surname was and he may have married after 1845 considering he was born in 1810 and then again he may not have as marriages were early back then, where do you go to get the cival record? Is it searchable?

    you can search the Irish Civil BMD Index on familysearch at : http://search.labs.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#p=collectionDetails&c=fs%3A1408347

    Once you locate possible references (i.e. name, year quarter, registration district, volume and page numbers) you can then order certs from the GRO or GRONI which will show the full details.



    Shane


  • #13
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    shanew wrote: »
    you can search the Irish Civil BMD Index on familysearch at : http://search.labs.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#p=collectionDetails&c=fs%3A1408347

    Once you locate possible references (i.e. name, year quarter, registration district, volume and page numbers) you can then order certs from the GRO or GRONI which will show the full details.



    Shane

    Naw no luck what do you suggest i do now then?


  • #14
    shanew
    Registered Users Posts: 2,777 ✭✭✭shanew


    owenc wrote: »
    Naw no luck what do you suggest i do now then?

    have you located baptisms for any of his and Rachel's children ?

    Wherever that is would be the first place to try for their marriage.

    Note - not all early church records survive, so there's no guarantee that details of the marriage or earlier baptism still exists.


    Shane


  • #15
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    shanew wrote: »
    have you located baptisms for any of his and Rachel's children ?

    Wherever that is would be the first place to try for their marriage.

    Note - not all early church records survive, so there's no guarantee that details of the marriage or earlier baptism still exists.


    Shane

    Yes magilligan presbyterian church, but that church was built 2 years after he was born and they don't keep marriages before 1845.. and for some reason they are burried in dunboe presbyterian church were he is burried, i think he was attending dunboe aswell as that time so i don't know why he bothered baptising them their to go straight to dunboe.. There is no record of him being born in dunboe either we asked the minister, we also asked the magilligan churches minister and he found nothing, so i have sort of come to a complete block as both of those churches have birth records back to his birth date..


  • #16
    pinkypinky
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,614 Mod ✭✭✭✭pinkypinky


    What about Griffiths valuation to check for him and his father? They might be living on adjacent land or nearby. Addresses might be the same as when children were baptised.

    http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • #17
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    pinkypinky wrote: »
    What about Griffiths valuation to check for him and his father? They might be living on adjacent land or nearby. Addresses might be the same as when children were baptised.

    http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml

    Yes see here: http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml?action=doNameSearch&familyname=cummins&firstname=&baronyname=&countyname=LONDONDERRY&unionname=&parishname=&Submit.x=20&Submit.y=2

    They are mostly in magilligan, there is a samuel, henry and david there i have a funny feeling that they are his brothers and the john is his father as i remember going into coleraine library and seeing a john somewhere and a ann.. that is why i am trying to work out the father to see if i can attach him to a john cummins who married in derry in 1769 in a coi of ireland church and then go the whole way back to 1650 and find out were the family came from!? Any other ideas as griffiths evaluation has no ages..


  • #18
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    Right i'm going to go with this and try and find out the father of david cummins, i found a document in familysearch showing his death, how do i go about getting this and what will be in it, will it show parents and were they are born?


  • #19
    Ponster
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,911 Mod ✭✭✭✭Ponster


    owenc wrote: »
    Right i'm going to go with this and try and find out the father of david cummins, i found a document in familysearch showing his death, how do i go about getting this and what will be in it, will it show parents and were they are born?


    I'm afraid that out of all the certs, the death cert will have the least amount of information on it. The best you can hope for is "next of kin". It certainly won't mention his parents.


  • #20
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    Ponster wrote: »
    I'm afraid that out of all the certs, the death cert will have the least amount of information on it. The best you can hope for is "next of kin". It certainly won't mention his parents.

    ok what will it mention.


  • #21
    shanew
    Registered Users Posts: 2,777 ✭✭✭shanew


    county, registration district etc
    date and place of death (sometimes home address is mentioned if death took place in a hospital )
    name and age
    cause of death and duration of illness
    informant and qualification - can be a doctor or family member
    name of the registrar


    Shane


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  • #22
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    shanew wrote: »
    county, registration district etc
    date and place of death (sometimes home address is mentioned if death took place in a hospital )
    name and age
    cause of death and duration of illness
    informant and qualification - can be a doctor or family member
    name of the registrar


    Shane

    Ok that would not be usefull, have you any idea what i can do to get back to 1700s? I really need back there as once i get that far i could hopefully attach myself to those ones from 1600s.


  • #23
    shanew
    Registered Users Posts: 2,777 ✭✭✭shanew


    owenc wrote: »
    Ok that would not be usefull, have you any idea what i can do to get back to 1700s? I really need back there as once i get that far i could hopefully attach myself to those ones from 1600s.

    not many parishes have records for the 1700s.. if you have already managed to find details back to the early 1800s then you could be at a dead end


    Shane


  • #24
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    shanew wrote: »
    not many parishes have records for the 1700s.. if you have already managed to find details back to the early 1800s then you could be at a dead end


    Shane

    Thats why i'm trying to get them back to 1700 as this church has really old records... are there any really good censuses or anything?


  • #25
    shanew
    Registered Users Posts: 2,777 ✭✭✭shanew


    owenc wrote: »
    Thats why i'm trying to get them back to 1700 as this church has really old records... are there any really good censuses or anything?

    I thought you mentioned that your ancestors were presbyterian and the parish with the old records was CofI ?

    I believe There are some fragments of early census returns for Co. Derry - not sure if these are online anywhere.


    Shane


  • #26
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    shanew wrote: »
    I thought you mentioned that your ancestors were presbyterian and the parish with the old records was CofI ?

    I believe There are some fragments of early census returns for Co. Derry - not sure if these are online anywhere.


    Shane
    Yes and i'm thinking maybe there were no presbyterian churches back then... or maybe they were presbyterian and the records weren't there. Thanks for your help i'll have to try and find census in the late 1700s.


  • #27
    shanew
    Registered Users Posts: 2,777 ✭✭✭shanew


    the census extracts are for the early 1800s

    Many of the settlers in Northern Ireland from Scotland were Presbyterian, so they would have have set up churches when they arrived (I think they called them congregations) - whether there are surviving records I dont know...


    Shane


  • #28
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    shanew wrote: »
    the census extracts are for the early 1800s

    Many of the settlers in Northern Ireland from Scotland were Presbyterian, so they would have have set up churches when they arrived (I think they called them congregations) - whether there are surviving records I dont know...


    Shane

    Yes which makes me wonder why i found ones in the church of ireland in 1600 which brings me to the conclusion that there were no presbyterian churches about, for example there are 10 presbyterian churches near me within 15 miles and they were all built in the 1800s!! I did find someone in the 1740 protestant census who was in magilligan what info would be in that?? The one thing i could use would be the 1766 census but sadly they aren't in that and i have no idea why!


  • #29
    shanew
    Registered Users Posts: 2,777 ✭✭✭shanew


    There's details of the various census extracts available for the county at http://www.nireland.com/genealogy/londonderry_census.html

    I think the 1766 census you mentioned only includes certain parishes.

    I would be pretty sure there were at least some Presbyterian churches in the county in the 1700s


    Shane


  • #30
    owenc
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,524 ✭✭✭owenc


    shanew wrote: »
    There's details of the various census extracts available for the county at http://www.nireland.com/genealogy/londonderry_census.html

    I think the 1766 census you mentioned only includes certain parishes.

    I would be pretty sure there were at least some Presbyterian churches in the county in the 1700s


    Shane

    Yes the one that james cummins attended was built in 1650 it was probably the oldest in the county but it only started records in 1805!! Thats why i'm hoping they were church of ireland!


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